Help on Jointer Choice

[Jeff Keith]

I've narrowed it down to the Oliver 12" (model 4260) Parallelogram Jointer or the Grizzly 12" (model G9860ZX) Parallelogram Jointer. Both have helical cutterheads, and from what I can gather both are Taiwanese built machines. The Oliver has a Baldor motor and the Grizzly motor is unspecified. The Grizzly is around $800.00 cheaper, with a slightly shorter overall bed (which is actually a plus for me), and about 500 lbs less - another plus.

I was really hoping for a Minimax FS41 Classic, but for various reasons that's not in the cards - please don't ask, it has nothing to do with Minimax. Anyway, I'm leaning toward the Grizzly, but the Baldor motor on the Oliver is nudging me in their direction.

Thanks!

[Andrew Hughes]

There's a lot of grizzly tool owners on his site.I doubt anyone will suggest the Oliver but me.Baldor motor and longer tables are more important than the saving.
But wow a whole 800 sure wouldn't want to be in your shoes.:)

[Jeff Keith]

There's a lot of grizzly tool owners on his site.I doubt anyone will suggest the Oliver but me.Baldor motor and longer tables are more important than the saving.
But wow a whole 800 sure wouldn't want to be in your shoes.:)

The shipping for the Oliver may reduce the savings a bit (haven't checked), but yeah the Baldor motor is a big push for me. The difference in tables is about 8 inches, and shorter is better for me, but 8 inches isn't going to to put me over the edge.

[Andrew Hughes]

I had a 8 inch Oliver. With a Oliver HH head it was 3 inch diameter 6 rows of nine inserts.Total 54 inserts.Its motor was not a Baldor and was very noisy after several years.
It cut nice but I like straight knives better.
How many inserts does the bear have?

[Jeff Keith]

84. The Oliver has 44. Good catch!

[glenn bradley]

Sparsely populated insert heads can be suboptimal. Do the cutter paths overlap well? Just thinking out loud. I have a few Grizzly badged 2and3HP motors that have been running for years without issue.

[John C Bush]

I've had the Griz 0609X--12"er-- for several years and it is a great machine. Not sure of the differences with the 9860ZX, but the 0609X is a real workhorse. I mill lots of rough stock @ the full 12"es and there is plenty of power from their standard motor--3hp I think. nice long beds as well. Of course now I want a 16"er!!

[Robin Frierson]

One factor to consider is which company is most likely to go out of business. I bought a 16 inch joiner from Wilke, a Bridgewood, and they went out of business less than a year later. And this was a company that of been around a long time. The new Oliver has been out for a while now but I think they would be more likely to go out of business that grizzly. Thing you want is parts 10-15 years from now..both machines look great. I think you will be happy with either one.

[Marc Burt]

I agree with this logic and apply it to my own purchase process. It's strange to live in a world where Grizzly is a stalwart in the industry....but then again the same logic would've made Delta look like a winner 10 years ago and look at the miserable death they suffered!

Anyway if you prefer the lower weight and the shorter beds AND it's $800 less then to me I think you should go with Grizzly. In gets you more of the things you want and keeps money in your pocket.

I keep looking at those new Oliver machines too though...

[rudy de haas]

Other things being equal.. the motor choice may come down to your expectations about the machine's duty cycle and probable longevity in your working environment. If this is the key issue for you, why not contact both companies and ask them what the their motors are designed to handle?

(P.S.I'd bet they're about the same.)

[Jeff Keith]

Thanks everyone for your helpful comments.

Glen - It looks like the Grizzly cutters overlap much better than the Oliver.

John - I had considered the 0609X first, but being made in China in a non-ISO 9001 factory makes me nervous. It's far less of a crapshoot with the Z-series and their Taiwanese, ISO 9001 origins. Just the idea of having to hassle with potential quality-control issues is something I'll pay to avoid.

Robin - Good point. I hadn't thought of that.

Marc - Yep.... I was looking for someone to give me a good reason to choose the Oliver over the Grizzly.

rudy - Great idea. Thank you!

