Hammer slider vs. Minimax

[Ryan Pappas]

I have decided to sell my sawstop and get a sliding table saw. I have narrowed it down to hammer k3 79x48 and minimax. I have the SC2 and the SC4 in mind for minimax. Also adding in the SC3 to the mix. I mainly make end grain cutting boards so not sure if a full 8ft is necessary for me but I know myself and I tend to want the best. Any help would greatly be appreciated.

[Jim Andrew]

I have the Hammer 79 x 48, and it is a fine saw. The slider is a little long on the left side of the saw when you rip between the fence and blade, think if there had been a showroom close by, would have looked at the 48 x 48. The outrigger is very important, but if you get really good blades, and work with solid wood, the scoring blade is not important. Plywood is much more brittle than solid, as the finish layer is so thin.

[Andy Giddings]

What sort of help are you looking for? Any of the saws in your list are more than capable for what you are building. If you have the space for a long slider, general feedback I've seen from users is the longer slider is better - but you do need the real estate in your workshop

[Rod Sheridan]

I have a Hammer B3 Winner, I've had it for 7 years now.

I have the 48" long slider, the ergonomics on it are like a cabinet saw.

If you're making cutting boards, the ergonomics for ripping are going to be a lot more important than slider length, in your case bigger will be worse.

You can't go wrong with either machine.

Do you have a shaper? If not then I would consider buying a combo saw/shaper for edge treatments, nothing beats a shaper with a stock feeder for profiling cutting board edges.
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Regards, Rod.

[Mason Truelove]

whats the best brand for combo shaper?

[Michael Koons]

I have the SC4 Elite and like it. I'm not good on "this vs. that" threads because I find that people have different criteria. What I did when looking for saws was put a detailed spreadsheet together that showed each key feature I was interested in. (HP, dimensions, blade changing, price, country of build, etc...) One of the reasons I went with MM was availability as they had their saws in country vs. a several month wait from Felder/Hammer. Also (in my opinion), I thought quality of MM was more in line with Felder than Hammer. Happy to give you any details about my experience.

[David Kumm]

Compare the builds of the various models of each mfr first. That will give you an idea of what each machine has as an improvement over the other. Then you can start to compare each manufacturer. As the slider gets longer, the build becomes more important. Thickness of the extrusions and how flat they are ground. How stout the base is to support the extrusion. Look at the blade and arbor assembly and see how it is built and how it moves. Dovetails with adjustment, rods with bushings, etc. While you make the machine stationary or do you plan to move it around? A machine that is moved needs a much stouter base than one that is leveled and planted. If the internals are hung off the cast iron table ( done more often now that base steel is thin ), how thick is the cast iron and how heavily ribbed? Some machines develop a hollow where the weight pulls them down. Do your homework and go online and look at drawings and schematics of industrial saws as well as what you are considering. Knowledge of the differences and similarities will help with your decision. Dave

[Ryan Pappas]

I have the SC4 Elite and like it. I'm not good on "this vs. that" threads because I find that people have different criteria. What I did when looking for saws was put a detailed spreadsheet together that showed each key feature I was interested in. (HP, dimensions, blade changing, price, country of build, etc...) One of the reasons I went with MM was availability as they had their saws in country vs. a several month wait from Felder/Hammer. Also (in my opinion), I thought quality of MM was more in line with Felder than Hammer. Happy to give you any details about my experience.

The SC4 is what I keep leaning towards but the price is a little out of my range. The mm rep told me that an SC2 would be about the same quality as my sawstop and that the sc4 is a lot beefier built. I don't want to get something that is not as good of quality so that has me a little concerned about hammer. Though I have found a used one for basically the same price as I could sell my sawstop. Part of me says(and my wife too) just buy what I want now and be happy.

[Ryan Pappas]

I don't have a shaper but keep seeing how it can benefit me. My only problem is the price of the combo machines. I would love a bigger jointer but I have a 20" planer so I would be paying for a tool I would never use.

[Rod Sheridan]

I was worried about that with both Hammer and MiniMax when I was going from a General cabinet saw.

