Child Safe Clear Coating

[Bill George]

I did a job for a very important client , my wife. Wood blocks engraved with my laser they need to be sanded down a bit and then clear coated, maybe. Going to young children who may end up chewing on them or not, and they would need to be wiped clean when needed.

Suggestions for coating? I will do a search over in the Wood Working forum but if someone has an answer please suggest. Thank you

[Lawrence Richards]

I would use nothing....defocus your laser to get a nice brown etch in maple or alder and then leave em natural. If you MUST put a finish on, mineral oil, shellac, or wax are all options... But I would leave them unfinished

[Matt McCoy]

I would use nothing....defocus your laser to get a nice brown etch in maple or alder and then leave em natural. If you MUST put a finish on, mineral oil, shellac, or wax are all options... But I would leave them unfinished

Good suggestions here.

[Frederick Skelly]

I use shellac as a kid safe finish.
Fred

[Pieter Swart]

As A Licensed Painting Contractor, I think I could shed some light on this matter:D:D

We use a waterborne Lacquer ( note I said waterborne, not solvent based ) from Lenmar,or Chemcraft ( Our local Ben moore stocks it )
Shellac is a great idea, but will break down after a year or so and will be poisonous to kids...

The waterborne coatings from Home Depot like Polycryl from Minwax, is not too bad.

BUT if you want to be totally natural and food safe even, we use Food grade Carnuba wax. This is usually used on our drift wood pieces and butcher blocks... it lasts about 6 months if you apply it 3 times before you ship it out... you could use this stuff as chap stick too...



( as a side note: My wife is an artist and helps me out on my job sites when I am short staffed on large projects... She is allergic to paint.... YUP, allergic to paint. So everything we use is safe for her... therefore safe for you as the client and your kids )

[Matt McCoy]

Shellac is a great idea, but will break down after a year or so and will be poisonous to kids...

The waterborne coatings from Home Depot like Polycryl from Minwax, is not too bad.


Can you pass along more info about shellac breaking down and becoming poisonous? It is my understanding that once shellac evaporates, it reverts back to its natural state, as secreted by the lac bug, and is considered by the FDA as a food-grade finish. Candies (M&M's) are coated with shellac.

Minwax responded to an email that water-based Polycrylic finish should be allowed to cure at least 30 days, before children handle pieces with this finish and they should never be allowed to chew on it.

Thanks for the info.

[Pieter Swart]

I see your point about the polycryl! That would not be suitable!

The shellac on food is one thing, and I fully agree with you on your statement about shellac being natural once the solvent evaporates. Food grade and commercial grade are also very different products.

However with that being said, with the new EPA "Go Green" laws, formulas have changed... and it is very apparent when you spray a can that was in stock for a year versus a new one delivered to the shop yesterday. There is a marked difference in smell, as well as listed ingredients. Some of those ingredients are no longer safe after the product starts to break down in a year or two... and some of the "new" chemical added do not always evaporate with the solvent like it used to. To clarify, I base my info on a study done where it was demonstrated under artificial conditions, I must add, so there is a chance that, that data could be flawed.

I suppose, that you could argue that the toy would not have a service life passed a year or two, but can you risk it? with the changing formulas of all paints, a lot have changed in the last coupe of years and not keeping up with current info, could put yourself at risk for selling toys that got a kid sick... At any rate, I would err on the side of caution, rather than get sued.

Hence the reason I suggested Food safe Carnuba wax as a coating also... It give a lovely satin finish and comes in liquid brush on or sprayable coatings.

Just to clear up, I was not trying to cut down anyone with my earlier statements, I was merely giving my two cents, and two cents is all its about worth... lol

[Matt McCoy]

I see your point about the polycryl! That would not be suitable!

The shellac on food is one thing, and I fully agree with you on your statement about shellac being natural once the solvent evaporates. Food grade and commercial grade are also very different products.

However with that being said, with the new EPA "Go Green" laws, formulas have changed... and it is very apparent when you spray a can that was in stock for a year versus a new one delivered to the shop yesterday. There is a marked difference in smell, as well as listed ingredients. Some of those ingredients are no longer safe after the product starts to break down in a year or two... and some of the "new" chemical added do not always evaporate with the solvent like it used to. To clarify, I base my info on a study done where it was demonstrated under artificial conditions, I must add, so there is a chance that, that data could be flawed.

I suppose, that you could argue that the toy would not have a service life passed a year or two, but can you risk it? with the changing formulas of all paints, a lot have changed in the last coupe of years and not keeping up with current info, could put yourself at risk for selling toys that got a kid sick... At any rate, I would err on the side of caution, rather than get sued.

