What wood for shutters that will take abuse from the elements?

[Malcolm Schweizer]

I am afraid I'm going to have to replace some shutters on my house. These are fully functional shutters nearly 2" thick and take the heat of the sun all day, and during hurricanes they take all sorts of abuse. These are very old-school shutters, hung on pintles and large iron strap hinges. They weigh a ton, as they are 2" thick, 35" wide, and 56" tall. Current shutters are old growth heart pine.

Whatever wood I use will have to be ordered and shipped by boat, so I'm open to all schools of thought. I would like the wood to be:

Rot resistant
Termite resistant
Able to withstand direct tropical sun
Strong enough to fend off flying debris.


The above is the perfect scenario and I realize there's no perfect wood. I DO NOT want to use treated because I have yet to find treated lumber that wasn't just absolute rubbish as far as growth rings per inch, moisture, knots, etc. I want these to be built like furniture.

Here is my short list:

Western Red Cedar
Atlantic White Cedar
Douglas Fir
Redwood (Probably the hardest to get, as I will be trying to source from the east coast for the lowest shipping cost)
Spruce (but that would require some sort of deal, as vertical grain spruce is outrageously expensive)
Port Orford Cedar- again would require a deal, but the stuff is awesome for boatbuilding, so I'd order a big bulk and build a boat with some of it.


I want to get a wood that I can order some extra of for building surfboards and boats. I'm open to any suggestions. Remember- I really want to keep the shutters lightweight, which is why Cumuru and Ipe are out. The shutters put a lot of strain on the pintles.

What do you guys use and why?

[Malcolm McLeod]

Take a look at bald cypress. I made shutters for my house from it. They're only 6 yrs old and no hurricanes in Dallas yet, so can't speak to their mechanical durability. But, they have weathered very well, cypress is rot resistant (due to cyprocene(??) content) and it is plentiful, so priced reasonably. ....Not sure about insects?

Edit: Not much surfing in Dallas area either, so you're on your own there!

[Mark Wooden]

+1 on cypress.

[John R Green]

Please post pic's of shutters to be replaced.

[Frederick Skelly]

+2 on cypress - IIRC, that's what the old plantation homes along the gulf used.

[Robert Hayward]

What is wrong with replacing with the same wood ? Not old growth, but Southern Yellow Pine. Tough wood that can take the elements.

[Jeff Bartley]

Spanish cedar would be in the running were I in your shoes. It works well by machine or hand and will fill your shop with the most wonderful aroma!

Will the shutters be painted?

[Malcolm Schweizer]

Shutters will be painted. I will get pics when the sun comes up. As for southern yellow pine, most of what is sold today is just so fast grown that there are few rings per inch and it is more prone to warping.

[Ron Kurzius]

I made 50 shutters for a house that was built in 1936, they were eastern white pine that was red lead primed. These were on an up scale home and maintained during their life. I explored all the options available and went with vertical grain fir.

I would have liked to use pine because it is so easy to work with but around here new pine seems to last about 5-10 years.

[Malcolm Schweizer]

Here are the shutters. Yes, my house is purple and white- it's the Caribbean, okay? :D That will change to a traditional red and white. The prior owner painted it that color without consulting the historical preservation society. Also the door is going to be mahogany. The previous owner built that door and he is not a woodworker. He did not believe in varnishing. The doors have been left raw since they were made in around 1997. I'm amazed. If it wasn't that he used construction pine with knots filled with wood filler, I would have varnished them. There was no need as I knew all along they were going to go. The center is redwood and that will be salvaged and made into a surfboard. I only have had the home 2 years and other things were higher priority.

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[Bill Adamsen]

My sister has a place on Camanoe, one of the islands off Tortola in the BVI. It is "basic" by local standards (no AC) but as a former plantation, exudes charm. When planning is possible, they choose teak delivered from plantations in Indonesia, which is fairly insect resistant. Shorter planning window jobs are "catch as catch can" scenario, with predictable results (termites). I was intrigued by Jeff's suggestion of Spanish Cedar ... which from the description one might think was commonly available. A locally sourced material would be the most authentic and economically sustainable, and Spanish Cedar sounds like a suitable material. Good luck!

[Malcolm Schweizer]

My sister has a place on Camanoe, one of the islands off Tortola in the BVI. It is "basic" by local standards (no AC) but as a former plantation, exudes charm. When planning is possible, they choose teak delivered from plantations in Indonesia, which is fairly insect resistant. Shorter planning window jobs are "catch as catch can" scenario, with predictable results (termites). I was intrigued by Jeff's suggestion of Spanish Cedar ... which from the description one might think was commonly available. A locally sourced material would be the most authentic and economically sustainable, and Spanish Cedar sounds like a suitable material. Good luck!

I'm just a few miles away from your sister! Teak is out of the question at $25+/bft. Spanish Cedar would be wonderful to work with. I love that smell. It's not available locally. The only woods I can get locally in stock are mahogany, ipe, cumaru, and cypress, but the Cumuru and Cypress are only available in tongue and groove with a "V" edge at the join, and the ipe is very expensive and only avaialble in decking. Mahogany is too expensive and also I would just hate to paint mahogany. (Not going to deal with varnishing every 6 months for sure!)