I looked at both in cabinet shops and realized that any differences were of absolutely no bearing on how well the machine would perform or how long it would last.

Both manufacturers make a great machine, that will do what they're supposed to do when we're all dead and gone.

A contractor saw will probably still be here when we're all gone as well.

As for the comments on mobility, both are built to be moved, mine is moved everytime it's used.

There's far too much worry about whether the steel is 3mm or 3.5mm. No matter what it is it will do what it's designed to do, and 3.5mm won't make the machine any better, or last any longer.

When was the last time you heard about a cabinet failure on a cabinet saw?

The most important thing is to pick a machine with the accessories and options you want, and has good dealer support.

I live in a town with an actual Felder factory dealership, SCM/MiniMax have much poorer support in my particular location, which steered me to the Hammer product.

I would have been just as happy with a MiniMax or SCM product.................Regards, Rod.

[Dan T Jones]

Ryan,
I bought a used 2000 model Hammer C3-41 combination machine. I have the a short slider, shaper, 16" jointer/planer and mortiser. I could not be happier. Space savings and quality. I had the Sawstop PCS and a Powermatic 60 jointer and frankly there is no comparison in quality and function. I can still rip out to about 40". I have 3 4hp motors. I did find a Delta Unifence on CL which is a real upgrade to the Hammer fence of the the 2000 vintage. I have added a power feeder and am looking forward to using the shaper. I don't know how much better the Felder or higher level Minimax machines are but I cannot imagine much difference for a hobbiest.
Dan

[Jim Becker]

These are all excellent machines.

I personally wouldn't want to have less than the 8'6" wagon that I have now, even if it didn't get used a lot. I don't work with boards longer than 8', but regardless of length, I straight line rip them clamped to the wagon and use a parallel jig to rip them to width if they are over 3-4" wide. That totally eliminates "edge jointing" at the jointer.

For the cutting board work you cite, you're going to love the repeatability. Be sure you get the smaller miter bar for whatever machine you choose as using the larger table can be cumbersome for smaller workpieces.

For the record, I have a MiniMax slider and am extremely pleased with it.

[Larry Edgerton]

I don't have a shaper but keep seeing how it can benefit me. My only problem is the price of the combo machines. I would love a bigger jointer but I have a 20" planer so I would be paying for a tool I would never use.

I think Rod was referring to a saw/shaper combination, not one with a planer jointer.

[David Kumm]

My point about the base build had nothing to do with saw failure, but about the machines ability to hold settings over the entire travel length of the slider. That isn't nearly as critical with just a saw, but when you add a shaper, the up and down variation can become a larger issue. Hanging a quill, blade flask and two or three motors off the cast iron also means the table must support it. I'm not saying any one machine here is superior, just what to compare. I follow both the MM and Felder groups and problems pretty much follow the price point.

Again, I'm not advocating one over the other, just pointing out what I look for when comparing. I've read too many threads about slider problems to believe all will be risk free. I own seven myself so I have pretty specific likes and dislikes. Dave

[Brian W Evans]

I recently purchased a MM SC4 Elite, which I absolutely love. The repeatability and power are a joy, as well as the ability to lay a full sheet of plywood on it and cut it precisely with little effort. It is a very solid machine - about 1500 pounds, IIRC - and I have seen no evidence of anything going out of alignment as the table moves. The SC4 Elite comes with the big outrigger and the smaller miter gauge that Jim mentioned.

Another thing you're going to love about these European machines (I assume the Hammers are this way) is the ease with which you can align things - all adjustments are easily accessible and intuitive. My two euro machines required almost no adjustment at all, and the few minor tweaks I made took about 30 seconds each - I spent more time looking for my allen wrenches than making the adjustments. I also didn't need to look at the manual or parts diagrams to figure out what to do.

I thought very seriously about getting ST4 Elite saw/shaper combo but it was WAY out of my price range - would've been nice, though.

I have no experience with Hammer/Felder, so I can't offer any comparisons.

Good luck with your decision.

