Still struggling with G0555 tension now w/ pics

[Dave Macy]

I continue to struggle getting any tension on my G0555 that we bought used. Here's where I'm at. I'd bought a 3/4 bladerunner from Iturra, but yes, I also have a 1/2" too. It makes no difference right now.

I took out the old tension rod, ran it through a die to make sure the threads were good, and ran a tap to clean the threads on the square nut. I put in the new iturra spring, but couldn't get it tensioned for more than a 1/8" blade. So I ordered a new rod and nut thinking hey why not.

I put the bushings all the way at the top, but as you can see in the pics, even with the rod screwed all the way down until the point bottoms out on the saw, I can't get enough tension. Please help me figure out what's wrong. My dad has no ideas and neither does my neighbor and neither does my shop teacher at school.348622348623348624348625

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Dave,

I would check to see if the lock collar on the tension rod is in the right position. It's held on by a set screw. Regardless of where you set the tension, that tension rod should not be able to reach and bottom out onto the saw.

If you look at the manual for the G0555, the lock collar is item#130A. It should keep that rod from going down that far regardless of where the tension is set.


If the collar was farther down towards the end of the tension adjustment rod, it would allow the nut below the spring to climb up farther increasing tension.

[Dave Macy]

130 on mine looks a bit different - see the top bushing on both pics 2 and 4. I have it on the rod as far as threads will let it go before putting in the set screw. I'm totally lost and don't see what's wrong.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

See the lock collar below the knob on the adjustment shaft? That collar needs to be moved towards the other end of the shaft. Right now IMO it's too high allowing the nut to run out of threads before it tensions the blade properly. If the collar is moved down, the nut will pick up the mechanical load of the spring sooner and have more threads to climb towards the knob thus increasing spring tension.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

The G0555 is a popular bandsaw and there are a lot of users.

Hopefully one of them will get on this thread and confirm whether or not that tension rod should ever extend until it gets near or touches the upper frame arm.

There is nothing magic about this. You are pulling against the frame trying lift up the upper wheel bracket,compressing the spring, simultaneously pulling up on the upper wheel and applying tension on the blade.

If you can't get it to move up, either you have run out of threads or the nut is slipping due to bad threads on the nut or shaft..or the blade is too long..or the upper frame arm is flexing which is the least likely cause.

If you look closely to photo number 3, there appears to be either metal particles or sawdust on the upper frame arm.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Dave,
have you checked this video at Grizzly?


https://youtu.be/kxAfPq6ZcUA

Notice that the end of the tension rods doesn't get near the upper frame arm.

[Rod Sheridan]

Another possibility is that your blade is too long.

I would check all of the above points first however...........Regards, Rod.

[Bill Space]

Another possibility is that your blade is too long.

I would check all of the above points first however...........Regards, Rod.

I think Rob hit the nail on the head with blade length.

With no blade on the saw you can compress the spring fully. To develop tension in the blade, the upper wheel must pull against the blade as the spring is compressed. If the blade is too long, the upper wheel cannot pull against the blade very hard before the spring is fully compressed, and no more tension can be developed past that point.

So if the blade is too long, only a little tension will Be developed before the spring is fully compressed, marking an end to further tension increase (for practical purposes. You might get more by forcing things in some cases).

Bill

[glenn bradley]

I think Rob hit the nail on the head with blade length

I am in this camp.

[Prashun Patel]

Did you call grizzly? I think is had this same problem years ago and they walked me through how to reset the tension.

I apologize but I forget the procedure now. But whatever they told me did work at the time.

[Alan Schwabacher]

... even with the rod screwed all the way down until the point bottoms out on the saw, I can't get enough tension. 348624

The rod should always rest on the cast iron of the saw at the bottom, so that turning it pushes the sliding block up. This raises the wheel to put tension on the blade, compressing the spring. Yours has raised the block higher than is desirable without compressing the spring at all, so it's not working correctly. The blade is definitely too long or the blade is not engaged with both wheels. It's possible there is an adjustment that would raise the wheel compared to the sliding block, as that could allow longer blades. You should not be able to install a correctly sized blade while the block is so high.

All I've tried to do here is to explain why I think those who suggest the blade is too long are correct.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Dave,
have you checked this video at Grizzly?


https://youtu.be/kxAfPq6ZcUA

Notice that the end of the tension rods doesn't get near the upper frame arm.


The rod should always rest on the cast iron of the saw at the bottom, so that turning it pushes the sliding block up. This raises the wheel to put tension on the blade, compressing the spring. Yours has raised the block higher than is desirable without compressing the spring at all, so it's not working correctly. The blade is definitely too long or the blade is not engaged with both wheels. It's possible there is an adjustment that would raise the wheel compared to the sliding block, as that could allow longer blades. You should not be able to install a correctly sized blade while the block is so high.

All I've tried to do here is to explain why I think those who suggest the blade is too long are correct.


Alan...did you watch the video produced by Grizzly tech support for the G0555 bandsaw? My eyes are aging but I didn't see the end of theshaft touch the upper frame arm anywhere during the alignment procedure or even when they detensioned the blade.

Furthermore, his knob is below the top of the cover while in the video, the knob is well above the top of the cabinet. Just observations.

[Dave Macy]

Spent some time on phone with Grizzly. I made 2 super dumb mistakes. I didn't know I needed to have the blade on it. I was trying to test it to make sure I could get to 3/4 before I put the blade on, and I had the bushings up too high. It can't get tension until the lower bushing is against the sliding bracket. Ok, I'm dumb but at least it looks like I should be able to get it going.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Dave....we all have made mistakes! Glad to know it's working. Thanks for the update!

[glenn bradley]

No troubles. Sounds like you've got it now.

