Lesson Learned: Ordering Glass

[andrew whicker]

I ordered some tempered .25" thick glass for a coffee table. The coffee table design has a small shelf and a large top.

The glass shop etched in their logo on the small piece. Apparently, since the glass was small the company assumed it was for a window and intentionally etched their logo on the glass.

Not a huge deal, they'll re-cut the glass for free.

Anyway, be sure to spec out 'no logo' or something similar to avoid this problem.

Cheers,

[Brian Henderson]

I wouldn't let them put their logo on it regardless, they're not paying me to advertise their business, why would they think they get free advertising on something I paid for without my express permission?

[George Bokros]

I have never had a glass shop do this and I have dealt with three different local glass shops in the last 5 yrs and none have done this.

[Mike Henderson]

I've never run into that either. If they did do that I'd refuse the glass.

Reminds me of when car dealerships used to attach a dealership "name/logo" on the back of the car. The problem was that they would drill two holes in the car to attach the chrome like logo. A woman friend went to pick up the car she had just bought and found that on her car. She refused to take the car until they had removed the logo, filled the holes and painted the area. She told me, "I'm not going to be a free rolling advertisement for those people."

Mike

[Randall J Cox]

We just bought a large tempered glass top for an end table, no logo nor did they even ask. Never heard of that.

[Ole Anderson]

Is there a requirement to ID tempered safety glass for a window? Just asking. I see that a lot in commercial work.

[Mel Fulks]

I know you have to be able to produce proof (invoices and such) that tempered was used where required. So when asked to do so we ordered glass without the stamp. I've seen sash that had a stamp on every pane

[Andrew Hughes]

Maybe the guy that cut the glass was proud of his work and signed it.Everone like to sign their work these days to promote them self personally or business.

[Dave Lehnert]

I never heard of a glass shop doing that but thanks for the heads up.

[Rick Malakoff]

In California door glass and the adjacent window's have to be tempered and marked as such or you wont pass the inspection, art glass is a different story.
Rick

[Mel Fulks]

I can understand not wanting the stamp ,but failing to be in compliance and getting caught is a big deal. And gives a lot more credibility and sympathy to anyone sustaining an injury. Been some real big payouts.

[John C Bush]

Did the etching say Chihuly?

[Bill McNiel]

Did the etching say Chihuly?

Only a true NorthWesterner would think of this. Well done.

John, have you been to the Chihuly Garden at Seattle Center? I would love to have witnessed the interactions between Dale and the Landscape Architect.

[Martin Wasner]

I would guess no glass shop has the ability to temper glass. They ordered it from some where. Unless specified, the standard operating procedure is to sandblast a logo in the corner prior to going into the furnace.

[Ole Anderson]

Only a true NorthWesterner would think of this. Well done.

John, have you been to the Chihuly Garden at Seattle Center? I would love to have witnessed the interactions between Dale and the Landscape Architect.
We have seen his travelling display in Grand Rapids MI, and the permanent displays in Seattle and St. Petersburg. Amazing talent in his shop. If you get a chance, his DVD is worth viewing.

[Mike Goetzke]

Few years back I built an entrance door with side lights. They were marked as tempered.

Additionally, the door builder that mentored me (over the internet) also said to make sure you have them put in writing to return your glass template. Maybe this isn't needed for straight geometry glass but my side lights had curved tops..

Mike

[Alan Lightstone]

Did the etching say Chihuly?
Well played.

[Jerry Olexa]

I would not want that on my ordered glass...agree

[John Gulick]

I much prefer to have the logo etched in. There is no question as to the safety properties of the glass

[andrew whicker]

They did it again!

This is frustrating and embarrassing. Except this time, it was on the bigger piece ($140).

I've been waiting on the bigger piece in order to make some cuts on the top. I'm going to pick up the piece, use it for making sure I make the correct cuts, then give it back I guess.

BAH!

[andrew whicker]

Nevermind, they were mistaken. The glass never got ordered. So they are knocking it down from $140 to $100.

The real problem is that I'm ordering from vendor A and they are ordering my glass from vendor B. Communication is not great...

[Brian Henderson]

Nevermind, they were mistaken. The glass never got ordered. So they are knocking it down from $140 to $100.

The real problem is that I'm ordering from vendor A and they are ordering my glass from vendor B. Communication is not great...

