Laguna 14/12 vs Rikon 10-326 [Archive] - Sawmill Creek Woodworking Community

Frederick Skelly

08-21-2016, 7:23 AM

IMO both cost more and are worth less than a Grizzly G0513.

You might be right Kevin. I'm curious to know what you're basing the opinion on - reading machine statistics, actual use (or testing) of all three, bad experiences with other machines from these importers, personal brand preference or something else?

Greg, I have the previous version of this Rikon bandsaw. From what I can tell, it's nearly the same as the one you are considering. I like mine. It does everything I ask of it. It had one minor issue early on and they talked me through how to fix it on the phone. I have not tried that Laguna. You could search the archives for opinions on it. Or, find a store near you and call to see if they will let you test drive one or both. There's no substitute for hands on. Grizzly has many fans. I just dont see them in stores around here and I'm not comfortable buying without at least looking over a demo model. Maybe you are.

Good luck!
Fred

Paul Saffold

08-21-2016, 8:07 AM

Greg,
If you show your location on your page you might be able to find members who will show you their machines. I just bought the 14-12 this week so don't have enough experience to tell you much. Go to youtube and search for each machine and you will find reviews by actual users. All 3 brands have those who love them or not. Good luck.

Greg Parrish

08-21-2016, 10:21 AM

I'm in the middle of nowhere in north florida and not near a store and do not have time to drive to one any time soon but worse than that I have found discount pricing online on each of the 3 via either a coupon code or other discount that expire on the 31st. I really need to make a decision quickly. The grizzly 10% coupon code was a public shared code so as soon as someone uses it that avenue is gone. And the laguna and rikon discount pricing all ends on the 31st.

I'm leaning towards the laguna but don't really know why. Maybe they have sexier marketing or something. I have 220 in the garage but using it means I would have to swap my table saw cord and my band saw cord between uses which would be a pain. I do not plan to drop another leg as my oneida v3000 is using my only other 220 drop in the garage. I'm wanting to be able to resaw up to 12", do general curved bandsaw cutting, split or cut logs for boards or turning material, etc. I think they would all be able to do this. I'm also wanting the highest quality unit for the price. I love my restored powermatic 66, I love my Oneida V3000, I love my powermatic 54a (even though I wish it were bigger), I like my dewalt 735 planer except for noise level, I like my dewalt miter saw, and I'm so so about my grizzly drill press as I feel like it's basically a rebadged harbor freight quality unit. I realize these are all imports but I'm sure one is better built than the others.

Looks like these would be my approximate pricing:

Laguna 14/12 $1,000 shipped to location
Rikon 10-326 $866 plus possible shipping fee of $75 to location but may be able to save shipping if I pick up at terminal
Grizzly G0513ANV $900 shipped to location
Grizzly G0513X2 $1100 shipped to location

Frederick Skelly

08-21-2016, 10:53 AM

SMC seems to have more readership on Monday morning than over the weekend, so with luck you'll get more first hand feedback. In the mean time, if you havent already, search the SMC archives for each saw and see what turns up. You can also do that at other WW web sites (like Wood Magazine's). Then a general google of each model. At least you'll have as much information as possible before deciding.

I do vaguely remember some negative feedback on that particular model of Laguna, but I cant recall if it was significant. I would say truthfully, that Rikon is the new guy on the block of the three. As is sometimes the case, they had some initial teething problems. Mine had (a minor) one too. Grizzly is a more established brand than Rikon but I cant say more than that - I dont own any of their stuff.

Good luck. Let us know what you buy!
Fred

Art Mann

08-21-2016, 11:34 AM

I have a Craftsman "professional" bandsaw, which is nothing more than a Rikon with different paint. It is older than the 10-326 but the design is similar. I also own the Laguna 14/Twelve. I have had lots of time to compare the two. Believe it or not, the Craftsman, which I bought for $350 as it was being discontinued, is a pretty good saw. It has one fatal flaw that the new Rikons have not fixed. The roller bearing blade guide mounts are sloppily made and are hard to adjust. The mechanics are such that the position of the bearings change as the lock screw is tightened. It becomes a trial and error exercise, which I hate. The laguna has ceramic blade guides, which I really like. I can go from different width blades in just a minute or two. Right now, I keep a thin blade on the Craftsman for scroll saw type work and use the Laguna with 1/2 inch Wood Slicer blade for resawing.

glenn bradley

08-21-2016, 11:46 AM

But it would mean giving up cast iron trunions, cast iron wheels and a resaw fence. The throat depth is a little more but not terribly much. All 3 only manage 12" height. all 3 are imports. What would make the 513 or 513 anniversary version better? The version with cast iron wheels and trunions cost more. Thanks.

