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Chuck Pickering
12-29-2016, 1:21 PM
I have dragged my Dad's old 113-299xx Craftsman Table Saw out of storeage to clean it up and make a few accessories for it.
Dad used this saw to create some amazing things and remodel our home in the 50s to 70s. He never made a crosscut sled, sacrificial fence or any jigs that I can remember.
I want to build these and a box joint jig, among others.
The TS fence for the Craftsman has 3 plane(not tapped) holes through it, I assume for attaching the sacrificial fence. What type of hardware should I use to safely secure said add on? I've been looking at various versions on the internet(don't yet have any books to reference). I've seen T-track devices and some 'L' shaped hooks that engage the sacrificial fence from the top. Is that the best way? The stock fence does not have provision for adding T-track.

Edit: Also, what wood is best to make the guide strips for the sleds from?

Chuck

Steve Eure
12-29-2016, 1:55 PM
I have the fence clamps from Rockler. They work well but if your fence is too high, the sacrificial board may canter on the bottom end because the hold down clamp may not go far enough down to properly secure it. As far as the runners for the sleds, etc. I always have good results with red oak. Any good hardwood will do. Also, you can go to the dollar stores and buy their cutting boards that are made of plastic. Some have used them with great results. They will not be affected by changes in weather or seasons. Wood will swell with humidity and such and sometimes makes for a tighter fit. I have also used miter track as runners when thats all I had. Works well also.

Chuck Pickering
12-29-2016, 2:35 PM
Thanks for your comments, Steve.
I need to clean the cast iron top of the saw. Plan to wipe down with mineral spirits, and clean with scotch brite, and then paste wax it.
It's cold in the garage(aka wood shop), but I went out an looked at the fence and miter gage and they both have just plain holes in them for attaching wood accessories. So, guess the next step is to get some counter sink screws and nuts, unless anyone can recommend a better system. Maybe a rectangular piece of wood with a nut plate in them, or a nut pressed in a tight hole, to fit into the casting? I do have a mill and lathe(metalwork is my main hobby), maybe I can make something.

Chuck

Chuck Pickering
12-30-2016, 7:43 AM
I'm looking at the 80/20 extrusion system to add to my OEM fence. I would like to keep the OEM fence to where I can return it to original configuration. If not extrusions, I will just add a sacrificial fence to it.
How do folks attach the sacrificial fence to the OEM fence? As stated, both the OEM fence and the miter have plain 5/16 holes in the castings. Are there special fasteners made for this?

Chuck

George Bokros
12-30-2016, 8:37 AM
I like Steve use the Rockler fence clamps. The fence clamps are available from others Rockler was just the first to come out with them.

I have a Craftsman 10" table saw from the 70's and the fence that came with it is junk for a woodworker. It is ok for someone that uses it occasionally, it does not square itself so you have to measure at the front and back of the blade to make sure it will not bind the stock to blade causing kickback or cause your piece to not have parallel sides. The miter gauge was also junk. I have upgraded my saw with a Biesemeyer Home Shop Fence and an Incra miter gauge, both dependable improvements.

Chuck Pickering
12-30-2016, 8:56 AM
Just did a search for the Biesemeyer Home Shop Fence. No one in my area even carries them, even if I could afford one. I'm just trying to improve my saw as best I can.
I have used a tape measure and framing square to check the fence on critical cuts for years, didn't hurt a bit...


Chuck

Jerry Bruette
12-30-2016, 12:51 PM
If you could find a Delta T2 or maybe a T3 fence I'd put that on the saw. I have a T2 and it makes setting the fence a joy, actually took the stock fence and hauled it and a bunch of other scrap to the junk yard. There are other brands of fence systems too, some have t-slots built into them and you don't have to bolt on any 80/20. I also use a home made version of the Rockler fence clamps.

I used Incra mite sliders when I built my crosscut sled and haven't had to adjust them in over three years.

Lee Schierer
12-30-2016, 1:14 PM
I have a 113 series Craftsman table saw and I've made several accessories for it.

To attach a sacrificial fence to your OEM fence, when I had mine I used wood screws from the back side into the added wood piece. The holes should be high enough above the table and not at a place where the blade can reach them that you have to worry about the blade hitting the screws. I have since replaced my OEM fence with a Biesmeyer and have no regrets.

