Dust collector canister life span

[Richard Dooling]

Is there a life span on dust collector canister type filters? That's assuming no accidental rips or other damage.
Mine is a Dust Dog that came with a Jet collector.

Thanks Richard

[Ben Rivel]

On may yes. Varies by type and manufacturer. With one like that though you should have probably replaced it from the start. Those "upgraded" canister ones that come as options or with dust collectors are never very good. Check out Wynn filters for an upgrade and replace it!

[Bill Adamsen]

With care (knock on wood) I have not had to replace my Wynn filters in the 2+ years I've had them. I just serviced the filters on my dust collection and they are functioning like new.

[Bruce Page]

On may yes. Varies by type and manufacturer. With one like that though you should have probably replaced it from the start. Those "upgraded" canister ones that come as options or with dust collectors are never very good. Check out Wynn filters for an upgrade and replace it!
That is a very broad statement. What do you base it on?

[Andy Giddings]

Wynn typically state their filters last for "many years". Probably difficult for any manufacturer to give a specific number of years due to type of use and maintenance. Richard, would recommend getting in touch with Jet for guidance as to life. A quick search on SMC brought up this link http://www.woodturningvideosplus.com/dust-collector.html where a Dust Dog owner has been washing his "for years". One thing to bear in mind with getting the filter totally clean - some filter media only reaches peak efficiency once its initially loaded with dust. So getting all the dust out may lead to some initial leakage. One exception to this is the Wynn Nano material.

[Ben Rivel]

That is a very broad statement. What do you base it on?Well for starters they are usually only 1 or 2 microns. Then their surface area is usually A LOT less than a finer quality filter AND the material of which they are made is usually lower quality as well which both contribute to air flow efficiency. Many people around the net claim great improvements all around by upgrading the cheap chinese canister filters that come with inexpensive dust collectors to something like a Wynn Nano filter. And if the dust collector has one of those fine dust spreading bag "filters"? Oh forget it, those things are complete junk.

[George Makra]

I have worked in clean rooms and HVAC for over forty years.
Use a manometer to check the differential pressure across the filter when it reaches .5 inch of water column drop across the filter is reaching a higher efficiency i.e. plugged.

And to be perfectly honest the subject of dust collection on the web is hilarious with the 'micron readings" by a bunch of rank amateurs tossing around CFM and velocity blah blah blah.
They are actually important measurements however never on any of these dust collection threads does one mention the methods and means to measure these terms. Has anyone mentioned a hot wire anemometer or a particle count meter or even a lowly manometer to make measurements. Or even the calculations converting velocity to CFM?

For a lower mid level clean room such as a pharmaceutical clean room or an operating room the air is purified to 5 microns since viruses are larger than 5 microns.
So when I hear that dust collection is trying to get cleaner than an operating room its funny because there is no way I would get operated on in my shop or any of yours.
Everybody breathes mold spores, skin flora, bacteria, pollen, smoke and other stuff that's much worse than nuisance wood dust.

As for filters when it comes down to the HEPA media there is only one company in the world that makes it and that is Flanders in South Carolina. So who ever builds the filter, the media comes from the same place.

There is a lot to ventilation and if someone wants to learn I am willing to talk about it.

Its a big business selling dust collectors and accessories.

My advice quit worrying about the minutiae of dust collection enjoy your hobby and when the dust collector doesn't seem to be working any more wash the bag or replace the filter.

[Bill Adamsen]

I have worked in clean rooms and HVAC for over forty years. ... There is a lot to ventilation and if someone wants to learn I am willing to talk about it.

Thanks George for pledging to share your wisdom. And the info on Hepa (my filters are rated at Merv 15). This community evolves and members new and old are seeking mentorship in areas where others may have greater strengths.