[Dave Macy]

My problems continue. Maybe I'm not cutoit for this stuff. i love the woodworking but the machine problems kill me. Now i have tension on the spring but no tension on the blade. its as if i need to some how move the wheel up or the spring and slider bad aren't making the wheel go higher. at this point i hate life in the shop

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Dave...post photos similar to the ones you posted earlier but from a slight larger perspective. I want to see a larger portion of the upper part of the machine in one photo. I want to see both sides of the upper part of the machine.

This isn't magic. It's just figuring out what is not happening and why.

[Dave Macy]

Thanks Mr Fitzgerald. Sorry for being so bothersome. It's just driving me crazy. The woodworking part is so much fun but trying to figure out why a machine won't work is driving me crazy.

[Ronald Blue]

I know this was mentioned before but did you make sure you had the correct blade length? It looks like the blade is to long. Like you are out of stroke on adjustment. You can probably pick up a blade for testing purposes at any big box home improvement store near you.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Dave,

First, you aren't a bother! Many on this website have helped me.

Based on the photos, I agree with Ronald Blue, it appears that you have a blade that is too long.

Let me check the Grizzly website and find out what size blade is recommended for the G0555. I will get back to you soon.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Dave,

The Grizzly website shows the blade length for the G0555 to be 92 1/2"-93 1/2".

Take the blade off, lay it on the ground. Lay the blade teeth up to prevent damaging the teeth. Be careful to not cut yourself! Put a piece of tape on one spot of the blade and put a pencil mark on it. Now measure from that mark around the blade back to the mark.

[Geoff Crimmins]

The sliding casting with the spring in it moves up when you tighten the tension knob, which causes the upper wheel to move up and tension the blade. It looks like this casting has moved up until it hit the shaft collar on the bottom of the tension arm. When the casting hit the shaft collar it stopped moving, and further tightening of the knob caused the spring to compress. So....it looks to me like either that shaft collar is too low on the shaft, or the blade is too long for the saw. The tension mechanism is working correctly, it's just running out of range and hitting the shaft collar before wheel has moved enough to tension the blade.

--Geoff.

[Dave Macy]

Thanks everyone. The blade is definitely the right length and matches another that I tested from store. I will try to move the lower bushing or lock nut further up thanks

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Did you measure the blade? What is it's length?

[Dave Macy]

Its 93-1/2" best I can tell. Kind of helard to measure it but that's what I get. I can push the wheel up by hand so I wonder if something broke because I cannot get the casting or wheel up high enough

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Is the wheel going up or just tilting?

Let me take a look at the part diagram again. I 'll be right back.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

There is a shaft onto which the upper wheel is mounted. One end of the shaft passes through a bearing which is pressed into the wheel and the wheel is held on by a washer & nut. The other end of the shaft goes into the shaft bracket and is held in by a roll pin. At the left and right sides of this triangular shaped shaft bracket are pins (one on each side). The shaft bracket swivels/tilts towards and away from you as you face the wheel so you can see the blade on the wheel. This swiveling motion is controlled by the knob on the other side of the BS which is how you track the blade on the wheels.
The two pins (one on each side of the shaft bracket) are mounted on the sliding housing where you are reading the spring tension (blade size). So without tension, the wheel without tension will tilt. Once tension is on it, the blade tracking knob will then tilt it.


Has this BS worked since you bought it? Do you have an old blade that was mounted and tensioned correctly?

[Bill White]

Just a point of info....
The 3/4" blade is wayyyyyy too much for the saw. I have the 0555LX, and only use a 1/2" blade max.
Keep listening to Ken. He's the BOSS.
Bill

[Rick Moyer]

Have you changed anything on the tension rod? In your original post pics the tension rod is almost touching the casting at the bottom of the rod (as it should be), but in post #11, the rod is up away from the casting. It would seem that the rod is unscrewing vertically when what should be happening is the nut climbs the rod thereby compressing the spring. Are the set screws in place in the two collars near the top? The tension rod should not be moving vertically, I don't believe.

[Myk Rian]

The other end of the shaft goes into the shaft bracket and is held in by a roll pin.
The bracket may be bent. Common problem caused by over-tension.
Part # 35-3

[Dave Macy]

Yes, the bandsaw worked when I got it but it only had a fine tooth 1/4" blade that was completely shot. It came out of a small furniture maker's shop. He had other big ones in there. The arms aren't bent and when the blade is off, the wheel tilts in and out fine in fact I took it off just to look. Here's what I know although it isn't much:

I've tried with a few blades including the one that was on. I have the same problem all of the time so I know it's not the blade.
The problem started when I switched out springs and took out the tension pieces.
I know the bottom lock bushing is what creates the tension - when it hits the casting it draws on the square bottom nut and tensions the spring.

What I don't know is, what pulls up the casting?

I also noticed the new tension rod I got from grizzly is about 5/8" shorter than the original one, so I put the old one through a die and am back to using that since the threads have been restored... but it still feels like it may not be able to create the tension because it skips when it starts to get tight.

So while I can get tension on the spring, I am not getting tension on the blade.

If I thought I could dump this and get at least some of my money back I would and get something else. I'm a student though so don't have much money. I have a neighbor who asked me to make something for him for his wife for Christmas that would be my first money making piece but I don't think that's going to happen now.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Dave,

The sliding bracket is that piece with the blade size markings on it. At the top of it is the lower lock collar. The lock collar has a set screw in it. Flip the tension release lever to the up position. Then turn the tension knob slowly until you see and can untighten the set screw in the lower lock collar. After backing that set screw partially out, screw the lower lock collar up the tension shaft until it lightly touches the bracket the upper lock collar is resting on. Then turn the tension knob and see if you can add tension to the blade.

