New Hammer K3 Winner won't power up....looking for help.

[scott vroom]

I connected a 240V plug to the saw motor wire and plugged it into a hot recepticle....nothing happened. The blade guard is in place and locked, the emergency stop button is in the ready position. Felder provided zero electrical troubleshooting documentation. I called tech support, they were very busy and would try to call tomorrow.

Any thoughts on what the problem might be? Maybe I've overlooked a safety switch or reset button somewhere on the saw?

[Erik Loza]

Are you pressing and holding the start button in for a few seconds when you do that? Not just "pressing once", if you get my meaning?

Erik

[Andy Giddings]

Scott, any buzzing sound coming from the machine when the start is pressed would indicate that one of the safety micro-switches is open (although on a K3 I'm guessing there is only one)

[Brad Shipton]

There is a safety switch on the guard you open to access the blade. The machine will not turn on if this is not in the middle. I had to call about that. My machine is older, but I am assuming they are still the same.

[Chris Parks]

The safety guard switch is a right royal pain to get in exactly the correct position on a K3. I have played with mine a few times and it is now easier to locate the middle position but I believe every single one is the same.

[Mark Carlson]

Are you sure the stop button is in the correct position? This tripped me up when I tried to start my A3-31 the 1st time. That and holding the start button for a few seconds. Good luck.

[scott vroom]

Chris and Brad nailed it. Tech support returned my call and the guy new immediately what the problem was: Page 24 of the user's manual says that for the saw to operate the safety guard knob "must be pushed all the way up". That's inaccurate...the knob must be in the middle position. But it doesn't say that. Tech support guy say he gets a lot of calls on that. Unless you're looking for a middle position it's easily overlooked, particularly when the instruction is to push it all the way up. Felder probably printed thousands of user guides and aren't going to correct the misprint until the next revision. Hopefully someone else will read this thread and avoid all the cussin' and head scratchin'.

Thanks to all for offering help :)

[John TenEyck]

If they had the owner's manual online it would be easy to update/correct. I would expect better from a company selling machines in that price range.

John

[Mike Henderson]

If they had the owner's manual online it would be easy to update/correct. I would expect better from a company selling machines in that price range.

John

Amen. And not only that, but people who are interested in the machine would probably like to read the manual to see how everything works before making a purchase decision.

Mike

[Jim Andrew]

Do you have your blades yet? I ordered 3 from Carbide Processors. A 12" rip blade, a 10" plywood blade, 80 tooth, and a solid wood blade, also 80 tooth. Best blades I have ever had, Tenryu brand. Asked if they had a dado drilled for the Felder Hammer, they tried to sell me one with a 5/8" arbor.

[Dan Friedrichs]

If they had the owner's manual online it would be easy to update/correct. I would expect better from a company selling machines in that price range.

John

You would think. The manual for my C3-31 has a whole page they forgot to translate from German. Pretty sloppy thing to overlook...

[scott vroom]

Felder threw in an upgraded silent power silver universal rip blade...it's PDN. I've got several Forrest and Ridge blades that I'm going to send in for 30mm boring. I'll look at the Carbide Processors as well....thanks for the input.

[scott vroom]

You would think. The manual for my C3-31 has a whole page they forgot to translate from German. Pretty sloppy thing to overlook...

The sales rep told me that the high end Felder & Format machines get the majority the factory's attention, as well they should. I suspect they view Hammer as a lower margin commodity and support it accordingly. I've been disappointed at the sketchy support from sales and the Delaware shipping location....a number of miscues and mistakes, lost time. The sales rep has never used a table saw, let along a euro. But all that will be soon forgotten if the tool is as impressive as advertised.

[Rod Sheridan]

Glad you got it running.

The reason for the extra position on the interlock is that on the B3's, down unlocks the saw cover, middle locks the saw cover and shaper access door and up unlocks the shaper door.

So yes, middle position is locked and don't forget to hold the start button until the machine is up to speed (There's no centrifugal switch in the motor)..........Rod.

