Wood dye suggestions

[Zahid Naqvi]

Lately I have been thinking about trying dye on some of my projects. Any suggestions on what works and what doesn't. The current stock of wood is limited to Poplar, had Maple and curly Maple.
The colors I am looking for are black/ebony, red cherry, and a dark amber for the curly. Open to suggestions.

[Bob Tate]

The very best I have been able to find is the WoodBurst stains. They have a web site www.woodburst.com (http://www.woodburst.com) but I got mine from WoodCraft. A little expensive but they work well. They have a excellent variety of colors.

[Jim Becker]

I use the TransTint dyes from Homestead Finishing (Jeff Jewitt) I typically stay with water soluable dyes as they are more "forgiving" in application and then seal them with an application of de-waxed shellac of the appropriate "color" for the project. Alcohol soluable dyes flash off way to fast for me...'need to be sprayed, IMHO. But I do keep some around for tinting shellac to be used as a toner.

[Michael Ballent]

David Marks uses metal acid dye to ebonize wood... I have no experience using it nor where to get it... Perhaps someone else here has used it.

[Dan Stuewe]

(9/24/2005) Ignore this post!!!! The information contained in this post is incorrect.

I don't have experiance with this, but last night when I was flipping through Bob Flexner's "Understanding Wood Finishing" I read that dye won't highlight the curl in figured maple since it absorbs evenly and the curl is due to different densities of the wood. Now I could be mixing up something since it was pretty late last night (I'll double check this when I get home). If someone wants to dispute this, feel free. Like I said, this info is based on late night reading. :o

[Jim Becker]

Well, Dan...a lot of folks seem to apply dye to figured maple and lightly sand it off. (The more pourous areas of the figure absorb the dye deeper) then they dye again, sometimes with a different shade, even! But I've never done it yet, so maybe I'm misrepresenting the process.

[Steve Schoene]

Woodworkers Supply carries a LARGE selection of water based dyes that judging from the naming system are likely made by Lockwood, a major manufacturer with an excellent reputation. Transtint is good. Highland hardware carries dyes from a European maker Asti, which includes a line that is specially designed for large pored woods such as oak which some time resist water based dye.

The only downside I see for the water based dyes is that they can raise grain. The key is to experiment. If at first the dye is to strong just dilute it. You can lighten dye that turns out a bit too dark with water. You can adjust colors either by mixing the liquid dyes, or by over-dying with another color. If its just all wrong, you can use chorine bleach and remove the dye completely. I'd splurge and use distilled water from the grocery store in the of chance that your tap water has strange stuff in it.

[Alan Turner]

I use dyes to highlight figure, and think it works quite well. If Flexner disagrees with this, then I disagee with him. Jeff Jewitt recommends this approach, and I have seen him use and teach it in a class I took several years ago. A surface stain would tend to kill the figure as it lays on top of the wood more so than a penetrating dye. A gallon of distilled water water is always on hand. Best $1 you can spend. Also, use this same water to raise the grain, and then sand it back with 320, before using the dye, and you will have far less grain-raising with the dye than if you skip this step, esp on a tight wood like maple, but also on mahogany. This hand sanding also catches some things that might have otherwise have been missed, which is handy. I prefer the layered approach to dyes, generally, and oft start with a dye on the yellow side as a base. BLO over the dye finishes the process, and thne you can finish with just aobut anything, from dewaxed shellac to any of the varnish oils.

[Steve Schoene]

One more point on using dyes. Dyes can look AWFUL when dry but before top coating. The final color under a top coat will be more like what you see with the wet dye. You can judge colors by wiping on a bit of naptha or mineral spirits.

I like Alan's layer'd approach. A base dye coat can then be partially sealed with a shellac wash coat and a second dye color applied that will leave some of the base as a muted highlight. Example: a awful bright yellow on mahogany will, when partially sealed and then dyed with a brown mahogany dye, end up with golden highlights as seen on antiques.

[Frank Pellow]

I have never used dyes but I am planning on making several building blocks for children out of scrap wood, mostly cedar and pine. This set of dyes:

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=20082&cat=1,190,42996

is available from Lee Valley. Do you think that they are worth the investment (even more on Canadian $)? Also, I would appreciate any advice that anyone cares to give about finishing blocks with these dyes.

[Jim Becker]

Good dyes, Frank, when you want bright colors. Perfect for your application!

[Frank Pellow]

Good dyes, Frank, when you want bright colors. Perfect for your application!
What would you suggest using as follow-up to the dye?

[Jim Becker]

You could use any finish you prefer. I'd probably use water bourne acrylic or shellac, but those are the things I happen to use on my projects normally. There is no "safety" issue with any finish available today...they are all non-toxic once cured. So if you really feel inclined to use the readily available "evil" polyurethane varnish...no problem... :D (The water bourne products generally will add less yellow to the blocks as would lacquer, such as Deft in the spray can or other NC lacquers)

[Zahid Naqvi]

Good discussions, I am off to Dallas next week and perhaps can pick some supplies at woodcraft or rockler.
Alan, Jim, thanks for the ideas. I might ask you for some more advice when it gets closer to project time. Dennis P. has his own favorite dye brand which he has used with great success on curly maple.

[Dan Stuewe]

My appologies to everyone here and to Bob Flexner. I completely misspoke in my earlier post. The section of his book that I was remembering had to do with gel stains not working well with figured wood. In fact he coments on dyes working well to highlight the figure.

Again, my apologies.

[Earl Kelly]

My favorite dye are the Arti brand. Highland Hardware sells them, they have some oustanding colors. The rosewood can make mahogany look very close to real rosewood, at least from across the room.

[Pete Bradley]

I've been using TransTint and I think I'm finally getting the hang of it. The colors are great and you can mix colors in small batches drop by drop to get the ratios right. What works:



raise grain with plain water, let dry, and lightly sand smooth
mix dye with water only. Alcohol dries faster but it causes the color to go badly uneven in many cases (I think this is due to surface tension, but not sure)
Dye both sides of anything that could warp (which is virtually everything) at the same time
As with any finish, test the entire process from sanding through the final topcoat on scraps of the same wood efore committing anything to the real piece.
I'm wrapping up a Craftsman style table that is colored with dye followed by pigmented gel stain. I'll post some pics when it's done.

Pete

[Jim Becker]

raise grain with plain water,

Be sure to use distilled water, both for the grain raising and for mixing water soluble dye.

[Pete Bradley]

Be sure to use distilled water,
Good point. Some people's water may have side effects. Happily mine works straight from the tap.

Pete