LV O-1 Fitment in LN Planes

[ken hatch]

A couple of years ago Lie-Nielsen stopped production of O-1 tools. I can understand from a bottom line standpoint but....There is that damn but again....Some of us really do not like to use A-2 cutters. I like the LN planes, they are very well made if a little heavy, I can live with heavy. Living with A-2 cutters, not so much.


So of course Hock and Lee Valley come to mind, they both make very good O-1 and LV makes PM-11 irons as well, there is just one tiny problem. Both Hock and LV plane irons are just a silly mm thinner than LN's irons. That difference keeps either from mating with the LN frog. The LN depth adjuster has a steep slope and to mate with the cap iron requires a cutter of LN's thickness, other wise it will not let the cutter/chip breaker mate with the frog.


I've gone back and forth, sell all my LN planes but I like 'em except for the irons. Live with A-2 cutters, OK I've tried....It's like a bad marriage, you can make it work but is it worth the effort. What to do, what to do. BTW, I've had a Clifton iron on back order for months now (Its specs show it is the same thickness as the LN) but so for no joy.


I finally did a little red neck engineering and enlarged the depth adjustment slot on a Hock chip breaker and installed a LV O-1 iron with the modded Hock chip breaker in the LN #4. It works, the iron/chip breaker mate with the frog and there is little "slop" in the depth adjuster.


I'll live with the mod for a few weeks and if there are no problems the rest of the LN's will get the same adjustment.

ken

[Mike Brady]

That is interesting and I'm glad that you mentioned the idea as I was thinking of trying the LV irons in an LN #4. Chris Schwarz says he uses a PM-V11 iron in his LN #3. How is he doing it? Here is a quote from a recent blog post by Chris:" My smoothing plane is a Lie-Nielsen No. 3 in bronze with a 45° frog, improved chipbreaker and a (gasp) Veritas PM-V11 iron. I am a huge fan of this steel. It takes a wicked sharp edge that lasts a long time".

[Stewie Simpson]

Ken; I did find the following link of some interest in regards the difference in recommended honing angles.

01 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 30°
A2 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 33-35°
PM-V11 – grind at 25° and hone at 33° for low-angle planes; grind at 25° and hone at 30° for ordinary Bailey planes.

owledge.axminster.co.uk/workshop/o1-a2-or-pm-v11-which-steel-is-for-you/ (http://knowledge.axminster.co.uk/workshop/o1-a2-or-pm-v11-which-steel-is-for-you/)

[Patrick Chase]

Ken; I did find the following link of some interest in regards the difference in recommended honing angles.

01 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 30°
A2 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 33-35°
PM-V11 – grind at 25° and hone at 33° for low-angle planes; grind at 25° and hone at 30° for ordinary Bailey planes.

owledge.axminster.co.uk/workshop/o1-a2-or-pm-v11-which-steel-is-for-you/ (http://knowledge.axminster.co.uk/workshop/o1-a2-or-pm-v11-which-steel-is-for-you/)

The problem with honing at 33 deg for a low angle plane is that it leaves you with a 12 + 33 = 45 deg cutting angle, which defeats [one of] the point[s] of using such a plane to begin with.

PM-V11 does much better than A2 at low edge angles, enough so that I routinely use PM-V11 irons honed at 25 deg for end grain work with BU planes. I believe that Derek does or has done the same. While this may seem like heresy I think that as shipped by LV it's at least as good as typically hardened (~Rc59) O1 at 25 deg.

It would be interesting to try PM-V11 at its maximum manufacturer-recommended hardness of Rc64 (making what I believe to be a fairly safe assumption about ID), which is approaching Japanese blade territory. I assume LV doesn't use that precisely because they want it to work well at lower honing angles.

[Derek Cohen]

A couple of years ago Lie-Nielsen stopped production of O-1 tools. I can understand from a bottom line standpoint but....There is that damn but again....Some of us really do not like to use A-2 cutters. I like the LN planes, they are very well made if a little heavy, I can live with heavy. Living with A-2 cutters, not so much.


