Oak vs. Ash

[Brian Hale]

How similar are these two woods apperance wise? I'm doing a kitchen island, desk and TV stand for the inlaws and money is tight. I can get Ash for $1.49 bd ft and Oak for $2.09 and i'll need about 175 bf ft for the project.

I assume i'll need to fill either wood for a smooth writing surface on the desk?

Thanks

Brian :)

[Kelly C. Hanna]

The Ash I have seen is very close to Oak in grain and color. I am not sure about Ash, but the Oak will need to be filled.

[Scott Parks]

You'll have to get a couple samples side by side and compare, but I think they are very similar. I like ash. Although, I've smoked my sawblade trying to saw it before.:eek: (pre-3horsepower days)

[Scott Parks]

The Ash I have seen is very close to Oak in grain and color. I am not sure about Ash, but the Oak will need to be filled.

For my oak table, it took about 5 coats of Target EmTech sealer to fill the grain.

[Ron Robinson]

This is the top of a bookcase I threw together for my kitchen. It is 6/4 ash with satin poly.

Ron

[Gail O'Rourke]

Brian, recently I have used a lot of ash and it works quite nice, it is a little more yellow than oak, but a very similar grain, I have found it comes much narrower from the lumber yard.. but I have been pleased with it.

However, the ash ply is about $60.00 a sheet..I will post a pic if I find one.

Gail

[John Miliunas]

Brian, I just got done milling up about 90 brd/ft. of Ash for my stair project. Personally, I think it's just a tad tighter grained than Oak and should require a bit less filling for the writing surface. There are the typical "gotchya's", similar to Oak, though. Be very careful surfacing it, as it has a tendency to tear out, especially when grain changes direction. Also, it's not any easier on the old muscles! I worked 8/4 rough and that stuff is heavy!!!:) :cool:

[Andy Hoyt]

Brian - Notice what all these folks have been using lately? Ash.

I agree with that trend and here's why - everyone else is using oak. It's seen way too much use over the last fifteen years or so. Go into a spec built kitchen and what do you see? Oak.

Your projects are mostly high impact/use types. Just like baseball bats.

Ash.

[scott spencer]

Ash tends to be lighter in color, but has a similar grain contrast and pattern. On cathedral gain, ash tends to be more oval at the tips, where oak tends to be more wavy. Both are nice, but I honestly think ash is prettier, plus it's cheaper and less common. Our ash dining room table looks like oak having a great day.

[chris toomey]

ash can be stained to look just like oak.....the average person would be hard pressed to tell the difference....if at all

[John Miliunas]

Yeah, and with the ash beatle taking a major foothold on so much of the Ash tree population, that humble Ash project may indeed turn into one of rare hardwood in the very near future!:mad: Kind of sad, in a way, but there's a definite reality in that statement. Get it while you can and while supplies are still plentiful.:) :cool:

[Frank Foley]

Brian,

I have done several projects with oak and ash. I'm remodeling my kitchen and it will be ash. Of the two I would say the ash is very similiar to oak but the grain is a little tighter. IMHO ash is a nicer looking wood. Good Luck

Frank

[Fred Voorhees]

I have used ash in replacement of oak and the two are very similar in appearance.

[John Bailey]

I've always liked working with ash. It is hard and therefore a bit hard, muscle-wise, to work by hand, but is very predictable and solid. I use it to edge and tip kayak paddles, and I carved a set of dingy oars. I also used it to make a "curved sanding plane" to shape the blades of my kayak paddles. It's takes a shape well, but takes a lot of muscle to get the shape.

John

[lou sansone]

I guess I have a more general question about ash vs oak. I have worked with ash and as others have said it is decent. I have also worked with red and white oak. It seems to me that if I were going to compare ash and oak, I would be thinking in terms of red oak and ash and not white oak and ash. Is this the general consensus here or am I the only one being a little more specific on this comparison?

lou

[scott spencer]

I guess I have a more general question about ash vs oak. I have worked with ash and as others have said it is decent. I have also worked with red and white oak. It seems to me that if I were going to compare ash and oak, I would be thinking in terms of red oak and ash and not white oak and ash. Is this the general consensus here or am I the only one being a little more specific on this comparison?

lou I was thinking red oak too...most of the white oak I've used is not as similar to ash.

[Andy Hoyt]

Yup. When I hear the word oak I think of red oak. I don't care for red oak. I love white oak - especially quarter sawn.

