Changing brake fluid?

[Wade Lippman]

According to my scheduled maintenance on my Subaru Impreza, I am past due on changing brake fluid?
What is that likely to cost. ($5, $50, $500?)
Does anything else have to be done at the same time, or is it like an oil change?

Just want to be not totally ignorant when I call for an appointment.

[Matt Day]

Just ask for a brake fluid flush, will probably cost $100 or so. Or spend that money on speed bleeders and DIY. It makes sense to do it when you're replacing pads too.

How many miles on your subie? Some people never change it, and others follow the maintenance schedule of every 30k. I change it about every 50k, which reminds me I should do it again since I'm at 115k. '04 Forester XT

[Wade Lippman]

They say to do it 3 years or 30,000 miles. I am at 6 years, 32,000 miles.
Seems like it is about time, thanks.

My Mazda CX3 never has to have its brake fluid changed; except in Canada or Mexico, and then it is every 30,000 miles. Maybe US brake fluid is better?

[Jim Koepke]

One of the reasons for changing brake fluid is it being a hygroscopic material meaning it can absorb water.

Moisture inside the cylinders and other components can cause corrosion. Not something one wants in a vital part of their automotive systems.

jtk

[Ken Fitzgerald]

One of the reasons for changing brake fluid is it being a hygroscopic material meaning it can absorb water.

Moisture inside the cylinders and other components can cause corrosion. Not something one wants in a vital part of their automotive systems.

jtk

I've also read that moisture in the brake fluid can cause braking failure because it can turn to steam.

[Wayne Lomman]

Yeah, always read that you should change brake fluid periodically. In real life? I do all my own maintenance (too far from town) and I have never changed brake fluid in my life and never had a brake failure or loss of efficiency. Brakes get tested every year for roadworthy. Average year is 80,000km/50,000miles for our vehicle. Maybe they never get cold enough to get condensation. Cheers.

[Chuck Wintle]

One of the reasons for changing brake fluid is it being a hygroscopic material meaning it can absorb water.

Moisture inside the cylinders and other components can cause corrosion. Not something one wants in a vital part of their automotive systems.

jtk
I never touched the brake fluid on any of my cars and never had trouble. On a closed system like brakes how would moisture get in? Thats my question.

[Mike Cutler]

Wade

This is a very easy job to do. A vacuum, or pressure operated, rig would cost you less than the cost of the shop work if you have the confidence to do the work yourself.
In my opinion though, a car with only 32,000 miles could probably skip a full flush. You've probably never had to add brake fluid to your system, and your pads should be good to go unless you've been auto crossing it. 30,000 miles on a truck used to pull trailers, or 5th wheelers, on a regular basis would be a little different story. It's subject to the conditions the vehicle is driven in.
The only "tricky" part involved, is ensuring that the ABS controller will get the air evacuated from it. A dealership will put the ABS system into a mode that simulates the car having the ABS system activated to make sure any entrapped air is bled from the ABS controller.
Each car will cost a different amount depending on transmission type and the configuration of the master cylinder, and what the shop considers a "Brake flush".
In the home garage setting, as long as you don't let air get into the system while flushing it. It should not be an issue.

Brake fluid is brake fluid. There are different types, DOT3 and DOT 4, and different countries will have an equivalent rating. US brake fluid is no better or worse, than any other brake fluid.

Other than checking pads, rotors , and looking for rotting lines,when bleeding brakes, there's not much else to really look for. If you trust the place you're taking it too, have them check your upper and lower control arm bushings and tie rod ends, strut boots, etc. 6 years of Upstate New York winters can have an effect on your soft steering components. The rubber parts can harden and split due to the cold and road salt.