So of course Hock and Lee Valley come to mind, they both make very good O-1 and LV makes PM-11 irons as well, there is just one tiny problem. Both Hock and LV plane irons are just a silly mm thinner than LN's irons. That difference keeps either from mating with the LN frog. The LN depth adjuster has a steep slope and to mate with the cap iron requires a cutter of LN's thickness, other wise it will not let the cutter/chip breaker mate with the frog.


I've gone back and forth, sell all my LN planes but I like 'em except for the irons. Live with A-2 cutters, OK I've tried....It's like a bad marriage, you can make it work but is it worth the effort. What to do, what to do. BTW, I've had a Clifton iron on back order for months now (Its specs show it is the same thickness as the LN) but so for no joy.


I finally did a little red neck engineering and enlarged the depth adjustment slot on a Hock chip breaker and installed a LV O-1 iron with the modded Hock chip breaker in the LN #4. It works, the iron/chip breaker mate with the frog and there is little "slop" in the depth adjuster.


I'll live with the mod for a few weeks and if there are no problems the rest of the LN's will get the same adjustment.

ken

Hi Ken

I have a PM-V11 that works in a LN #3 without modification, although it is thinner than the 1/8" thick LN. The plane uses a LN chipbreaker (the new style, not the old Bailey style). Other make chipbreakers do not match as the LN slot is 1/4" further back.

I have also used a Clifton blade. It is exactly the same thickness as the LN. The downside of this blade is that it does not hold an edge as long as A2 in the abrasive woods I use. I would get twice (at least) the longevity from an A2 blade. Also note that A2 gets as sharp as O1 when you use appropriate media (in my case, hollow grinding, then Shapton 1000 > Spyderco Medium and Ultra Fine > green compound on hardwood). All blades are beveled at 30 degrees.

Lee Valley also sell a blade that is the same thickness as the LN. Unfortunately, not for a #3. However you have a #4, and they do make one! It is not the Stanley Replacement series but the blades made for the Veritas bench planes they continue to produce (I assume that they will be replaced by the Custom planes at some stage).

Regards from Perth

Derek

[david charlesworth]

Ken,

If I understand correctly, the problem could easily be solved by a replacement yoke, which could be filed a little to fit the c/b slot.

I am sure L-N would supply such a thing.

David Charlesworth

[Stewie Simpson]

The problem with honing at 33 deg for a low angle plane is that it leaves you with a 12 + 33 = 45 deg cutting angle, which defeats [one of] the point[s] of using such a plane to begin with.

PM-V11 does much better than A2 at low edge angles, enough so that I routinely use PM-V11 irons honed at 25 deg for end grain work with BU planes. I believe that Derek does or has done the same. While this may seem like heresy I think that as shipped by LV it's at least as good as typically hardened (~Rc59) O1 at 25 deg.

It would be interesting to try PM-V11 at its maximum manufacturer-recommended hardness of Rc64 (making what I believe to be a fairly safe assumption about ID), which is approaching Japanese blade territory. I assume LV doesn't use that precisely because they want it to work well at lower honing angles.

Patrick; I have reread the article and made the following changes to give a clearer representation of the author's intention. As an example; under PM-V11 steel ; the author has a preference to use a honing angle of 30* on the bd planes; but a higher honing angle of 33* for the bu planes. http://knowledge.axminster.co.uk/workshop/o1-a2-or-pm-v11-which-steel-is-for-you/

01 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 30°
A2 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 33-35°
PM-V11 – grind at 25° and hone at 30* ( for low-angle planes hone at 33* )
grind at 25° and hone at 30° for ordinary Bailey planes.