[John TenEyck]

The sales rep told me that the high end Felder & Format machines get the majority the factory's attention, as well they should. I suspect they view Hammer as a lower margin commodity and support it accordingly. I've been disappointed at the sketchy support from sales and the Delaware shipping location....a number of miscues and mistakes, lost time. The sales rep has never used a table saw, let along a euro. But all that will be soon forgotten if the tool is as impressive as advertised.

I guess business is good when you can conciously ignore a portion of your customers. In the long run that usually self corrects.

[Joel Wesseling]

I get My K3 Next week. I cant say enough positive things about the support and sales knowledge from my Canadian Outlet.

Only issue is have to spend money on new blades. don't know where I can get my 5/8 blades bored out around here.

[scott vroom]

Joel, send a PM to Rod Sheridan, he's a Canadian member on SMC also from Toronto and I know that he had his blades bored for his new Hammer.

[Joel Wesseling]

Thanks Scott. I PM'd Rod.

Hopefully 6 Freud and several other 10" blades can be salvaged for a decent price for the modification.

[Tom Bain]

FYI -- Forest sells the Dado King with a Felder-compatible bore.

[Rod Sheridan]

Joel, send a PM to Rod Sheridan, he's a Canadian member on SMC also from Toronto and I know that he had his blades bored for his new Hammer.

Thanks Scott, Joel did contact me.........Rod.

[Donna Wynne]

Dittos, Mike. I thought by now, all responsible mfg'rs make their owners' manuals available online. Regardless, they should have produced "errata" stickers for the printed manuals -- even if they don't want to do a complete print run to fix the needed corrections. It's my understand that at least some of the Felder machinery manuals are available through the Felder Owners Group site, but I suspect, alas, it's no thanks to our friends at the Felder Gruppe.

[Mike Stelts]

It turns out the error in the B3 manual is a double-edged sword... I just bought a 2016 B3 for $2500, because we couldn't get it started. I decided I'd take the chance and figure it out at home. Thanks to Creekers, I solved the problem with this post have a great machine at a great price.

[Dan Friedrichs]

Wow, congrats, Mike!!

[Jim Becker]

It turns out the error in the B3 manual is a double-edged sword... I just bought a 2016 B3 for $2500, because we couldn't get it started. I decided I'd take the chance and figure it out at home. Thanks to Creekers, I solved the problem with this post have a great machine at a great price.

Congrats, Mike! Very nice you were able to find something like that for sure!

[Mike Stelts]

I couldn't believe the serendipity. I had just priced a B3 and was waiting on an ST4 quote before deciding my favorite placing the order. Now, I'll inch my way up to the new price by decking it out with accessories. Thanks for showing me your saw, Jim. You "slid" me over the edge on my decision to get one.

[Curt Harms]

If they had the owner's manual online it would be easy to update/correct. I would expect better from a company selling machines in that price range.

John

Or even do a loose insert. It would probably pay them in reduced support calls.

[Curt Harms]

Amen. And not only that, but people who are interested in the machine would probably like to read the manual to see how everything works before making a purchase decision.

Mike

That's what I did with my Jet J/P, read the manual and watched some videos. I had never laid hands on one before the crate was in the garage but things were fairly familiar.

[Mike Stelts]

I just checked the 2016 Hammer B3 user manual (pg. 24) and the online version (pg. 27). In fact, they both state that the safety break switch must be in the center position. I overlooked this subtlety. My conclusion: It's in the manual; but, it could be written more clearly.

[Jim Becker]

Mike, I knew that once you fondled a slider, you'd find one! :)

[Michael Drew]

Hu....safety switch half way position.

I'll try this, after I get the dam control unit put back together. I've been chasing current and continuity with my Fluke for hours now. Figured I screwed something up when I swapped out the short cord with a longer one.

This thing has two rather large fuses. Mine were just dangling in the cabinet. They have a threaded stud on the bottom, for mounting. Why would Felder not mount them, verse have them just daggling in the cabinet?

