Metal cutting Bench Top Bandsaw ?

[Tim Boger]

Seeking recommendations to help in making the notch cut for turning tools more accurate .... see pic

I have a 14" Jet Bandsaw that I could put a metal cutting blade on but I've read that the blade speed may be an issue .... actually, I'm not certain a metal cutting blade is even available for that saw.

338700

[Matt Day]

Would a bandsaw be the right tool for that job?

[Bruce Page]

A bandsaw? A small bench top mill would be a much better choice. You would be able to mill the undercut, and drill & tap for the screw in one setup.

[Tim Boger]

A bandsaw? A small bench top mill would be a much better choice. You would be able to mill the undercut, and drill & tap for the screw in one setup.

Hey Bruce ... having little to no back ground in metal work I'm not even aware of just what a Bench Top Mill is ... time to google.

Thanks for the feedback,
Tim


(EDIT) *** Goodness ... pricey little devils.

[Mike Cutler]

Tim

They do make metal cutting blades for the Jet 14" band saw, but Bruce is right, a small bench top mill is the correct tool machine.
You are correct, they aren't cheap. Even the "cheap ones" still have a good price tag. ;)

[Charles Lent]

That could be done with a metal cutting file, but it will take some careful work to get it to come out right. If you haven't done this before, practice on a piece of scrap to develop the technique for getting the notch flat and square. The best tool for doing this would be a mill, but those of us who don't have access to one usually end up using a metal cutting file to do this.

Charley

[John K Jordan]

I would not use a bandsaw for this even though I have two metal-cutting band saws. They would not be accurate enough and would leave a pretty rough surface and require grinding or a lot of filing. Even a cheap mini-mill would work far better to cut these little steps on a flat bar and the result would be precise, you just have to take off less metal on each pass.

I bought a mill and lathe from the Little Machine Shop and one thing I promise - you will find SO many uses for these in building and repairing things.

Another idea that doesn't include buying a mill - get someone else to mill it! For example, I have friends with manual and CNC mills who would be glad to make some little cuts like that - it wouldn't take long. A local Maker's club might have someone that would mill these. Even a machine shop might do this for you for less than you might think. I'd drill the hole on the mill also - more precise than a typical drill press.

If getting someone else mill these, I'd get several made at once since the setup is usually more time consuming than the milling.

JKJ

[Tim Boger]

I would not use a bandsaw for this even though I have two metal-cutting band saws. They would not be accurate enough and would leave a pretty rough surface and require grinding or a lot of filing. Even a cheap mini-mill would work far better to cut these little steps on a flat bar and the result would be precise, you just have to take off less metal on each pass.

I bought a mill and lathe from the Little Machine Shop and one thing I promise - you will find SO many uses for these in building and repairing things.

Another idea that doesn't include buying a mill - get someone else to mill it! For example, I have friends with manual and CNC mills who would be glad to make some little cuts like that - it wouldn't take long. A local Maker's club might have someone that would mill these. Even a machine shop might do this for you for less than you might think. I'd drill the hole on the mill also - more precise than a typical drill press.

If getting someone else mill these, I'd get several made at once since the setup is usually more time consuming than the milling.

JKJ

Greetings John,

Very interesting post, I've spent a little time since starting this post to look at mills and such ... if you would be so kind to link me to a mini-mill that is suitable for this type of work so I can have a benchmark to work from. Thank you for your feedback.

Tim

[John K Jordan]

The don't offer the exact configuration I bought now, but this id the basic model: the HiTorque. I researched this for over a year before I decided on this one (and a lathe). The solid column (non-tilting) was a bug plus for me. I like the R8 spindle.

http://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=3990&category=1387807683

Variable speed, plenty of power for small work. There are many others and some come from the same factory in China. You can get a small mill from Harbour Freight. I've seen used for sale. Some evidently need a bit of disassembly and clean up if internal slides and things.

