Narrow hand tool shop

[Oskar Sedell]

Hi all,

looking for advice on using the space in a very small hand tool only shop.

I'll be moving in a couple of weeks, and it looks like I'll get my first own shop in a storage room in the cellar. Since I've been working off my kitchen table (in a single room apt) so far this will be a huge improvement. Back side is that the room is only about 5 by 11 feet, with the door at the short end.

Building a bench will be first priority, and it will be placed along one of the long walls. About 8' long gives some clearance at the ends. Since the bench will be the only working surface I plan to maximize its length given the space.

My question is about the free space in front of the bench. I'm thinking of a 22'' wide bench, or even 20'', which I can back off from the wall if needed for traverse planing of wide panels. This leaves a bit more than 3' free floor space in front of the bench. Is this too little? Should I rethink putting an almost full size bench in this small room?

What are your experiences? how much space in front of the bench do you use/want for hand tool operations? Anything that comes to mind, that I might have missed in planning the shop? Since I've been working on a planing beam on my table for quite some time I might oversee something obvious about working on a real workbench.

To save space wood storage will be restricted in the shop. Probably only enough for upcoming projects, and the rest in the garage. Tools have to be put on the walls, either in the open or in very shallow, 1 tool deep, cabinets/shelves.

Looking forward to your comments and suggestions.

Oskar

[steven c newman]

Maybe a photo visit to my shop for ideas?

The Dungeon Shop......
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Unless the board(s) is being worked , it stays upstairs..
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Maple,Cherry and Poplar...

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Oskar

Congrats on the new space!

I would build the bench 20" wide. Mine is 22" and I would not miss 2". This will give you a little more room - and the more you can save to move around, so much the better. I would build a second, higher bench into the end of the room. Use this for sharpening and joinery (dovetails and tenons). Build a cabinet above it to store planes and saws. Store all your marking tools on the wall above the bench. I would add a holder for your bench chisels as well.

You need about 12" clear between the bench and wall to traverse. I wonder if you want to make the bench movable, or attach a bench to the wall. Attaching a bench will make it easier to build a very rigid top. Plus, then you can build storage under the bench.

What about traversing then? You would get the same effect of moving the bench out by 12" by adding a 12" front section when you need to traverse. This could be done with a hinged section - flip it out when needed. I build something like this. In my case, it was a flip down extra bench top ...

https://s19.postimg.org/x5k538ihv/Cabinet2.jpg

https://s19.postimg.org/f4105fogz/Cabinet3.jpg

https://s19.postimg.org/jefo10tk3/Cabinet4.jpg

I would build this as part of the bench top. When folded into the top, it is just part of the bench. Fold half out to traverse, and this creates fence against which the work piece can rest.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Frank J Hall]

I use a narrow space in the garage, I usually don't even back out the car, which I think makes our widths fairly comparable. The pictured bench is 2ft deep. Since this pic was taken I replaced that bench with one that is 30" deep. You may stand in the space at the front of your proposed bench width with a saw in hand and just make sure your elbow doesn't nail the wall behind you, but I think you will be more than fine with that space and a 22"-ish bench. The more common problem for me is that you also want to be sure the bench isnt too narrow, otherwise with rough crosscutting, the front of the saw will hit the wall on the push stroke. If you had a 20" bench and are crosscutting a 10" board, you could only push about 10" of saw through the wood, while starting the cut, before hitting the wall.. of course you can angle things and make it work, but keep it in mind.

I will say though that when I assemble something like a table which I just made, I did need to back the car out, something like this you may have to leave the shop for the glue up.

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[Archie England]

Frank, nice picture of your confined space. Now I feel like a glutton (in comparison). BTW, is that your saw bench sitting on top of the clamp rack?

[Oskar Sedell]

Derek, thank you very much for your comment! Good idea about extending the work surface when needed, this I will consider. My plan so far was to keep the bench free standing. I have a sturdy roubo-like construction in mind. This way I can move it if I need to. For example if I want to sleeve something over the end, or occasionally clamp something also from behind. But of course bolting the bench to the wall adds to the stability.

Would you do the "fold-out-part" full length, or just a part in the middle of the bench? Do you think this would interfere with using holdfasts?

Another, higher bench for sharpening and joinery is tempting. I have to see if there is space enough for this. Otherwise I might build a shop stool and/or a moxon/bench on bench for this purpose.

[Oskar Sedell]

Frank. Thank you for the pic and your answer. Good point about having space for the saw blade when cross cutting. Now I'm using mostly japanese saws, and they don't take that much space. I'm also thinking that ripping and resawing with longer saws/frame saw will be done standing at the short end, working in the lengthwise direction of the bench.

Also, it is clear that bigger assemblies and cutting of big boards have to be done outside, in the garage or in the living room when needed.

[Nathan Johnson]

If you decide to fix the bench to the wall, you could go with a split top bench with a tool well for additional clamping options. Also, you can use that tool well for a bench hook since you'll be pulling the work towards you with the Japanese saws. This is the route I've decided to go in my basement, though I'm as of yet undecided on fixing the bench to the wall.