BTW, an easy way to measure the bandsaw blade. Lay the blade on the floor teeth up. Take a piece of string and some masking or painters tape. Tape one end of the string to the outside of the blade. As you wrap the string around the outside of the blade every foot or so put another small piece of tape to hold the string in place. Mark the string where it passes or touches the end taped to the blade. Now remove the string and measure in a straight line from the end to the mark on the string.

[Dave Macy]

Thanks. I'll try again. I stopped for the night since my dad asked for help with Christmas lights. I'll be back out there after church tomorrow.

[Geoff Crimmins]

I know the bottom lock bushing is what creates the tension - when it hits the casting it draws on the square bottom nut and tensions the spring.
What I don't know is, what pulls up the casting?
.

Dave, this isn't quite correct. When you tighten the tension knob it it causes the square bottom nut to move up, which causes the spring to move up, which causes the tensioning casting to move up, which causes the upper wheel to move up. Eventually the blade becomes tight around the wheels, so the upper wheel can't move up any further. At that point, tightening the tension knob more will cause the spring to compress.

I believe the upper shaft collar rides on the quick-release arms, and is what holds the threaded tension rod in position so it can lift the square nut. I'm not sure what the lower shaft collar does, but it should not be touching the tensioning casting. If it does, it will prevent everything from moving up correctly, and you won't be able to tension the blade. I think it's the position of this lower shaft collar that is causing your problem. (It's hard to be certain without being able to see the saw in person.)

--Geoff

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Dave, this isn't quite correct. When you tighten the tension knob it it causes the square bottom nut to move up, which causes the spring to move up, which causes the tensioning casting to move up, which causes the upper wheel to move up. Eventually the blade becomes tight around the wheels, so the upper wheel can't move up any further. At that point, tightening the tension knob more will cause the spring to compress.

I believe the upper shaft collar rides on the quick-release arms, and is what holds the threaded tension rod in position so it can lift the square nut. I'm not sure what the lower shaft collar does, but it should not be touching the tensioning casting. If it does, it will prevent everything from moving up correctly, and you won't be able to tension the blade. I think it's the position of this lower shaft collar that is causing your problem. (It's hard to be certain without being able to see the saw in person.)

--Geoff

Geoff is dead on. I agree, the lower collar needs to move up.

They upper collar riding on the arms of the quick release lever is the device pulling the sliding bracket up via the shaft, spring and square nut. In doing so, it puts the tension on the blade. The shaft for the upper wheel is on the other side of the sliding bracket. As the sliding bracket moves up so does the upper wheel shaft.

The lower collar is there to limit the amount of movement probably to reduce the chances of over-tensioning the blade and damaging the upper wheel shaft IMO. If you watch the video on blade tension adjustment http://www.grizzly.com/products/The-Ultimate-14-Bandsaw/G0555 , they move it all the way up to the top collar until the blade is tensioned and tracking properly. Then they screw the lower collar down until it 1 or 2 turns from the upper wheel sliding bracket where they tighten the set screw to hold it in place.

There really is nothing magic about this. The upper collar rides on the two arms of the quick release lever. The upper collar is locked to the shaft of the tensioning rod by a set screw. Thus when you turn the tension shaft you are either pulling the sliding upper wheel bracket up to increase blade tension or pushing the sliding upper wheel down to reduce tension on the blade. On one side of the sliding upper wheel bracket you have the window to see the nice new yellow spring and the washer/pointer to set the tension to the gauge on the bracket. On the other side of the upper wheel sliding bracket you have the upper wheel shaft hinge.

Over tensioning the blade could conceivably bend the wheel shaft. Whether or not it could prevent you from tensioning a blade of proper length, I don't know. But it could certainly cause some tracking problems.

Watch the video. See how the pros at Grizzly recommend it be done!

[Dave Macy]

I've watched that video so many times I think I can quote the whole thing haha. I'm getting closer, see pics. I know what I need to do now but didn't get much chance since we got our tree and I had to work on a term paper for school.

I moved both bushings much further down and I'm now closer. I think here's why:

When the bottom bushing (lock coller) hits the casting, this is what draws the nut up and tensions the spring.

What the top bushing does, and only after it hits the arms, is draw up the casting.

So I have them all way too far up the rod. I only figured this out from using what I learned in scouts when navigating... build in an intentional error. So what I did was move everything too far down and try that, then move everything up too far and try that and see which is closer. I think right now I'm almost there, but need to move both a bit lower and keep the existing gap the same distance. I think if I go back out there tonight my mom is going to kill me though since I have to work on my paper.

Thanks for all the help, especially you Mr Fitzgerald. Thanks for all the time you spent on my problem.
348838348839

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Is the blade getting more tension on it? That is the question. I could care less what that scale reads. Is the blade tensioning....getting tighter?


Work on your paper. Education is more important!

I disagree with your analysis. Notice in the video, after they have adjusted blade tension and blade tracking, then and only then, do they adjust the lower locking collar down to the casting and then adjust it up 2 turns before they lock it in place with the set screw. The lower collar is there to set a range. It's not designed to put tension on the casting or the blade. Watch the video and follow it exactly.

The upper locking collar lifts the sliding upper wheel bracket (casting) and in doing so raises the wheel.

Good luck!

Get the paper done in good fashion too! Education is more important!

[Geoff Crimmins]

I would recommend removing the lower shaft collar and seeing if you can properly tension the blade without. If so, then you can replace the collar and find the correct position for it so that the blade still tensions correctly.

--Geoff

[Van Huskey]

There is a lot going on here and I personally don't have a clear enough picture in my mind to know the solution BUT I am curious did you compare the height of the Iturra spring to the original? I have seen significant height differences in OEM and aftermarket springs and significant variations in OEM springs from year to year.