Then why don't you just order from vendor B and save yourself the markup?

[Mark Bolton]

I would guess no glass shop has the ability to temper glass. They ordered it from some where. Unless specified, the standard operating procedure is to sandblast a logo in the corner prior to going into the furnace.

Absolutely. By default most tempered glass is suppose to be marked as such (ever look in the corner of your doors and windows?). You can opt to not have the mark, but as Mel stated, your in for the liability if you bail on the mark.

We have built several large interior glass units, and they MUST be marked as tempered. Sure one can guess a coffee table for their own use wouldnt need marking but the company by default likely marks. Our glass supplier makes you opt-in for the mark which is nice.

[Martin Wasner]

Maybe the guy that cut the glass was proud of his work and signed it.Everone like to sign their work these days to promote them self personally or business.

Actually, as far as I know, you can't cut tempered glass. It's cut as regular plate glass. The edges are dressed/seamed, then it goes into furnace where it is heated almost to the point it starts to melt. Then it rolls into a quench, which blows a zillion cfm of air across it to rapidly cool it. That's what tempers the glass. The quench I saw had a pair of 200hp fans.

[andrew whicker]

I'm going to next time. I learned who it is they go to. I figured that their vendor was a large quantity type vendor. But it's just a small business

[John Lanciani]

..your in for the liability if you bail on the mark...

Just because I'm curious, what do you perceive the liability to be on a piece of glass that is tempered but not marked as such?

[Martin Wasner]

Just because I'm curious, what do you perceive the liability to be on a piece of glass that is tempered but not marked as such?

The liability of having to replace the glass with one that bares the mark of tempering to prove it is tempered.

[Mark Bolton]

Just because I'm curious, what do you perceive the liability to be on a piece of glass that is tempered but not marked as such?

Just like many states require a fire door to have a tagged 1.5 hour rating, its often the case that any fenestration glass or glass incorporated into permanent furniture, especially glass within a certain distance of the floor, in a railing assembly, etc. be marked. Like I said, a project for your own use its wise to ask if your supplier etch marks by default. Many do. As Martin said, I wasnt speaking to a liability of harm (the glass is tempered) but it wouldnt be out of the question that you could wind up having to swap some glass if it wasnt marked and needed to be.

[Mark Bolton]

Actually, as far as I know, you can't cut tempered glass. It's cut as regular plate glass. The edges are dressed/seamed, then it goes into furnace where it is heated almost to the point it starts to melt. Then it rolls into a quench, which blows a zillion cfm of air across it to rapidly cool it. That's what tempers the glass. The quench I saw had a pair of 200hp fans.

Dead on. When the glass is tempered the outer skin of the glass is put under tremendous tension. Like blowing up a balloon. The air inside the baloon is the normal plate glass, and the balloon is the the outer skin under tension. You poke the skin and the whole thing comes apart. Of course the outer skin is bound to the core of the glass so it shatters in a million pieces.

Oddly I know several glass blasters/carvers that commonly sandblast etch pretty deep into tempered panels. 20% or better and they swear they have never had an issue. Ive always wondered if its because the etch is a radius and no a point load.

I remember being a teenager and my mom was a stained glass artist and I brought a piece of glass home and wanted to cut it into shelves. She had no idea it was tempered. We scored it, slid a 2x4 under at the score, and tried and tried to get the glass to snap. No go, So we stood on either end bouncing up and down and POW, like a cannon shot, there was millions of 1/8" glass cubes on the studio floor lol.

[John Lanciani]

Just like many states require a fire door to have a tagged 1.5 hour rating, its often the case that any fenestration glass or glass incorporated into permanent furniture, especially glass within a certain distance of the floor, in a railing assembly, etc. be marked. Like I said, a project for your own use its wise to ask if your supplier etch marks by default. Many do. As Martin said, I wasnt speaking to a liability of harm (the glass is tempered) but it wouldnt be out of the question that you could wind up having to swap some glass if it wasnt marked and needed to be.

I hadn't thought of it that way, thanks.

[Mel Fulks]

I've always referred to the rules Mark mentioned when ordering tempered glass; its neccesary on large custom homes with odd configurations. Once when I gave an employer a more extensive list than he thought neccesary he griped and wanted me to change it. Hmm, why didn't HE change it? He knew I was right but would have been glad to skimp and save some money ...if only Mel was willing to chance going to prison.