For runners, I use soft maple, but you can also use UHMW strips. The slots in the table are 3/4" wide.

Buy a cheap dial indicator and attach it to your cross cut guide with a block of wood. Take the time to align your saw blade to the miter slots and the fence to the miter slots. Alignment will greatly improve the performance of your saw. You can get a cheap but usable dial indicator from Harbor Freight for less than $20.

I made a cross cut sled from a 1/4 sheet of 1/2" plywood. I specifically paid more and bought a quarter sheet so that the edges would all be straight and square to start.

Chuck Pickering
12-30-2016, 1:40 PM
Thanks, Lee. How about using the spurred T-nut inserts on the sacrificial fence?
My main hobby is machining metal, so I have a couple dial indicators.
I do plan to make a crosscut sled. Saw mentioned somewhere to get a UHMW cutting board from the Dollar store for runners. Son-in-law may have some soft maple , also.

Chuck

Wayne Jolly
12-30-2016, 3:55 PM
I had an old Craftsman 113. contractor saw for many years. The two best "accessories" I added were a set of home-made PALS, and a Delta T-2 fence. I found the T-2 on sale for about $100 on a clearance table at Lowes. It only had 30" rails and I wanted longer, so I bought some steel from a local supplier and made my own. Once those two "accessories" were added, that ol' 113 was as accurate as any. I bought a PM66 so now my son has the 113, but he hasn't used it.


Wayne

Chuck Pickering
12-30-2016, 7:20 PM
Wayne, forgive my ignorance, but what is a PALS, and can you explain some of how you made it?

Chuck

Chuck Pickering
12-30-2016, 7:34 PM
Wayne, forgive my ignorance, but what is a PALS, and can you explain some of how you made it? I have searched via this forum and find many references to it, enough to indicate it's an alignment tool Any other info would be much appreciated. Being retired military, I am quite familiar with acronyms. We were required to write out the entire name the first time it appeared in each correspondence it appeared in, with the acronym in parentheses after. That was those not familiar with the acronym had a definition of it.

I spent an hour or so milling a couple pieces of 1/4" aluminum to fit the pockets in my saw's miter gage ,tapping for 1/4-20 so I can screw on a miter extension.

Tomorrow I will run down(drive down, really) to the local dollar store and look for a cutting board to make sled runners from. If I can't find any, I'll go to Lowes and get some hardwood.

Tried to edit previous post , but it wouldn't save, or cancel. I hat to close the browser and re-open it.

Chuck

Chuck Pickering
12-31-2016, 9:08 AM
This morning I continued my search as to what a PALS is. Finally found that it meant "Precision Alignment System", Duh!
I would still like info on the home made PALs for a Craftsman 10" 113-29920 table saw with tilting Arbor. I have not had any problem with ripping.
Looking at the PALS kits on Amazon, my Dad may have had one in the tools I inherited, just didn't know what it was when I saw it.

Chuck

Lee Schierer
12-31-2016, 11:39 AM
Thanks, Lee. How about using the spurred T-nut inserts on the sacrificial fence?
My main hobby is machining metal, so I have a couple dial indicators.
I do plan to make a crosscut sled. Saw mentioned somewhere to get a UHMW cutting board from the Dollar store for runners. Son-in-law may have some soft maple , also.

Chuck

I don't think cutting boards are made from UHMW, but are made from high density polyethylene. Even so they should work for runners. You can get UHMW from McMaster Carr in various sizes.

With regard to the tee nuts, you can use them as long as they cannot be touched by the blade at it highest raised position. I found that my miter gauge for my Craftsman saw fit too loosely in the miter slot. After trying the dimple with a center punch trick to find that it helped the fit, but didn't last long. I brought home some self adhesive UHMW tape left over from a project at work and added a strip to the side of the miter gauge bar that was .003" thick. That tape has worked for years and has eliminated all side play in my miter gauge. McMaster Carr has UHMW tape too.