Your reference of 12 + 33 = 45 deg cutting angle is correct; but you also need to factor in that the Veritas Low Angle Smoothing Planes are not restricted to end grain work; the point reinforced by the option of purchasing the iron with a 25* ; 38* ; or 50* primary bevel. http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/page.aspx?c=&p=45864&cat=1,41182,48944

regards Stewie;

[Patrick Chase]

It is not the Stanley Replacement series but the blades made for the Veritas bench planes they continue to produce (I assume that they will be replaced by the Custom planes at some stage).

I hope not.

The old-style planes (4, 4-1/2, 5-1/4W, 6) are $60 cheaper than their custom counterparts in the cases of the 4 and 4-1/2, but every bit as good (and IMO better in one or two respects) if you don't actually need customization. The mouth adjustment via a moving frog that goes all the way through the sole is especially clever, and avoids both the flatness issues of movables toes and the chatter and "coupled adjustments" that have historically come with moving frogs.

Also, I'm not ready to let go of "East German Swimmer" humor. Rob's comment was and is a gift that keeps on giving.

[ken hatch]

Ken; I did find the following link of some interest in regards the difference in recommended honing angles.

01 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 30°
A2 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 33-35°
PM-V11 – grind at 25° and hone at 33° for low-angle planes; grind at 25° and hone at 30° for ordinary Bailey planes.

owledge.axminster.co.uk/workshop/o1-a2-or-pm-v11-which-steel-is-for-you/ (http://knowledge.axminster.co.uk/workshop/o1-a2-or-pm-v11-which-steel-is-for-you/)

Stewie,

Thanks for the link.

ken

[ken hatch]

Hi Ken

I have a PM-V11 that works in a LN #3 without modification, although it is thinner than the 1/8" thick LN. The plane uses a LN chipbreaker (the new style, not the old Bailey style). Other make chipbreakers do not match as the LN slot is 1/4" further back.

I have also used a Clifton blade. It is exactly the same thickness as the LN. The downside of this blade is that it does not hold an edge as long as A2 in the abrasive woods I use. I would get twice (at least) the longevity from an A2 blade. Also note that A2 gets as sharp as O1 when you use appropriate media (in my case, hollow grinding, then Shapton 1000 > Spyderco Medium and Ultra Fine > green compound on hardwood). All blades are beveled at 30 degrees.

Lee Valley also sell a blade that is the same thickness as the LN. Unfortunately, not for a #3. However you have a #4, and they do make one! It is not the Stanley Replacement series but the blades made for the Veritas bench planes they continue to produce (I assume that they will be replaced by the Custom planes at some stage).

Regards from Perth

Derek

Thanks Derek,

I'll order one of LV's replacement irons for the #4.

ken

[Tony Zaffuto]

I woild also consider either Clifton or Ray Isle's irons.

I do have and like the LV PM V11.

[ken hatch]

Ken,

If I understand correctly, the problem could easily be solved by a replacement yoke, which could be filed a little to fit the c/b slot.

I am sure L-N would supply such a thing.

David Charlesworth

David,

I've filed the yoke on one frog. I was a little ham handed (OK a bunch ham handed) and it ended up pretty "sloppy" much like an old Stanley plane. I may see if I can get a couple of yokes to play with.

ken

[ken hatch]

Hi Ken

...Clifton blade. It is exactly the same thickness as the LN. The downside of this blade is that it does not hold an edge as long as A2 in the abrasive woods I use. I would get twice (at least) the longevity from an A2 blade. Also note that A2 gets as sharp as O1 when you use appropriate media (in my case, hollow grinding, then Shapton 1000 > Spyderco Medium and Ultra Fine > green compound on hardwood). ...
Regards from Perth

Derek

Derek,

That is the crux of O1 vs. A2 or even PMv11, what wood do you use and how do you sharpen. I mostly work with USA domestic hardwoods and I much prefer natural stones for sharpening. Why natural stones? I can come up with a dozen reasons but the bottom line is probably two things they are how I learned to sharpen so they "feel right" and there is some "romance" to natural stones. Dumb I know but it is what it is. BTW I've started down the JNat slippery slope and I'm not sure where it will end. Say your Omni, Omni, VOR's for me I may need 'em. :p

ken

[Simon MacGowen]

http://knowledge.axminster.co.uk/workshop/o1-a2-or-pm-v11-which-steel-is-for-you/