[Dan Friedrichs]

Hu....safety switch half way position.

I'll try this, after I get the dam control unit put back together. I've been chasing current and continuity with my Fluke for hours now. Figured I screwed something up when I swapped out the short cord with a longer one.

This thing has two rather large fuses. Mine were just dangling in the cabinet. They have a threaded stud on the bottom, for mounting. Why would Felder not mount them, verse have them just daggling in the cabinet?

Are you sure they're fuses? Can you post a picture?

[Michael Drew]

No, I'm not sure they are fuses. I think they are capacitors now.

After moving the safety switch to the "middle" position, I can now hear the motor relay engage, but the motor will not start. Doesn't matter if I hold the button in either. All I hear is vibration, or maybe humming?

[Dan Friedrichs]

Should be easy enough to see if you have current going to the motor. The humming you hear may just be the relay coil.

On my C3, those 2 capacitors are zip-tied to some part of the front frame.

[Robyn Horton]

Also make sure the Red Emergency Stop button on the side under the slider is in the out position. If that is in it won't start

[Chris Parks]

Also make sure the Red Emergency Stop button on the side under the slider is in the out position. If that is in it won't start

Not to confuse things but my K3 does not have a red safety switch but being three phase may be the reason for that. I played with altering the tension on the isolation switch until I found it to be easier to detect the centre position.

[Michael Drew]

I found two zip ties. The caps must have just came out during transport. Thanks for noting that, or I'd have not found them. Had to fit my fat head into the machine to see them.....

The problem was an OE terminal adaptor in the motor connector that plugs into the box where the power button and electronics are housed. A trip to NAPA and I was able to find one that would fit. Starts up fine now. I have not ever heard one of these machines run, or stop. It is normal to hear humming after I stop the machine? Mine hums for a few seconds after the blade comes to a stop.

[Jacques Gagnon]

Michael,

The hum you are referring to is likely the brake for the blade. The hum lasts a few seconds and then disappears.

It seems just like last week when your first post enquiring about the saw - time flies😁!

Regards,

J.

[Dan Friedrichs]

Congrats on getting it working!

As Jacques said, the buzzing is the brake and is normal.

Also make sure that when turning the motor on, you hold the button down until the blade is up to full speed - the motor doesn't have a centrifugal switch (like typical induction motors) and instead relies on you holding the button then releasing it a few seconds later to engage/disengage the starting winding.

[Michael Drew]

Michael,

The hum you are referring to is likely the brake for the blade. The hum lasts a few seconds and then disappears.

It seems just like last week when your first post enquiring about the saw - time flies!

Regards,

J.

Yah, time doesn't stop. It's only been about 8 months since I started thinking about buying one of these things. I'm in the process of deciding if I'm going to work off the front fence, or the rear fence. Or maybe just use both. :)

Appreciate all the help you've given me on this thing Jacques.


Congrats on getting it working!

As Jacques said, the buzzing is the brake and is normal.

Also make sure that when turning the motor on, you hold the button down until the blade is up to full speed - the motor doesn't have a centrifugal switch (like typical induction motors) and instead relies on you holding the button then releasing it a few seconds later to engage/disengage the starting winding.

Thank you. It seems to spin up pretty quick. Definitely not seconds.... Wonder if mine is different?

I took a couple pics in case someone else runs into a similar problem.

Motor quick disconnect plug, box side (not sure exactly what it's called). This is actually on the "lid" of the box where the one/off button is mounted. The black thing is the back side of the on/off button. The white thing next to the on/off button is the offending quick disconnect plug for the motor.

488930

Bad/damaged connector. It was not fully set into the motor quick disconnect.

488931

Electronics/electrical box removed.

488933

One of the two capacitors. Could not get a pic of the second one.

488934

[Dan Friedrichs]

It seems to spin up pretty quick. Definitely not seconds.... Wonder if mine is different?

With a 10" blade, it does come up pretty quick (probably <1s). But if you put a 12" blade on it, you'll notice it takes longer.