Big trees - what a shame

[John Ziebron]

A friend recently sent me an email with a bunch of historical photos and captions. These two were among them. I would love to see these giants in person some day.











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California lumberjacks work on Redwoods. Thousands of tree rings in these ancient trees - each over 1000+ years old or even much older...such a shame...irreplaceable giants.

National park treasures all gone but a few – what kind of men would do such a thing for over 100 years - destroy something they cannot ever fix or replace for 2000 years? It is an evergreen, long-lived, monoecious tree living 1200–1800 years or more. An estimated 95% or more of the original old-growth redwood forest has been cut. In 1850, old-growth redwood forest covered more than 2,000,000 acres...down to 8,100 acres by 1968, by which time nearly 90% of the original redwood trees had been logged.

[Yonak Hawkins]

It's old fashioned selfishness .. depriving our progeny of something we take for ourselves.

[Art Mann]

When those trees were cut, there were probably many square miles of such trees and it didn't seem like depriving anyone of anything. One should not assign blame or claim selfishness to the people of history who didn't realize what they were doing.

[John Ziebron]

I just said it was a shame that this happened. I wasn't blaming anyone for it. I understand the circumstances of the time. I'm sure there are things we are doing today that a hundred years from now people will say the same thing.

[Matt Day]

They didn't have the benefit of hindsight. Can't be mad at them - it was a different time and place and American used up that wood faster than it could be cut.

[Prashun Patel]

My favorite place in the world (as if I've been everywhere ;) ) is Muir Woods outside of San Francisco.

We'll have our own set of pictures to evoke our children's pity and outrage, as they will have theirs.

[Jim Koepke]

Who was it who said, "a tree is a tree, how many more do you need to look at?"

(He is often misquoted as having said, "If you've seen one redwood, you've seen them all.")

jtk

[John K Jordan]

My favorite place in the world (as if I've been everywhere ;) ) is Muir Woods outside of San Francisco.


Me too! I was also surprised at the "hidden" pockets of big redwoods I found while exploring the state. (I used to fly out to write software and spent the weekends driving aimlessly!)

JKJ

[Mel Fulks]

[QUOTE=Jim Koepke;2675770]Who was it who said, "a tree is a tree, how many more do you need to look

Some self effacing guy with a rope around his neck

[Pat Barry]

Did you see the size of that saw??

[michael langman]

The white man was brought up to conquer nature, not to live alongside of it.

Very sad indeed.

[Pat Barry]

Kind of ironic isn't it. A bunch of woodworkers lamenting some trees getting cut down?

[Art Mann]

The same thing is happening today to the vast rain forests in underdeveloped countries of the world. Some of the people who are clear cutting them for farm land are just trying to stay alive. I can't blame them either.

[Yonak Hawkins]

I, for one, am not willing to be so forgiving. We've known for centuries, ever since the majority of trees were cut from Europe that there are finite natural resources available to us but, when we found more resources on the other side of the ocean, we took to decimating them without reservation and without remorse. Did we listen to the natives in America who revere nature ? No .. you can't say we didn't know. We were selfish and uncaring for the people who would follow us. Now they will be deprived of the gift nature gave us. By the way, it's still happening.

[David Helm]

Those guys cut a lot of trees for sure, but the actual deforestation did not happen till the advent of the chain saw and major clear cut logging. The Redwoods and the temperate rain forests in the Northwest are mere fractions of what they once were. Replanting a single species does not make for a magnificent mixed species, mixed age forest. Monoculture has proven to never work in the long run. As for woodworkers decrying logging; I don't see a problem as long as the wood used is from sustainable harvesting done with continued health of the forest in mind. Most of what I get here in Washington is done that way. There is no logical reason to continue clearcutting the remaining ancient forests.

[John K Jordan]

... We've known for centuries, ever since the majority of trees were cut from Europe ...

Driving through Great Britain some years ago we made a loop through Scotland to the west cost then north and as we drove south I commented on how there were no trees in that part of the country - nothing but hills, hills, grassy hills and some scrub. Then I topped one hill and saw a wall of big old growth trees, in a straight line, evidently the border of some protected area (royal forest?) which was obviously the natural state - all else was deforestation.

I read a book once about wrought iron. It was astounding how much forest was required to make charcoal to support the wrought iron industry, apparently responsible for much deforestation in the US.

JKJ

[Mel Fulks]

Even the Indians did a lot of cutting ,especially brush and low growth....I've gotten over my anger about them stepping on wild flowers.

[Jim Barkelew]

I think everybody who walks thru an old growth forest, especially the redwoods, is changed for life. I have stood on a stump that is as big as our living room.

On the other hand, I just made a segmented bowl out of some salvaged redwood and it is a lovely wood to turn.

[Roger Feeley]

Read "Collapse" by Jared Diamond. He's best known for "Guns Germs and Steel" but Collapse is just as interesting. In it he traces the downfall of a number of civilizations including Easter Island. One bit sort of sticks with me. He asks what the native thought as he cut down the very last tree on Easter Island for firewood knowing that he was sealing the fate of the whole population to cook his dinner.

