Cermark 6000 vs 6060? vs ?

[Mike Audleman]

So, starting to get back into the game again. All my cermark dried up over the last couple years. Not a biggie, just reconstitute it with DNA. But I was looking for some more and I see there is the 6000 and the 6060. From cermarksales dot com it appears the 6060 is a water based product. Curious if its any better/worse than 6000 which is alcohol based.

I presume the alcohol based 6000 would dry faster on the work piece than the water based product. But by how much? I am not a production house so waiting a few minutes isn't a deal breaker. Waiting hours, well, that would test my patience.

Anyone tried the copper or pearl?

[Keith Downing]

So, starting to get back into the game again. All my cermark dried up over the last couple years. Not a biggie, just reconstitute it with DNA. But I was looking for some more and I see there is the 6000 and the 6060. From cermarksales dot com it appears the 6060 is a water based product. Curious if its any better/worse than 6000 which is alcohol based.

I presume the alcohol based 6000 would dry faster on the work piece than the water based product. But by how much? I am not a production house so waiting a few minutes isn't a deal breaker. Waiting hours, well, that would test my patience.

Anyone tried the copper or pearl?

There was some discussion about this a few months back and opinions seemed mixed as to the comparison of the application and results.

My take on it was that the 6060 was an option they developed to avoid shipping a flammable/hazardous product. But it costs a few more $$'s I believe; and can (should?) still be cut with DNA.

I'm not sure there's any other advertised (or realized) benefit to using the 6060 over the 6000; unless you're in a local where you just can't get the 6000.

I'll try to dig up the thread from last time this discussion came up.

[Keith Downing]

Here's a link to the last active thread I was referencing on this topic from last year. But it comes to pretty much the same conclusion I just stated I believe.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?242679-Cermark-6000-vs-6060

[Mike Audleman]

Here's a link to the last active thread I was referencing on this topic from last year. But it comes to pretty much the same conclusion I just stated I believe.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?242679-Cermark-6000-vs-6060

Yes, I had seen that post and the one linked in it.

But nobody seems to have posted any comparison between them. No mention of drying time or use on 6060. And no mention on the white or copper versions of Cermark.

I have even read through this thread, however loosely associated with my OP here:
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?163305-Forget-Cermark-and-Plaster-of-Paris-try-this

And even this one...
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?126312-Engraving-on-metal-compound-20-for-one-year&highlight=plaster+paris

[Keith Downing]

I really haven't heard much discussion, so my guess is not many of the guys here use the 6060. I had read a little about the pearl and copper, but it seemed like they were still mostly in testing. And not as easy to use on most types of metal with consistent results.

Personally I'd love to see some comparisons, but not badly enough to order hundreds of dollars of different products and do it myself. Haha

[Mike Audleman]

I really haven't heard much discussion, so my guess is not many of the guys here use the 6060. I had read a little about the pearl and copper, but it seemed like they were still mostly in testing. And not as easy to use on most types of metal with consistent results.

Personally I'd love to see some comparisons, but not badly enough to order hundreds of dollars of different products and do it myself. Haha

Rofl. Exactly. I had hoped that someone had already purchased one of the others and had experience with 6000 as a baseline of comparison. I have only done very minimal marking before the laser died two years ago so i don't have a practical foundation to do any useful comparisons on.

[Terry Wade]

I just recently got some of the 6060 and so far I pleased with the results. I cut it with DNA at a 2:1 for the first try and it spread good with the foam brush and dried pretty quick. I have not used the 6000 but I have used the Dry-Moly lube and had pretty fair results with it. The 6060 goes on easier and cleans up a lot easier with just plain old tap water. The reason I decided to try the 6060 was to avoid the shipping hazmat fee, so far I'm happy with it.

[Mike Null]

I have both pearl and copper. I haven't had occasion to use the copper but the pearl was acceptable on a forged steel hammer I engraved for a blacksmith. I recently used some of my JDS sample account to buy a small bottle of LMM14 for testing but I'm getting into my peak eason and haven't had time to test it yet. FWIW I want to test it on brass, aluminum and shiny steel as I have had no success with LM 6000 on those surfaces.

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[Mike Audleman]

Odd. I guess I wasn't aware that LM6000 can't work on brass :) Wish you hadn't told me that now. This won't work anymore:
http://cdn.ipernity.com/200/43/16/44634316.62cf2509.500.jpg (http://www.ipernity.com/doc/wolfie/44634316)

I like that copper look on the hammer.