[Dave Anderson NH]

We could give you a much better set of options if you could provide us with the overall dimensions of the space. Better yet would be a sketch showing the door location and any obstructions. It would help us help you.

[Warren Mickley]

Oskar gave his room dimensions as 5 X 11 feet with a door on one of the short sides. Usually for rooms like this the door opens out, which is helpful. He envisions an 8 foot bench, a nice size for hand work, which leaves only 3 feet of length to play around with. I might be inclined to go 7 1/2. Mouldings for large pieces of furniture can be 7 feet long. There is no room for another bench and none is needed.

I would put the bench just a few inches from the wall, but leave it loose from the wall so it could occasionally be moved. Traditional cross cutting and ripping is done on trestles or a low bench, not on the bench top. You might break down long boards by setting up in an adjacent room or outside temporarily, or having the board sticking out through the doorway.

Traditional traversing is done with the board cross wise on the bench, still planing toward the stop. I guess this could be a problem occasionally, but most stock preparation work is done planing with the grain against the stop and it is not necessary to traverse.

In a traditional workshop, the benches are around four feet apart. You have a adequate amount of room.
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[Prashun Patel]

For the space-challenged person, a smaller bench can work well. Mine is 60". There are a handful of times I require longer, and auxiliary supports handle those times. It's not optimal, but I prefer the extra space; a shorter bench allows me to place mine in the center of my shop floor, so I can access all way round.

[Oskar Sedell]

If you decide to fix the bench to the wall, you could go with a split top bench with a tool well for additional clamping options. Also, you can use that tool well for a bench hook since you'll be pulling the work towards you with the Japanese saws. This is the route I've decided to go in my basement, though I'm as of yet undecided on fixing the bench to the wall.

Thank you Nathan. I probably will screw some vertical wooden stiles to the wall behind the bench, for fastening tool holders. This will leave a gap where I can put bench hooks for pull saws. Thank you for the reminder! I do not want a tool well, rather have the full work surface.

[Oskar Sedell]

We could give you a much better set of options if you could provide us with the overall dimensions of the space. Better yet would be a sketch showing the door location and any obstructions. It would help us help you.

Dave, thanks for joining in! As Warren wrote, the room is 5 by 11 with no obstructions and the door swings out of the room.

[Oskar Sedell]

Warren, thank you for your comment!

Yes, I plan to use saw horses, or a saw bench for breaking down stock. Joinery cuts on the bench. Rotating the board, and cross planing towards the planing stop is a good point. This also relies on a movable bench, when the panels are wider than the bench width. What is your preferred bench width? do you also have your placed along the wall?

[Oskar Sedell]

For the space-challenged person, a smaller bench can work well. Mine is 60". There are a handful of times I require longer, and auxiliary supports handle those times. It's not optimal, but I prefer the extra space; a shorter bench allows me to place mine in the center of my shop floor, so I can access all way round.

Thank you Prashun, agreed, it would be nice to access the bench from all sides. But since the room is so narrow I think it is wiser to put it along the wall, and keeping as much free floor space on one side as possible. Therefore I also want the bench long, since the room accomodates this.

[Paul Sidener]

Hi Oskar, What do plan on building? With space being limited, an 8' bench seems a little large. If you could get by with a 6' bench, it would give you more options.

One thing that would help with storage is a shelf on the work bench.

Moving the bench away from the wall won't make your work any easier. It will be difficult to plane if you move the bench away from the wall. You were thinking of a 2' wide bench, leaving you 3' of space. If you 1 foot from the wall, leaving you 2 feet of space to stand an move. A narrower bench will help, If that would suit the work you are looking to do. Have you considered a Moravian Workbench? It has a narrow top with a tool shelf in back. This would allow you to traverse while planing, without moving the bench away from the wall. The shelf will also help with a little bit of storage with smaller tools.

[Derek Cohen]

Derek, thank you very much for your comment! Good idea about extending the work surface when needed, this I will consider. My plan so far was to keep the bench free standing. I have a sturdy roubo-like construction in mind. This way I can move it if I need to. For example if I want to sleeve something over the end, or occasionally clamp something also from behind. But of course bolting the bench to the wall adds to the stability.

Would you do the "fold-out-part" full length, or just a part in the middle of the bench? Do you think this would interfere with using holdfasts?

Another, higher bench for sharpening and joinery is tempting. I have to see if there is space enough for this. Otherwise I might build a shop stool and/or a moxon/bench on bench for this purpose.

Hi Oskar

I should clarify that my suggestion was just a way to make it easier to build a bench that is attached to the wall and narrower than you planned. I think that you have less space for traversing across a bench than you realise. Traversing forms a smallish part of preparing panels, and adding something that you can flip up or down would maximise your space. A 20" bench along a wall is plenty for jointing and planing faces. My bench is 6'6" long and I really have not felt it was lacking in length. You have a limited amount of space, and more needs to be given to other tasks, such as sawing and joinery.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[John Kananis]

Oskar, assembly will be your real challenge (and forget on working on more than one or two projects at a time). How large scale are you looking to work? If small boxes, etc, then no worries. But, when you get to small end tables and larger, you'll find yourself challenged towards the end of the build. I work in a small space (especially compared to my last shop) - not counting the one side of the garage where the power stuff slumbers - and still keep my bench off the wall. I find it 'confines' me less.