[mark mcfarlane]

... I don't want to get something that is not as good of quality so that has me a little concerned about hammer. Though I have found a used one for basically the same price as I could sell my sawstop. Part of me says(and my wife too) just buy what I want now and be happy.

If you have a used Hammer available for a reasonable price you can buy it and sell it in 6 months for the same price if it doesn't meet your needs. I suspect it will be fine.

FWIW, I just ordered an 8.5' MiniMax CU300 combo machine today, but that was to meet my needs.

If I was primarily making cutting boards I would think that an 8' slider would get in the way a lot, unless you are starting with 8 foot stock. In which case, like Jim said, you can make glue line ready rips on the long slider with appropriate clamps/stops... and that could save you a lot of time.

[Andy Giddings]

Just noticed there's a Hammer B3 (saw/shaper) for sale in classifieds if you are interested

[Larry Edgerton]

Andy beat me to it, but here it is.
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?253532-FS-Hammer-B3-Sliding-Table-Saw-Shaper-Combo

That price is bottomed out, you could buy it and sell if you don't feel it fits you needs for the same money. Put a general location at the top so people kinda know where you are. State would be fine.

[Ryan Pappas]

Andy beat me to it, but here it is.
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?253532-FS-Hammer-B3-Sliding-Table-Saw-Shaper-Combo

That price is bottomed out, you could buy it and sell if you don't feel it fits you needs for the same money. Put a general location at the top so people kinda know where you are. State would be fine.


Ok thanks guys I'll check it out. I'm in Birmingham Alabama. I guess I haven't really looked to see how to display that.

[Erik Loza]

I won't give you an unbiased suggestion as to which brand I suggest folks buy best but I can can give you an unbiased answer on build quality: The Hammer is not as robust as the Minimax Classic series and the Minimax SC4 Elite is in a whole different league than either. All that being said, I don't see how you could go wrong with a Hammer B3 for the price that one is being offered at. Assuming is has no major issues. It will be light years ahead of anything you have ever owned. Best of luck in your search.

Erik

[scott vroom]

I'm also looking at K3 winner 79" and SC2. The K3 comes prepped for a dado; looks like the C2 is not. I was surprised at the weight difference (K3 851 lbs, SC2 595 lbs). Seems like a big difference for 2 machines with similar specs.

[Ryan Pappas]

I have decided to sell my sawstop and get a sliding table saw. I have narrowed it down to hammer k3 79x48 and minimax. I have the SC2 and the SC4 in mind for minimax. Also adding in the SC3 to the mix. I mainly make end grain cutting boards so not sure if a full 8ft is necessary for me but I know myself and I tend to want the best. Any help would greatly be appreciated.

Well with the help of Sam Blasco and a lot of thought I have decided on the Minimax SC4 Elite. I feel like it is a better built machine and will last me lots of years. I came close to pulling the trigger on the SC3 Classic but was told the footprint on the SC4 Elite isn't really much difference so I figured might as well have the bigger slider. Hopefully in a week or so I'll be heading to Atlanta to pick it up.

[glenn bradley]

I think you will be very happy. I agree with others here in that for your purposes, bigger is not better. Minimax offers a good variety of accessories of a very high quality. Enjoy your machine.

[Jim Becker]

Congratulations, Ryan! That's an excellent machine!

[Michael Koons]

Congrats! Same as my saw and I love it. Accuracy and repeatability are a dream and it is built very well. You'll enjoy it immensely.

If you have any questions, feel free to send me a PM. I know you have a great resource in Sam, but if I can be of any help, happy to share experiences.

[Robert Baker36]

Well with the help of Sam Blasco and a lot of thought I have decided on the Minimax SC4 Elite. I feel like it is a better built machine and will last me lots of years. I came close to pulling the trigger on the SC3 Classic but was told the footprint on the SC4 Elite isn't really much difference so I figured might as well have the bigger slider. Hopefully in a week or so I'll be heading to Atlanta to pick it up.
How do you like your machine? I assume you have had it for a while and can offer some insight. Rob

[Ryan Pappas]

I love having a sliding saw. I will never go back to a cabinet saw that’s for sure. As far as the SC4, I would say it is the best saw at its price point. If my budget was higher I may have gotten a different saw and/or brand. I am a tool nerd so I’m constantly looking at new machines and I could definitely see other features that I wish my saw had. With that being said, I am very new to sliders so a lot of my aggravation’s could be from user error and not enough hours with the machine.