01 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 30°
A2 steel – grind at 25° and hone at 33-35°
PM-V11 – grind at 25° and hone at 30* ( for low-angle planes hone at 33* )
grind at 25° and hone at 30° for ordinary Bailey planes.

regards Stewie;

The author uses a general statement "due to the metallurgical make up, it is not recommended to hone it at 30° ..." to support his recommendation. He is a fine craftsman, but in all my years of using A2 steel sharpened/honed at various angles, i have not found the 30* honing or 25* + micro bevel an issue at all -- I keep a 50* blade for difficult grains.

To me, he is splitting hair on that (unless Lie Nielsen's A2 steel he referenced is significantly different from Veritas A2 steel which I use). None of my peers (a few full-time cabinet makers using hand tools for fine fitting work) sharpen their A2 blades at odd angles like 33* or what not. Frankly, all we do is ball park 30* freehand and who cares about 33* or 34*.

Simon

[george wilson]

Ken, I wonder how many here are old enough to recall that the "Silly Millimeter" was the advertising slogan of a cigarette manufacturer back in the 50's. They advertised that they made their cigarettes a "Silly millimeter" longer than others did. I certainly heard that slogan many, many times!

[Prashun Patel]

"Romance to Natural Stones"

Isn't this a bad 80's movie?

[Stewie Simpson]

Simon; appreciate your feedback on A2 steel.

regards Stewie;

[Patrick Chase]

The author uses a general statement "due to the metallurgical make up, it is not recommended to hone it at 30° ..." to support his recommendation. He is a fine craftsman, but in all my years of using A2 steel sharpened/honed at various angles, i have not found the 30* honing or 25* + micro bevel an issue at all -- I keep a 50* blade for difficult grains.

To me, he is splitting hair on that (unless Lie Nielsen's A2 steel he referenced is significantly different from Veritas A2 steel which I use). None of my peers (a few full-time cabinet makers using hand tools for fine fitting work) sharpen their A2 blades at odd angles like 33* or what not. Frankly, all we do is ball park 30* freehand and who cares about 33* or 34*.

Simon

L-N's A2 is pretty good stuff. It's cryo-treated and long-wearing even as A2 goes, though not quite up to the level of PM-V11 in that regard. I have L-N #8, #2, and #10-1/4 planes, and they worked OK grinding at 25 and honing at 30 back before I moved to higher edge angles on my common-pitch planes.

As noted in the other thread A2 prefers higher angles like any high-alloy, non-PM steel though IMO anything over 30 deg is acceptable for most uses.

[Patrick Chase]

Derek,

That is the crux of O1 vs. A2 or even PMv11, what wood do you use and how do you sharpen. I mostly work with USA domestic hardwoods and I much prefer natural stones for sharpening. Why natural stones? I can come up with a dozen reasons but the bottom line is probably two things they are how I learned to sharpen so they "feel right" and there is some "romance" to natural stones. Dumb I know but it is what it is. BTW I've started down the JNat slippery slope and I'm not sure where it will end. Say your Omni, Omni, VOR's for me I may need 'em. :p

ken

It's like a "romance" with an abusive partner that takes all your money and won't let you hang around with any of your old high-alloy friends, but it feels so good when you "sharpen your blade" so it must be right...

So I have a curiosity question: What do Japanese woodworkers use to sharpen their Blue Steel tools? Based on composition that stuff has to have nontrivial Tungsten carbide content, and the Silicate abrasives in JNats aren't going to work so well on those.

[Brian Holcombe]

I sharpen blue steel 1 & 2 along with exotic alloys like Togo Kou (modern Togo Regiou) with natural stones. I'm getting clear edges. I also sharpen extremely hard white steel 1 and Assab K120 with the same stones.

