Stanley #79 Side Rebate Plane.

[Stewie Simpson]

Its been a while since I have had to use this plane, but when the job requires it, its a handy tool to have at your disposal.

As you can see from the following 2 photo's mine requires a bit of a clean-up and resharpen, to bring it back to a serviceable condition.

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/stanley%2079/_DSC0326_zpsl4pevkdt.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/stanley%2079/_DSC0326_zpsl4pevkdt.jpg.html)

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/stanley%2079/_DSC0327_zps27fzup4m.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/stanley%2079/_DSC0327_zps27fzup4m.jpg.html)

After being soaked in a bath of Evapo-Rust for 24hrs. All parts were then cleaned down with WD-40 to nuetralize any further reaction from the R-S, before being re-assembled. The leading skew angle on both the blades were slightly out of spec, so they received a light grinding, before the cutting edges were honed to a very sharp edge.

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/stanley%2079/_DSC0330_zpsluixdynv.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/stanley%2079/_DSC0330_zpsluixdynv.jpg.html)

For demonstration purposes on how to use a Stanley #79, I chose a short length of hardwood that I had previously worked a 1/4" groove on using my Record 043 Plough Plane.

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/record%20043/_DSC0244_zpsqojna80q.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/record%20043/_DSC0244_zpsqojna80q.jpg.html)

Putting aside any controversy on how to use a Stanley #79, I will just forward the way I was taught to use it. If that doesn't seek favour, then use what ever method chooses your fancy.

To increase the width of the groove from 1/4" to 3/8", 1st I scribe a line to the required distance. The direction of the long grain is then accessed, and the appropriate blade is then adjusted to the required depth of cut and tightened into position. Check to insure the spare cutter is fully retracted, then adjust the depth fence to the correct height and tighten in position. To commence the cut is no different to using the Record #043, you start from the far end of the groove, and work your way back, repeating the same process until you have reached your targeted scribe mark, along the full length of groove. My personally preference is to adjust the cutter for the final pass, taking a full length light shaving. After widening the groove (or rebate, or rabbet, whatever takes your fancy) the bottom floor may need a light clean out with a hand router.

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/stanley%2079/_DSC0331_zpslmnlpuah.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/stanley%2079/_DSC0331_zpslmnlpuah.jpg.html)

Hopefully someone found this information of relevant value.

regards Stewie;

[Bill Houghton]

Thanks. I own one but haven't yet had occasion to use it; your tutorial was helpful.

[Curt Putnam]

+ 1 .

[Phil Mueller]

Thank you posting this, Stewie. Wasn't familiar with this plane. With the opposing cutters, I assume it can be used left or right handed, however, I can't see how that would be done. I guess I can't tell how the piece holding the cutters can be positioned with the guide bars/"handle" piece to be used in either direction.

[Stewie Simpson]

As to the easiest method to correct an out of alignment skew angle on both blades; 1st remove the depth stop and both blades, on the underside of the blades mark an area close to the cutting edge with a dykem or permanent marking pen, slide the blades back into position and tighten with cutting edges fully exposed, use a small 90 degree engineers square and scribe mark the return angle on the back of the blades nearest to the cutting edge with the rest side of the square hard up against the bottom skate of the plane, remove both blades and grind a new fresh skew angle to match the scribe-d lines, if you have an adequate set up on your grinders tool rests you can reduce the time taken on the honing stones, finish off the sharpening process by honing the blades to a very sharp cutting edge, re-install both blades and depth stop.

Stewie;

[Stewie Simpson]

Thank you posting this, Stewie. Wasn't familiar with this plane. With the opposing cutters, I assume it can be used left or right handed, however, I can't see how that would be done. I guess I can't tell how the piece holding the cutters can be positioned with the guide bars/"handle" piece to be used in either direction.

Phil; does this photo help answer your question;

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/stanley%2079/_DSC0327_zps27fzup4m.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/stanley%2079/_DSC0327_zps27fzup4m.jpg.html)

[Jim Koepke]

My #79 was sold a few years ago. It was a good user, but having a #98 & #99 made it an extra tool that mostly sat unused.

Most of the time my side rabbet planes are used to clean up the edges of a slot, rabbet or quirk from a molding plane. They are a handy addition to the tool chest for such.

jtk

[Greg Krummel]

As a tip for anyone who finds one in good condition but missing the depth adjustment and back screws, they are both pretty reasonable to remake with the right tools. The fence is a punched and bent sheet steel form, and I remade mine out of a small sheet of 14 gauge aluminum to make it easier to form. You can also make other angled fences for different trimming purposes (I made a 45 degree fence for trimming an undercut).

The screws are bit more difficult to replace since they require lathe time, and the thread is a Unified Special thread (#10-28). Thankfully a few die manufacturers still make that thread size (how I made mine), and the blade holder screws are the same thread size as the fence screws (so they can be interchanged).