[Dave Macy]

Well it looks like removing the lower bearing to see if I can tension the blade without it wasn't a good choice for me. As it tightened, the casting broke. So here goes more money into the saw and even more lost time. At this point I'm tempted to put it out with the trash but I can't afford anything else on my budget, especially with the holidays coming up. I'm so frustrated. Even after chilling for a few days not thinking about it, I go back in tonight and within 10 mins this happens. Maybe I should take up video games and make other bad choices after school.... I won't, but it seems like it would be easier.

[Ronald Blue]

That's unfortunate. Without seeing it welding or brazing might be an option. Backing up you said this tensioned the blade that came on it. If after you reassembled it you either have something together in the wrong order or just the wrong position. Lean on Van Huskey here. He is extremely knowledgeable about bandsaws and most everything else as well. Get a lot more photos so it's clear how things are assembled and set. I am a heavy equipment mechanic. From time to time when I put something back together and it doesn't work I backtrack and examine everything I did. When it worked before I "fixed" it and then doesn't afterwards I know most likely I made a mistake. When you are dealing with small orifices in valves and the like inverting a piece can cause something to no longer function or funtion incorrectly. Good luck.

[Van Huskey]

Well it looks like removing the lower bearing to see if I can tension the blade without it wasn't a good choice for me. As it tightened, the casting broke. So here goes more money into the saw and even more lost time. At this point I'm tempted to put it out with the trash but I can't afford anything else on my budget, especially with the holidays coming up. I'm so frustrated. Even after chilling for a few days not thinking about it, I go back in tonight and within 10 mins this happens. Maybe I should take up video games and make other bad choices after school.... I won't, but it seems like it would be easier.

By removing the bottom bearing do you mean the bottom guide?

Which part broke?

When you get the correct part in I suggest reassembling the saw with the original tension spring as you know the saw worked with it and you remove the variable of the new spring.

I am sorry you are having so many problems and I know what you mean about being frustrated but it is a problem that can be sorted out but you aren't the first nor the last to be stymied by a machine.

[Myk Rian]

The bracket may be bent. Common problem caused by over-tension. Part # 35-3
I'm still betting on this.

[Van Huskey]

I'm still betting on this.

The tension bracket is indeed a very big potential issue here and very well may have been bent and now has broken.

[Dave Macy]

Here's the update. I took some time, a lot of money, and ordered almost every part of the tension system new from grizzly. New rod, bushings, sliding tension bracket and even a new shaft with hinge and had to drive in the pins. Now I am right back where I started only much less money to buy more wood. The upper wheel will not move up anymore than it has. The new hinge with shaft has a piece that sticks out and hits the hole in the frame so it won't go any higher. I've had almost the whole thing apart.

Is there any reason why I shouldn't pour gas on this thing and just try to blow it up? Yes, I'm kidding. I'm ready to almost junk it but only problem is it would take months to save up enough money to get something else even used off Clist. it's as if the blades are all too long but I know at least the one fit when I got it although doesn't now. Man I hate this thing, and I've spent so much time on the phone with grizzly reps although several have given my conflicting directions. Ok my rant is over, but man I'm just so angry.
350227350228350229

[Van Huskey]

Have you tried switching the spring back to the stock spring? When trouble shooting always look at what you changed FIRST and what was not changed last.

[Ronald Blue]

Van is correct. You stated it worked until you took it apart to change the spring. Either the spring or something else you disassembled is not correct. Take a deep breath and retrace your actions. I know it's been several weeks. I hope you took photos as you disassembled it. Good luck.

[keith micinski]

https://simple.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

At this point it is going to be hard to go back to the beginning since you have replaced a bunch of parts and disassembled it multiple times. I would be willing to bet a large sum of money that the very first time you dissassembled it to replace the spring, when you say you knew for a fact that the saw was working properly, is where your problem lies. Identify those parts and processes and stop trying to find other problems until you verify that was done properly.

[Tom Ewell]

maybe I'm missing something but I'm not seeing the nut at the bottom of the screw in his pictures

350235

[keith micinski]

This thread seems to address the nut and why you might not see it in his photo. Also could be his problem.

http://lumberjocks.com/topics/30692

[Tom Ewell]

Gotcha, the nut gets exposed only when the tension is loosened all the way, otherwise it's inside the casting when tension is set.

[John Lanciani]

I'm betting on that top collar on the tension rod being in the wrong place. In pic #2 the tension spring is almost fully compressed but the tension rod is not bearing on the saw frame. If the tension rod isn't bearing on the saw frame it isn't putting any upward pressure on the wheel support to raise the upper wheel and tension the blade.

[Don Orr]

I'm with John L. here in that the tension rod is not bearing on the frame. That is not correct. I'm certainly no expert but have been using my bandsaw a long time. They are all fairly similar. If you have or can get a parts diagram, that may help with how the parts go together. I think you might have something out of order. I would also try and assemble things WITHOUT the quick release mechanism and collars to see if you can get it to work. Or even look at diagrams from other makes of saw to see how their tension systems work. After all, Grizzly just copied established designs. I've been watching this thread and hoping things would go more smoothly and feel bad that they have not. Unfortunately a good lesson in perseverance. You can get this-stick with it and do some more research. I have confidence in you. Keep us posted.

Found the parts diagram for you.
http://cdn1.grizzly.com/partslists/g0555_pl.pdf

[John TenEyck]

I think there are two ways that saw can apply tension to the spring. One is with the rod bearing on the frame, just like it does on my Delta 14". In that case, the quick release mechanism won't function properly. The other way is with the rod off the frame. In that case, tension is applied by means of that big barrel nut (for lack of a better term) that sits on top of the quick release mechanism. In both cases, the rod moves the captive nut (Part # 39 in the Grizzly parts list) up against the bottom of the spring.