[Brian Hale]

Once again you folks have all the answers i need!:cool:

Looks like i'll be using Ash for the in-laws stuff but i'll be ordering a total of 500 bd ft of Ash and 500 bd ft of Oak for the LOML's china cabinet/buffett which will get me the 1,000 bd ft discount. ;) I'll use the Ash for drawers and shelves inside the cabinet.

Thanks!!!

Brian :)

[Fred Voorhees]

I guess I have a more general question about ash vs oak. I have worked with ash and as others have said it is decent. I have also worked with red and white oak. It seems to me that if I were going to compare ash and oak, I would be thinking in terms of red oak and ash and not white oak and ash. Is this the general consensus here or am I the only one being a little more specific on this comparison?

lou
In regards to my answer, yes, I meant a comparison between red oak and ash.

[Alan Turner]

I have worked a lot of ash, and a fair amount of red oak. For my money, irrespective of any price difference, ash is my choice.

It is open grained, like oak, but it does not have the reddish or pinkish cast that red oak does. It will yellow over time, but it is a pleasant shade. If you want to "freeze" the whitish color of ash, start out with a coat of BLO, to which is added a bit of oil based white paint. Think 50's Danish modern, but better looking. Expermient a bit.

Ash has a delightful smell, to my nose, when sawn. It is less prone to chip out, but is a bit chippy. It dries well, and stays straighter than oak. It is easier to work, and is more attractive. But, as they say, taste has no friends, so this is a hard issue to debate on objective grounds.

[Jim W. White]

I'm with Allen and many of the others, in that I'd actually prefer to use the Ash to flat sawn red oak. I've used it for several projects now and I think it' one of the most under-rated hardwoods out there! Stable, hard and inexpensive. It also takes finish (including stain) very well.:D

[Lee DeRaud]

Looks like i'll be using Ash for the in-laws stuff but i'll be ordering a total of 500 bd ft of Ash and 500 bd ft of Oak for the LOML's china cabinet/buffett which will get me the 1,000 bd ft discount. ;) I'll use the Ash for drawers and shelves inside the cabinet.Uh, 1000 bdft? Just how big is this china cabinet anyway?:eek:

[Donnie Raines]

How similar are these two woods apperance wise? I'm doing a kitchen island, desk and TV stand for the inlaws and money is tight. I can get Ash for $1.49 bd ft and Oak for $2.09 and i'll need about 175 bf ft for the project.

I assume i'll need to fill either wood for a smooth writing surface on the desk?

Thanks

Brian :)

Ash is more appealing to me as well, for all the reasons stated. BUT!!!, that i going to change in the coming months...maybe years. The ash tress are being destroyed at an alarming rate by boreing insects. I no the Ohio, Indiana, Kentucky and West Virginia area have been hit very hard. What does this mean? Well, like everything, lower supply...normally higher cost. Ash is very economical today...but it is gradually climbing.

[Steve Wargo]

Ash turns and bends, both laminating and steam, much easier than red oak. I believe that red oak is a bit denser, but ash can often be found with some great grain patterns. I always felt that when working with ash it was almost a little stringy. Sort of like poplar, but not to the same degree. They both fill nicely with pore filler, but ash will build smoothly with urethane a bit faster.

[Niels J. Larsen]

For my oak table, it took about 5 coats of Target EmTech sealer to fill the grain.

Ok - I'm a newbie and haven't worked with oak or ash (yet), so bear with me - what is this sealer you mention ?

Won't it show after finishing with e.g. oil ?

/Niels

[John Tarro]

I've used hundreds of bd ft of the stuff for T&G paneling. Looks really nice and holds up well. My experience is that it holds it's dimension well with noisture changes and will not cup or warp once finished (as long as you finish BOTH sides of the wood). One problem, when using a router on it, be sure that when possible you do NOT run the router into the emerging grain. Above, someone noted that it is more "stringy" than oak . . true. Ir you run against emerging grain, it will want to lift the grain and tear it out. BAD!!!!!

there is also a big difference between white and black ash. Most of what is sold is black. Some white will work it's way into the supply. It is softer and not as durrable.

Nice wood but I would be careful of what I used it for.