I have been the recipient of great advice especially with regards to dust collection - that had it not been forthcoming - would have caused frustration, expense and other functional issues. Bill Pentz' spreadsheet (http://www.billpentz.com/Woodworking/Cyclone/staticcalc_faqs.cfm) is a great resource for estimating static pressure and velocities. A search of the forum for "pitot tube", "hot wire anemometer", "laser particle counter", or "megnehelic" for instance will show that many forum members use these tools to better understand their systems. I rather enjoy the journey as much as the end result, so research, analysis and measurement are my trade.

[Larry Frank]

I see that we have a new person on the Creek.....welcome.

I think that if you check you will see that all of the things you mentioned have been discussed. I have actually used a hot wire anemometer to measure velocity and a manometer to measure pressure. I even have calculated average velocity from cfm

If you wish to not worry about breathing fine dust from sanding, that is OK with me. However, I know that if I do not use dust collection in my hobby shop that I get sick with sinus and bronchial problems.

[Andy Giddings]

I think I'll stick with my filter setup rather than go back to the 5 micron bag that came with it. Even if it doesn't cause harm to my lungs (which I doubt despite your 40 years) it makes the workshop a lot cleaner

[John K Jordan]

I have worked in clean rooms and HVAC for over forty years....the subject of dust collection on the web is hilarious ...Has anyone mentioned a hot wire anemometer or a particle count meter ...For a lower mid level clean room such as a pharmaceutical clean room or an operating room the air is purified to 5 microns since viruses are larger than 5 microns....Everybody breathes mold spores, skin flora, bacteria, pollen, smoke and other stuff that's much worse than nuisance wood dust. ...My advice quit worrying about the minutiae of dust collection enjoy your hobby and when the dust collector doesn't seem to be working any more wash the bag or replace the filter.

These opinions may certainly be valid for a bio clean room environment. Apparently the hazards of fine wood dust are far more serious than the "nuisance" dust speculated, the dust you can see and sweep up. Repeated exposure to even sub-micron wood dust evidently can slowly increase sensitivity and lead to disabling respiratory problems. Some people work their whole lives with zero issues. Other people become so sensitized to certain species over time that even entering a room where certain woods have been recently worked can send them to the emergency room due to invisible particles in the air.

Some exotic woods are especially hazardous; one of the most notorious is Cocobolo. This is not profit-driven marketing hype but fact based on observation and research. I personally have to wear long sleeves when working Cocobolo, Borneo rosewood, and to a lesser extent others or my skin will break out into a rash. I do not want that dust in my lungs.

In the last few years two woodturners in our club alone had to quit working with wood and sell all their tools. One sold his house and moved since he could no longer use his shop even after repeated cleanings. (He took up metal turning.) Yes, this is anecdotal "evidence" but it certainly factual to those who experience it. The writings of Bill Pence are a good start for learning about issues specific to wood dust. BTW, BIll strongly recommends exhausting dust to the outside rather than filtering and returning the air to an enclosed shop.

I personally use a cyclone with the Wynn filters plus a respirator when sanding. Like many others, I use a laser particle air quality monitor in the shop to help assess my procedures. With a history of asthma I choose to minimize my exposure to fine dust as much as I can within my means.

I'm not nearly as concerned with the common airborne biological contaminants. Unlike the snowballing sensitivity risk from fine wood dust, the body's defense mechanisms take care of many biologicals in a non-surgical environment. In fact, there is evidence that repeated exposure to some biologicals such as viruses, germs and pollen can actually build immunity and desensitize to allergic reactions. I understand this is the basis for flu shots, allergy shots and the use of local pollen-bearing local honey. This apparently doesn't work for sub-micron wood dust.

My own policy is to pay close attention to the minutiae of wood dust collection so perhaps I can enjoy my hobby for years to come. And my property is a no-smoking zone.

JKJ

[Richard Dooling]

Thanks to everyone for their replies!

I know dust collection/filtering is a complex subject but the further I get into the topic the more overwhelming it feels.

So I'll reach for improvements that are doable.