[Oskar Sedell]

Hi Oskar, What do plan on building? With space being limited, an 8' bench seems a little large. If you could get by with a 6' bench, it would give you more options.


Oskar, assembly will be your real challenge (and forget on working on more than one or two projects at a time). How large scale are you looking to work? If small boxes, etc, then no worries. But, when you get to small end tables and larger, you'll find yourself challenged towards the end of the build. I work in a small space (especially compared to my last shop) - not counting the one side of the garage where the power stuff slumbers - and still keep my bench off the wall. I find it 'confines' me less.

Paul and John, thanks for joining in, much appreciated!

Until now I've been forced to stay with small projects; boxes, planemaking and the occasional picture frame. Stepping it up with a shop and a workbench I look forward to wall cabinets, benches and chairs, small tables and so on. Nothing really big, but still furniture size. Assembly will have to move out of the cellar, when the projects doesn't fit on the bench/in the room anymore. In "worst" case I have a good friend with a really big shop where I can be for big projects (like the bench build).

The 8' was my idea of saving space. Instead of multiple workspaces for sharpening, planing and assembly I thought it might be a good idea to make one for all tasks, and keep the rest of the room free. I will have to think this over again, and maybe go down to a 6.5 - 7.5' bench.




One thing that would help with storage is a shelf on the work bench.

Moving the bench away from the wall won't make your work any easier. It will be difficult to plane if you move the bench away from the wall. You were thinking of a 2' wide bench, leaving you 3' of space. If you 1 foot from the wall, leaving you 2 feet of space to stand an move. A narrower bench will help, If that would suit the work you are looking to do. Have you considered a Moravian Workbench? It has a narrow top with a tool shelf in back. This would allow you to traverse while planing, without moving the bench away from the wall. The shelf will also help with a little bit of storage with smaller tools.

Yes, a shelf is planned for. Maybe even with a few drawers below, but otherwise close to the Roubo design to make space for using clamps and holdfasts under the top.

Thanks for the idea of the Moravian bench, so far I did not consider this. I'm however still inclined to a bench to free of a tool tray. With just the narrow top I have the possibility to put it against the wall, with a "lot" of space in front, or to back it out when needed. The foot print of the moravian would always be the same.

[Oskar Sedell]

Derek, thanks again for sharing your thoughts. As I've seen what you've built and posted here on SMC it puts it into perspective that you aren't/wouldn't be limited by a 20'' wide and 6'6'' long bench. I will sit down again with paper and pen and try to fit in a higher bench in addition to the planing bench.

[Warren Mickley]

Oskar, as I worked the last two days, I set up a pair of trestles with a long board that was 2 feet and then 3 feet from the bench to simulate your situation. I don't think you will have any trouble with the narrowness of the shop. I would not go less than 7 1/2 feet for the length of the bench; most people with six foot benches use machinery for stock preparation. Also as you also noted the longer length lets you keep tools on the shelf under the bench and even on the bench if the work doesn't require the length. It could be that you will find a better situation (more room) long before you wear out the bench.

I would go easy on the tool purchases as tool storage and access will be a challenge. Four bench planes instead of fourteen, two or four bar clamps instead of twenty, five handsaws rather than 15, etc.

[William Fretwell]

That's a wonderful picture Warren. Imagine the shavings coming up to your knees before you sweep, talk about being immersed in your work! I especially like it for the trestle leg traditional bench.

[William Fretwell]

If you build a traditional tail vise it can extend 13" thus 'lengthening' your bench a foot when needed instead of the captured vise. A vertical clamp rack on a French cleat can hold many clamps in a small space. You will need the bench off the wall a few inches so you may as well have a tool tray at the back to catch the tools. The extra width will then give your legs more 'stance'. A 20" bench top and 5" tool tray leaves you almost 3 feet to work in which will work. Tool storage under the bench will keep the space over the bench open, a clamp rack on an end wall and you are good to go. I would make a rubber covered thick board to go on your bench for sharpening or as a small shelf in a corner. You can do a lot with very little.

[Oskar Sedell]

Oskar, as I worked the last two days, I set up a pair of trestles with a long board that was 2 feet and then 3 feet from the bench to simulate your situation. I don't think you will have any trouble with the narrowness of the shop. I would not go less than 7 1/2 feet for the length of the bench; most people with six foot benches use machinery for stock preparation. Also as you also noted the longer length lets you keep tools on the shelf under the bench and even on the bench if the work doesn't require the length. It could be that you will find a better situation (more room) long before you wear out the bench.

I would go easy on the tool purchases as tool storage and access will be a challenge. Four bench planes instead of fourteen, two or four bar clamps instead of twenty, five handsaws rather than 15, etc.