I was looking at the Pearl and the Copper for possible use on gun parts (blued and black cerekote).

[Gary Hair]

Just like the way Wile E Coyote doesn't fall until he looks down!

[Mike Null]

Mike
There are some who have had luck with 6000 on brass but on my 45 watt machine it doesn't work.

You can direct engrave on most Cerakote finishes but I don't think any Cermark will work on them. I have tested a dozen or so of their colors with varying degrees of success. All can be engraved with a CO2 laser but the contrast may be a little less than you want on some. Contact them and they'll send you some sample swatches for testing.

[Mike Audleman]

I wasn't wanting to remove the cerakote which I assume would happen if I tried to engrave directly onto it. That is why I was looking at the pearl because I had hoped that it would bond with the surface of the black cerekote and to blued gun metal (any anything else black/dark I tried it on ;) )

[Mike Audleman]

Just like the way Wile E Coyote doesn't fall until he looks down!


Thats funny right there. I don't care who ya are :)

[Kev Williams]

All I've ever used is the 6000..
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I get great results on aluminum and brass-- but only with the DC/glass/80 watt Triumph. My western machines simply won't reliably fuse Cermark to brass or aluminum, keyword 'reliably'. They'll do it, but it's hit and miss for sure.

The Triumph, crank up the power and it's ON there. Now if only I could get stainless to Cermark decently! It's frustrating that I have hot/cold issues with SS but not alum and brass...

[Kev Williams]

Cerakote-- your laser will simply remove Cerakote- might take a couple of passes and some tight resolution settings, but it will do it.

This is a Cerakoted Micarta grip from a Kimber 1911 I test engraved 2 days ago- this was one pass at 30 speed 100% (40w) on my LS900 at 500 lines per inch. you can see that about half the Cerakote was removed in that one pass....
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-- at say 18 speed (my Cermark speed) and say 800 lines, the Cerakote would likely be gone in one pass-- and especially so with more power than I have...

What this is to say is, if you put white pearl or any other Cermark directly on Cerakote, you'll probably get a less than stellar results.
But if you run a couple of passes first to remove the Cerakote, then the Ceramark may have a chance to work...

[Mike Audleman]

Cerakote-- your laser will simply remove Cerakote- might take a couple of passes and some tight resolution settings, but it will do it.

This is a Cerakoted Micarta grip from a Kimber 1911 I test engraved 2 days ago- this was one pass at 30 speed 100% (40w) on my LS900 at 500 lines per inch. you can see that about half the Cerakote was removed in that one pass....
358633358634
-- at say 18 speed (my Cermark speed) and say 800 lines, the Cerakote would likely be gone in one pass-- and especially so with more power than I have...

What this is to say is, if you put white pearl or any other Cermark directly on Cerakote, you'll probably get a less than stellar results.
But if you run a couple of passes first to remove the Cerakote, then the Ceramark may have a chance to work...

Won't removing the cerakote expose the metal and allow rust to form on the unprotected metal?

[John Lifer]

358645

I see someone else likes to use cheap brass! LMM14 BTW. Works pretty well.


358646

But I like the fiber too! Dark Burn and light mark. Dark is way darker than the picture.Darker than the Ceramark above.

Mike, I guess it would depend on the design and your customer as to removing the cerakote.
I just did this to my carry and it is cut into the tenifer finish on the gun. I'm not worried about it rusting.
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[Mike Audleman]

That piece of brass was one of my calibration reference rounds for reloading. Thats why its marked with the bullet manufacturer and the COAL. I keep a tray of reference rounds for each caliber. Makes resetting the dies on the progressive very quick as I can quickly go to within a couple thousandths of the COAL I want for the seat die by screwing it down until it meets the reference round (which has no powder or primer if anyone thought I was dumb enough to laser a live round) and then a couple handle pulls while making final adjustments and I am good to run. Saves a lot of time switching from my IDPA load to target load, etc.

I also use it in my COAL gauge. I place it in my gauge and zero it. Then as I run a lot, I can pull samples and quickly see how far up or down from my reference round I am and verify I am still spot on. I know its rather anal for handgun rounds. The habit formed (constant checking) from loading rounds for my 30-06 and my 300WM Barrett for quarter-mile and out distances, half a thousandth could make a difference in POI.