[James Cheever]

Hi Ryan. I am looking at moving from my 24 year old 52” Delta Unisaw / Unifence to a MM slider. I’m currently thinking of the SC4. If you don’t mind me asking, can you tell me what options you ordered with your SC4? After you use of it over the last year, would your have made any different choices?

Thanks.

[Brian W Evans]

James,

I hope you don't mind me butting in on a question you asked of Ryan, but I also have the SC4 Elite. I purchased an extra cam clamp for the sliding table and I'm glad I did. I don't use it often but, when I need it, it's there. If I had to do it over again, I would buy the MM overarm blade guard/dust collector. I cheaped out and bought a Grizzly that I don't like that much. Having seen the MM version online a few times, I think I would have liked it much better.

My other advice would be about saw blades. The SC4 can run 12" blades and I bought some Forrest blades to use in mine. Most online retailers carry 12" blades with 1" arbor holes, but the SC4 has a 5/8" arbor. I bought the 1" hole blades and use an adapter to make them work on the 5/8" arbor. If I had to do it again I would order the 12" blades from Forrest with a 5/8" hole. It would be a little more expensive but I don't like using the adapters. Any future blades will have the 5/8" hole.

On the other hand, the 5/8 arbor allows you to use 10" blades off the shelf, and the 8" dado sets that most of us have (the dado blade insert comes with the SC4).

Best of luck.

[Jim Becker]

I'll echo what Brian Evans just wrote....I have two of the cam clamps with my S315WS and use them. It would be nice to have fancy pneumatic clamps, but... ;) And for the blades, I recently transitioned from my 10" Forrest blades to 12" Forrest blades, although I bought mine in 5/8" bore from SilversMill for a good price. The machine actually performs a little better with the 12" blade it's designed for...better tip speed I suspect, although it was perfectly fine with the 10" blades, too. I don't know what's standard these days, but I use the smaller miter gage accessory a lot more than the full outrigger. If it costs money, IMHO, it's worthy to have for many cross cutting operations that don't involve large panels.

And yea...I need a better over-arm blade guard as the one that attaches to the riving knife is a bit restrictive. That's a project I have planned... ;)

[James Cheever]

Jim, Brian, I very much appreciate your insights and feedback. Every bit of your learning (both now and any future insight you may have) will help me and absolutely be put to good use. Your info on the blades is very helpful. I was wondering if I should transition to the 12”blades or run with my 10” Forrest blades for the time being.

[Brian W Evans]

James,

My SC4 came standard with the smaller miter gauge accessory that Jim mentioned. Also, 1 cam clamp, the dado blade insert, blade guard/dust collection piece that attaches to the riving knife.

I leave my outrigger on all of the time because I have room and because I find it a pain to take it off, store it, and put it back on when I need it. You can easily use the miter gauge accessory with the outrigger still attached so, if you have the space, you might prefer to leave the outrigger on all the time.

[Jim Becker]

Brian, it's nice you got the dado insert...it seems they started including those after I bought my machine. To get the OEM piece now would cost me $350 plus shipping. :eek: (so I'll be making my own since I've decided to go back to using a dado blade for some opertations)

James, on the blade question, I think it comes down to money. I ran the 10" Forrest blades from when I bought the saw in the mid-late 2000s until recently. They had plenty of life in them (still do, actually) and sometimes I take a more frugal approach to things. In December, I decided to buy a 12" 48T since the "price was right" from Silvers Mill and I had the money. I'm very pleased with the blade, including the extra depth that comes in handy for stopped cuts, etc. I plan on buying another soon since I prefer to always have a spare, and will likely sell the 10" versions for "a very attractive price" to some other woodworker with a 10" saw. I'll still have the 20T ripping blade for when it's appropriate, but otherwise, being standard on 12" blades makes sense. Oh, and to use the riving knife for non-through cuts, you do need a 12" blade. I originally had to buy a second riving knife and grind off the top of it to use with the 10" blades since I always needed the ability to do non-through cuts. That trade-off was less money than buying new blades...at the time.