Be warned though, that brake work is easy "bread and butter" work with high profits for a shop/dealership. they all seem to want to push for something additional. ( I used to work in a tire shop that specialized in brakes and front end repairs/alignment. )
One more thing to ask, if it's going to a dealership is, are they going to to do the work, or sub it out? Some dealerships will sub it out to a local shop and avoid tying up their lifts, leaving them free for bigger, more profitable, work. ( My FIL was the service manager for 35 years at a BMW/Toyota dealership in Hamden Ct.;))

[david a graham]

For a Toyota the local shop runs about $150 for a flush.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

A lot of what you need to do as far as brakes is determined IMO by your usage. I live in a city where my home is 800' higher in elevation than the main part of town. When I leave town, I climb 2,000' in elevation in any direction I go. Thus, my brake usage may well be more than those who live in flat country.

In a '83 full sized Blazer we bought new, the brakes failed twice coming down a 6 mile grade that drops 2,000 into the valley. Each time my wife was driving. There have been 9 truckers killed when their brakes failed on that grade in the 34 years we have been here. Once as I was returning from an elk hunting trip, the brakes failed on me coming off a mountain with loaded logging trucks around me on the 2 lane gravel road. The car was still under warrantee. Eventually it got out of warrantee and I took over the brake jobs. We never had another brake failure. I went to some extremes. I changed fluid every 3 years. When ever I replaced pads, I had the rotors resurfaced.

We had a lot of transmission failures in that Blazer and eventually, we got rid of it.

[Brian Henderson]

Honestly, newer cars hardly need anything but oil changed very often. Still, whenever I change brake pads, I siphon out as much brake fluid as I can and then refill from a sealed bottle and I haven't had a problem. I don't know if it's necessary to suck every drop of fluid out of the system, I've never had a problem at all and honestly don't trust commercial shops since the time that a shop accidentally refilled my power steering with brake fluid and ruined the whole system. They had to pay to replace pretty much everything.

[Mike Cutler]

A lot of what you need to do as far as brakes is determined IMO by your usage. I live in a city where my home is 800' higher in elevation than the main part of town. When I leave town, I climb 2,000' in elevation in any direction I go. Thus, my brake usage may well be used more than those who live in flat country.

In a '83 full sized Blazer we bought new, the brakes failed twice coming down a 6 mile grade that drops 2,000 into the valley. Eventually it got out of warrantee and I took over the brake jobs. We never had another brake failure. I went to some extremes. I changed fluid every 3 years. When ever I replaced pads, I had the rotors resurfaced.
.

Yikes!!!:eek:,:eek:
I think Id have taken over at the first failure. That had to be scary as all heck for your wife. Wow!!
I bought a used GMC Sierra Denali last fall, first US made vehicle I've purchased in almost 40 years, and I hate the brakes on it. To squishy, with very little progressive feel, and I don't think I would trust them with the horse trailer on a grade.
They're definitely going to be changed out. Probably going to a bigger brake rotor and calipers also, unless I can find an OEM size I think I can trust.
If you don't mind my asking Ken, what is your brake configuration?

[Wade Lippman]

I changed the brake fluid. $80.

But two questions:
1) I also got the spark plugs changed at the same time in my 4 cylinder car. I was a little surprised at $120, but since the brake fluid was reasonable, I figured the spark plugs was also.
Was it?

2) Neither of my Mazdas EVER require the brake fluid to be changed. Should I anyhow? Maybe their brake lines are more durable than the Subaru's?

[Brian Henderson]

1) I also got the spark plugs changed at the same time in my 4 cylinder car. I was a little surprised at $120, but since the brake fluid was reasonable, I figured the spark plugs was also.
Was it?

They don't just change the plugs, they change the wires too. That's a pretty reasonable price for that.

[Chris Padilla]

Yikes!!!:eek:,:eek:
I think Id have taken over at the first failure. That had to be scary as all heck for your wife. Wow!!
I bought a used GMC Sierra Denali last fall, first US made vehicle I've purchased in almost 40 years, and I hate the brakes on it. To squishy, with very little progressive feel, and I don't think I would trust them with the horse trailer on a grade.
They're definitely going to be changed out. Probably going to a bigger brake rotor and calipers also, unless I can find an OEM size I think I can trust.
If you don't mind my asking Ken, what is your brake configuration?You sound like you know brakes on vehicles but I wonder if you've flushed/bled those brakes due to the squishy feel or is it simply the design of the braking system on that vehicle? I got a touch more response on my old E39 BMW when I swapped out the rubber lines with SS lines but I wouldn't say it was significant but then again the brakes on it were quite good stock.