Warren. Thanks for taking the time, and thinking about my shop situation. This is very appreciated!

Good to hear your views on bench size. I will do a lot of dimensioning by hand, as hand planes and hand saws is what I have. My bench will be of a knock-down type with tusk tenons. I have to get it into this room, and at some point get it out as well. And yes, one day I might put the bench in a (hopefully) bigger shop.

Tool purchase is always slow for me since money come slow. The planes I use I mostly build myself, which also keeps the number down. I don't see any problems with tool storage. Since I'm about 6'4'' I can comfortably use the walls all the way to the roof as storage.

[Oskar Sedell]

If you build a traditional tail vise it can extend 13" thus 'lengthening' your bench a foot when needed instead of the captured vise. A vertical clamp rack on a French cleat can hold many clamps in a small space. You will need the bench off the wall a few inches so you may as well have a tool tray at the back to catch the tools. The extra width will then give your legs more 'stance'. A 20" bench top and 5" tool tray leaves you almost 3 feet to work in which will work. Tool storage under the bench will keep the space over the bench open, a clamp rack on an end wall and you are good to go. I would make a rubber covered thick board to go on your bench for sharpening or as a small shelf in a corner. You can do a lot with very little.

Thank you William, good to hear your ideas. I use water stones, and I have to come up with a solution for sharpening. Either a small sharpening bench in a corner, or as you suggested, a removable board/tray to put on the bench. A small shelf is not a bad idea either! There is no running water, so it might also be that sharpening, lapping and stone storage has to be located up in the apartment.

[Nicholas Lawrence]

We moved recently, so I have more room than I have ever had. Our last place had a little more space then what you have, but not a lot. I agree with Warren about the length of the bench. I tried to make some larger things on my 6 foot bench, and it is very difficult to get the lumber prepared properly.

For sharpening, I use a dish pan to soak the stones. For sharpening, I use a cookie sheet (a large shallow metal pan with low sides. I put a piece of rubber shelf liner down, and the cookie sheet on that. Another small piece of shelf liner in the pan, which keeps the stone from sliding around. A sink is nice, but you do not need one.

[Peter Christensen]

A suggestion regarding the clamp storage. Since you mentioned your a tall guy, store the clamps horizontally across the ceiling, lengthwise to the room. Two sheets of plywood with full length spacers between will let you slide the bars of the clamps into the slots leaving the heads out. Picture it looking at the end like this IIIIIIIIIII with the bars of the clamps in the spaces. If you mount it lower than the ceiling you would have a shelf above for some storage. With LED tube lights being as thin as an inch and a half you could attach a couple fixtures to the bottom of the clamp rack and not have shadows below. It won't work with short clamps or those with big heads but Bessey K-body types or pipe clamps will. In your tight space you can't rule out the ceiling for storage. ;)

[Jerry Olexa]

Agree with Prashun: Access all around to your bench is to me, Important....One of my best moves in my shop..

[Jason Baker IX]

My shop is 15ft x 5ft -- just a little longer than yours. I have had no problem working on any projects using just hand tools over the past year. My Nicholson bench is 7ft long x 23in wide and it's positioned against one of the long walls. The door to the shop is facing part of the workbench, so it makes the space feel a little bigger. What's nice is that the doorway is wider than a standard door. That lets me move workpieces and materials in and out of the shop easier. My dust collection system is in the adjacent basement room and connected via a hose piped through the wall.

[Oskar Sedell]

We moved recently, so I have more room than I have ever had. Our last place had a little more space then what you have, but not a lot. I agree with Warren about the length of the bench. I tried to make some larger things on my 6 foot bench, and it is very difficult to get the lumber prepared properly.

For sharpening, I use a dish pan to soak the stones. For sharpening, I use a cookie sheet (a large shallow metal pan with low sides. I put a piece of rubber shelf liner down, and the cookie sheet on that. Another small piece of shelf liner in the pan, which keeps the stone from sliding around. A sink is nice, but you do not need one.

Thank you Nicholas! I'm getting more and more convinced not to shorten the bench more than necessary. A cookie sheet is a good suggestion for a sharpening tray. And possibly a bucket of water to lap the stones in.

[Oskar Sedell]

A suggestion regarding the clamp storage. Since you mentioned your a tall guy, store the clamps horizontally across the ceiling, lengthwise to the room. Two sheets of plywood with full length spacers between will let you slide the bars of the clamps into the slots leaving the heads out. Picture it looking at the end like this IIIIIIIIIII with the bars of the clamps in the spaces. If you mount it lower than the ceiling you would have a shelf above for some storage. With LED tube lights being as thin as an inch and a half you could attach a couple fixtures to the bottom of the clamp rack and not have shadows below. It won't work with short clamps or those with big heads but Bessey K-body types or pipe clamps will. In your tight space you can't rule out the ceiling for storage. ;)

Peter thanks for the idea! Your right, the ceiling should not be ruled out for storing tools or wood. So far I've managed without a lot of clamps, but that might change as I move to bigger builds.