[David Kumm]

Although pricey, take a look at Mac's clamps at airtightclamps.com. I have several sets for saws and shapers and they are similar in quality to Aigner accessories. When buying blades for sliding saws it is always nice when the plate and tooth width is the same on all blades ( excepting rip since you don't use scoring when ripping ). Your fence settings stay exact and you don't need to adjust the scoring blade. Scorers are great but a pain to adjust. I'm assuming a split scorer if the saw doesn't have a lever with stops to raise the scoring blade. When choosing a blade, measure the thickness of the riving knife. A larger blade may need a separate knife as the riving knife should be slightly thicker than the plate of the blade but less than the tooth width. Often the riving knife that works with a 10" blade is too thin to be much use with a heavier plate 12". I like a heavy plate blade so several knives are usually necessary in my world. Dave

[Erik Loza]

I recall pricing out the overarm saw guard for an SC4 owner once and it was something like $1K, excluding shipping...:eek: Unless things have changed, the OEM accessory kit for the US SC4E's should be:

-Short mitre fence
-Slider push handle ("butt bar")
-(1) eccentric clamp
-100mm conical scoring blade
-Edging shoe (if 8.5'; optional on 5.5')

To echo what the other guys are saying, "if" you switch back and forth between solid wood and finished panels a lot, it might be worth investing in a paired scoring blade.

James Cheever, you're talking to Sam Blasco, right?

Erik

[James Cheever]

Guys, I love all this information. I have been reading a lot and watching all the YouTube videos I can find but this “hands on knowledge and experience” is exactly what I wanted and hoped for when I posted. I’ve been cabinet saw guy for so long, I didn’t want to miss something obvious because I didn’t know what to ask or I made the wrong assumption. Based on all your feedback, I started a SC4 options list. Sawmill Creek is the best!!!

Yes, Erik, I am. I reached out to Sam last week (based on my reading in an earlier 2015 Creek thread). He replied back in just a couple of hours; super responsive. I’m hoping to setup a phone call with him soon to really lock down the size of slider that will fit in my basement space. I want the largest that will fit; but clearly, fitting is key. I’m thinking the 8.5’ slider may push the envelope a bit too tight.

I plan to continue to be a knowledge sponge and soak everything in I can. Thanks again, Guys.

[Erik Loza]

James....

http://galootcentral.com/membersites/billwebber/BS%20S315.jpg
http://galootcentral.com/membersites/billwebber/BS%20enter.jpg
http://galootcentral.com/membersites/billwebber/BS%20sawdustcollectorpipe.jpg
http://galootcentral.com/membersites/billwebber/S315%20ripjig.jpg

Notice that he essentially eliminated the rip table. Where there's a will, there's a way. FYI that I am no longer in the machinery industry and have been stuck using a regular cabinet saw last year and a half. Going back sucks! Find a way to make it work; you won't regret it.

Erik

[Jim Becker]

Erik, I know a really good sales dude that can fix that lack of slider problem you have...and he's not too far from you, either. LOL

[Erik Loza]

LOL, Jim! :p

[Rod Sheridan]

. I want the largest that will fit; but clearly, fitting is key. I’m thinking the 8.5’ slider may push the envelope a bit too tight. Guys.

Hi James, don't get a bigger saw that you'll be sorry about later.

Have a good look at what you do, then decide on the slider length. I went with the smaller slider that will cross cut a sheet of plywood for my basement shop.

Most furniture components are small enough that I can straight line them on the slider, if longer I have a piece of ply with a "T" track from the saw manufacturer that gives me 8 foot capability. In seven years I've used it once.

That's as large as I require as I primarily build solid wood furniture. The smaller sliders have better ergonomics as you don't have the sliding table support sticking out where you stand.

I normally don't have the outrigger on the saw unless I'm using it to support long or heavy objects, it takes less than a minute to put it on the saw.