This shouldn't be that hard. Either the rod can move the nut up enough to tension the spring or it can't. If the rod is bearing against the frame it's just a matter of turning the knob at the top of the rod until the captive nut compresses the spring enough to apply the desired tension. If you run out of travel before that happens then something is bent or the blade is too long. If the rod is off the frame and the barrel nut is in play then you would need to turn the barrel nut, then move the quick release to engage tension, check where the tension is, disengage the quick release, and adjust the barrel nut accordingly, until you have the desired amount of tension when tension is engaged. Again, if you run out of adjustment before achieving the desired tension something else is wrong.

John

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Here's a photo from the G0555 manual.

350290



The tension rod isn't designed to touch the upper frame arm. The tension rod is suspended from the support plates (qty. 4) by the upper tension collar. One end of the support plates is bolted to the pivot arm which is attached by two screws to the upper frame arm. The other end for the support plates is raised and lowered by the quick release lever depending on whether or not the blade is tensioned. The quick release lever is bolted to the upper frame arm.

The "working area" of the quick release lever is somewhat triangular in shape with a groove at it's highest point. When the handle of the quick release lever is pulled down, it's the triangular area that raises the spacer separating the support plates, lifting the support plates, raising tension rod due to the upper tension collar.

The upper tension collar is designed to set the blade tension depending on the blade size.

The lower collar is designed to set the minimum tension when the blade tension is released so that one might not experience the need to readjust the blade tracking every time the quick release lever is engaged and disengaged.

All the above is just my opinion, of course.

[Van Huskey]

Ken and John are correct the clones that have quick releases put the pressure on the large nut which bears on the cross piece between the yokes of the frame, those without a quick release bear the pressure on the bottom of the yoke.

I still think the OP needs to assemble the saw with the OEM spring or at least compare the diameter and height of the new spring he has. It worked with the old spring so it is either the spring or the assembly (meaning the OPs putting it back together) but each time he disassembles and reassembles it without verifying the spring issue he potentially adds variables to the mix.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

The tension rod in my MM-16 pushes up to tension the blade. The tension rod on this b/s is pulled up by the quick release lever.

Think of a wheelbarrow. You have a pivot point at one end (the axle for the wheels) in the case of this bandsaw, the bolt through the support plates to the pivot arm. The equivalent of handles and body of the wheelbarrow would be the support plates in this bandsaw. The action of your legs lifting up and raising the wheelbarrow by the handles is the equivalent of pulling down on the quick release lever handle raising the triangular end of the quick release lever until the spacer on that end of the support plates drops into the notch on that end of the quick release lever. The upper tension collar rides on the top the support plates. The mechanical load in a wheelbarrow can be in the barrel or it could be suspended under the barrow.....as is the tension rod of this bandsaw.

I think the OP has experienced more than one problem but with the same resultant symptoms.

I dearly wish I lived closer cause I'd be there in a heart beat.

[Van Huskey]

The key is upward pressure has to be applied to the wheel and on this saw it is pulling the spring up which pulls down on the quick release crossbar vs pressing down on the yoke which the non-quick release versions of this saw do. Looking at the pictures it appears the spring is indeed being compressed so it indicates to me something is binding and preventing the upward pull on the wheel. IF the upper wheel support hinge is not significantly bent then my guess is either the tension slide or the spring is binding because the spring is apparently compressed by the look of it.

If anyone is local and can contact the parents and go over I think a fresh set of eyes may be all it takes to get this saw right.

[keith micinski]

I don't think its the spring only because the spring shouldn't even begin to compress until the bade starts to to tighten up and give it something to push against. It sounds like he can't even get the blade to start gaining tension before the spring is compressed making me think something else is causing the top wheel bracket to catch before it is at it can begin to engage the blade.

[keith micinski]

I basically just said what van said two minutes later. Sadly I have gotten sucked into this thread and I don't even own this saw and never will

[Ken Fitzgerald]

I don't think it's the spring. As long as the spring is long enough and fits inside the upper wheel sliding bracket, you should be able to tension the blade.

Pulling down on the quick release lever until it's in a horizontal position lifts up on the tension rod via the upper tension collar. The tension rod passes through the upper wheel sliding bracket. On the other side of the upper wheel sliding bracket is the upper wheel hinge and shaft assembly to which the upper wheel is mounted. When the tension rod is pulled up, it compresses the spring on the top "lip" of the upper wheel sliding bracket. The higher the tension rod is raised, the more it will compress the spring. Increased compression of the spring, raises the sliding bracket higher and in doing so, raises the upper wheel hinge and shaft assembly and the upper wheel.

It's the distance between the top of the nut on the lower end of the tension rod (just below the tension spring) and the bottom of the upper tension collar that sets the overall width of the range of the compression on the spring. It's the location of the those previously two mentioned points on the tension rod shaft that determines where that range is located. It's a sort of sliding scale that is adjustable in width and position in a given range.

If the upper wheel tension collar is too high up(towards the knob end) on the tension shaft it can't pull the tension shaft up enough to reach the higher tensions because it can't compress the spring enough.

If the lower nut on the tension rod is too low, it can reduce the range of compression.

The lower tension collar sets the minimum tension achieved when the blade tension is released via the quick release lever. I believe it's adjusted to reduce the odds of one having to readjust the blade tracking each time you tension the saw blade.

[Van Huskey]

I have another thing to look at because I think something HAS to be binding or in the way of the upper wheel sliding bracket preventing it from moving up since in the pictures it appears the spring is compressed. There is a spacer the bolt runs through on the handle side of the quick release (between the two cross bars of the quick release), make sure that the sliding bracket is not running into the spacer and limiting the travel of the sliding bracket. If this is happening the slide will stop moving up but the spring will continue to be compressed more and more as you release and turn the screw in an attempt to increase the tension.

