ALUM354 Black/Gold Laserable aluminum issues

[Steve Utick]

I've got a sheet of ALUM354 from JDS Industries here. Been trying to get it to engrave to a good gold color on my 100watt laser, but having no such luck. I can either blow through the gold and expose the underlying silver color of the aluminum, or the black doesn't come off. Can't seem to get anything in between. I did the same job on my smaller 40 watt laser, and can get a decent result however. But, working on a job that's bigger than the table on my 40 watt. Has anyone had any luck with this material, and if so, what settings, etc. did you use to get it to actually look gold when done?

Thanks.

[Kev Williams]

I quit using that stuff around 2 years ago because of that problem. I get mine from Marco, the masking says "Laser*It", but I suspect it may be the same stuff.. When I first started buying it I was very pleased with it, the gold was nice and gold, and I liked NOT having to buy laser-steel (or RAZOR-steel may be more fitting). Then one day I started on a new batch and I seriously thought I grabbed a sheet of silver by mistake.

Nope.

If you engrave each, side by side you can tell the difference, but only barely. The gold simply looks silver with a touch of a gold hue.

I complained, traded what I bought in on some Laser Steel, and about 6 months later I bought another sheet to see if the 'bad batch' was used up.

Nope. And there's no settings that will make it any gold-er that I've found. It just plain ain't gold enough...

And I bought another sheet 6 months after that, same thing.

I hate Laser Steel, but at least it's gold. And unless another mfr. makes a better gold-aluminum, I'm afraid you're stuck with Laser Steel too...

[Ross Moshinsky]

JDS has laser power settings to start with. We use this material with both our 30 and 60 watt lasers with positive results
https://shop.jdsindustries.com/site_images/PDFS/Laser_Power_Speed_Settings.pdf

[Steve Utick]

I quit using that stuff around 2 years ago because of that problem. I get mine from Marco, the masking says "Laser*It", but I suspect it may be the same stuff.. When I first started buying it I was very pleased with it, the gold was nice and gold, and I liked NOT having to buy laser-steel (or RAZOR-steel may be more fitting). Then one day I started on a new batch and I seriously thought I grabbed a sheet of silver by mistake.


I hate Laser Steel, but at least it's gold. And unless another mfr. makes a better gold-aluminum, I'm afraid you're stuck with Laser Steel too...

I'm not near the metal at the moment, so don't remember if it's the Laser*It or not. Will have to check. What is the part number for the laser steel from Marco? Looking at their catalog, but don't see anything called that, so not sure of the exact metal you are talking about.

[Steve Utick]

JDS has laser power settings to start with. We use this material with both our 30 and 60 watt lasers with positive results
https://shop.jdsindustries.com/site_images/PDFS/Laser_Power_Speed_Settings.pdf

That's where I started at, but at those powers, it just blows right through the gold. Their powers work out to about 24 watts or so, but I'm at 7.6 watts and 550 mm/s on my 40 watt laser to get anything that's remotely usable when done. Not sure in what world they were using 24 watts, I can't get anywhere close to that on my machine.

[Tim Bateson]

I 2nd the "Laser-It" product. Great product.

[Kev Williams]

I'm not near the metal at the moment, so don't remember if it's the Laser*It or not. Will have to check. What is the part number for the laser steel from Marco? Looking at their catalog, but don't see anything called that, so not sure of the exact metal you are talking about. 2017 catalog, top of page 37, the 'laserable aluminum' section it's the H116-21, 'black, lasers GOLD'-- 'Laser*IT"s brand name is just below on the same page--

[Kev Williams]

For the record, I love Laser*it, just not their gold/black aluminum!

I'll show ya why---
Here I have 3 pieces of trophy stock, the 2 Laser*it's and small piece of Lasersteel...
362030

Opposite side- Because they only print what it is in one place,
I do (did) this on the backs so I knew the gold from silver...
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I ran a laser test of each, all at 40% power and 75% speed, on my 40w LS900...
These are the results. Top is Lasersteel, middle is gold, bottom silver...
Can you tell any difference between the gold and silver in this pic?
362032

A closer-up shot reveals a hint of gold now...
362033

When you get the light just right, it does somewhat resemble gold... :)
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However, I can't sell this to anyone because chances are the light's not always going to be right...