Consider how much space the larger slider takes, and the less optimum ergonomics, and evaluate your actual requirements. You can actually buy too much machine, which you have to live with afterwards.

regards, Rod.

[James Cheever]

Great advise, Rod. Thanks. Your caution is my worry.

I mainly deal with solid wood for furniture. Ply is just for backs (sometimes) and various cabinet builds. Like you, the most I see myself cutting in ply is 4 feet. My current thinking is the SC4 Elite with 5.5' slider will work just fine.

Thanks, again.

[Jim Becker]

James, while I enjoy having the longer 8'6" wagon, I really could work quite happily with the shorter one if I needed to in the future, especially since "there are ways" to accomodate longer rips if it's really necessary as Rod mentioned. Aside from eliminating edge jointing for me, the slider has really kicked things up a big notch for accurate and repeatable cross cutting. I could never go back to a cabinet saw and be happy, for sure.

[James Cheever]

Thanks, Rod and Jim. A basic and likely dumb question; asking since the footprint drawings I see on line are not clear (at least not to a beginner wannabe slider owner). If a saw has a 8.5’ or 5.5’ slider, can it edge rip to 8.5’ or 5.5’ or is the max rip something shorter? I rarely rip beyond 5’, but I do make beds and sometimes the bedposts and rails get that long (especially in a queen or king). Space is a limitation in my basement but I dont want to “lock” myself out if I can avoid it, so I want to better understand the max lengths possible with a certain slider length.

[Jim Becker]

Practically, you need a few inches on either end of the wagon to properly secure the material if you're going to use the wagon to move the wood through the cut. So for my 8'6" slider, I can do 8' lumber if I remove the outrigger and only use hold-downs. I'm guessing it would be simmer for the shorter stroke machine. For my S315WS with the 8'6" wagon, the end-to-end stroke requires a total of 19' unobstructed for a full length cut.

[James Cheever]

Excellent, Jim. Thank you.

[Ryan Pappas]

Hey James, I would agree with everyone on the blade guard. I really don’t like it at all and feels it limits me sometimes. I would highly recommend an over arm dust port. Honestly I never even knew that feature existed for my saw when I bought it nor did I even know that I needed it. The other feature I wish mine had would be the start/stop button on the end of the wagon. I am by no means a professional and don’t have the hours on my saw that most others in this group have and may can offer better suggestions for that problem but I could definitely see that as a great option to have. Overall the saw does great. It is a very high quality saw. I went from a saw stop industrial to this and am very happy I got into the sliding saw. I think for what I wanted to spend it was a good decision but knowing what I know from using this for the last year I may have decided to spend a little more and get the more upgraded features or a completely different saw altogether. I have a problem with being satisfied because this is a really great saw. I just started noticing things I wish mine had and then I see them on other saws for just a little bit more in price. I am the type that would rather pay more and get exactly what I want.

[James Cheever]

Thanks, Ryan. I really appreciate the comments. I understand what you are saying about spending a bit more. I had a long conversation with Sam Blasco this morning. I was pretty much set on a MM SC4E. After talking to him, I’m now asking him about the features and improvements (if any) of a MM 315ES with the 8.5’ slider vs the SC4E to see if I want that one instead. Clearly more money but I’d rather cry once. Based on how long I have had my Delta Unisaw, this will likely be my last saw so I want to choose correctly.

Your comment on the controls on the end of the wagon helps a lot. That is a feature I asked Sam about and think I might want to add to my slider (what I get).

I really want to learn from you and the other on the Creek. Thanks aagain for your insight.

[Ryan Pappas]

Thanks, Ryan. I really appreciate the comments. I understand what you are saying about spending a bit more. I had a long conversation with Sam Blasco this morning. I was pretty much set on a MM SC4E. After talking to him, I’m now asking him about the features and improvements (if any) of a MM 315ES with the 8.5’ slider vs the SC4E to see if I want that one instead. Clearly more money but I’d rather cry once. Based on how long I have had my Delta Unisaw, this will likely be my last saw so I want to choose correctly.