[Oskar Sedell]

Agree with Prashun: Access all around to your bench is to me, Important....One of my best moves in my shop..

Jerry, thanks for your comment. I'd love to put my bench in the middle of a room, but as I wrote to Prashun, I assume that putting it along a wall makes better use of this narrow space. As the bench is built I'll try to put it in the middle and see how it works.

[Oskar Sedell]

My shop is 15ft x 5ft -- just a little longer than yours. I have had no problem working on any projects using just hand tools over the past year. My Nicholson bench is 7ft long x 23in wide and it's positioned against one of the long walls. The door to the shop is facing part of the workbench, so it makes the space feel a little bigger. What's nice is that the doorway is wider than a standard door. That lets me move workpieces and materials in and out of the shop easier. My dust collection system is in the adjacent basement room and connected via a hose piped through the wall.

Jason. Great to hear a report from an equally narrow shop. Ever felt that the space in front of the bench was too constrained? Do you have separate benches for sharpening and joinery? How do you use the extra 8' along the wall (at the end/ends of the bench)? If you have pictures from your shop I'd be interested to see your layout and storage solutions!

As my work is with handtools I don't plan on any dust collection system.

[steven c newman]

If you could see the floor plan of my shop..it would look like the letter "F"
At the top of the letter would this area
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I can touch both sides with my elbows..
Looking down the side of the letter..
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I routinely bump the washing machine while working at the end of the bench....dresser is tool storage
As for the short "leg" of the letter
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EVERYTHING is within an arm's reach Bench?
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5' long, have added a rack to hold chisels ad other ready use tools
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The bench with the mitre box is now sitting behind this area.
IF you were to straighten this into a single line....might be a narrow shop..

[James Pallas]

Hello Oskar, I'm a little late to this party but have some things to share. I have 24 inch anti fatigue mats on both sides of my bench and very rarely step off of them. I think in your shop I would be tempted to put a second bench across the end of the shop about 24" deep for an assembly space. Your idea of a 20" bench or even a little less is fine. You need to keep it as a working area. There is nothing more miserable then trying to assemble a chair or something on your bench and then having to move everything to make a new part. Or. Even worse is having to go to an entirely different room to get a mark on a part.
Jim

[Oskar Sedell]

thank you Steven

[Oskar Sedell]

Hello Oskar, I'm a little late to this party but have some things to share. I have 24 inch anti fatigue mats on both sides of my bench and very rarely step off of them. I think in your shop I would be tempted to put a second bench across the end of the shop about 24" deep for an assembly space. Your idea of a 20" bench or even a little less is fine. You need to keep it as a working area. There is nothing more miserable then trying to assemble a chair or something on your bench and then having to move everything to make a new part. Or. Even worse is having to go to an entirely different room to get a mark on a part.
Jim

Hi James, not too late at all. I really enjoy all suggestions so far. Good observation about your mats, another piece of evidence that the room in front of my bench will be enough. Having an assembly space is a good point, and under such a table there would be lots of room for drawers, cabinets or shelves. But maybe I'll make a pair of horses for this need, that can be moved out of the way and double as extensions of the bench when needed.

[Andrey Kharitonkin]

My working area is similar to yours. I measured it and me, my arms and elbows and feet, and my bench fit in slightly less than 5'. It works alright for dimensioning stock using hand tools. And hopefully, you can also chop in the cellar without fear of annoying neighbors (I can't).

My bench is not attached to the wall. It stands about 8" away from the wall. Firstly because I use shooting board across my bench. And secondly because I sometimes cross plane wide (like 1') boards. Hand planes should not bang into the wall during these operations. Thirdly, I use Nobex mitre saw and it has to fit and work across my bench.

My bench is 22.6" wide and 63" long with twin screw end vise and no front wise yet. But it has aprons and a lot of holes for holdfasts. I plan to add front leg vise but it might be also less convenient to use in such narrow room. The good thing about leg vise is that it is usually quite easy to remove sticking out parts (jaw with screw and pin board) when needed. End vise is also used for holding parts for sawing, like tenons or dovetails, while I stand at the end of the bench. Workbench doesn't have tool well.

I usually dry-fit and assemble ready parts in another room.

Storage room better be heated and dry... otherwise, I wouldn't keep there lumber or parts for any time. That's why I occupied third room in my apartment and not storage room in cellar - it has the same temperature/humidity like all other rooms and my cellar is wet and cold.

[Pat Barry]

The room is 5 ft by 11 ft. That includes a doorway. Half of 5 ft is 30 inches. IMO You should keep your bench 65 inches or less by about 24 inches wide. Anything more would be inappropriate for this space and you would not be able to work. There is simply no need for an 8 ft bench in an 11 ft room. You could barely build an 8 ft bench in an 11 ft room.