The tension screw is set abnormally high but it still should have enough range given the spring looks fully compressed in one picture.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

I have another thing to look at because I think something HAS to be binding or in the way of the upper wheel sliding bracket preventing it from moving up since in the pictures it appears the spring is compressed. There is a spacer the bolt runs through on the handle side of the quick release (between the two cross bars of the quick release), make sure that the sliding bracket is not running into the spacer and limiting the travel of the sliding bracket. If this is happening the slide will stop moving up but the spring will continue to be compressed more and more as you release and turn the screw in an attempt to increase the tension.

The tension screw is set abnormally high but it still should have enough range given the spring looks fully compressed in one picture.


Van,

I'd think that would result in an indication of increasing compression without any actual change in blade tension. In other words, you'd get an indication of increasing tension on the "blade tension indicator" gauge and yet the blade would still be loose.

[Van Huskey]

Van,

I'd think that would result in an indication of increasing compression without any actual change in blade tension. In other words, you'd get an indication of increasing tension on the "blade tension indicator" gauge and yet the blade would still be loose.


That is exactly what would happen. The pictures he has shown show different levels of spring compression so the spring or the sliding bracket have to be catching. It is pretty simple, if the spring is compressing it is either not transferring the pressure to the slide, which would be very unusual given it is enclosed in the slide housing so even if it binds in the housing it is still transferring the pressure to the slide since it would have to be binding against the slide OR the slide's travel is being impeded so the pressure is being transferred to something other than the wheel. This is based on the assumption the spring is compressing since it appears that way in the pictures.

As an aside I have never really thought it was an issue with the spring itself BUT removing all the variables introduced when a system stops working properly is the "correct" way to troubleshoot a problem. I don't know how many times what could not possibly be the problem has turned out to be my problem.

[Rich Aldrich]

I have the ShopFox W1706 and had similar issues. I bought the 6" riser block with the saw and set it up with the riser block right away. The blade was like a snake at full tensions even after installing the Ittura spring. The only thing that made sense is that the distance between the wheels was too short. Maybe the riser block was too short or the frame was machined short. I put a 1/8"thick plate between the riser block and the top frame and solved the problem. I can set the tension on the scale and it follows what the normal recommended tension is supposed to be for the blade width.

The 1/8" plate extended the blade length 1/4" because the distance between the wheels was moved 1/8". If you try this:

1) Start in small increments.
2) The plate should be the same size as the contact area of the block and/or frame.
3) You will have to drill a hole in the plate for any alignment pins and notch for the bolt that holds the frame together.

This band saw runs great now.

You could try measuring the distance between the wheels, but I wasnt sure what the dimension should be. I could calculate the distance but it seemed just as easy to try the shim.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

That is exactly what would happen. The pictures he has shown show different levels of spring compression so the spring or the sliding bracket have to be catching. It is pretty simple, if the spring is compressing it is either not transferring the pressure to the slide, which would be very unusual given it is enclosed in the slide housing so even if it binds in the housing it is still transferring the pressure to the slide since it would have to be binding against the slide OR the slide's travel is being impeded so the pressure is being transferred to something other than the wheel. This is based on the assumption the spring is compressing since it appears that way in the pictures.

As an aside I have never really thought it was an issue with the spring itself BUT removing all the variables introduced when a system stops working properly is the "correct" way to troubleshoot a problem. I don't know how many times what could not possibly be the problem has turned out to be my problem.

Van,

Professionally I troubleshot everything from all the equipment used in air traffic control centers, equipment used on fast attack submarines to MRI scanners for 40 years. The OP said it did work when he received it and now it doesn't. I couldn't agree more about removing all the variables. It becomes a matter of having the self discipline to do it. Throwing new parts at something without determining a need is an inefficient, expensive method of ineffectively fixing an issue.

If it was me, I'd put the original blade back on to see if I could get it to tension. Step one. The problem started when the OP tried to replace the blade. If the original blade tensioned properly before, it should do it now. If not, we need to determine why.

At this point, I could care less about what that blade size gauge indicates. I would love to know if the blade is actually tensioning. Is it loose or is it tight when the spring is compressed?

[John Lanciani]

From the Grizz website; " Blade size: 92-1/2" to 93-1/2" "

The OP stated that his blades were 93.5" nominal, I'm now leaning heavily towards the camp that thinks the new blades are the problem. If they are even just a touch over stated length the tension mechanism might likely be topping out before the blade has any tension.

[Don Orr]

I still think he should try assembling the tension mechanism WITHOUT the quick release device and the tension rod pushing against the frame to see if it works at all. Take out a variable. FYI-I have never released the tension on my saw in about 15 years and have had no trouble at all.

[Van Huskey]

Van,

Professionally I troubleshot everything from all the equipment used in air traffic control centers, equipment used on fast attack submarines to MRI scanners for 40 years. The OP said it did work when he received it and now it doesn't. I couldn't agree more about removing all the variables. It becomes a matter of having the self discipline to do it. Throwing new parts at something without determining a need is an inefficient, expensive method of ineffectively fixing an issue.

If it was me, I'd put the original blade back on to see if I could get it to tension. Step one. The problem started when the OP tried to replace the blade. If the original blade tensioned properly before, it should do it now. If not, we need to determine why.

At this point, I could care less about what that blade size gauge indicates. I would love to know if the blade is actually tensioning. Is it loose or is it tight when the spring is compressed?

I knew your past and actually had a mental image of you standing beside a MRI that didn't work.

Maybe I have lost track of when the saw actually quit working, I thought it was when the spring was changed but if not returning the configuration of the saw to when it last worked (just like a computer) is what I would suggest, then move forward changing one thing at a time to verify when the problem occurs.

[John TenEyck]

Yes, I would put the original blade back on and try it, because I think John L. may have found the underlying problem - the new blades may be too long.