Hence the reason I suggested Food safe Carnuba wax as a coating also... It give a lovely satin finish and comes in liquid brush on or sprayable coatings.

Just to clear up, I was not trying to cut down anyone with my earlier statements, I was merely giving my two cents, and two cents is all its about worth... lol

Good info -- thanks.

[Bill George]

Shellac has been the same for a thousand years or so.

Shellac is a resin secreted by the female lac bug, on trees in the forests of India and Thailand. It is processed and sold as dry flakes and dissolved in ethanol to make liquid shellac, which is used as a brush-on colorant, food glaze and wood finish.
Its used as a food glaze and I imagine its dried by then.

[David Somers]

There are food grade, FDA approved Shellacs. A quick search of the web will locate them. I have to admit though that I dont like using shell finishes on things that will be used for anything but dry foods and whole fruits for the simple reason that over time the shell finish will get micro cracks and moisture and nutrients from the food will get in. The result is fine dark lines at first, then darkening of the wood underneath from decay, slow decay, but still decay. The only way to resolve it is to remove the finish to bare wood and reapply. I much prefer salad oil finishes, tung oil, cured walnut oil, or even plain (not scented) mineral oil.

I would tend to approach a childs toy the same way. Assume they will gum it and bang it and crack a shell finish and introduce nutrients and moisture into it. Parents will want to clean it as well, also introducing moisture into the micro cracks. Better to simply use one of the edible oils or waxes suggested already and keep it simple and clean. I recently made an alphabet block set for a new niece using a CNC and used tung oil as the first coats, followed by a stablized walnut wax that wont go rancid. The finish was soft to the hand and buffed to a soft shine. It also had a pleasant smell and little to no taste. You do need to let tung oil cure BTW. It cures with exposure to air and hardens in the wood rather than on the surface.

I also use these finishes for anything to do with moist foods when I do utility bowls by wood turning.

Hope that helps.

Dave

[Lawrence Richards]

Interesting idea about the waterborne lacquer and I will definitely be checking it out, thank you! I love lacquer but struggle with its negatives
In my original post I debated whether to put in shellac or not because of the "flake" you described and am glad you brought up this questionable characteristic. Your two cents is worth just as much as mine (and possibly more as you have the credentials to back yours up!) and I appreciate learning something from this post.

One last thing to mention for the OP- make sure you check out whether your business liability insurance covers you for children's toys (mine specifically does NOT at my current coverage)

Lawrence

[Bruce Clumpner]

I think the issue with the Shellac finish cracking is not that the finish can be consumed or is harmful, it's that other nasties can get into the cracks and grow. Things like mold and bacteria, specially after a baby slobbering on it.

[John Lifer]

Shellac is safe, wax would be my first choice.
One other finish is a salad bowl oil finish. Usually Walnut oil. Food safe. As long as no nut allergy, it would be second choice.

BE CAREFUL of TUNG OILS FINISH! almost 100% are NOT really Tung Oil! And NOT safe!

[David Somers]

John,

True about Tung Oil very likely not being pure Tung Oil. You do need to check the label to make sure it is 100% Tung oil with no other curing agents, hardeners, or other finishes blended in. They exist though and places like Rockler and Woodcraft and Craft Supply USA carry them, as well as the salad oil finish you mention. General is the most common brand I see. Walnut Oil is also excellent provided it is highly refined and stabilized. Mahoney's Walnut Oil and Walnut Wax is listed as free of walnut alergens because of how it is refined and cooked, removing and destroying the proteins involved in an alergic reaction. It is made specifically to be food safe. Doctor's Workshop brand walnut finishes are also listed as alergen free and safe for food contact and consumption. If you still have concerns about the products contact the manufacturers. They are widely used however, for what that is worth. As a woodturner these are two brands of finishes I rely on heavily for utility pieces while I utilize Shellac and Lacquers for show pieces with a high gloss. Doctor's Workshop finishes are excellent for French Polish techniques, especially on a wood lathe.

[John Lifer]

David, I've got two bottles on my shelf that granted are getting old and hard, but are NOT true Tung Oil. Formby is one brand, Watco the other. BOTH contain Mineral Spirits, Both claim they are a varnish when you read closely.
I'd rather stick with plain beeswax or shellac than use either of these on a toy. Now the true NUT OIL finishes are fine also. Just be careful guys and READ the label. BTW, neither say food safe or FDA approved on either. My Walnut oil DOES.