A2 always appears to have an eroded look when worked with natural stones, that same issue in not the case with the steels mentioned above.

Often it is right on the edge of being able to cut those steels.

[ken hatch]

Ken, I wonder how many here are old enough to recall that the "Silly Millimeter" was the advertising slogan of a cigarette manufacturer back in the 50's. They advertised that they made their cigarettes a "Silly millimeter" longer than others did. I certainly heard that slogan many, many times!

George,

I expect not many. A sure sigh it may be time to shuffle off stage, visit the Tijuana Farm and Ranch store, do a Thelma & Louise, is when you have to explain all your cultural references. I've been doing it for a few years now, sometimes my clients look at me with the "what is this old fool talking about now" look. Sometimes I tell 'em to suck it up, may you live so long.:)

ken

[Patrick Chase]

I sharpen blue steel 1 & 2 along with exotic alloys like Togo Kou (modern Togo Regiou) with natural stones. I'm getting clear edges. I also sharpen extremely hard white steel 1 and Assab K120 with the same stones.

A2 always appears to have an eroded look when worked with natural stones, that same issue in not the case with the steels mentioned above.

Often it is right on the edge of being able to cut those steels.

To be clear the problem here isn't average hardness, it's homogeneity or lack thereof. I'm not surprised that super-hard White 1 works because that stuff has almost no carbides and is therefore uniformly hard.

The problem with A2 is that it has ~5% Cr, and the resulting Chromium carbides have hardness well in excess of Rc70 even when the average hardness of the alloy is tempered to typical A2 values of Rc61 or so. Those carbides are large enough that you get noticeable edge dulling if the sharpening medium chips/erodes them out instead of honing them.

After thinking about it some more I think I understand why Blue Steel works: Tungsten tends to form finer grain structures than Chromium, and Blue only has ~2% W to begin with. The resulting carbides are Rc75+, but they're probably small enough that chipping/eroding them out during honing doesn't result in a detectably dull edge. It would be interesting to see what's going on with an SEM though.

"Small carbides" are also why PM-V11 hones acceptably on natural stones. It appears to have wicked high Cr content (more than D2) but PM processing shrinks the individual carbides to the point where it isn't a practical issue.

[ken hatch]

It's like a "romance" with an abusive partner that takes all your money and won't let you hang around with any of your old high-alloy friends, but it feels so good when you "sharpen your blade" so it must be right...

So I have a curiosity question: What do Japanese woodworkers use to sharpen their Blue Steel tools? Based on composition that stuff has to have nontrivial Tungsten carbide content, and the Silicate abrasives in JNats aren't going to work so well on those.


I sharpen blue steel 1 & 2 along with exotic alloys like Togo Kou (modern Togo Regiou) with natural stones. I'm getting clear edges. I also sharpen extremely hard white steel 1 and Assab K120 with the same stones.

A2 always appears to have an eroded look when worked with natural stones, that same issue in not the case with the steels mentioned above.

Often it is right on the edge of being able to cut those steels.

Thanks Brian.

Patrick,

Your analogy is better than mine:).

I do not have any Blue Paper Japanese tools so I defer to Brian on that one.

ken

[ken hatch]

"Romance to Natural Stones"

Isn't this a bad 80's movie?



Prashun,

It was good enough for even worse sequel.

ken

[Derek Cohen]

Derek,

That is the crux of O1 vs. A2 or even PMv11, what wood do you use and how do you sharpen. I mostly work with USA domestic hardwoods and I much prefer natural stones for sharpening. Why natural stones? I can come up with a dozen reasons but the bottom line is probably two things they are how I learned to sharpen so they "feel right" and there is some "romance" to natural stones. Dumb I know but it is what it is. BTW I've started down the JNat slippery slope and I'm not sure where it will end. Say your Omni, Omni, VOR's for me I may need 'em. :p

ken

Hi Ken

I read sharpening threads with a mix of curiosity and bewilderment. Perhaps I am being over-simplistic here, but the aim of sharpening is to create two intersecting, polished edges. The only issue is that some media are better or less suited to certain steels. Everything gets abraded with diamond, but diamond does not polish well. Choose the poison you prefer. Just ensure that it abrades the steel you use, and that you can polish to the level of smoothness you prefer.