I think anyone who has had good success with a machine tends to feel it is a good choice; "better" is subjective to some point. I have the no-longer-offered tweener G0513X. It is a G0513X2 without the CI trunnions that were added when reviewers pointed out their absence. I could upgrade for about $100 but, the CI trunnions use the same hardened metal teeth as mine and I have never noticed the lack of CI.

I do like the mass of the CI wheels but, that again can be subjective. Table size is close and they all will tension a 3/4" blade which is as large as I've ever needed (I actually prefer a 1/2" for resawing). Make a list of the features that are most important to you and this should thin the herd and allow you to make a decision. The rest of us may value different features and cannot specifically answer for you.

Art Mann

08-21-2016, 12:22 PM

(I actually prefer a 1/2" for resawing).

That is also my preference and I think it is worth repeating. Do not feel like you are better off with a 3/4 inch resaw blade on these small saws. That may very well be a false assumption.

Doug Hepler

08-21-2016, 12:50 PM

I'll chime in to say that, like Art Mann, I had a Craftsman Professional 14" that was very similar to the Rikon. Now I have the Laguna 14/12. Both are excellent saws. I could adjust both saws to cut drift-free (I'm a disciple of Michael Fortune when it comes to band saws.) They did everything I needed. I do not miss the dual speed that the Craftsman offered. I do miss the storage cabinet under the saw that the Craftsman had. The upper wheel bearing had to be replaced after about a year. The guide bearings were a bit of a pain to adjust. Still, excellent value for money.

The Laguna is a nicer saw by far. It has been my go-to saw for over a year now and I am very happy with it. It's more solid. The dual trunions and CI table really stay put. I like the ceramic guides and the dual-purpose fence. The Laguna can tension a 3/4" blade although I could resaw just fine with a 1/2" blade. I like the 12/14 blade release lever. The tension wheel is more convenient. Mobility base is very convenient. The light is not as useful because the upper guide assembly puts the work in a shadow and I keep bumping my forehead on it. The table height on the 14/12 is a bit low for me (I'm 6-1)

The Laguna did not come with both wheels co-planar. I feel that this was a serious flaw, but I was able to correct it in an hour or so. It's a bear to assemble unless you have help. Customer service was first rate for my questions when the saw was new and later when I had questions about using a 1/8" blade.

Doug

richard poitras

08-21-2016, 12:54 PM

I have 220 in the garage but using it means I would have to swap my table saw cord and my band saw cord between uses which would be a pain.

Gregg, one option I have done when using 220 is put multiple 220 plugs on one circuit and plug in say 3 machines. I know the circuits can only handle one machine at a time but I only use one machine at a time anyways. That way you never have to go back and forth switching cords and having to plug them in.
Also I have had all 3 brands of machines and my recommendation would be the Laguna.
Good luck.

Kevin Groenke

08-21-2016, 12:56 PM

You might be right Kevin. I'm curious to know what you're basing the opinion on - reading machine statistics, actual use (or testing) of all three, bad experiences with other machines from these importers, personal brand preference or something else?

3" of additional throat depth is not insignificant.

I have a G0513 at work and another at home and we have a Rikon 10-326 at work (a student shop in a design college). The frame on the Rikon is not rigid which can lead to blade tracking issues (if you push on the table with one hand and the upper blade housing with the other you can deflect or twist without considerable effort - maybe they've fixed this, our saw is at least 5 years old). If Rikon has fixed the deflection it looks like there are some other improvements (fence, table tilt crank, guide bearings) that might make it stronger.

The cast iron goodies on the X2 versions of the G0513 are worth the added cost. If you don't get the resaw fence in particular, you will probably want to add it later.

I have not used the Laguna or even studied it closely, perennial support complaints about Laguna, and very mixed reviews of the ceramic guides come to mind any time I consider their equipment.

Greg Parrish

08-21-2016, 1:04 PM

All good points. I have been thinking about whether the additional features one saw adds over the other are real considerations. What I mean is just what you said in that if I immediately start adding or replacing items like guides or fences or what not then is it worth it. IE, the laguna comes with what appears to me to be a nice fence and nice ceramic guides but if they aren't as nice as the aftermarket ones and people end up changing them out then it may not represent the value I'm giving it. As you point out the Grizzly G513 isn't a good value if you end up buying the cast iron stuff later to make it the X2 version as it will cost way more. The x2 adds cast wheels, grunions and resaw fence which would run nearly $500 after the fact but add $200 at time of purchase.