[Jason Baker IX]

I've never felt constrained by the space in front of my bench. The original workshop bench built by a previous homeowner is at the end (short side) of the room. I'm planning to remove that soon because it just collects dust. I have a Moxon vise that mounts to my workbench if I need to work on dovetails. My sharpening station is a tray which lays inside of one section of a laundry sink in the adjacent basement room. One of the shop walls is covered in pegboard and I'm removing that as well since most of my tools have migrated to a Dutch tool chest. The wall facing the bench is not finished and I took advantage of this by building in lots of shelves. You would be surprised how much stuff is stored on this wall. What you don't see behind me in this photo is 30 clamps in a wall-mounted rack and a lunchbox planer on a cart.
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[Oskar Sedell]

The room is 5 ft by 11 ft. That includes a doorway. Half of 5 ft is 30 inches. IMO You should keep your bench 65 inches or less by about 24 inches wide. Anything more would be inappropriate for this space and you would not be able to work. There is simply no need for an 8 ft bench in an 11 ft room. You could barely build an 8 ft bench in an 11 ft room.

Thanks for joining in Pat. Can you elaborate on why I won't be able to work with a bench longer than 65'' ? Also, I agree that it would be hard to build the bench in this room, but I plan to build it elsewhere. At least the top. Possibly cutting/fine tuning the joinery of the base in my shop.

[Oskar Sedell]

My working area is similar to yours. I measured it and me, my arms and elbows and feet, and my bench fit in slightly less than 5'. It works alright for dimensioning stock using hand tools. And hopefully, you can also chop in the cellar without fear of annoying neighbors (I can't).

My bench is not attached to the wall. It stands about 8" away from the wall. Firstly because I use shooting board across my bench. And secondly because I sometimes cross plane wide (like 1') boards. Hand planes should not bang into the wall during these operations. Thirdly, I use Nobex mitre saw and it has to fit and work across my bench.

My bench is 22.6" wide and 63" long with twin screw end vise and no front wise yet. But it has aprons and a lot of holes for holdfasts. I plan to add front leg vise but it might be also less convenient to use in such narrow room. The good thing about leg vise is that it is usually quite easy to remove sticking out parts (jaw with screw and pin board) when needed. End vise is also used for holding parts for sawing, like tenons or dovetails, while I stand at the end of the bench. Workbench doesn't have tool well.

I usually dry-fit and assemble ready parts in another room.

Storage room better be heated and dry... otherwise, I wouldn't keep there lumber or parts for any time. That's why I occupied third room in my apartment and not storage room in cellar - it has the same temperature/humidity like all other rooms and my cellar is wet and cold.

Thank you Andrey! I think and hope that chopping and other loud activities will work. This I have to clear this with the neighbours before doing anything else. Did you post pictures of your shop on SMC somewhere? I'd be interested to see your workspace!

Regarding wood storage, this I have to check as well and invest in a dehumidifier if needed. I don't think the cellar is too moist.

[Oskar Sedell]

I've never felt constrained by the space in front of my bench. The original workshop bench built by a previous homeowner is at the end (short side) of the room. I'm planning to remove that soon because it just collects dust. I have a Moxon vise that mounts to my workbench if I need to work on dovetails. My sharpening station is a tray which lays inside of one section of a laundry sink in the adjacent basement room. One of the shop walls is covered in pegboard and I'm removing that as well since most of my tools have migrated to a Dutch tool chest. The wall facing the bench is not finished and I took advantage of this by building in lots of shelves. You would be surprised how much stuff is stored on this wall. What you don't see behind me in this photo is 30 clamps in a wall-mounted rack and a lunchbox planer on a cart.


Thanks a lot Jason! Looks like you managed a lot with your small shop, and still have some free space.

[Pat Barry]

I find that there are times when it is better to work at the ends of the bench, not just the front. I figure you need about 2 1/2 feet, minimum, at each end or side you expect to work at.

What type of projects do you intend for your shop? Certainly making boxes of various types, carving work, small furniture pieces, etc. Why do you feel you need an 8 ft bench?

Will you have an end vise? Are you going to break down larger boards (more than maybe 7 ft) somewhere else? I have a 5ft by 2ft bench, it could easily have been bigger, but I don't recall ever feeling like it was too short / small. On the other hand, open floor space, that I could really use.

[Brian Holcombe]

My biggest complaint with my current bench is that I made it too short (6'). When I build another (provided some spare time at some future unknown point) it will be 8' long and 22" wide.

You might consider using a planing beam and heavy saw horses rather than a bench. You can knock the assembly down and move it out of the way if you need the space temporarily. A bench can be moved as well, but not as easily, especially so in the current trend of 6" thick bench tops.

[Nicholas Lawrence]

You need some space on each end of the bench (the plane has to start and finish somewhere) but the issue I have had with a 6' bench is trying to prepare longer stock. The stock really needs to be supported in its entirety if you are trying flatten and square it. If part of it is hanging off the end, it will want to flex, you will have trouble figuring out a way to hold it properly, etc. If someone is sure they are never going to try to build a dining room table, a long sitting bench, a bed, a tall shelf, etc., then by all means they do not need a longer bench. Likewise if you are doing most of the preparation with power tools. But trying to do any significant preparation of longer stock with hand tools it will be difficult if you have two or three feet hanging off the bench.