Your comment on the controls on the end of the wagon helps a lot. That is a feature I asked Sam about and think I might want to add to my slider (what I get).

I really want to learn from you and the other on the Creek. Thanks aagain for your insight.


Im with you on the cry once. I feel if I could do it again I may would go the same route. I’m not saying the SC4 is bad at all. The 315 may just have those extra features I would like to have. I never even looked at the 315 though. This was stuff that never really occurred to me to ask.

[David Kumm]

Have you talked to Sam about a Casadei saw. They are owned by SCM and the machines tend to be similar. I believe there is a special price running , something like 11K at this time. Might be worth a look if for no other reason than to learn about choices. Dave

[James Cheever]

Never heard of them, Dave. I’ll ask Sam. Thanks for the lead.

[Ryan Pappas]

Never heard of them, Dave. I’ll ask Sam. Thanks for the lead.


James, I would also think it would be worth it for you to check out Felder. I’m not trying to bash MM at all but in the price range you are looking and your location I would at least check them out. The K700 S is a pretty nice machine.

[David Kumm]

The Casadei will likely be three phase only. I didn't think of that as I am used to three phase as the norm. The Feldeer 700 and 900 are nice machines. Dave

[johnny means]

Call me spoiled, but I don't think either saw will replace the Sawstop. I've always used a slider in conjunction with a cabinet saw. End grain cutting boards would seem to require a lot of little prices, which I never found a slider to be good for. First of all, the slider form factor makes working close to the blade awkward. Also, moving an 5-12 ft carriage back and forth to cut dozens or even hundreds of small pieces gets tiresome real fast. I can't say much about your Mini-Max verses Hammer question, but I would advise you to hold on to the cabinet saw until you know you won't miss it.

[Ryan Pappas]

I make a lot of end grain boards as well and I really started using my bandsaw more than anything for cross cuts and rips. The waste is almost nothing. And I actually feel a little better cutting close to the blade with my slider compared to my sawstop. The sliders move so smooth that it doesn’t take much effort to go back and forth. I loved my sawstop too but I guess I’m really liking the slider.

[Rod Sheridan]

A Fritz und Franz jig on a slider improves your safety dramatically when cutting small pieces and will do many other tasks as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqzVglze9Nk&t=130s

Regards, Rod.

[James Cheever]

Understand, Dave. I actually start my Unisaw replacement search with the SawStop. However, for the work I do (ie, furniture), the sliders are really drawing me.

David, thanks for the update. I really want to stay with single phase versus three phase.

[Jim Becker]

I believe that the 315 Elite is currently on sale based on an ad in the current issue of Woodshop News. That should make the cost more approachable and hopefully closer to the SC4.

[James Cheever]

Great to know, Jim. I'll ask Sam and see what is possible.

[James Cheever]

Ryan, and All - I am trying to reach out Felder too. I understand the 700 series is comparable to the MM SC4E.

However, after several emails through their website, so far they have not contacted me. My next step is to try a cold call. I admit I do get a bit put-off when people and companies don't respond to requests for contact. In comparison, Sam replied within hours to my MM questions.

Does anyone happen to have any specific contact info for someone at Felder?

Thanks.

[Rod Sheridan]

Ryan, and All - I am trying to reach out Felder too. I understand the 700 series is comparable to the MM SC4E.

However, after several emails through their website, so far they have not contacted me. My next step is to try a cold call. I admit I do get a bit put-off when people and companies don't respond to requests for contact. In comparison, Sam replied within hours to my MM questions.

Does anyone happen to have any specific contact info for someone at Felder?

Thanks.
Hi, just call : 866-792-5288 and speak to one of the sales people................Rod.

[James Cheever]

That will be my next step. Thanks, Rod.

[Ryan Pappas]

That will be my next step. Thanks, Rod.

Call Steven at Felder. 302-351-5918. He’s consistently calling me. If that number doesn’t work call 302-322-7732.

[Carl Beckett]

Does anyone have examples of overarm dust collection that they have used on these saws? (I didnt see a strong recommendation in the thread...)