I'm keeping my eye on craigslist but many of the listings are for old, old, old saws that are in poor condition; super small saws, or huge saws. The nice saws I'm finding are just not really priced low enough to not also consider all of these as it appears most listings are only a hundred or two less than new when the saw looks as new.

Lots to consider. Thanks for all of the comments so far and those to follow.

Frederick Skelly

08-21-2016, 6:10 PM

3" of additional throat depth is not insignificant.

I have a G0513 at work and another at home and we have a Rikon 10-326 at work (a student shop in a design college). The frame on the Rikon is not rigid which can lead to blade tracking issues (if you push on the table with one hand and the upper blade housing with the other you can deflect or twist without considerable effort - maybe they've fixed this, our saw is at least 5 years old). If Rikon has fixed the deflection it looks like there are some other improvements (fence, table tilt crank, guide bearings) that might make it stronger.

The cast iron goodies on the X2 versions of the G0513 are worth the added cost. If you don't get the resaw fence in particular, you will probably want to add it later.

I have not used the Laguna or even studied it closely, perennial support complaints about Laguna, and very mixed reviews of the ceramic guides come to mind any time I consider their equipment.

Thanks for the update Kevin. It helps to have this background.

Greg, FWIW, I have not experienced any problem resawing on my Rikon (though I havent tried resawing a 10" thick oak timber either).

Greg Parrish

08-21-2016, 6:28 PM

Thanks Frederick.

I've made a few offers on some used 513's within a few hours drive of me but no response. One popped up in last few hours about 3 hours away with resaw fence and shop fox rolling base for $550 in good looking shape. I emailed that I would take it 4 hours ago right after it listed but haven't heard a peep so I can only assume it probably sold and someone beat me to it. If tomorrow I've not gotten any response I'll assume it gone and move on back to considering the new ones. I'm about 3/4 way to deciding to order the laguna 14/12 with a 1/4" laguna starter blade and going from there. It seems to have the most options on it from the get go for the price and will probably meet my needs I'm guessing since I'm a home hobbiest woodworker.

Regardless, it's easy to get caught up on the Grizzly page though as when I start looking at the 513, my eye wonders and I start thinking for only $200 more I can get the 513X2. Then I start thinking for only $300 more I can get the 513X2F. Etc, etc. :)

richard poitras

08-21-2016, 10:45 PM

I'm keeping my eye on craigslist but many of the listings are for old, old, old saws that are in poor condition; super small saws, or huge saws. The nice saws I'm finding are just not really priced low enough to not also consider all of these as it appears most listings are only a hundred or two less than new when the saw looks as new.

Greg where are you located as someone reading may have a saw for sale or know of a deal.

Patrick Curry

08-21-2016, 11:14 PM

I have a Laguna LT3000 18", which I believe is very close to what you're looking at except for size so I'll chime in.

The guides are fantastic. Easy to adjust and durable. The saw is just 'well built' and has been a joy to use over the past 3 yrs.

The customer service was simply over the top. Had some bad blades from another manufacturer but I misdiagnosed the problem. Their customer service department was easy to reach, spent an hour on the phone with me before they determined the blades were my problem (from another manufacturer). Discounted their resaw King for me and then called back the day after the resaw King arrived just to make sure the problem was fixed.

I have an 8" grizzly jointer that I've been happy with but that's more due to the low price/value compared to my options in the 8" jointer category. The difference between the two machines in fit and finish is significant...but so was the price

Greg Parrish

08-22-2016, 2:23 PM

Greg where are you located as someone reading may have a saw for sale or know of a deal.

I'm in north central Florida. I reached out to someone via email from Jacksonville FL CL saying I wanted the saw not 1 hour after they listed a nice looking Grizzly 0513 with resaw fence and shop fox mobile base for $550. At this point I've not heard a single response after 3 emails and they don't have a phone number listed. I can only assume that they have sold it or that the emails are going into their spam folder. Not sure what else to do to find out but it looked like a nice saw for the money.

Greg Parrish

08-23-2016, 2:31 PM

Okay, after looking and reading until my head is getting dizzy, how about between these two models:

Grizzly G0513X2F or Laguna 14BX 1.75hp

I know they are not exactly comparable in that one is 1.75hp and the other is 2hp and one is 17 throat and the other 14. But price wise they are similar due to deals I'm finding.