I would also toss the OEM throat plate and make a zero clearance insert from either luan plywood with a reinforcing strip of wood underneath or make a new aluminum one with replaceable inserts like I had made for mine. Lee's Insert (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?10839-New-zero-clearance-Insert)

glenn bradley
12-31-2016, 1:21 PM
I'm not sure I would go throwing money at the OEM fence just yet. There are a few ways to attach the sac-fence. These (http://www.rockler.com/universal-fence-clamps?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=&utm_content=pla&utm_campaign=PL&sid=V9146&gclid=CJv85IT4ntECFUUaaQod9rkBjw), or these (http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/161950/MATCHFIT-Dovetail-Clamp-Pair.aspx?gclid=CMv3mJ74ntECFRK5wAodzyoIkg) or just pan head screws of the right length from the side opposite the blade. I have done all three. There's no danger of hitting the screws as long as you don't put them where the blade is.

Chuck Pickering
01-01-2017, 4:40 PM
I have been cleaning up my old saw. Got the table smooth, but haven't gotten the stains out yet. I will try some of the suggestions above. Also cleaned off the blade, as it had residue from cutting vinyl siding on it.
I took out the table insert and was surprised at how thin it is. While reading up on Zero Clearance Inserts(ZCI), most cut them out of thin ply and run the saw blade up through them. My OEM insert measures .091" with a micrometer. What do you use that is that thin?

Chuck

Lee Schierer
01-01-2017, 5:31 PM
I have been cleaning up my old saw. Got the table smooth, but haven't gotten the stains out yet. I will try some of the suggestions above. Also cleaned off the blade, as it had residue from cutting vinyl siding on it.
I took out the table insert and was surprised at how thin it is. While reading up on Zero Clearance Inserts(ZCI), most cut them out of thin ply and run the saw blade up through them. My OEM insert measures .091" with a micrometer. What do you use that is that thin?

Chuck

There should be set screws to help level the insert to the table top. Measure the depth of the recess and it is identical to the thickness of Luan underlayment. Cut an oval of Luan and then determine where the blade will cut up through it. Then glue a rib of wood (3/4" square) to the right of the blade slot to give support to the Luan once you cut through it. Depending on your metal working skills you can make a better insert like this (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?10839-New-zero-clearance-Insert).

Chuck Pickering
01-01-2017, 8:16 PM
There should be set screws to help level the insert to the table top. Measure the depth of the recess and it is identical to the thickness of Luan underlayment. Cut an oval of Luan and then determine where the blade will cut up through it. Then glue a rib of wood (3/4" square) to the right of the blade slot to give support to the Luan once you cut through it. Depending on your metal working skills you can make a better insert like this (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?10839-New-zero-clearance-Insert).
I've read and re-read that thread, Lee. I just may have to try that. Wish I had your friends... I have the insert out and tomorrow I'll try making a pattern of the inside of the step. May try making one from ply and som material I have left from making a backsplash fir my cooktop.

Chuck

Wayne Jolly
01-02-2017, 3:49 PM
Regarding home made PALS, I saw a picture of a set and know I could make one fairly easily. I don't remember the specifics, but I had a piece of 1" angle iron 3/16" inch thick. I just cut pieces about 1/2" wide, drilled a hole in one of the sides for the bolts that mount the table top, drilled and taped a hole on the other side for the alignment bolt. I can't remember for certain, but I think I also had to slightly modify some standard bolts to use them for the alignment bolts. It wasn't that difficult to make them.


Wayne

Chuck Pickering
01-03-2017, 1:29 PM
I found the piece of Formica I had, but it's too thin to make the throat plate from by itself. Still looking. Might use one of the Dado plates to make a ZCI by gluing some ply to the bottom.

Chuck

glenn bradley
01-03-2017, 1:45 PM
I have been cleaning up my old saw. Got the table smooth, but haven't gotten the stains out yet. I will try some of the suggestions above. Also cleaned off the blade, as it had residue from cutting vinyl siding on it.
I took out the table insert and was surprised at how thin it is. While reading up on Zero Clearance Inserts(ZCI), most cut them out of thin ply and run the saw blade up through them. My OEM insert measures .091" with a micrometer. What do you use that is that thin?

Chuck

My C-man 113. saw also had this thin insert. I just used 1/2" BB ply and rabbeted around the outer edge to create a lip of the appropriate thickness. I needed the thick plate to support the MicroJig MJ Splitter I used for this saw. The thickness also allowed me to put a cut off 8d nail in the tail to emulate the spring on the original. I also used a little leftover material as a beaver tail. Both methods worked fine.

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