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I'm not sure about the original fence, but I found sometimes the new fences slipped under the new smooth screws. Adding a matching rubber washer under the screw head helps give a little more hold.

[Stewie Simpson]

My #79 was sold a few years ago. It was a good user, but having a #98 & #99 made it an extra tool that mostly sat unused.

Most of the time my side rabbet planes are used to clean up the edges of a slot, rabbet or quirk from a molding plane. They are a handy addition to the tool chest for such.

jtk

Jim; all good your personal choice of side rebate plane, but this thread is focused on the #79.

regards Stewie;

[Phil Mueller]

Sorry, Stewie, I get it. I reread your post more carefully...I was misinterpreting the photo of the Record 043 thinking it was somehow a part of that...

So the depth guage assists in depth, of course. The distance from the edge is either first established with the 043, then widened free hand...or without the 043, the entire groove is just free handed between scribe lines. Is that correct?

[Stewie Simpson]

Phil; the initial groove was completed using the Record 043 plough plane, fitted with the 1/4" wide blade. (4th photo) In the example shown I have described the process of increasing the width of that groove from 1/4" to a slightly wider 3/8". That was achieved using the Stanley #79 side rebate plane. (5th photo) No attempt was made to deepen the existing groove.

regards Stewie;

[Stewie Simpson]

Phil; lets go with another example of when the #79 side rebate plane comes in handy. Your making up a sliding draw for a piece of furniture. You have the front, back, and both side boards cut to length, and have just added a bottom groove on each of those boards to receive the plywood bottom. When you test fit the plywood bottom you realize you haven't allowed enough room within the grooves width to allow for later expansion. Your next course of action is to increase the width of those grooves slightly using the #79 side rebate plane.

Stewie;

[Phil Mueller]

That woud have come in very handy with a recent box project...thank you. Given what I had, I slightly adjusted the guide for my router plane...but the #79 would have been the better/quicker solution.

[Stewie Simpson]

Phil; good to hear.

regards Stewie;

[Jim Koepke]

Jim; all good your personal choice of side rebate plane, but this thread is focused on the #79.

regards Stewie;

Okay...


That was achieved using the Stanley #78 side rebate plane.

regards Stewie;

#78 :confused:

jtk

[Derek Cohen]

Phil; lets go with another example of when the #78 side rebate plane comes in handy. Your making up a sliding draw for a piece of furniture. You have the front, back, and both side boards cut to length, and have just added a bottom groove on each of those boards to receive the plywood bottom. When you test fit the plywood bottom you realize you haven't allowed enough room within the grooves width to allow for later expansion. Your next course of action is to increase the width of those grooves slightly using the #78 side rebate plane.

Stewie;

If you are using plywood for the bottom, why do you need to allow space in the groove for "later expansion"? Surely there is no expansion.

On a separate note, you can turn the Stanley #79 into a plane for sliding dovetails ..

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/SlidingDovetailsWithTheStanley79_html_680e7f25.jpg

Article: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/SlidingDovetailsWithTheStanley79.html

Regards from Perth

Derek

[John Gornall]

I was given a new in the box made in England 79. The bed was not flat. None of the parts fit well. The shoes were twisted. The screws for the shoes were crooked because the holes were drilled out of square. The heads of the screws were in the way of the depth stop. In the end I removed the 2 knobs and depth stop, backed the blades off and went at the whole thing on sandpaper, granite block. It took a bit of work first getting the screws flat, then the shoes flat and finally the whole bed flat to the rest. Works well now.

[Stewie Simpson]

John; that's unfortunate. The uk Stanleys were generally build to a higher standard. imo

[Patrick Chase]

Thank you posting this, Stewie. Wasn't familiar with this plane. With the opposing cutters, I assume it can be used left or right handed, however, I can't see how that would be done. I guess I can't tell how the piece holding the cutters can be positioned with the guide bars/"handle" piece to be used in either direction.

Side rabbet planes are either reversible or come in pairs, which is useful both ergonomically and when dealing with uncooperative grain.

For comparison here's the LV equivalent: http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/Page.aspx?p=60012&cat=1,230

Here's the other Stanley pair (98/99) that Jim referenced: http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan11.htm#num98

Here's the LN version of the 98/99 pair: https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/side-rabbet-plane-pair

[Patrick Chase]

If you are using plywood for the bottom, why do you need to allow space in the groove for "later expansion"? Surely there is no expansion.

The plywood bottom and therefore the groove will be dimensionally stable as you point out. Plywood is unstable in thickness, so the plywood side that goes into the groove can expand. I believe that was Stewie's point.