I'm assuming this level Laguna is made in Taiwan just like the grizzly?
The brake design on one any better than the other? Both are foot brakes. The laguna looks to be a disc brake design but not sure about the Grizzly.
The Grizzly is 100 lbs heavier so I'm guessing it is probably a little more stable but don't know for a fact.
Similar looking magnetic switches on both
Both include a resew fence, cast iron wheels, cast iron trunions

What am I missing in comparing these two saws? Is the grizzly built better than my little grizzly 14" floor standing drill press that I feel is harbor freight quality? For light home/hobby use with general all around needs and a desire to do some resawing, are these both way overkill? I just hate buying things this big and immediately wishing I went bigger/better. I avoided that on my table saw but didn't on my 6" jointer.

Sorry for the ramble.

Glenn de Souza

08-23-2016, 2:51 PM

In a situation like yours, narrowed down to two choices that you have well studied, flip a coin.

When it's in the air, you'll know which one you're hoping for.

That's the one to buy and not look back.

Doug Hepler

08-23-2016, 3:18 PM

Amen, Glenn

Greg Parrish

08-23-2016, 8:23 PM

Geoff Crimmins

08-23-2016, 9:21 PM

In the past Laguna used saw-duty rather than continuous-duty horsepower ratings. If they are still doing that, then there will be a bigger difference than you would expect between the 1.75hp Laguna and the 2hp Grizzly. I have a 1950s Delta bandsaw with a 13-amp 1hp motor. An internet search shows that the Laguna 1-3/4hp motor is a 14-amp motor. I'll let you figure that out. Let us know how you like your knew Grizzly saw; I expect you're going to like it.

Gary Cunningham

08-23-2016, 9:31 PM

I have the Rikon. As my first bandsaw my frame of reference is limited.

I can say that if you loosen the tension knob too much the 'nut plate' will fall off the threaded rod.
Then you will need to remove the top wheel and futz around to get it back together.

Also, not sure if it because of the design, or mine is wonky, but to square the resaw fence to the blade requires shims under the leading edge and the drift adjuster.

Frederick Skelly

08-23-2016, 9:44 PM

Hope I don't regret it but I ordered the ............................

Grizzly G0513X2F with the Shop Fox mobile base. I found someone's 10% off coupon on another forum which helped greatly.

I suspect the Laguna is a more refined saw but to get one with a brake would have been another $200 more than the Grizzly and it would have been smaller. I didn't order any blades yet since it comes with one but I'll need to get a couple of blades ordered too to have a resaw blade and a decent scroll blade.

You chose with good reason based on what matters to you most Greg. No need for regrets. Be happy about it and excited - you have a brand new, nicely-equipped bandsaw coming. That rocks man! :):):)

Let us know when it arrives and how you like it!
Fred

David Kumm

08-24-2016, 8:25 AM

My concern would be the ability to resaw 12" on any of those saws. If only once in a while and you go slow you will be OK, but if you plan to do much, there are few saws in the 16-17" range that do that well. Each inch of resaw adds issues. Dave

lee cox

08-24-2016, 10:41 AM

I had a Rikon 10-325 which I sold. I looked at the new Rikon 10-326 at Woodcraft. I liked the guide setup better than my 10-325. I also looked at the Laguna 1412 and I liked the Laguna 14SUV better. I ended up buying a used Minmax S45 for less money than these other bandsaws. It is a light weight Minimax which fits in my small shop well for a 18 inch bandsaw. The table height matches my table saw height and out feed table. I push some small oak and cedar logs through the bandsaw and needed more table support. The S45 is very smooth has a bigger motor and larger wheels than my old Rikon 10-325 which probably holds true for the other small 14 inch bandsaws.

Greg Parrish

08-24-2016, 6:52 PM

I realize the one I ordered is not a commercial 12" resaw machine but for my intermittent use in a home hobby shop it should be just fine. It will certainly do way better than the one I have now, since I don't have one. :)

Most any band saw would have gotten me started but I wanted to buy one that would hold me for a long while with the most features that I could afford and justify for the price. An 18" laguna or even a 14 SUV laguna would have been nice but at a much higher price. The 14BX laguna was nice too but again $200 more than the G0513X2F Grizzly that I ordered. I didn't think about it until now but I could have gotten an 18" Rikon 10-341 for a little bit cheaper than the Grizzly (Maybe $60) but I have no clue how it would compare and it was missing the brake feature I decided I wanted.

Anyway, I'm sure the Grizzly will be just fine for my needs.