[David Kumm]

I think you are on your own here. The things you really need to know on a jointer, rating of the cast iron, specifications for how far out of flat, quality of motor, bearings, electricals, etc will not get answered until you tear down each machine or find someone who has. My motor guy can tell me in two minutes how good a motor is but I'm still clueless and I've bought and rehabbed dozens of machines. Whatever you buy, check it over, put a good long straightedge on the tables, see if it keeps its settings when you dump a timber you can barely lift and you will learn what is important to you. There are good and bad examples of every model made so it is a crap shoot unless you can see and test what you are buying. If it makes wood flat you are golden. Dave

[Andrew Hughes]

Huh I'm surprised David,You didn't tell the Op to buy a used machine.
Are you feeling ok?:confused:

I was going to myself but I give up and gave in go with the flow.:o

Aj

[Mike Heidrick]

I have a 12" DJ30 Delta jointer with straight knives made that was in Taiwan. It has an Asian motor and straight knives with no idea what kind of cast iron and it was shipped to me sight unseen and its 3phase (I put a FM50 TECO VFD on it). ITS AMAZING!! You wont loose in either of those choices. Id go Grizzly personally. I keep looking at the Oliver WBS and cant see a reason to buy it over a Grizzly or ShopFox if I decide to buy an Asian WBS.

[David Kumm]

[QUOTE=Andrew Hughes;2583171]Huh I'm surprised David,You didn't tell the Op to buy a used machine.
Are you feeling ok?:confused:

I was going to myself but I give up and gave in go with the flow.:o

I have a 166 in storage so that would have been tacky. Mike, the DJ 30 was originally an Invicta before moving to Taiwan and a solid machine. A step up from the Oliver ( Sunhill ). Dave

[Kelby Van Patten]

That Grizzly has a 4" dust port, and the Oliver has a 6" port. That's going to make for a pretty significant difference in how effectively you pick up the dust.

I haven't used either of those machines, but I have a 12" Laguna jointer with a helical cutterhead, and it sure is nice to have that much capacity. Mine has the 88" bed, like the Oliver. While it does take some space, the length is nice to have when you are trying to face joint a long 12" wide board.

[John TenEyck]

OK, I'll say it - get a used machine. Find yourself a used MiniMax, Hammer, or Felder, or some old NA iron, or even a Grizzly, and you will never regret it. It'll cost no more than half the price of new. I'm not sold on the need for helical heads on a jointer, so that made my decision to go used easy. When you buy used you get to see and test the machine and walk away if you don't like what you see. When you buy new, you generally don't get to see your machine until you already own it.

If you buy new, I wouldn't let the Baldor motor sway me one way or the other. The Grizzly is $800 cheaper. A new motor can't cost that much, and chances are you'll never need one. If you are hobbiest you almost certainly never will.

John

[Jeff Keith]

Buying used is easier said than done. I've been looking on Craigslist, on the industrial machine websites, eBay, etc., for nearly a year now. Plenty of 6 and 8 inch machines out there, and some 12 and 16 inch, but the problem is finding a decent 12" single phase that doesn't need a ton of restoration and doesn't have the cost of a used Northfield – my dream jointer. Yes, you can get a Northfield in single phase.

Anyway, I've gotten close and even missed a few, but that configuration is hard to come by. I've almost pulled the trigger on few 3 phase machines, but the cost of getting one in working order – phase converter, restoration, and just getting it to my location always makes me hesitant and then they're gone.

Nevertheless, I'm still looking. In fact, I recently picked up a very nice mid-50s 12" Powermatic planer in great condition off of Craigslist less than 15 miles from where I live, and made a new friend to boot. There was no hesitation on that one.

[David Kumm]

For about $250 you can put a VFD on a three phase motor. Just budget it into the deal. Much better and fewer problems with three phase. Dave

[Bradley Gray]

+1 for finding a used machine for all the reasons others have listed, especially seeing the actual machine before you buy. If you get on the mailing lists for some of the industrial auction houses one will show up quickly.

Old school wood shops are always closing - I get a post card a couple times a month and there's almost always a nice old joiner - they just don't wear out.

[Jim Andrew]

I have had a Go609 for several years, added a byrd cutterhead, but would go with the grizzly helical as they have straight cutters, and you would not lose the ability to cut a rabbit joint, but the only trouble I have had is a set screw coming loose on the motor pulley. Might put some locktite on it next time. I use the jointer to flatten rough sawn boards, and it is a beast. Get a good push block for safety.