[Gordon Eyre]

I have an Infinity that I bought new and it now has 230,000 miles on it. To the best of my recollection I have never changed the brake fluid on it. My friend seems to be changing his often so I said to him "you seem to be addicted to brake fluid" and he said "no, I can stop anytime I want."

[Mike Cutler]

You sound like you know brakes on vehicles but I wonder if you've flushed/bled those brakes due to the squishy feel or is it simply the design of the braking system on that vehicle? I got a touch more response on my old E39 BMW when I swapped out the rubber lines with SS lines but I wouldn't say it was significant but then again the brakes on it were quite good stock.

Chris When I was in the Navy I used to work part time at privately owned Brake Shop. Of course, "back then" disc brakes were not as common as now, most cars were running drums all around, or drums in the rear and discs up front.
I've already flushed the brake system, and I test drove a new GMC truck and they felt the same. On a hard stop, you can lock them up and initiate ABS, but I'd like a little more of a progressive feel. I'll more than likely end up adding a brake booster. I'll also try a different pad/rotor combination.
I like messing about with cars, so it'll be fun to experiment.

I've owned Beemers ,and currently have two Mini Coopers, so I'm familiar with BMW's brakes. The John Cooper Works I have can hurt you with it's brakes, and they're OEM. I have Ceramics on the Cooper S, and they're definitely a softer brake, but they're also single piston calipers, and a smaller pad.The JCW has dual piston caliper sand a larger pad.

I gotta get back to wood working though first. I've been on a "not self imposed hiatus" for about 2-3 years, and it's time to get back in the shop. I bought a shaper and Carvex from the classifieds in the interim, and I can't wait to give them a whirl. That Carvex is really super sweet, and all I've done with it so far, is cut up some pallets for kindling to start the wood stove.:D

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Yikes!!!:eek:,:eek:
I think Id have taken over at the first failure. That had to be scary as all heck for your wife. Wow!!

If you don't mind my asking Ken, what is your brake configuration?

Mike, IIRC it was front disc, rear drums. We bought it new and traded it in less than 5 years. That was the first year they introduced the 700R4 transmission. Even though the first 4 transmissions were covered under warrantee, when the 5th transmission developed a problem, I traded it for a used '86 4 -Runner. The full sized Blazer had 41,000 miles on it when I got rid of it. The 4-Runner was 1 year old with 19,000 miles on it. We drove it 16 years and 160,00 miles. I changed the timing chain and the alternator in the 4-Runner which in my opinion is to be expected.

In those days, I repaired my own vehicles.

[Wade Lippman]

If you trust the place you're taking it too, have them check your upper and lower control arm bushings and tie rod ends, strut boots, etc. 6 years of Upstate New York winters can have an effect on your soft steering components. The rubber parts can harden and split due to the cold and road salt.



The Subaru (the car I was asking about) got the rubber components replaced as a recall last year; and 4 year old CX9 will have it's control arms replaced in a recall later this year. So I ought to be good.:rolleyes:

I just hate the uncertainty over this. I mean really; why does the CX9 never need the brake fluid or rear differential fluid changed in the US, but regularly in Canada and Mexico? One of those requirements is wrong. (we are 70 miles from Toronto, so the climate isn't a factor...)

[Mike Cutler]

The Subaru (the car I was asking about) got the rubber components replaced as a recall last year; and 4 year old CX9 will have it's control arms replaced in a recall later this year. So I ought to be good.:rolleyes:

I just hate the uncertainty over this. I mean really; why does the CX9 never need the brake fluid or rear differential fluid changed in the US, but regularly in Canada and Mexico? One of those requirements is wrong. (we are 70 miles from Toronto, so the climate isn't a factor...)

No uncertainty, Change the brake fluid in the CX9 at the same interval as the Impreza. It's your car, and it won't hurt it to change brake fluid.
Might be "gilding the lily", but it's your lily to guild.
Car makers don't always get it right. ;)