[Jim W. White]

John,

Not to nit-pick... but, I beleive what you meant to say was: most of what is sold is White Ash (not black). White Ash is what's commonly used in furniture construction and the ever so poplular Louisville Slugger's:)

[Brian Hale]

Uh, 1000 bdft? Just how big is this china cabinet anyway?:eek:

Well, it's a good size unit and we think we'll want a server also. Besides,I'mm a most accomplished producer of firewood :o

Brian :)

[Tom Hoffman]

Hello Brian: I think you'll find the two woods very similar in working qualities. Ash will generally have much more pronounced grain features. If you click on this link:
http://home.comcast.net/~tom.hoffman/3workbench.htm
you will see pictures on a workbench I made out of ash. Here in Folsom, CA I paid $3.00/bf and thought I was getting a deal.

Tom Hoffman

[George Matthews]

Well, it's a good size unit...

The top left is 52" and the top right 53.5"


From my experience, making them identical would significantly reduce the amount of work and potential for mistakes. Even if you need to add a filler strip to the right and make them both 52".

[Mark Singer]

Brian, I just got done milling up about 90 brd/ft. of Ash for my stair project. Personally, I think it's just a tad tighter grained than Oak and should require a bit less filling for the writing surface. There are the typical "gotchya's", similar to Oak, though. Be very careful surfacing it, as it has a tendency to tear out, especially when grain changes direction. Also, it's not any easier on the old muscles! I worked 8/4 rough and that stuff is heavy!!!:) :cool:

Didn't like my fire pole idea?:confused:

[John Miliunas]

Didn't like my fire pole idea?:confused:

Oh, I like the idea just fine but, after checking with the building inspector, he said we weren't zoned for having a strip joint! Go figure....:rolleyes: :D :cool:

[Brian Hale]

The top left is 52" and the top right 53.5"


From my experience, making them identical would significantly reduce the amount of work and potential for mistakes. Even if you need to add a filler strip to the right and make them both 52".

Good catch George! We haven't made a final decision on the design but we have talked about those 2 top cabinets and you're right, making them the same size is simple enough and will make cutting the parts much eaiser.

Thanks
Brian :)

[Jim Jakosh]

Ash does look a lot like oak but it is heavier.

[Matt Day]

Jim,
If he does need some wood, you'll need to fire up the flux capacitor and head back to 2005. ;)

[Yonak Hawkins]

I worked 8/4 rough and that stuff is heavy!!!

White ash is quite heavy. I've been working quite a bit lately, however, with Georgia grown 8/4 green ash and I find it's quite light weight. Even though it's classified at about .53 sg, I believe what I'm working with is way below .5. It cuts like a dream, sands easy and has a very tight grain. It looks less like oak, however.

[Chris Fournier]

I really enjoy using white ash in my shop and if you take the time you can make it look as light or dark as you want. Here is some white ash that I dyed and glazed to get a rich dark brown effect. I like the open grain and kept it that way. It is an underutilized domestic hardwood and the pricing reflect it too. Shhh!298647298648Previously posted pictures, pun intended but they make my point.

[lowell holmes]

Ash furniture was sometimes known as Golden Oak. There are a lot of ash trees int Texas forests. A lot of it ends up in the furniture shops on the East coast.

When kitchen cabinets were mostly "job Built", ash was the premium wood in South central Texas. See the description for ash at the link below.

http://www.lewislp.com/woodchar.asp

[Yonak Hawkins]

http://home.comcast.net/~tom.hoffman/3workbench.htm

That's a beautiful work bench, Tom.

[Larry Edgerton]

The top left is 52" and the top right 53.5"


From my experience, making them identical would significantly reduce the amount of work and potential for mistakes. Even if you need to add a filler strip to the right and make them both 52".

I disagree. Not only that it makes it easier, but also that it is less work. How could it be less work? So you take a custom piece made to fit and reduce it down to Home Depot standards with fillers? Not in my world.

On the Ash/Red Oak question I hands down prefer Ash in almost every circumstance.

Larry

[Ole Anderson]

I could be wrong, but I believe the good deals on Ash are due to an abundance of supply of trees due to the EAB killing a lot of trees and making them available to the sawyers. Also, the Ash I have used has a grain pattern similar to Oak, but LESS pronounced and much less porous.

[Prashun Patel]

Ash finishes up more yellow; oak finishes up more pink. Stained they're good substitutes for each other. I don't know whether qs ash is prone to the nice flecking you can get in QSO.

[David Weaver]

When ash became abundant here, it was available cheap, but the suppliers who sell lumber retail never really dipped that much and the specialty places that like to make a lot of money on wood stopped carrying it entirely.

I have thus never been able to get it cheaply, at least not cheap compared to what I'd expect. Which is probably a suggestion of how much of the cost of lumber is in the hauling and preparation and markup vs. the raw material.