[Pat Barry]

The plywood bottom and therefore the groove will be dimensionally stable as you point out. Plywood is unstable in thickness, so the plywood side that goes into the groove can expand. I believe that was Stewie's point.
That's what I believe Stewie was providing the example of also, thickness changes, although, even that isn't going to be much for 1/4 inch plywood

[Patrick Chase]

That's what I believe Stewie was providing the example of also, thickness changes, although, even that isn't going to be much for 1/4 inch plywood

Yeah, but Stewie didn't specify a thickness so I was giving him the benefit of the doubt. At 3/4" you could easily see a few hundredths of expansion across a reasonable climatic range, and that would be enough to cause trouble in some situations.

[Bill Houghton]

And the LV version is a redesign/rethinking of the Preston/Record plane, which was also adopted/adapted by Sargent:

http://www.record-planes.com/record-no-2506-side-rabbet-plane/

[Frederick Skelly]

As an aside, Woodcraft also sells a side rabbett, for $75. They claim it's based on the Record 2506s. I have one because I just couldn't convince myself to drop the extra coin for something better for this particular tool. It works fine when I need it.

[Patrick Chase]

As an aside, Woodcraft also sells a side rabbett, for $75. They claim it's based on the Record 2506s.

They claim that it "takes its linage [sic]" from the 2506S. It looks to me as though the blades are uncrossed (they overlap and therefore have different cutting angles in the Record), which suggests to me that it may have descended from the Record by way of LV/Veritas. As Bill Houghton noted the Veritas plane is also patterned after the Record.

[Stewie Simpson]

Patrick & Pat; good to see you guys are switched on with using plywood as draw bottoms. There a valid reasons why draw bottoms should be no less than a slide fit within their grooves when installed.

regards Stewie;

[Stewie Simpson]

There are a number of modern tool manufacturers who would not exist today were it not for the expiry date on early Stanley patents.

[Pat Barry]

Patrick & Pat; good to see you guys are switched on with using plywood as draw bottoms. There a valid reasons why draw bottoms should be no less than a slide fit within their grooves when installed.

regards Stewie;
On this forum that can be looked on with disfavor ;)

[Stewie Simpson]

There are 3 important criteria I base my decisions on when selecting the appropriate hand plane to use with my woodwork, and not 1 of them covers the need for that tool to be a certain brand of manufacturer. That's left for tool reviewers to worry about. The 1st and foremost is being able to read the grain on the surface I am working with. The 2nd is selecting the right hand plane to suit that grain type, as well as its dimensional size. The 3rd is understanding that a sharp cutting edge on the plane iron will deliver me the optimal results I am after.

Moving on to an example today where those 3 critical criteria came into play. I needed to flat dress, on all 4 sides, 2 short lengths of 260mm x 70 x 23mm timber for the final sharpening stone box I am working on. The timber is Australian Jarrah, with some slightly challenging directional grain. I could have chosen a double iron wooden or metal soled smoothing plane, but I needed something slightly smaller in footprint to allow me a closer view during the surface flattening process.

I chose to proceed with a Stanley low angle block plane. A slightly steeper micro bevel was needed for this type of grain, which took little time to hone to sharp cutting edge.

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0332_zpsydzqtgak.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0332_zpsydzqtgak.jpg.html)

Then it was on to dressing the stock on all 4 sides. The end results were most acceptable, with only a couple of tiny areas along the side grain that showed signs of tear out. Those areas will be addressed later nearer to completion of this project.

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0334_zpsmi0ehbmu.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0334_zpsmi0ehbmu.jpg.html)

Stewie;

[Stewie Simpson]

Did everyone recognize the black handled tool that's between the Marples chisel and the Claw Hammer.

[steven c newman]

Push Drill......Yankee style....Modern version.
349573
Not so modern versions.....Unless it is a #41?
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[Stewie Simpson]

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/jarrah%20sharpening%20stone%20box/_DSC0335_zpshuqdsqfw.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/jarrah%20sharpening%20stone%20box/_DSC0335_zpshuqdsqfw.jpg.html)

[Bill Houghton]

Push Drill......Yankee style....Modern version.
349573
Not so modern versions.....Unless it is a #41?
349578

Steven,

the top pictures are actually screwdrivers rather than push drills; and there are other versions of the Yankee push drill besides the 41s, although Stewie's looks different from those I'm familiar with. But then, there push drills made by lots of folks, including Millers Falls and Goodell Pratt, who used a cruciform shank and a four jaw chuck.

The push drill is an amazing tool; I would not be without one.

[Stewie Simpson]

Bill; mine is a traditional Brad Push. (Short Nail Push)

[steven c newman]

Well, since I do have a few Millers Falls sitting around...
349584
here is both of my Millers Falls push drills. #188 and a #100

As for what was confusing one other poster...
349585
Sitting here with a Stanley #39 3/8" dado plane is a Stanley made for Wards #78 rebate plane. Jim K. I think was confusing it with the #79...

I'll just stick with the #45..
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At least for now....

[Jim Koepke]

As for what was confusing one other poster...