Get a better main filter. Wynn seems to be a good choice from what I've read here and in some other resources. Their web site is very informative and they seem dedicated to their mission.
Wear my mask more. It's a pretty good mask and not too uncomfortable (he said in temperatures under 90).
Get a real ambient filter. I've just got a box fan with a decent furnace filter now.
See if I can exhaust to the outside in warmer weather.
Use hand planes and scrapers more and sand less. Turn cleaner and sand less. Got to get better with the dreaded skew!!


I'm starting to see the ambient air filter as more important than I have in the past. Fine dust just floats for hours if not captured plus it can get kicked back into the air when whatever it landed on is disturbed.

Larry, thanks for the welcome! I've actually been on the Creek since 2007 but haven't posted in quite some time. I used to mostly be in the Neander forum but I've caught the turning bug.

Where's my wallet?

[Ben Rivel]

I have worked in clean rooms and HVAC for over forty years.
Use a manometer to check the differential pressure across the filter when it reaches .5 inch of water column drop across the filter is reaching a higher efficiency i.e. plugged.

And to be perfectly honest the subject of dust collection on the web is hilarious with the 'micron readings" by a bunch of rank amateurs tossing around CFM and velocity blah blah blah.
They are actually important measurements however never on any of these dust collection threads does one mention the methods and means to measure these terms. Has anyone mentioned a hot wire anemometer or a particle count meter or even a lowly manometer to make measurements. Or even the calculations converting velocity to CFM?

For a lower mid level clean room such as a pharmaceutical clean room or an operating room the air is purified to 5 microns since viruses are larger than 5 microns.
So when I hear that dust collection is trying to get cleaner than an operating room its funny because there is no way I would get operated on in my shop or any of yours.
Everybody breathes mold spores, skin flora, bacteria, pollen, smoke and other stuff that's much worse than nuisance wood dust.

As for filters when it comes down to the HEPA media there is only one company in the world that makes it and that is Flanders in South Carolina. So who ever builds the filter, the media comes from the same place.

There is a lot to ventilation and if someone wants to learn I am willing to talk about it.

Its a big business selling dust collectors and accessories.

My advice quit worrying about the minutiae of dust collection enjoy your hobby and when the dust collector doesn't seem to be working any more wash the bag or replace the filter.Many of us want to talk about it and learn more! So lets talk. I own a hot wire anemometer (Dywer 471-1), a particle count meter (Dylos DC1100 Pro) and can make any calculations you like. Drop some knowledge on us and school us! We're all ears! Or eyes in this case.

[Wade Lippman]

Thanks to everyone for their replies!

I know dust collection/filtering is a complex subject but the further I get into the topic the more overwhelming it feels.

So I'll reach for improvements that are doable.


Get a better main filter. Wynn seems to be a good choice from what I've read here and in some other resources. Their web site is very informative and they seem dedicated to their mission.
Wear my mask more. It's a pretty good mask and not too uncomfortable (he said in temperatures under 90).
Get a real ambient filter. I've just got a box fan with a decent furnace filter now.
See if I can exhaust to the outside in warmer weather.
Use hand planes and scrapers more and sand less. Turn cleaner and sand less. Got to get better with the dreaded skew!!


I'm starting to see the ambient air filter as more important than I have in the past. Fine dust just floats for hours if not captured plus it can get kicked back into the air when whatever it landed on is disturbed.

Larry, thanks for the welcome! I've actually been on the Creek since 2007 but haven't posted in quite some time. I used to mostly be in the Neander forum but I've caught the turning bug.

Where's my wallet?

I don't see where it has been established there is anything wrong with your existing filter.

[Richard Dooling]

I don't see where it has been established there is anything wrong with your existing filter.

Hi Wade,

When I started the thread my question was about canister filters wearing out. I've been a little concerned because this system uses a beater bar to help keep the V fold filter media somewhat dust free. I don't know if that is gradually deteriorating the effectiveness of the material or not and I can't establish if this brand is very well respected. Are their stated specs real or only obtainable in a lab?

