New old stock D-12

[lowell holmes]

I have one that I bought from the auction site a few years ago. It came to me with grunge and a bit of rust. The factory sharpening is still on the saw. I meant to clean the saw when I got it, but other things got in the way, and I ignored it until now.

It is a 10 tpi. It has a really ugly handle and I am making a new handle out of sapele for it. I will keep the old handle and saw nuts in case I need to put them back on to preserve the value.

I have sanded the rust and most of the grunge. The saw plate has a sheen to it. It seems the grunge is stain.

The etching is still legible and the Disston D-12 is legible.

Like I said, there is a sheen and the sanding marks are very fine. Are there any tricks to removing the grunge, leaving the sheen.

[Mike Brady]

Saw plate tends to get smudges that turn into permanent black marks. I have one truly NOS Atkins saws that still was wrapped, in the box when I got it. It has several black spots even though it was wrapped in some kind of oiled onion skin-type paper. The handle has some very minor scratches too. Something as big as a hand saw will get those kinds of marks even while it is stored before sale.

To your question, I know of no way that these dark stains can be removed. If they are abraded away you still have the scratch marks from that left behind. Any chemicals you use on a saw plate will also immediately stain the steel. Unlike many hand tools, saws can not really be restored to a like-new condition. That is why NOS saws bring much greater prices than very good used ones. Once restoration is begun, they are no longer in NOS condition. Any use has the same effect. Don't buy NOS to use unless you don't care about your investment.
http://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee300/finefettle/IMG_0383_zps7auc55lj.jpg?1473110759890&1473110766599&1473110771853&1473110779102&1473110786668

[Rich Riddle]

I have several saws with the black marks and as another member said if you remove them you then have scratch marks. In my experiences the black marks don't detract from the saw properly functioning. You might ask Mike Allen as he restores many saws.

[Mike Brady]

Black marks and even pitting don't hinder saw performance if they are away from the tooth line. One of my best performing saws is actually very dark (unpitted) steel. A clean, waxed plate really helps.

[Pete Taran]

Lowell,

Post a picture of the saw and offending marks.

Pete

[lowell holmes]

343637

Pete,
Here is a photo of the sawplate.
I'm not sure you can see the etching. It is dark. I can make out that it is a D-12. I would be surprised if anything can be done.
I do like the saw. The teeth are still grabby when you touch them.
It cuts reasonably well.
I may sharpen it, but not until I know what's going on with the saw. It is 10 ti.

I have a D-7 that looks new. It is 10tpi also. I have posted pictures of it in the past. I made a new handle for it because the original handle was so ugly.

I feel the same way about the handle on the D-12.

My interest in the D-12 is caused by the fact it is supposed to be the top of the Disston line.

[Dave Beauchesne]

Lowell:
Would a bit of Autosol take away the stain, that is, without scratching it.
Just a thought.
Dave B

[lowell holmes]

Lowell:
Would a bit of Autosol take away the stain, that is, without scratching it.
Just a thought.
Dave B
We will know tomorrow. I have Autosol in the shop.
Thanks for the thought.

[Pete Taran]

Lowell,

Candidly, that saw is not in pristine enough shape to worry about. The stain you show is only cosmetic, and won't affect the function at all. From your initial description, I thought the saw was bright and pristine, like the one in Mike's post above. If that were the case, there are some techniques to remove the wayward spot, but in your case, it's pretty much the whole saw, so it's really not worth the effort.

Regards,

Pete

[Rich Riddle]

I think Pete is right on this saw.....it's a user and there certainly is nothing wrong with that.

[lowell holmes]

343700

I will use it. I am making a new handle for it because the one that is on it is so ugly. I've done this with a D-7 10 pt crosscut I have that is gorgeous. I will put a sapele or curly maple on it.
I want my saws to be pretty as well as sharp and well behaved. The picture is the D-7.

[lowell holmes]

343853
Here is the handle that will go on the D12. It will be made of sapele.
I was going to make it a bit flashier but decided that would be over kill. It is a 10tpi saw plate.

I've been able to clean the active rust and dirt off of the saw plate. It has a shine, but certainly has some stains that will not come off.

[Phil Mueller]

Lowell, if you have the time, I would appreciate seeing a step by step photo thread on the handle project. It's something I need to do myself, and a build thread would be very helpful.

[lowell holmes]

Lowell, if you have the time, I would appreciate seeing a step by step photo thread on the handle project. It's something I need to do myself, and a build thread would be very helpful.

I will post pictures, but Popular Woodworking has a video I recommend. I bought it and a couple others they have.
The videos cover making a back saw, tuning a back saw, and how to sharpen saws.
The first video you might want to see isBuild a Backsaw with Matt Cianci" He covers making saw handles.

He does a better job than I ever could. He goes into filing teeth and saw handle making.

[Phil Mueller]

Thanks Lowell!

[Mike Brady]

.....practice sawing the slot for the blade in some scrap before you launch into your good wood. In fact, I recommend that you saw the slot first, and then shape and finish the handle. Oh yeah, better do those screw holes next. If the slot and the holes are off: game over.

[lowell holmes]

I've made saws before.

I've successfully sawn the blade slot free hand. There is another method that is pretty fool proof.
You have to have a flat block of wood that is of a thickness that is 1/2 the thickness of the handle less half the saw blade thickness.

Placing the saw flat on the spacer block I just described you slide the handle flat on the work bench against the teeth on the saw.
I think Cianci covered it in his article.
Back and forth until you have sawn the blade slot.

[steven c newman]

Sometimes, all it takes to improve a handle is to add some curves...
343876
Sometimes...

[lowell holmes]

Sometimes, all it takes to improve a handle is to add some curves...
343876
Sometimes...

Steve,
I like what you did.

[steven c newman]

1/2" radius round-over bit. Then sand the "H" out of it. Was a bit "blocky" before all of that.

[lowell holmes]

344208

Phil,
Here is a picture of the handle being worked. I think you will understand the process.
I made a full size drawing of the handle with AutoCad and plotted it on my printer. If you need, handle drawings can be found on line for saw handles. I will be willing to help by making a drawing for you if needed. I will not charge for the drawing.

The wood is Sapele. I glue the drawing to the wood. I drill the holes in the wood by centering the drill bit on the hole. The drawing has the centers marked.

My next step will be rasping the shape to the lines on the drawing.

I will round the edges of the handle.It can be done with a rasp or router round over bit
.
I will saw the blade slot by placing a saw on a block of wood that is 1/2 the thickness of the handle minus 1/2 the thickness of the saw plate.

The slot will be cut by sliding the handle back and forth in contact with the saw teeth. This is shown in the video I mentioned earlier.

The saw nut holes will be placed by laying saw plate on the handle and center punching the location.

This is a handtool forum, but being lazy, I did use a band saw to cut the outline. I sawed the inside cuts with a bow saw that I made some years ago. It is the plan from "Tools For Working Wood" web site. I also used a drill press for cutting holes in the handle. I would have used my auger bits. but the largest I have is 1". I've never had much luck with with adjustable bits. I have two, but I haven't "conquered" them yet.

I think this will give you a feel for what's involved. It is a fun project.

[Phil Mueller]

Thanks Lowell! And thanks for the drawing offer. I have another handle I can use as a template, so I think I'm good there. I am planning to get the video. Sawing the blade slot is what causes me the most anxiety...appreciate the tip.
Thanks for taking the time and posting the progress.