I haven't bought this stuff in over a year, maybe 2 years. It USED to plenty gold, but 3 different buys over the course of more than a year gave me results you see here. I can't sell gold that's not...

If it's better now, I'll gladly start buying it again :D

[Ross Moshinsky]

Aluminum leaves a residue on the material that's more obvious than on steel. Wipe it off with polishing compound and it will be gold. Steel comes out "golder" but I've found the pros of Aluminum outweigh the cons.

[Steve Utick]

2017 catalog, top of page 37, the 'laserable aluminum' section it's the H116-21, 'black, lasers GOLD'-- 'Laser*IT"s brand name is just below on the same page--

Thank you sir. That's the one I thought it was. I'll give some of that a try. The results from your test definitely look much better than what I'm seeing with the current metal I have.
Appreciate the insight and advice.

[Kev Williams]

Aluminum leaves a residue on the material that's more obvious than on steel. Wipe it off with polishing compound and it will be gold.
With all due respect my friend, no, it won't :)

second round of testing-- settings as they say, 500dpi both directions
--this is as it came off the machine, no air, no buffing-
Almost looks like the Cermark settings are right...?
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This is after hitting it with Mothers mag polish. I wiped it hard enough it etched the black coating...
You can see from the thumbnails that THIS one appears more gold. But it's only because the ash
was still covering the plate in the pic above (I did wipe yesterday's samples down, just not with polish)
362095
The only hint of suitable gold here is what's showing under the black in the 20 power version.
But just a slight increase in power density and it's gone...

It's nothing I'm doing, fact is there is simply something wrong with this batch I got. I was very happy with this gold, probably 20 sheets worth before
the bad started showing up.

[Steve Utick]

2017 catalog, top of page 37, the 'laserable aluminum' section it's the H116-21, 'black, lasers GOLD'-- 'Laser*IT"s brand name is just below on the same page--

Argh. So, I ordered 6 sheets of H116-21 from Marco for this project. Got the box, opened it up, and it's Laser*IT metal that they sent. :-\ So, I guess I have to call them tomorrow and see if I can get the actual H116-21 that you showed that actually works.

[Kev Williams]

you got the right stuff, check the back, it should say 'LASER BLACK-GOLD ALUMINUM' in black dot matrix lettering. And that writing is the only way you can tell it apart from the 'engraves silver' stuff, which is why I covered the back of my gold sheets with yellow highlighter G's...

I'm curious how it works-- and oh yeah, there will a manufacture date on the back-- I just bought some silver that was made in 2014...

[Steve Utick]

you got the right stuff, check the back, it should say 'LASER BLACK-GOLD ALUMINUM' in black dot matrix lettering. And that writing is the only way you can tell it apart from the 'engraves silver' stuff, which is why I covered the back of my gold sheets with yellow highlighter G's...

I'm curious how it works-- and oh yeah, there will a manufacture date on the back-- I just bought some silver that was made in 2014...


OK, I guess I'm confused now. I thought that you said the Laser*IT was the stuff that didn't work well, and came out Silver instead of gold? This is a pic of the front and back of the stuff I got from Marco. Is this the same as what you were calling Laser Steel that engraves to a good gold?

Thanks for your assistance.

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[Tony Lenkic]

Steve,

You may have received wrong product but it is marked on the back correctly. Could it be that you are overpowering it. Try less power or faster speed on a test grid.
JDS is another source you can order from. Couple of products show in their catalog.

JDS P/N is ALUM621 (black lasers gold) or another produce ultra aluminum P/N ULT203 (Gloss black aluminum lasers gold).

[Kev Williams]

Oh man... My apologies, I just went back upwards and re-read your original question, and somehow I missed 'lasersteel'... Now I feel bad!