[Roger Feeley]

Kind of ironic isn't it. A bunch of woodworkers lamenting some trees getting cut down?

Aren't hunters and fishermen some of the most vocal advocates for wildlife protection? Coastal fishermen (not the corporate types), are some of the most vocal protectors of our waters. SCUBA divers have long spoken out for our reefs.

It stands to reason that woodworkers would be advocates to protect forests. I remember reading some years ago that the principal products being produced from clear cutting rain forest woods was plywood that was sent to japan for concrete forms. I think there is a big difference between cutting down a tree to make a fine cabinet and cutting it down to make utility grade plywood.

[Mel Fulks]

That Easter Island thing should be a warning to people who love garden gnomes.

[Malcolm McLeod]

Read "Collapse" by Jared Diamond. He's best known for "Guns Germs and Steel" but Collapse is just as interesting. In it he traces the downfall of a number of civilizations including Easter Island. One bit sort of sticks with me. He asks what the native thought as he cut down the very last tree on Easter Island for firewood knowing that he was sealing the fate of the whole population to cook his dinner.

"Guns, Germs, and Steel" is very thoughtprovoking and I highly recommend it.

I haven't read "Collapse", but I hope Diamond doesn't portray the Easter Islanders as stupid (I can't imagine that he would?). All too often we see these ancient civilizations as less intelligent than we are today, but there is no evidence of this. They simply had less knowledge of and access to our current technology - - and that doesn't make them stupid. They may very well have cut down the last tree to cook dinner, but it is probably just as likely they cut down the last 50 trees, made canoes and sailed to the next 'paradise'. (I hear they were pretty good seamen & navigators.)

They might even have been sustain-ably harvesting the trees and a drought/fire, or a mud-slide, or earthquake, or mismanagement of water resources wiped out the trees. ...Strikes me as a little California-like today.

[Yonak Hawkins]

It's really telling to look at the island of Hispaniola. Half if it (Dominican Republic) is verdant and vibrant and the people have a fairly good standard of life. The other half (Haiti) has been cleared of trees and it's a poor, poor Country. To me, there's a pretty clear connection.

[Tony Pisano]

We live in MA near Mt Greylock, our tallest "mountain" Its preserved state land now by way back before my time there are pictures of most of it being clearcut, I think also for charcoal production. I agree with many of the creekers that the people who use resources are most often the most vocal about their protection. I know a good portion of the hunting and fishing license money in our state goes for land and habitat preservation. Big corporation use of resources is another story altogether.
I bought a copy of guns,germs, and still a while back, but haven't gotten to reading it yet. Thanks for the reminder. I'll have to pull it off the shelf.

[Pat Barry]

Aren't hunters and fishermen some of the most vocal advocates for wildlife protection? Coastal fishermen (not the corporate types), are some of the most vocal protectors of our waters. SCUBA divers have long spoken out for our reefs.

It stands to reason that woodworkers would be advocates to protect forests. I remember reading some years ago that the principal products being produced from clear cutting rain forest woods was plywood that was sent to japan for concrete forms. I think there is a big difference between cutting down a tree to make a fine cabinet and cutting it down to make utility grade plywood.
Hunters want to protect wildlife so they have more to hunt. Cutting trees down for furniture is worse than cutting for plywood because the furniture folks desire 'special' woods, figured, grain patterns, curly, wavy, mahogany, exotics and plywood guys don't care about that. The guys providing wood to furntiure makers seek out special trees and cut them down. Lumber makers, at least replant the forests they harvest.

[James Runchey]

I remember back when we bought our first house back in '62, there was lots of redwood in the lumber yards available at a cheap price. I put up a martin house on a redwood 4 x 4, a twenty footer straight as an arrow, nice to workwith. Had to have been cheap, didn't have much money in those days. Did many projects with nice clear redwood. I could also get clear white pine for 40 cents a foot in those days.

[Malcolm Schweizer]

It's really telling to look at the island of Hispaniola. Half if it (Dominican Republic) is verdant and vibrant and the people have a fairly good standard of life. The other half (Haiti) has been cleared of trees and it's a poor, poor Country. To me, there's a pretty clear connection.

There is more to it than that, but you are right- I travel to Haiti and the DR on business and there is quite a contrast. Haiti's poverty is mostly to blame on bad government. It was once a beautiful place and thriving economy. The hotel where I stay there is an old Victorian home. There are two classes in Haiti- the filthy rich and the dirt poor.

Their deforrestation is from making charcoal, which they load on boats and sell to surrounding islands, especially the Bahamas. The deforrestation also causes runoff issues and mudslides.

Pas for the cutting of redwoods, there is a video on YouTube that is an old film reel of them cutting the trees. Very sad, but also very interesting to see. Can you imagine chopping down a tree that big with only an axe and handsaw?