Also as far as I can tell this is a 2 micron filter when operating optimally. Enough? I'm still researching. I've also wondered if a larger filter could be fitted to improve air-flow.

So I'm not rushing to spend money on this right now, I'm really trying to understand my current setup and my options. Besides there are items on my (unordered) list that don't cost anything.

[Ole Anderson]

I have worked in clean rooms and HVAC for over forty years.
Use a manometer to check the differential pressure across the filter when it reaches .5 inch of water column drop across the filter is reaching a higher efficiency i.e. plugged.

And to be perfectly honest the subject of dust collection on the web is hilarious with the 'micron readings" by a bunch of rank amateurs tossing around CFM and velocity blah blah blah.
They are actually important measurements however never on any of these dust collection threads does one mention the methods and means to measure these terms. Has anyone mentioned a hot wire anemometer or a particle count meter or even a lowly manometer to make measurements. Or even the calculations converting velocity to CFM?

Actually there are a fair number of engineers on this site that have some experience in the subject at hand. Some go as far as hot wire anemometer and particle counters. I am a retired civil engineer having specialized in open channel and closed conduit hydraulics and many on this site are much more experienced in the field of air filtration and movement. I use a HVAC Velocitor (fan anemometer) for measuring air flow and have two Magnehelic gauges (0-5 in for filter loss and 0-15 for cyclone pressure (suction)). I keep a copy of my cyclone's performance curve mounted on the wall next to my gauges. Some filters, depending on design, will have more than 0.5" of loss even when new. The filter that came with my Oneida cyclone is a G.E. Certified H-12 HEPA. http://www.oneida-air.com/PDF/gehepa.pdf. A lot of us take the issue of dust collection pretty seriously.

I always perk up when someone starts a sentence with "And to be perfectly honest...".

And to answer the OP's question, it depends.

[Richard Dooling]

Talked to Jet technician and he said these filters can last for many years if not abused. Stated that the V fabric will not deteriorate with normal beater bar use. It's also OK to gently rinse after blowing or brushing out - obviously off the machine. Mostly he recommended blowing air from outside in while mounted to remove fine dust.
As others have noted though, cleaning may improve air flow while allowing coarser particles to escape.

[Andy Giddings]

Richard, the coarser particle issue is temporary, not permanent. I suspect if you use air to clean instead of washing, it won't even change the loading as its hard to get all of the dust out of a pleated filter using air alone

[Richard Dooling]

Andy, I tend to agree. I think from what I have read, that a moderate mechanical and air cleaning may be the appropriate method. Clean enough to maintain good air flow while allowing some loading of the filter to help with particle size.

I've decided to give up woodworking in favor of chasing the ultimate dust collection system. My Grail.

[Andy Giddings]

Andy, I tend to agree. I think from what I have read, that a moderate mechanical and air cleaning may be the appropriate method. Clean enough to maintain good air flow while allowing some loading of the filter to help with particle size.

I've decided to give up woodworking in favor of chasing the ultimate dust collection system. My Grail.
LOL I know the feeling. Good thing is you already have a pretty good system compared to many

[Alan Schaffter]

For a lower mid level clean room such as a pharmaceutical clean room or an operating room the air is purified to 5 microns since viruses larger than 5 microns.

It is posts like yours that don't help the discussion. For someone who has "worked in clean rooms and HVAC for over forty years" you should know the difference between microns and nanometers! Viruses run in size from 5 - 300 nanometers (0.005 - .3 microns)!!