As an aside, I built a quick release mechanism for my 14" Delta this morning in about an hour, using a Woodsmith design I saw as inspiration. I needed to replace the tension rod anyway because it had galled in the nut, so might as well do it all at once. So now I have essentially the same set up as the OP's saw - and it works just fine.

Why build a quick release mechanism at all? Well, when I run a 1/2" blade for resawing I put as much tension on the frame as it can handle, which isn't a lot really, but it can't hurt to let it rest when it's not being used and it only takes a couple of seconds to reset the tension. Now that I can do it with the quick release mechanism I have no reason not to.

As a further aside, does anyone now the bearing sizes for about a 1970 14" cast iron Delta? I had the upper wheel off and the bearings sound pretty dry. I might as well replace both the top and bottom, too, so if you know both sizes I'd appreciate if you could post it. Thanks. Sorry for the tangent.

John

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Yes, the bandsaw worked when I got it but it only had a fine tooth 1/4" blade that was completely shot. It came out of a small furniture maker's shop. He had other big ones in there. The arms aren't bent and when the blade is off, the wheel tilts in and out fine in fact I took it off just to look. Here's what I know although it isn't much:
QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Van Huskey;2639439]I knew your past and actually had a mental image of you standing beside a MRI that didn't work.

Maybe I have lost track of when the saw actually quit working, I thought it was when the spring was changed but if not returning the configuration of the saw to when it last worked (just like a computer) is what I would suggest, then move forward changing one thing at a time to verify when the problem occurs.

Van,
It first occurred, IIRC, when the OP bought and tried to install a new blade.

You can picture me working on radar, tacan, UHF, HF, VHF transmitters, receivers, radar antennas, (hanging and falling from a ships mast when shocked while working on a navigational radar, I was wearing a harness and tied off thankfully!) working on antennas used on fast attack subs, CT scanners, x-ray equipment, ultrasound systems, nuclear medicine cameras and computers, and yes, MRI.

[Rich Aldrich]

A few years ago, I bought a Shopfox W1706 band saw which is the same as the Grizzly G0555, except it has cast iron wheels instead of aluminum. I also decided to buy the 6" riser block so I had more clearance for cutting burls. It should take a 105' blade but most of these are just bit too long. Occasionally I could find a 105" blade that would run on the saw, but tension was to low. Recently I bought some blades from a supplier that also supplies blades for our two production saws at the mill which have 8 feet diameter wheels. These people are experts. These blades were also too long. With maximum tension applied I could still slide the blade on the wheels.

I decided that it was time to dig into the issue deeper and suspected that the riser block was too short.It measures 5 3/4". Knowing the wheel spacing was close with the tension applied, I decided to install a 1/8" spacer between the upper wheel frame and the riser block. I had to make one with a slot for the bolt that holds the upper frame to the lower frame. This bolt was long enough for a 1/8" spacer, but not longer. The 1/8" spacer would actually require the saw blade to be 1/4" longer. I also had to drill holes for the alignment pins. The pins were long enough to go through the spacer block and still go into the alignment holes in the upper frame.

What a difference. I can now tension the blade properly and use all of the blades that seemed to be too long. It will also accept the blades on the lower tolerance of length (I tried a "shorter blade that actually would run on the saw before the spacer was installed.) The saw now feels like any other good saw I have used in the past.

I know I am the only one with a messy shop, so please excuse the mess. http://www.woodturnersunlimited.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_lol.gif

[Stew Hagerty]

I have the G0555X Extreme Series version. Unfortunately for the OP, I bought the saw new approximately 6 years ago and swapped out the Tensioner & Quick Release for the Carter setup almost immediately. For that reason, I don't remember exactly how the stock system functioned. I wish I could help more. However, after reading through the thread, I tend to agree that the blade could be the culprit. I recommend the OP buy a high quality 3/8" or 1/2" blade from a maker such as Timberline.

For what it's worth, here are photos of my setup with the Carter components:

350372 350373 350374

[John K Jordan]

...I tend to agree that the blade could be the culprit. I recommend the OP buy a high quality 3/8" or 1/2" blade from a maker such as Timberline.

Might check to see if there is a supplier in your area that makes bandsaw blades. An industrial gas/welding supply company near me makes blades from Lenox stock, sometimes while I wait. The guy who makes them is very good at getting the length and weld right.

JKJ

[Dave Macy]

Here's the update with more pics supplied. I was on the phone with Grizzly for about an hour today. Even with the original blade, and original spring it won't tension anymore. Look at the pivot hinge though. There is a screw nub that sticks out, that wasn't there on the original pivot hinge, and it's preventing the sliding adjustment bracket to slide up anymore. The rep I talked to hadn't ever heard of this, so now we're thinking maybe they redesigned it and it doesn't work with my saw as-is. You can see the old one, which has old written on it. I am beyond frustrated. He had me take pics and email them. Hopefully I'll hear back from them by the end of Monday because Tuesday we're back in school again. I hate this saw.350403350404350405350406350407350408350409

[John Lanciani]

Either put the old bracket back in or take a file and remove the raised screw boss on the new one. Looking at your pics I still believe that a shorter blade will solve the problem by coming up to tension before the bracket gets as high up as shown in your pics.

[Dave Macy]

Can't put the old one back in. During one point of this whole process, I cranked so hard that I broke the sliding housing. Since the pivot hinge is held in by pins that were driven in, it means there is no way to get the old pivot hinge out and reuse it. I'm waiting for them to call me back but assume I'll have to file off that nub. Still no idea why it's even there though. There is no screw or anything that goes there.

[Justin Ludwig]

Dave, don't let frustration get the best of you. Sometimes you have to take a step back, put your hands in the air and turn in 3 circles to reset.

Think of this way - by the time you get this fixed, you'll be a Grizzly bandsaw guru and will be able to troubleshoot any future problems with ease. Take a breath, ol' buddy, take a breath.