[Derek Cohen]

Bench length is an interesting topic.

I suppose that, given the space, one will want to build as big as one can. 8 foot? I'd love the space to have a bench that length.

My previous bench, up until 5 years ago, was just 5 foot. I used it for 20 years. It was subject to many modifications over the years - changing vises and adding stops, etc. It was lightly built and clamped it to the wall for rigidity. While small by most standards, it survived many builds, and some of them large.

My current bench, a Roubo-style, was built 5 years ago. It is 6'6" long and 22" wide, and set 12" away from the wall. It is extremely heavy, being Jarrah and Oak, and it is not viable to move it back-and-forth. The point is, one either has a bench against the wall, or out from the wall. Do not expect to move it back-and-forth, especially if you build storage underneath.

Oskar, I probably have as much working space as you will have when working with hand tools. I have a double garage, but there machines shoehorned into half (my car still needs to park in the garage at night as it is a ragtop). The bottom line is this - build bigger if you are able, but I have not felt restricted by the size of my bench or the limits of the space around it. I have built a fair number of medium-large pieces of furniture.

What makes a difference is that the space works for you. I have a dedicated area for sharpening - not only my stones, but a grinder as well. I can leave the stones up and ready. I do not have to tidy a space on the bench for a tray that is kept under the bench. I have an area where I can use a shooting board or a sharpen a saw without disturbing the bench. I keep the workspace tidy - all the time. I avoid tripping over shavings, tools, and offcuts. I store tools at arms length, mostly on the wall, and this keeps them off the bench as well. I do wonder how much space on the average 8 foot bench is available to use, and how much is "storage".

https://s19.postimg.org/z6iwp9j1f/8_zps2cbbd7a2.jpg

To the left:

https://s19.postimg.org/n0tpev4bn/AWRentrysmall.jpg

To the right:

https://s19.postimg.org/kngd1lfab/Sharpening_Centre1.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Oskar Sedell]

Pat. I don't have any strict plan on what to build on my bench and in my shop. But I want it capable of building many things, not just boxes and hope not to feel limited by my use of shop space or the size of the bench.

To start with I will not install an end or tail vise. And yes, rough cutting of boards might or will happen outside of the shop.

[Oskar Sedell]

You need some space on each end of the bench (the plane has to start and finish somewhere) but the issue I have had with a 6' bench is trying to prepare longer stock. The stock really needs to be supported in its entirety if you are trying flatten and square it. If part of it is hanging off the end, it will want to flex, you will have trouble figuring out a way to hold it properly, etc. If someone is sure they are never going to try to build a dining room table, a long sitting bench, a bed, a tall shelf, etc., then by all means they do not need a longer bench. Likewise if you are doing most of the preparation with power tools. But trying to do any significant preparation of longer stock with hand tools it will be difficult if you have two or three feet hanging off the bench.

Thanks for sharing your experience with preparing long boards. As previously noted, I'd like to be able to build long/high stuff when I feel like it, hence I still feel like my original plan for a long bench is a good one.

[Oskar Sedell]

My biggest complaint with my current bench is that I made it too short (6'). When I build another (provided some spare time at some future unknown point) it will be 8' long and 22" wide.

You might consider using a planing beam and heavy saw horses rather than a bench. You can knock the assembly down and move it out of the way if you need the space temporarily. A bench can be moved as well, but not as easily, especially so in the current trend of 6" thick bench tops.

Brian, thank you for adding your thoughts. I started dreaming of a bigger and better planing beam than my current one. Then I wanted to add holes for holdfasts. Then I thought a lot about how to attach the beam to the horses in a sturdy way. And how I would plane panel edges. You see where its going; my plan was suddenly a pretty classic workbench. I'm attracted to the thought of a very solid work surface.

[Oskar Sedell]

...

Oskar, I probably have as much working space as you will have when working with hand tools. I have a double garage, but there machines shoehorned into half (my car still needs to park in the garage at night as it is a ragtop). The bottom line is this - build bigger if you are able, but I have not felt restricted by the size of my bench or the limits of the space around it. I have built a fair number of medium-large pieces of furniture.

What makes a difference is that the space works for you. I have a dedicated area for sharpening - not only my stones, but a grinder as well. I can leave the stones up and ready. I do not have to tidy a space on the bench for a tray that is kept under the bench. I have an area where I can use a shooting board or a sharpen a saw without disturbing the bench. I keep the workspace tidy - all the time. I avoid tripping over shavings, tools, and offcuts. I store tools at arms length, mostly on the wall, and this keeps them off the bench as well. I do wonder how much space on the average 8 foot bench is available to use, and how much is "storage".

...

Regards from Perth

Derek

Derek, thanks again for sharing your thoughts. This is what I need to find out, how to use the room in way that suits me and my work.