This way, A2 will certainly get as sharp as anything else. That is not to say that the edge is the equal of O1 or PM-V11. In theory, the larger carbides in A2 can leave a serration. In practice, I obtain excellent surfaces in hard woods. The woods in Australia are hard, interlocked and abrasive (high in silica). Edge holding is a high priority for me since a dull blade will more readily lead to tearout. For this reason, O1 is risky to use. I have replaced many of my blades with PM-V11. This has greater durability than A2 and a similar (better?) smooth edge than O1.

Your softer and straighter-grained woods are not demanding at all. You can use O1 happily all day long. The only issue for you is that softer woods will show up any shortcomings in sharpness. Fortunately, O1 can be sharpened by just about anything.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Graham Haydon]

Ken, if you have not yet moved on the new plane Iron I'd second Tony's tip on the Ray Iles. I only have one of their irons, it lives in a Stanley 78 Knockoff where the original iron supplied was super soft. Honed up very nicely on an oil stone and works very well.

[Patrick Chase]

Hi Ken

I read sharpening threads with a mix of curiosity and bewilderment. Perhaps I am being over-simplistic here, but the aim of sharpening is to create two intersecting, polished edges. The only issue is that some media are better or less suited to certain steels. Everything gets abraded with diamond, but diamond does not polish well. Choose the poison you prefer. Just ensure that it abrades the steel you use, and that you can polish to the level of smoothness you prefer.

I think the reason for the disconnect is because there's a second issue that you're consistently ignoring even though it's been repeatedly explained:

Every steel has a critical angle below which it can't be honed without unacceptable wear during use, due to edge-chipping. D2 is infamous for requiring high honing angles to avoid chipping, and A2 is problematic as well. Note that the sharpening medium does not matter as much in this context - even if you hone the edge perfectly, the carbides in the edge will still be vulnerable to chipping due to their weak attachment to the surrounding metal. This is why the straight-razor crowd don't use A2 or any other high-alloy steels.

I can buy that in your specific case you may not see this as a significant issue. If you're bashing away on "impossible woods" all day then low-alloy steels will probably be so vulnerable to conventional dulling and edge-folding when honed to low angles (<30 deg) that the chipping issue with A2 might not look like much of a problem. That doesn't in any way invalidate what other people are saying about what happens in *their* use cases as you seem to suggest above, though.

[ken hatch]

I woild also consider either Clifton or Ray Isle's irons.

I do have and like the LV PM V11.

Tony,

I've a Clifton on back order, who knows when it will show. I've a Ray Isle's in shop but it needs a modified cap iron as do the LV and Hock irons. Now that I may have worked out an easy fix that does not mod the plane or frog I will try the Ray Isles.

ken

[ken hatch]

Ken, if you have not yet moved on the new plane Iron I'd second Tony's tip on the Ray Iles. I only have one of their irons, it lives in a Stanley 78 Knockoff where the original iron supplied was super soft. Honed up very nicely on an oil stone and works very well.

Thanks Graham,

I've one to try.

ken

[Graham Haydon]

Cool, would be good to hear your thoughts, you don't find much user feedback on them.

[Derek Cohen]

I think the reason for the disconnect is because there's a second issue that you're consistently ignoring even though it's been repeatedly explained:

Every steel has a critical angle below which it can't be honed without unacceptable wear during use, due to edge-chipping

Patrick, I am not ignoring this factor. It is simply not relevant to the question asked.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Joe Bailey]

Ken, I wonder how many here are old enough to recall that the "Silly Millimeter" was the advertising slogan of a cigarette manufacturer back in the 50's. They advertised that they made their cigarettes a "Silly millimeter" longer than others did. I certainly heard that slogan many, many times!