[Earl McLain]

Been an interesting read. Picture 4 of post 75 shows a threaded hole on the back of the tensioner bracket--at approximately the same location as the offending screw head on the other side. From the shadow, it even looks like a washer may have been there at some point. Any chance that machine screw is on the wrong side of the bracket?
earl

[Dave Macy]

Both parts are brand new, however I did have them in a vise and used c-clamps to press in the pins which is why there are scratches on both. There was never any screw there originally in fact the nub wasn't even there on the original part. Grizzly just emailed me saying they got the pics so hopefully on Monday they'll give me a call. Thanks

[Van Huskey]

Well, now we know what was limiting the slide from moving up and explains the compressed spring with no tension. Take a deep breath and keep in mind this MAY not be the end of the issue since the screw boss was an added variable after the problems started so you MAY be back to your old issues when that issue is resolved. I don't say this to discourage you just to pace yourself in the event of it not fixing all your problems, you don;t want to stroke out in frustration if you merely go back to where you were. Also, whether you can appreciate it or not during the heat of the moment you are gathering valuable experience and will be more likely to open a machine up and work on an issue in the future.

[Mike Dowell]

I have a 555, and here's a picture of my setup with a 1/4 blade.
https://s30.postimg.org/r36jiup4t/IMG_20161230_174147952.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/r36jiup4t/)

I should say that the directions for this unit are not that great. I took apart the tension mechanism at one point about a year ago, for what reason I don't recall. Anyway, long story short, I recall having a problem like yours, but you don't have the (4) nuts as shown in the photo. Those were my problem, as I had positioned them oddly.

[keith micinski]

I agree with Van, there have been so many variables added this might not be the only thing but that absolutely is a problem and would cause exactly what your problems are. Also get that screw boss ground off pronto.

[Dave Macy]

Here is an updated pic. Note the sawdust :)
350620

That's the Iturra 3/4" blade on it. I didn't play around with the fence but did a quick resaw of 5-1/2" tall oak.
350621350622
The fence definitely needs to be adjusted since the top is much thinner than the bottom.

In the end, the guy at Grizzly that called me back today, said he showed the pic of the casting with the nub to someone who had been there for about 30 years. The guy said yeah, we changed the design a number of years ago. So I grinded off the nub and now it's tensioned fine. In fact, I used the flutter method and the guage says it's about a 1/2". So I can go tighter if need be. It's tracking well, although I may have the top wheel bearing off a bit as it flutters about 1/32" front to back.

It's been a lot of weeks, angry frustrated nights, long calls and posts, and part $, but now it's working. If I wasn't so tired, I would have used it more. I'm beat though, so am waiting for later in the week. Thanks for all the help but mostly for not letting me quit.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

I am so very happy for you Dave!

Kudos to Grizzly technical support!

[John K Jordan]

Yea!! Nothing sweeter than a well-running bandsaw. :-)

You can do the initial table alignment with a square, but what works well to check is to cut wide-ways through a 1x6 or something standing on edge then flip one side and see if the kerf mates perfectly.

JKJ

[John TenEyck]

After 81 replies (82 now with this one) it's time this got put to bed.

Enjoy your saw.

John

[Van Huskey]

Glad you got that dealt with! Now it is time to work on the resaw variation. Check the fence to blade distance at top and bottom of the fence and see if they are the same. While you are at it crank the tension up to the 3/4" mark, Iturra recommends 15K psi for that blade and even with his spring you are still going to be a little low even at the 3/4" mark.

[Rick Moyer]

I've never had any luck with a 3/4 blade on my Grizzly G0555. Use a 1/2 for resaw.

[glenn bradley]

That was a big splinter and it sure nice to have it out. Did we ever discovered the primary cause of the original issue?

[Don Orr]

Congratulations! I'm very happy that you finally got this figured out. Now a bit of fine tuning and you're on your way. I hope this machine serves you well for a long time. And just a side note-a 3/4" blade is a lot for that saw or any 14" bandsaw for that matter.

[Stew Hagerty]

I've never had any luck with a 3/4 blade on my Grizzly G0555. Use a 1/2 for resaw.

I run a 3/4" blade quite often on mine. I have the riser and have used that 3/4" Timberwolf blade to resaw 10" white oak with no trouble at all. Granted, mine is the G0555X with the larger motor & cast iron wheels, but the blade runs on the machine just fine. With the smaller, standard motor, you just have a slower feed rate.

[Rick Moyer]

I run a 3/4" blade quite often on mine. I have the riser and have used that 3/4" Timberwolf blade to resaw 10" white oak with no trouble at all. Granted, mine is the G0555X with the larger motor & cast iron wheels, but the blade runs on the machine just fine. With the smaller, standard motor, you just have a slower feed rate.
Good to know. I think the only 3/4 blade I tried was a Lennox carbide so that may be one reason (I couldn't get enough tension).

[Jay Houghton]

One thing I haven't seen is a change in the position of the quick release. If you're trying to tension the blade when it's in the de-tension state you'll never move the wheel up far enough. But if you move the lever to the tension state then it will take a lot less movement in the threaded rod to tension the blade. The way those quick release systems work is they take up the gross dimension, and the fine tuning is done by the knob. I've only see one position of that quick release in all the picture here. Is the tension state when the lever is up or horizontal? But moving that lever should move the wheel up or down quite a bit.
Jay

[Jay Houghton]

One thing I haven't seen in all these pictures is a change in the position of the quick release lever. If you're trying to tension the blade with the lever in the tension position you'll never get enough movement in the tension rod. You have to release the tension lever, take up the slack, then use the lever to move the wheel up. It reminds me of a vice grip. You move the screw in, test the grip, release it, adjust the screw, etc. But you don't adjust that screw in the handle when you've got the vice grip clamped!
Jay

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Jay,

He's fixed it.