I'm sure Marco will take it back but I feel bad for having you order the wrong material...

The laser STEEL is on the next page, 38 (2017 catalog) bottom of the page 'brass plated steel engraving stock' - part number H125-2 --

HOWEVER-- As penance for my goof, I'll buy one sheet of the gold you DID get, specifically for you to try out.
I'll even cover your shipping costs to ship the other back if it doesn't come out gold enough and you end up buying the lasersteel.

This way, you can see if it works before you send it all back. I'm curious to see if it DOES work now, I'm hoping LaserIt was aware of the problem and resolved it!

[Steve Utick]

Oh man... My apologies, I just went back upwards and re-read your original question, and somehow I missed 'lasersteel'... Now I feel bad!

I'm sure Marco will take it back but I feel bad for having you order the wrong material...

The laser STEEL is on the next page, 38 (2017 catalog) bottom of the page 'brass plated steel engraving stock' - part number H125-2 --

HOWEVER-- As penance for my goof, I'll buy one sheet of the gold you DID get, specifically for you to try out.
I'll even cover your shipping costs to ship the other back if it doesn't come out gold enough and you end up buying the lasersteel.

This way, you can see if it works before you send it all back. I'm curious to see if it DOES work now, I'm hoping LaserIt was aware of the problem and resolved it!

Sometimes, it's so easy to misread messages, e-mail, etc. The one disadvantage of electronic communications sometimes. Hopefully, I'll have some time to try some tests today, and will let you know what I find out.

[Steve Utick]

Oh man... My apologies, I just went back upwards and re-read your original question, and somehow I missed 'lasersteel'... Now I feel bad!

I'm sure Marco will take it back but I feel bad for having you order the wrong material...

The laser STEEL is on the next page, 38 (2017 catalog) bottom of the page 'brass plated steel engraving stock' - part number H125-2 --

HOWEVER-- As penance for my goof, I'll buy one sheet of the gold you DID get, specifically for you to try out.
I'll even cover your shipping costs to ship the other back if it doesn't come out gold enough and you end up buying the lasersteel.

This way, you can see if it works before you send it all back. I'm curious to see if it DOES work now, I'm hoping LaserIt was aware of the problem and resolved it!

OK, got a chance to fool around with this a bit this afternoon. On my 100 watt machine, even dropping down to 8 watts, and 600mm/s speed, it's blowing right through the gold. You can see some small remnants of gold in the test letters, and some halo of gold around the edges, but the centers of everything are very much silver. Not sure how low I'd have to go to try and leave some gold, but the 100 watt laser won't fire under about 8, so can't go any lower with that machine. So, looks like I'll call Marco and see if I can exchange this for some of the LaserSteel tomorrow, and stay far away from the Black/Gold Laser*IT Metal in the future....

[Kev Williams]

I was hoping for better news....

checking my photo archives, I do have evidence this stuff was once pretty good---

first pic, this is laser steel, as the plate says, in 2005. I don't even think they had gold laserable aluminum back then,
I know I was happy they had ANY laserable metals back then! A giveaway that it's not aluminum is, you can't
see the edge, because it's so thin...

362526

Below is a plaque I made with a good version of the gold aluminum-- I have some weird background reflections
going on that over-brighten some of the plate, but the logo and the big lettering, and many places
around the border are MUCH more gold color than the bad version, and is pretty close to on par with the steel.
And along the left edge the thicker, silver edge is visible...
362527

I would have hoped what's being sold these days would more resemble this plate...

[Steve Utick]

I was hoping for better news....

I would have hoped what's being sold these days would more resemble this plate...

I was certainly hoping for a better outcome as well. I can't see how vendors can sell a couple of the different black to gold metals I've tried. I can't see how anyone can get any kind of good output from them at all at this point. Really makes me worry about any of the colors to gold that different vendors have, and apprehensive to try and market any of that to my customers. Colors to silver yes, anything else.... Maybe not....