George, the '60s actually -- that was Chesterfield's campaign and an attempt to one-up the Benson and Hedges 100s -- I confess to remembering that era

[Jim Koepke]

George, the '60s actually -- that was Chesterfield's campaign and an attempt to one-up the Benson and Hedges 100s -- I confess to remembering that era

I remember the "silly millimeter" ads. I smoked Camels at the time. Tapping them down would reduce the depth of tobacco more than just a silly millimeter.

At the time there was only one cigarette branded as Camels. Now there are about a dozen and the Camel 'shorts' are not as prominent as they used to be. For the record I had my last cigarette a few years ago.

There used to be a lot of different features about the old Camel pack. Such as where was the camel owner, what would you do if you were on that camel dying of thirst, the camel tenders wife, the lion, the date 1914 on the pack and how many letters 'e' were on the back. Most people also know what they said about Camels back then, "nine out of ten men that try Camels go back to women."

Almost forgot about the trick with the word 'CHOICE' not reading backwards in a mirror.

jtk

[Pat Barry]

I remember the "silly millimeter" ads. I smoked Camels at the time. Tapping them down would reduce the depth of tobacco more than just a silly millimeter.

At the time there was only one cigarette branded as Camels. Now there are about a dozen and the Camel 'shorts' are not as prominent as they used to be. For the record I had my last cigarette a few years ago.

There used to be a lot of different features about the old Camel pack. Such as where was the camel owner, what would you do if you were on that camel dying of thirst, the camel tenders wife, the lion, the date 1914 on the pack and how many letters 'e' were on the back. Most people also know what they said about Camels back then, "nine out of ten men that try Camels go back to women."

Almost forgot about the trick with the word 'CHOICE' not reading backwards in a mirror.

jtk
Weren't those the Virginia Slims? 101 mm vs 100 mm for the other 'long' cigs.
Remember the old (I think it was Steve Martin) joke about Virigina Slims. What was it he said "Virgina Slims? That's a womans cigarette isn't it? What is it, do they have little br----s on them or something?"

[John Schtrumpf]

Well, if we are going to go back in time. I have always wondered whether George's wife's name is Martha?

[ken hatch]

My OF's cultural references make my clients eyes roll to the back of their heads, I believe most haven't a clue what I'm talking about when I mention flying "needle, ball, and airspeed".

Anyway......

I've only the LN #8 left for iron replacement. I expect it will be done sometime but there ain't no hurry because it seldom comes off the wall. If I had a working brain cell it, the #8, would have been gone long ago. Metal jointers are just too big and heavy, after 15 or 20 minutes of slinging that sucker around the shop my body is crying no mas no mas where with one of my wood jointers I can work long enough to get something done and still function the next day.


Sorry for the digression, sometimes the fingers have a mind of their own. It is a pretty simple fix to route out the depth adjustment hole on the cap iron. I used a Drimel with a diamond bit taking just a small amount off before test fits. On most of the cap irons the fit was good after two or three tries.


I've worked the planes with the new irons and modified chip breakers and the feel is the same as a unmodified plane with LN iron. No more backlash than before, if you have LN planes and want to use other irons it is worth the trouble.


Here is a staged photo of my set up:

http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh222/VTXAZ/openingDepthAdjustmentLNYoke160615_zpsqdfhwdvv.jpg

ken

[Kevin Hampshire]

Ken, "Needle, ball & airspeed" aside, I thought you might enjoy this. Wright brothers workbench.

339181

[ken hatch]

Ken, "Needle, ball & airspeed" aside, I thought you might enjoy this. Wright brothers workbench.



Kevin,

If you are interested in the Wrights, "Kill Devil Hill" by Harry Combs and Martin Caidin is the best I've read. The Wright Brothers let this dumb ol' West Texas farm boy have a life I couldn't have dreamed of as I watched Oklahoma blow by my bedroom window in the early '50s. They do not begin to get the credit they deserve.

Thanks for the bench photo,

ken