[Mike Baker 2]

I've been reading this thread, and learned a lot, so thanks to everyone involved.
Oskar, I don't have a shop, or to put it more correctly, my shop is my back yard.. So room is not an issue. But I still chose a 5 foot bench, mainly because I was limited by my supply of wood. But also because I had no clue what I might be building, and no practical idea of what I wanted or needed in a bench. I thought, keep it simple; just a simple bench. I can get into specifics with my next bench, after I've had the experience to know what I really need.
If I were you and could swing it, I'd build a simple, reasonably small bench from inexpensive wood(pine construction lumber?), 5 or 6 ft., and work it for a few months. Save the good wood to build a permanent bench, after you know what you need and what working in the space you have dictates.
MHO, and I know I'm a new guy, but that would be my approach.

[Oskar Sedell]

I've been reading this thread, and learned a lot, so thanks to everyone involved.
Oskar, I don't have a shop, or to put it more correctly, my shop is my back yard.. So room is not an issue. But I still chose a 5 foot bench, mainly because I was limited by my supply of wood. But also because I had no clue what I might be building, and no practical idea of what I wanted or needed in a bench. I thought, keep it simple; just a simple bench. I can get into specifics with my next bench, after I've had the experience to know what I really need.
If I were you and could swing it, I'd build a simple, reasonably small bench from inexpensive wood(pine construction lumber?), 5 or 6 ft., and work it for a few months. Save the good wood to build a permanent bench, after you know what you need and what working in the space you have dictates.
MHO, and I know I'm a new guy, but that would be my approach.

Hi Mike, thanks for your comment! I agree with you to keep it simple, and not expensive. I can't afford fancy timber for my bench. But I'll build it to the size I want and I think it will stand strong for a long time.

[Bill McDermott]

Oskar, I am also tall and worked with a similar arrangement. I encourage you to be thoughtful about the ceiling space. I got tremendous use from it. One suggestion, to avoid rearranging things... fit small items in small spaces. Reserve the long, free spaces for larger things you have yet to acquire.

[Oskar Sedell]

Oskar, I am also tall and worked with a similar arrangement. I encourage you to be thoughtful about the ceiling space. I got tremendous use from it. One suggestion, to avoid rearranging things... fit small items in small spaces. Reserve the long, free spaces for larger things you have yet to acquire.

Thanks for your advice Bill! I really look forward to get the key to the place and to start setting it all up!

[John Sanford]

Hi all,

looking for advice on using the space in a very small hand tool only shop.
...
Looking forward to your comments and suggestions.

Oskar

Check out Jim Tolpin's shop. https://www.byhandandeye.com/tour-of-jims-handtool-only-shop/

[Oskar Sedell]

Check out Jim Tolpin's shop. https://www.byhandandeye.com/tour-of-jims-handtool-only-shop/

Thanks John. A shop with a fireplace would be a dream. Maybe in the future!

[Oskar Sedell]

Thought I should update this thread. I moved a couple a months ago, and have been spending a lot of time making the cellar a usable workspace. Today I finished the workbench, a tusk-tenoned knock-down "roubo" with trestle in beech and a doug fir top. About 7.5' long and 20'' wide. Double planing stops for push and pull planes and a leg vise.

371651

sharpening corner:

371652

and a panorama view:

371653

[Bill Houghton]

The working space in front of my bench is about two feet; I can make it work, but three feet would be easier. Maybe if I cleaned up the shop...

[Warren Mickley]

This is terrific, Oskar. I had envisioned the workbench on the opposite wall with the tail end next to the door, but this is definitely workable. The window is a bonus. Thanks for getting back to us.

[James Pallas]

Looking good Oscar. Nice looking bench too.
Jim

[Jerry Olexa]

Very efficient use of space...Nice work..

[Oskar Sedell]

This is terrific, Oskar. I had envisioned the workbench on the opposite wall with the tail end next to the door, but this is definitely workable. The window is a bonus. Thanks for getting back to us.

I did too, from my first visit I had the false memory that the door opened the other way. Hence I had to change plans when actually moving in, to allow for a little longer bench.

The window is a bonus, although its below ground level and thus offers very little light.

[Oskar Sedell]

Looking good Oscar. Nice looking bench too.
Jim

Thanks James!

[Oskar Sedell]

Very efficient use of space...Nice work..

thanks Jerry. I don't have much choice. Still have to figure out a lot about wood storing, dehumidifier placement and such.

[Shawn Pixley]

Beautiful job! I could see myself working there. Enjoy!

[Oskar Sedell]

Beautiful job! I could see myself working there. Enjoy!

thank you Shawn! I most certainly will :) Been looking forward to this a long time.

[Scott Winter]

I must say... excellent job with the bench and small amount of space! You give me hope when I setup my new shop in the basement of my house. I'll be putting up a partition wall in my finished basement that'll give me an 8x17ft space.

[Oskar Sedell]

thanks Scott! I dream about having 8 by 17 to play with :) Hope you share some pics when you get your shop put together!

[bridger berdel]

The working space in front of my bench is about two feet; I can make it work, but three feet would be easier. Maybe if I cleaned up the shop...

I've seen your shop, Bill. You're going to have to do a bit more than tidy up (tiny shop, full of stuff).