Felder/Hammer f3 shaper question

[Acharya Kumarswami]

I was told that the Hammer F3 shaper is no longer provided with the forward reverse option.
Can anyone confirm whether that's true or not?

Thank you.

[John P Clark]

Just looked at the website - still shown as available on this shaper. Not having a reversing shaper would really limit what bits and cuts you could make

[Andy Giddings]

I was told that the Hammer F3 shaper is no longer provided with the forward reverse option.
Can anyone confirm whether that's true or not?

Thank you.
Question of who is doing the telling? At least last year they were reversible. If the Hammer sales team is telling you this then they must have changed the design (which doesn't make any sense as per John's comment)

[Rod Sheridan]

I asked Felder in Canada and apparently that's correct for the single phase Canadian models which need a Canadian Electrical approval.

Perhaps the US machines are also that way.............Rod.

[Andy Giddings]

I asked Felder in Canada and apparently that's correct for the single phase Canadian models which need a Canadian Electrical approval.

Perhaps the US machines are also that way.............Rod.
US Website states the Forward/Reverse run is optional. Don't know if there is a cost involved but at least its available. Still standard on the B3 etc

[Erik Loza]

When I was with Felder, reverse-run was an optional feature but you (the rep) would never really configure the machine that way since it was a key feature. Just like Minimax: It was "standard" in the sense that we (the US team) made it part of the US build code. But, if the sales rep was new, goofed, or whatever, a machine could be ordered without reverse-run, though there usually was enough oversight in place to prevent that from occurring. Odd that CSA rules create a conflict. I don't recall that being an issue with any of the Canadian Minimax configurations but maybe I never looked.

Erik

[Acharya Kumarswami]

Thank you for the input. The US sales rep for Felder/Hammer says, regrettably, that F/R is no longer available on the Hammer shaper (that includes the machines that it is part of). A distributor in Canada said the same thing, citing Canadian electrical rules as the reason.

Clearly the website is a little out of date. He also said the tilting spindle is no longer available on the 500 series Felder line.

[Andy Giddings]

Thank you for the input. The US sales rep for Felder/Hammer says, regrettably, that F/R is no longer available on the Hammer shaper (that includes the machines that it is part of). A distributor in Canada said the same thing, citing Canadian electrical rules as the reason.

Clearly the website is a little out of date. He also said the tilting spindle is no longer available on the 500 series Felder line.
Thanks for the confirmation, Acharya - seems like a backward step, especially getting rid of the tilting spindle as well

[David Kumm]

Does anyone know if the Hammer MF spindle is bi directional? I'm not clear on how it attaches. Dave

[Andy Giddings]

Does anyone know if the Hammer MF spindle is bi directional? I'm not clear on how it attaches. Dave
yes it is. Fixes via a long bolt through the center of the spindle

[David Kumm]

yes it is. Fixes via a long bolt through the center of the spindle

does the squared area on the tang keep the spindle from backing off when reversed? dave

[Andy Giddings]

does the squared area on the tang keep the spindle from backing off when reversed? dave
Yes, Dave, although it's a hex. On the part of the removable spindle that is inserted into the drive in the machine, there's a hex profile that mates with a hex profile in the drive (see attached photo of the removable router spindle)
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[David Kumm]

Any idea why Hammer didn't use a more traditional design- 30-40 taper similar to what other shapers and mills use. Pretty standard and more stout. Dave

[Rod Sheridan]

Any idea why Hammer didn't use a more traditional design- 30-40 taper similar to what other shapers and mills use. Pretty standard and more stout. Dave

Probably so they can be removed without effort, they don't lock in like a taper............Rod.

[Andy Giddings]

Probably so they can be removed without effort, they don't lock in like a taper............Rod.
+1 on Rod's comments. The Felder 500 and Hammer range use the MF system whereas the Felder 700 and up use a different quick change system that looks a lot more substantial (looks like the whole spindle including the driven portion is changed). None of them seem to use a taper so doesn't seem to be a cost/power issue

[David Kumm]

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The middle is a Felder F7 spindle cartridge. I arranged the spindles in what I believe are in order of strength. Left is a Knapp and being hollow, I believe it to be the weakest. Still a stout build but relative to others the shorter length is a clue that stacking is not an option for a hollow spindle. The newer Felder cartridges have four steps. On mine the smallest diameter is 40mm which would be the weak point- again only relative and maybe only when running a large 50mm spindle and heavy cutters which the F7 is not designed for. Right is a T130. Strength is related to spindle diameter as there is nothing unsupported below it as it fits into a taper. The old Martin system is very similar but as with all things Martin, just better. Takes a 1/4 turn of the collar to allow spindle to be unscrewed vs removing the whole collar on the SCMI. The real difference in the Martin vs the Felder or SCMI are in the bearings. Newer machines run light duty 60xx to allow for higher spindle speeds with standard grease shielded bearings. The good news is that the Felder bearings are much easier to replace than the SCMI. The old Martin runs precision 62xx bearings in a drip oil bath. Those bearings have a much higher radial load capability and still run at high speed. Expensive system to produce though.

I digress but spindle and quill designs are interesting and seldom considered when buying a shaper. Dave