Thanks for all the feedback- I'm really leaning towards cedar. Spanish cedar would be pretty fun to work with. Western Red would probably be more affordable.

[lowell holmes]

White oak is a good outdoor wood. I have a threshold made of white oak that is 7-8 years old. It is on an unprotected door. It is as solid as the day I put it in.
There is no finish on the wood.

[Jamie Buxton]

Here on the West Coast, Western Red Cedar is a better choice than Redwood for high-class construction. Some lumberyards stock WRC from British Columbia which is old-growth, clear, and usually rift sawn. The redwood which is available is pretty cheesy stuff -- second-growth, with wide growth rings, and limited resistance to insects and fungi. The last time I bought this kind of WRC, it was around $8 per bdft in small retail quantities.

[Mike Wilkins]

Another vote for Cypress. I built the shutters for my home last year, painted with 2 coats of exterior paint. The original shutters were made of Pine and were installed when my house was built in 1985. So the Cypress should last as long or longer.
And it ticks all the requirements you are looking for.

[rudy de haas]

What is available in your area for treated decking? Here, pressure treated decking is fairly cheap and usually some form of fir. This stuff has several advantages for you: bug free, long lasting, relatively easy to work, and reasonably lightweight (heavier than cedar, but lighter than mahogany or teak).

Further, there are now plastic decking "planks" that look like real wood, don't weigh much, and are impervious to wind, water, bugs, etc.

[Robin Frierson]

If you dont mind paying up, I would get sinker cypress...old growth stuff pulled from the river bottoms. There is a place in Micanopy Fl that will ship it to you, but cant recall the name of the lumber dealer. . If you use new growth cypress, make sure you remove all the sapwood as it will rot.

[Mel Fulks]

One problem with any conifer that isn't quarter sawn is the heart side popping up. Since your shutters are hinged and used you need two good sides. I would use a cheap hardwood and rely on solvent based copper naphthalate and good paint.

[Erik Loza]

Malcolm, this product would meet all your needs but it's expensive....

https://www.accoya.com/

50-year structural warranty and 25 year warranty for direct freshwater contact. Browse their portfolio page. One of their principal markets is windows and doors, in fact.

Erik

[Jeff Bartley]

Malcolm,
Just for the reference: we ordered 100 some bf of 6/4 Spanish cedar a couple months ago and it was $5 and change/bf. We used it for sash reproductions/repair.
The mill shop that we ordered it through used some of the same material for a run of shutters and they were really nice.
When you do your build please share it here! The aforementioned mill shop had the slat mortises cut at another shop on a cnc.....I was really surprised as this shop is very experienced. But maybe that experience led them to the cnc at another shop?!
If you do go with Spanish cedar make sure you find out if it's plantation grown, I was told the plantation grown is full of pin knots.

[Bill Adamsen]

Malcolm, this product would meet all your needs but it's expensive....

https://www.accoya.com/

50-year structural warranty and 25 year warranty for direct freshwater contact. Browse their portfolio page. One of their principal markets is windows and doors, in fact.

Erik

Erik this is super interesting, but I can't really parse all that sales info. Is it the wood or the chemical process that provides the longevity?

[Dave Stuve]

It's the chemical process that provides the longevity - the following may not be completely correct because I read it a few days ago and it's late but here goes. According to their web site, wood interacts with moisture via free hydroxyl (OH) groups, and the 'accoya' process reacts the wood with a benign chemical (they call it acetylation) that binds all those free OH groups. As a result the wood doesn't interact with moisture much any more, and is very stable and rot resistant. Acetic acid (aka vinegar) is the byproduct - no toxic metals or resins are used.

[Shawn Pixley]

My initial thought were either cedar or doug fir. With me leaning towards the cedar for rot resistance. But when mentioning the impactsfrom storms I reversed that to the Doug fir as my recommendation.

My experience from Northwest where I used cedar and doug fir extensively on my house (I had 70+ year old wooden gutters) was that cedar lasted very well but it is soft. For doors and shutters, I found doug fir much tougher on impact or other physical damage. I fear the cedar is just too soft; though I would enjoy working it more. Two good choices.

[Mel Fulks]

Doug fir is not going to be available quarter sawn or rift saw that thick . I would only use it "back to back" and the existing are not like that. It's true that even big companies like GP pay no attention to "bark side out" but I won't use fir any other way.

[Shawn Pixley]

Doug fir is not going to be available quarter sawn or rift saw that thick . I would only use it "back to back" and the existing are not like that. It's true that even big companies like GP pay no attention to "bark side out" but I won't use fir any other way.

I am surprised. I certainly could get 6/4 or larger rift or QS in the Northwest. I haven't tried in So Cal.

I built doors and other components from DF without needing to laminate.

