Rikon 10-342, damage, & Circle Saw

[Dale Murray]

Earlier this year I decided I needed an upgrade from my mid-70's 12" Craftsman bandsaw , the result was the purchase of a Rikon 10-342 18" bandsaw; a very worthwhile upgrade.

This would be a non-event, and not one worth noting here, if it were not for two things:
1. The retailer
2. How they handled a bad situation

The saw
I've had it setup for more than two months and extremely happy with it. Between the mass of the cast iron wheels and 2hp motor, I have yet to bog it down; granted I have not done much aside from resawing some 7" cherry boards.

The guides are easy to adjust and everything seems well thought out.
The dust collection is not as good as I had hoped but that may be my fault too - a lot of flex line between it and the DC. I am sure it will get better when I plumb the system.
Blade changes are a non-event.

I really dont know what else to say about it.

The only oops I could find from the factory was the wiring of the 120v outlet on the saw. After I replaced the existing power cord with a longer one I tested all the electrical connections and found the the 120v outlet on the saw had the positive and neutral reversed. I checked all my wiring, and it was correct. I pulled the outlet and found they were reversed at the factory - I will inform Rikon of this when I register the warranty.
Packaging
The only really hit I can have against Rikon in regard to this saw is packaging. This is a 365+lb tool and the crating is not at all sturdy.
My Honda lawn mower had a more impressive box and it was cardboard.
I made a crate to move my wifes childhood dollhouse and it is more sturdy than this crate.
You would be hard pressed to find something less sturdy than their crates. I will also bring this up when I register the saw.

I would like to add the quality of the crate had nothing to do with the next bit.

Damage
The first saw arrived in less than stellar condition.
It was shipped to my office and I thought our warehouse people had opened one side thinking it was for the shop. When I went to inspect it all seems good aside from one side being semi open.
When I got it home and removed all the film wrap I found it was NOT in good condition;
- cracked along the upper wheel housing on the motor side.
- the blade return opening (slot to remove the blade near the column) was smaller at the top than the bottom.
- upper and lower door hinges were broken.
- the upper door was dented by the upper guide column.
- the upper wheel housing was not in alignment with the lower wheel housing; it had been twisted.

I documented everything in photos and sent those to the retailer for review.
I also reviewed all of our security camera footage and found the crate had been damaged before it was ever taken off the truck - it was not my people who opened the crate. I took screen captures of the security camera footage and sent that to the seller too.

Ultimately, I had a nearly 400lb unusable saw in my garage and a bit freaked out about how to deal with it.

The Seller
I bought this from Circle Saw in Texas; I live in Illinois.
I searched the web and found everyone was selling this saw for the exact same price except Circle Saw. I was a bit curious/suspicious about this and found the reason why, the other sellers drop ship directly from Rikon whereas Circle Saw actually has them in stock. By stocking the saw they are able to sell it at a better price. Ultimately, I was able to save a couple hundred dollars.

The response of my contact at Circle Saw was that of alarm and concern in regard to the damage. When he reviewed the damage and security camera images he knew he would have to file and insurance claim with the shipping company.

He then went to the warehouse and pulled another Rikon 10-342 to ship to me. Before shipping his guys opened the crate to inspect, and reinforced the crate before shipping. The second saw showed up in stellar condition; this time I completely unpackaged everything before accepting it.

So now I have two Rikon 10-342 saws in my garage; one I can use and one that is a disaster.

In the end I was told I could do whatever I want with the damaged saw; neither party wanted it back and it is unusable due to damage (the cracks have gotten larger in the month it sat, btw). I've stripped the saw of everything and putting the body out for the scappers to take this weekend.

The take away
I am quite pleased with the quality of the Rikon 10-342, even more so after replacing the stock blade with a woodslicer blade.
Circle Saw handled this transaction and disaster professionally and proactively; they promptly replaced the damaged saw and had good communication throughout.

I really feel bad for them (Circle Saw); they are out a $1312 saw and now have to fight with a shipping company to get their money back.

[Van Huskey]

Glad everything worked out and glad Circle Saw took care of you since I have recommended them in the past.

[Frederick Skelly]

Glad to hear this Dale! Also thanks for the lead on another quality vendor!

[Tom Trees]

I think you should put an add up for the saw, if your just gonna send it to the scrappy.
Their might be a few folks willing to weld new parts up for the saw ..it would be a kind of template for tacking up thick stock to.
Think of the enjoyment one could get from it, like you do with your new saw .
There are folks who would love this opportunity to have it, and would cover your costs in time/space hindrance/gas to take it off your hands.
I done a lot of work to my saw because I knew it would be worth it in the end.
Tom

[Wade Lippman]

It would make a spectacular mooring. I use a 200# piano harp, but a 350 saw would be so much better.

My Rikon BS was well packaged.

[Van Huskey]

My Rikon BS was well packaged.

The issue with packaging items for shipment is a double edged sword, and heavy common carrier items like woodworking machines magnify that. First, you have the cost of the crating materials and the labor to build the crate. Then the final price has to include the cost of shipping of the weight and bulk of that material from half way around the world making multiple stops along the way to our shops. A well-run business will track damage vs crating/shipping cost to find the perfect balance. It is easy to simply build a bomb proof container for a machine but at a significant cost to the end consumer. The "cheap" prices we pay are contingent on things like minimizing shipping and crating costs, so we will have the odd issue of damage.

[Dale Murray]

I think you should put an add up for the saw, if your just gonna send it to the scrappy.