To qualify as HEPA by US government standards, an air filter must remove (from the air that passes through) 99.97% of particles that have a size of 0.3 µm (microns). Obviously, most but the very largest viruses are smaller than that! You also need to read up on what the EPA and various health organizations have to say about the dangers of wood dust- by the way, the most dangerous fall within the .5 - 10 micron range. The Flanders corporate office is just down the road from me in Washington, NC, and by the way, Japanese-owned Daikin Industries Ltd., through its subsidiary American Air Filter Co. Inc. purchased Flanders Corporation in 2016. Flanders located here because of the cheap labor and availability of cellulose for filter media. I'm not making any of this up- straight from Mr. Google.

[Ole Anderson]

Many of us have found that the final cleaning of a filter can be accomplished outside with a leaf blower. More gentle than 60 psi on an air hose.

[James Gunning]

Dick Wynn recommended cleaning with air no more than 60 PSI as I recall. A leaf blower works just fine as well. Dick also said the "flapper" type cleaning paddles were not a good idea as they would damage the filter media well before the normal time it would wear out.

[Richard Dooling]

Thanks James,

That's good to know.

Despite what the Jet technician said I have my doubts about the beater bar not damaging the filter. The 60 psi upper limit recommendation is valuable info.

Looks like Wynn has no units with beater bars.

[Malcolm McLeod]

Richard, just a minor hi-jack...

I've been around a considerable number of industrial dust collectors, 'tho never designed, spec'd, or installed them. Virtually all of those industrial units that I've seen use out>in flow (dust collects on the outside of a canister-style filter, or 'sock'). All of the 2-stage woodworking cyclones (that I've seen), use a in>out flow.

The cyclone manufacturers reverse the flow to avoid the cost of the filter enclosure and related pulse cleaning gear (valves, timers, etc.). I presume they think the market won't bear the extra expense?

I think the only real difference is in how the cartridge is cleaned. The industrial units can be cleaned by a hi-flow diaphragm valve opening an air reservoir to 'pulse' hi-pressure air into the filter's interior (flow is momentarily reversed and the dust knocked off the outside of the filter). This pulse occurs with the unit in operation, and no interruption to the process.

In the never ending quest to :cool:over-engineer:cool: something/anything/everything, I have a scheme in mind. Most of the cyclone DC's could be modified to put the filter in a (plywood?) box. An internal divider would serve to both mount the filter as well as route incoming air to the exterior. The interior of the filter could be vented to the shop. To clean the filter, just stick your leaf blower or 60psi air nozzle/wand into the vent(s). Dust is knocked off the filter and drops to the bottom of the box; open a door in the box and vacuum out. Simple if you have room for the box.

This eliminates the mechanical contact of 'beaters' with the filter media, and hopefully extends its life....? Food for thought.

Now I just need to acquire the marital capital reserves sufficient for a new cyclone.

[Alan Schaffter]

Here is another way to clean the filter(s) indoors if you have the typical in>out flow setup-

I have two cartridge filters (286 sq. ft. ea. Farr-type) connected in parallel for max flow. I remove one filter at a time to clean it and add a blank-out over the inlet hole. I place the filter to be cleaned over a small clean-out box that I connect with a DC port. I turn the DC on which now pulls air from outside to inside of that filter. I also rap on the wire mesh with a small mallet to help break the dust free from deep in the filter pleats.

My long cone cyclone is at garage level, below my shop, with the blower near the ceiling and is configured in a push-through configuration. It discharges into a small plenum located between the shop floor joists directly above:

http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/1329/medium/P10100382.JPG

http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/1329/medium/IMG_4013.JPG

A filter box, that is vented to the shop, sits atop the plenum. One filter has been removed, but the blankout not yet installed in this photo:

http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/1329/medium/P10100501.JPG

I use a length of 6" flex to temporarily connect a small "clean-out box" to the DC port that serves my jointer:

http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/1329/medium/P6290033.JPG

Filter being cleaned:

http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/1329/medium/P6290034.JPG

[Richard Dooling]

That's okay I guess but I don't think that it really compares to my Jet 650.

Seriously, I haven't seen anything like that outside of a large commercial shop.
Outstanding!