[Mel Fulks]

Shawn, you live in California and fir grows there. Malcolm is near Gilligan's Island. I live in VA and the 12 /4 fir we used to use for thick doors had to be custom ordered by our local supplier then sent to another place to be dried before being brought here. I agree your choice is good if affordable. The fir was slab and rift. I would always mark the bark side as " must be installed this side to exterior or warranty is void" both sides of the shutters will be exposed to weather

[Brian Holcombe]

POC or AYC if you can get it.

[Brian Holcombe]

Wait....you're in the land of Mahogany, just use that. I have doubts that you'd be able to get AYC, POC or Old Growth DF for less than you would be paying for good mahogany.

I pay $10/linear foot for 4/4 12" wide OG DF and I tend to think that is somewhat reasonable.

Plantation grown woods likely will not do well for this, as they'll be composed very highly of sapwood which will rot.

[jack duren]

IPE......Wouldn't consider anything else...

[Erik Loza]

Erik this is super interesting, but I can't really parse all that sales info. Is it the wood or the chemical process that provides the longevity?

Dave has it correctly. The generic term is "acetylated wood", Accoya happening to be the biggest manufacturer. Accoya sustainably harvests Monterey Pine from farms in New Zealand, sends to the Netherlands for acetylation, then offers it to the market. They are not very well known over here in the US but are HUGE in Europe. It's a multi-billion dollar company.

FYI that exterior wood is my business now. I'm dealing with architects and GC's all over the US and have seen pretty much every species of wood that got mentioned in this thread used as an exterior application. I won't tell anyone what to buy but IMO, if you want to only do it once, you need to look beyond natural woods and start looking at modified woods, such as Accoya. Since Cypress got mentioned here, I can tell you that we (Delta Millworks) have basically blacklisted it for exterior applications. Reason being that the only dimensionally stable Bald Cypress out there was the old growth stuff and it's practically impossible to obtain these days. Cypress "could" work OK in the South, where humidity and temps are fairly stable but I can tell you that there is no way I would spec Cypress in for any exterior application where finished dimensions were critical. Too much possibility for movement.

Someone else mentioned Ipe. Ipe is fine but won't out-perform Accoya for this application and also, you can screw and nail directly through Accoya, which you can't do with Ipe, so there is a labor savings there. If someone is set on Ipe, another modified wood you could look at is Kebony...

http://kebony.com/us/

A Norwegian company, they do their process ("furfurylation": Different process than Accoya's acetylation) to SYP and the result is a lot like a tropical hardwood: Darker, hard as a rock, and heavy. They're predominantly in the decking market though I suppose you could use them for windows or doors. Though Accoya would do the same thing there, but cheaper and easier to work with.

The only quirks with Accoya are that you have to use oil-based finishes. Since the cell walls are closed and don't absorb water. Also, only stainless screws or nails. The acetic acid will attack galvanized metal and stain the wood. Anyhow, if you're interested, I believe there's an Accoya dealer in Miami. Good luck in your search.

Erik

[Shawn Pixley]

Shawn, you live in California and fir grows there. Malcolm is near Gilligan's Island. I live in VA and the 12 /4 fir we used to use for thick doors had to be custom ordered by our local supplier then sent to another place to be dried before being brought here. I agree your choice is good if affordable. The fir was slab and rift. I would always mark the bark side as " must be installed this side to exterior or warranty is void" both sides of the shutters will be exposed to weather

Malcolm asked and Doug Fir was on his list and I expressed my opinion. Why is this a problem? He and all others are welcome to take this opinion or not. I have no dog in the fight.

[Malcolm Schweizer]

I can get Douglas Fir from two suppliers in the states that I order from and shipping isn't as bad as you might think. Ocean shipping is cheap. The land shipping to the dock usually costs e most! I love working with it and it's a beautiful wood.

I can get ribbon stripe mahogany locally for $8/bft, but it is prone to warping and also I just hate to paint such a beautiful wood. Varnish is not an option. The 2nd story shutters are 25 feet up and I don't want to deal with constantly varnishing them.

My my supplier in Fort Lauderdale has cypress. I think that may be my choice.

[Mel Fulks]

Have high respect for you and don't see it as any problem. Sorry I was not more careful in wording. Malcolm needs a material to finish 2" and I was relating how we basically had to commission that fir as it was not a stock item. Since the material is grown relatively close to you ,you have a better chance of buying it. I remember too that there were times we couldn't buy any redwood and were told "right now none is being sent out of California"...I think that meant that Californians could buy it. Stay well !!

[Brian Holcombe]

I can get Douglas Fir from two suppliers in the states that I order from and shipping isn't as bad as you might think. Ocean shipping is cheap. The land shipping to the dock usually costs e most! I love working with it and it's a beautiful wood.

I can get ribbon stripe mahogany locally for $8/bft, but it is prone to warping and also I just hate to paint such a beautiful wood. Varnish is not an option. The 2nd story shutters are 25 feet up and I don't want to deal with constantly varnishing them.

My my supplier in Fort Lauderdale has cypress. I think that may be my choice.

Yeah I would not want to varnish them either, that is a high maintenance project. Painted fir sounds like a nice choice, and just as nice to work with.

I've had really good luck with Honduran mahogany, it has not given me grief, but I know a few people who've had trouble with african mahogany and weird movement.