[mark mcfarlane]

Does anyone have examples of overarm dust collection that they have used on these saws? (I didnt see a strong recommendation in the thread...)

I use a Shark Guard with a 4" hose attachment, with the hose hung from the ceiling. From the ceiling it is rigid pipe, blast gate, then a foot of flex hose right above the guard. The 4" is overkill, if I open the blast gate too far it will suck up fairly large offcuts.

[Peter Kelly]

Does anyone have examples of overarm dust collection that they have used on these saws? (I didnt see a strong recommendation in the thread...)See post no. 7: https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?258395-Mike-s-Shop-is-Underway

[Jeff Gandy]

I hope your choice works out for you. I went from a Grizzly 1023 to a SCM/Minimax SC3. The customer service would be comical if it was not so awful. Make sure you document the arrival of the saw in total detail. Look for any signs that the saw has shifted inside the crate. Remove one of the crate ends BEFORE you even touch it on the truck. Pictures and more pictures. Especially when you unpack even if you don't see damages. And I would highly recommend making sure you have pictures of the saw inside the crate and how it was strapped down, including the feet where there are small plastic anchors that hold the saw in place.

You will be sent the terms of the shipment the day they ship it to you. Until that moment you do not know how it works, or who is responsible for what, or what you can and cannot do (ie refuse the shipment). You should ask for those terms up front, unless you want to gamble that you are willing to take the risk, or in my case to not learn about the situation until after the saw is on the truck and headed to your delivery point. Read Jim's comment on the dado insert, and the price. That piece is shipped beneath the saw and totally hidden until you uncrate. Along with a lot of other aluminum.

Don't wait to unpack that saw. Be on it quickly.

[Rod Sheridan]

Does anyone have examples of overarm dust collection that they have used on these saws? (I didnt see a strong recommendation in the thread...)

Hi, I installed an Excelsior guard on mine, it swings out of the way with the release of one toggle clamp.....Rod.

379550

[Jacob Mac]

I hope your choice works out for you. I went from a Grizzly 1023 to a SCM/Minimax SC3. The customer service would be comical if it was not so awful. Make sure you document the arrival of the saw in total detail. Look for any signs that the saw has shifted inside the crate. Remove one of the crate ends BEFORE you even touch it on the truck. Pictures and more pictures. Especially when you unpack even if you don't see damages. And I would highly recommend making sure you have pictures of the saw inside the crate and how it was strapped down, including the feet where there are small plastic anchors that hold the saw in place.

You will be sent the terms of the shipment the day they ship it to you. Until that moment you do not know how it works, or who is responsible for what, or what you can and cannot do (ie refuse the shipment). You should ask for those terms up front, unless you want to gamble that you are willing to take the risk, or in my case to not learn about the situation until after the saw is on the truck and headed to your delivery point. Read Jim's comment on the dado insert, and the price. That piece is shipped beneath the saw and totally hidden until you uncrate. Along with a lot of other aluminum.

Don't wait to unpack that saw. Be on it quickly.


I was going to buy a bandsaw from minimax a few weeks back and Sam Blasco told me that I had to arrange for my own carrier from Minimax’s place of business in Atlanta. Any and all issues with shipping were my responsibility to schedule. And any problems with the bandsaw that happened in shipping were between myself and whatever company I hired.

That sounded like a terrible solution, so I passed. Now I’m back to figuring out what to do for a bandsaw. I know there are resellers, so maybe I go that route.

[Peter Kelly]

Really? I ordered a C26 Genius from Sam a few months ago, SCM arranged the carrier including lift gate service with a straight truck. Worked out fine.

[Jacob Mac]

Really? I ordered a C26 Genius from Sam a few months ago, SCM arranged the carrier including lift gate service with a straight truck. Worked out fine.

So I bought a J/P from Sam in December and they arranged shipping. It worked just fine and I was pleased with the process so I called him about the bandsaw. Sam told me it was a new policy starting in January.

[John Sanford]

With that being said, I am very new to sliders so a lot of my aggravation’s could be from user error and not enough hours with the machine.

What aggravations?