Sitting here with a Stanley #39 3/8" dado plane is a Stanley made for Wards #78 rebate plane. Jim K. I think was confusing it with the #79...


Actually Steven there were a couple of typos that have since been corrected.

I am even more confused now since:


Jim; all good your personal choice of side rebate plane, but this thread is focused on the #79.

... seems to be no longer operative, or maybe the thread has lost its focus on the #79. That tends to happen on public forums.

jtk

[Bill Houghton]

Bill; mine is a traditional Brad Push. (Short Nail Push)

Ah. I've got one of those; haven't used it much.

[Stewie Simpson]

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0337_zpso9wveurx.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0337_zpso9wveurx.jpg.html)

[Stewie Simpson]

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0338_zpsmvc8e9sp.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0338_zpsmvc8e9sp.jpg.html)

[steven c newman]

While surfing the auction site last night, came across a "Minty" Stanley #79.......will keep an eye on it.

[Stewie Simpson]

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0342_zps6zpxmwt8.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0342_zps6zpxmwt8.jpg.html)

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0340_zpsvornvc9k.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/dalmore%20blue%20stone%20box/_DSC0340_zpsvornvc9k.jpg.html)

Stewie;

[Peter Gee]

Jim; all good your personal choice of side rebate plane, but this thread is focused on the #79.

regards Stewie;

That's a nice #79 you have there, Stewie. I didn't know you could buy them in wood, with a stone inside.

PS. My vote goes to a Veritas Side Rebate plane...

[Stewie Simpson]

Appreciate the feedback Peter G.

Congrats on your 1st post.

[George Conklin]

I wish I had a stone worthy of box like that.

I appreciate your posts on stones, Stewie. Being a Neander-newbie, you give me a much needed education. Thank you.

Btw, in your picture I see liquid on the stone and box. I'm assuming it's oil. Why? Isn't the stone removed from the box when in use?

Thank you again for sharing your knowledge and examples of your work.

[Jim Koepke]

Howdy Peter and welcome to the Creek. Your profile doesn't list a location. Where on this third rock from the sun do you call home?

jtk

[Stewie Simpson]

I wish I had a stone worthy of box like that.

I appreciate your posts on stones, Stewie. Being a Neander-newbie, you give me a much needed education. Thank you.

Btw, in your picture I see liquid on the stone and box. I'm assuming it's oil. Why? Isn't the stone removed from the box when in use?

Thank you again for sharing your knowledge and examples of your work.

Thanks for the feedback George. The lubricant used for this stone is water, not oil. The stone doesn't need to be removed from its lower housing when in use, but the option to do so is left to the user. Extra clearance for cross grain movement were factored in during the mortising out. In the event the stone were to become overly tight longitudinally, a removable packer has been installed. The type of wood selected for a sharpening stone box is a major consideration, but that's another topic on its own, which would be considered of low interest on this forum site.

Stewie;

[Stewie Simpson]

Plans are afoot to spend a great deal less time focused on woodwork forums during 2017. Its all gotten a bit stale on content over the last few years. I have tried to add some diversity in content within my own posts, but the viewers don't seem overly interested. There's way too much focus on the best brand of hand tool to buy imo, but that's not my call to make. (Far better for me to focus on what's important within my own work.)

I have a new project underway to make a set of Myrtle Winding sticks with Jarrah inlay. It will make a nice addition to the workshop.

Stewie;


http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/swagman001/winding%20sticks/_DSC0343_zpsopdpnquo.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/swagman001/media/winding%20sticks/_DSC0343_zpsopdpnquo.jpg.html)

[Jim Koepke]

I have a new project underway to make a set of Myrtle Winding sticks with Jarrah inlay. It will make a nice addition to the workshop.

It is likely many others would be interested in your method of making some winding sticks.

You can't always judge interest by how many people comment on your posts. This thread has over 2,000 views in 8 days which show quite a bit of interest.

jtk

[Stewie Simpson]

Jim; others should develop their own method of making winding sticks. Its not an overly difficult project.

regards Stewie;

[Jim Ritter]

While some may develop their own methods of making winding sticks is the goal, sometimes people need the push, or learn a new or more efficient way to perform a task. Hand tools versus power tools come to mind. There is an audience here. While skilled in my own field I come to the different forums to learn as much as to share. I for one enjoy your posts. For one it made me look at sharpening stone boxes in a different light.
Jim

[Robert McNaull]

Stevie,

i appreciate ate your threads and provide a different perspective many times. Your backsaw threads were great and don't be discouraged by lack of saw build threads on the forum. For someone like me, I get limited shop time and I am fairly new to hand tools. I am just learning proper techniques that work for me, building your advanced tools is a dream and at some point I'll have the skills to do it. Would like to see your process and winding sticks, I made a set last week but would love to see your process and the in-lays.

Bob