My concerns with selling it are liability. I understand it is damaged and the buyer may be aware it is damaged but if they do something stupid and get hurt who knows what they will do. Since I am out nothing but inconvenience I don't need anything more from it than for it to be gone. I've already stripped of everything useful, the carcass will hit the curb tomorrow.

[John K Jordan]

Dale,

I have the same saw and I love it.

I solved the dust problem on mine. I can describe it later if you are interested.

BTW, the first one shipped to me (through my dealer) was also a disaster. When I uncrated and inspected it I noticed a few things: It had no upper wheel. The entire trunion was missing as were the lower guides. There was more wrong but that was enough. I got to the bottom of it - some person at the Rikon warehouse mistakenly crated and shipped a saw that someone else was stripping for parts! Fortunately, Rikon drop-shipped a complete one directly to me within days.

Definitely strip down and save parts from the old one if you can. The guides are probably OK. You can likely use the tires when yours wear out. A spare motor and capacitor might be useful some day.

JKJ

[Dale Murray]

My Rikon BS was well packaged.

In my case the plywood is to flimsy and weak. I could easily puncture it with a screwdriver if I wanted.

Not griping about the saw, only about the quality of the crate.

[Van Huskey]

You now have the parts to build a small bandmill...

[Doug Garson]

Good to hear you got such good service from Circle Saw, just curious how they could offer a better price by having them in stock. I thought sellers saved money by not carrying inventory and having product direct shipped from the manufacturer. No need for a big warehouse, overhead cost for warehouse staff, insurance, building utilities money tied up in inventory etc. The only thing I could think of is they make large bulk orders and get a sizable discount.

[Dale Murray]

I know in the bicycle business, if you order 6 $3000 bikes you get a much better price than ordering just one. The shipping was also a better price than with other retailers though I opted for standard freight shipping, not lift gate.

If I recall correctly my total cost to my door was something like $1412.

[Dale Murray]

I have absolutely zero room for a band mill.

I will tuck all the parts away and if something comes up where I need them or can invent something, I have them.

I just hope somebody with a pickup swings by and hauls away the carcass today.

[Bruce Page]

I'm glad Circle Saw took good care of the situation, they sound like a good company to do business with.

True story; I had a used lawn mower that I wanted to get rid of. I set it out on the curb thinking someone would take it. After a week of it sitting there I put a "For Sale $20" sign on it. It disappeared over night..

[Dale Murray]

True story; I had a used lawn mower that I wanted to get rid of. I set it out on the curb thinking someone would take it. After a week of it sitting there I put a "For Sale $20" sign on it. It disappeared over night..

I used to use a push mower (spinning reel type) and stopped to talk to a neighbor - the mower 20' away, and a scrapper stopped their truck and tried to take it while it was still on my lawn!

The bandsaw was gone within 30 minutes of me putting it out there. I also put our a junk bench vise and some plastic shelving, all taken by the garbage elves. Love it!

[Dale Murray]

.

I solved the dust problem on mine. I can describe it later if you are interested.


Care to share your dust collection solution?
So far all I have done is plumbed a line from the front collection port that ties in to the bottom collection port via a radiused Y connector.

I had been contemplating something like Rob Cosmans solution or putting some sort of shielding between the between the bottom of the top and the frame.

[John K Jordan]

Care to share your dust collection solution?
So far all I have done is plumbed a line from the front collection port that ties in to the bottom collection port via a radiused Y connector.
I had been contemplating something like Rob Cosmans solution or putting some sort of shielding between the between the bottom of the top and the frame.

I'm sure others have done similar things but I haven't seen any.

I use a 5-hp ClearVue cyclone which moves a lot of air. The duct to the bandsaw is over 40' from the cyclone. I bring a 6" duct down close the table and put the blast gate there. I split the 6" into three 4" lines. Since the Rikon has two dust collection ports, I run one 4" PVC duct to each port. I get essentially no dust collecting in the lower cabinet with either stringy green or powdery dry.

For above the table I use a short length of stay-put flex which stays where I put it with a strong magnet fastened to the lip with a screw. The magnet is about an inch in diameter had has a center hole for a bolt. When making "skimming" cuts I position this to the right of the blade where it catches most of what would otherwise get sprayed onto the table. For cross cuts the magnet holds it nicely out of the way flush with the right edge of the table.

BTW, the opening in this extra flex hose is a great place do dump handfuls of small pieces of wood say from trimming the ends of turning blanks!

After all that, I still got a lot of dust on the floor at my feet - it came from the open area below the table containing the lower guides, just above where the blade disappears into the lower cabinet. For this I made a temporary shroud from corrugated cardboard, cut and bent to fit snugly around the right side of the guides, around the front, and a little around the left. (I made a template first with a piece of paper. I hold this onto the bottom of the table and the top of the lower cabinet with some round 1/2" magnets 1/8" thick.

This lets the angled port at the top of the lower cabinet pull air down from around the guides and keeps dust from being thrown on the floor. I was surprised at how well it works. Since it is open at the back and most of the left side, the air flows from there and across the blade, sucking up most of what comes down in the blade gullets.

I intended to use the cardboard prototype to make a more permanent one from thin clear plastic but so far I haven't bothered - this has worked fine for about 4 years now. I do have to remove it when changing the blade or to adjust the lower guides but it comes off and goes back on in seconds. It also can't be used when tilting the table but I don't tilt - for an angle I make a tilted aux table from plywood stuck to the top of the cast iron table with 2-sided tape.

357532 357533

JKJ

[Robert Engel]

The 10-342 saw I bought was wired for 240V.