The LMS has this model made to their specs and it worhed fine out of the crate. Their customer support has been fantastic which is a big plus. If you call them you get advice from real machinists.

JKJ

[David Malicky]

A mini-mill is certainly a useful machine, but if all you need to do is make that notch, a metal-cutting file would work just fine. Build a simple jig to keep the file level and square to the workpiece.

[Curt Harms]

A metal cutting bandsaw runs something like 80-200 ft./min. blade speed. A wood cutting bandsaw is around 3000 ft./min. Not good. There are bandsaws with gear boxes that will cut both but they're uncommon and generally expensive. I don't know if it would be possible to create some sort of grinding jig that would be adequately accurate or not. I'm sure a small mill is the best solution if you don't mind the $$$. This is about as cheap as I could imagine new and it might be a waste of $$$, I'm no machinist.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Mini-Milling-Machine/G8689?utm_campaign=zPage

[John K Jordan]

This is about as cheap as I could imagine new and it might be a waste of $$$,

I suspect that mill would easily cut the step. This the same basic mill as the one from Little Machine Shop for less money, but the LMS version may be worth the extra money due to the larger table, air spring head support, solid column (more rigid than tilting column), R8 spindle, and more. When I researched small mills some commented that the LMS version was apparently made to higher specs and required less tuning.

JKJ

[Tim Boger]

A metal cutting bandsaw runs something like 80-200 ft./min. blade speed. A wood cutting bandsaw is around 3000 ft./min. Not good. There are bandsaws with gear boxes that will cut both but they're uncommon and generally expensive. I don't know if it would be possible to create some sort of grinding jig that would be adequately accurate or not. I'm sure a small mill is the best solution if you don't mind the $$$. This is about as cheap as I could imagine new and it might be a waste of $$$, I'm no machinist.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Mini-Milling-Machine/G8689?utm_campaign=zPage

Hey Curt,

Thanks for the feedback, I spent an hour on the phone today with the tech support at Grizzly and must commend them for their customer service and technical knowledge. Really helpful.

I'm wondering why on the mini mill it doesn't say Mill/Drill ... I'm actually looking more closely at the Model G0758,the ad shows it with an optional base which unfortunately is not included in the sale price.

What do you think?

[daryl moses]

I recently made a few of these. I used a hacksaw to cut to the correct depth then simply used my bench grinder to grind up to that line. They worked like a charm.

[Jim Barstow]

A mill is definitely the tool of choice here.

I made the jump to metal working last year with a sherline lathe and mill. I also looked at the hi torque from littlemachineshop.com but came to the conclusion that the smaller sherline machines were a better entry point. (I can easily pick up the sherline equipment but the hi torque equipment is much heavier. Sherline also has a well deserved reputation for precision.)

I can highly recommend a small mill to complete all our woodworking machinery. I now integrate the use of small pieces of brass into my furniture and it really adds to the impact. Metal working, with attention down to .001", has really improved my woodworking.

I considering upgrading to big metalworking machines with CNC but wood is still my first love.

[David Malicky]

A high quality fine file, with skill and a jig or reference surface, can hit 0.002" or better. But getting the drilled hole sync'd with the cut is much more likely on a mill.

As John indicated, almost all the Sieg mini-mills (X1 and X2, sold under various labels) are pretty rough, not turn-key. They are "mill kits", requiring considerable rework to function properly. If you have the skills and time for rework, or don't care about precision, the Grizzly or HF Sieg mini-mills are bargains. If the LMS X2 is truly turn-key, it's definitely worth the extra $. These are all versions of the Sieg X2: http://littlemachineshop.com/info/minimill_compare.php

The other Chinese mini-mill is the "BF" series, made by a few factories. The BF20 (e.g., Grizzly G0704) is much bigger than the X2, most popular, and owners are generally very happy with them. The G0758 is a newer, downsized version and less is known about it. The BF mills are generally better designed and built than Sieg machines. One big difference vs the X2: the BFs have a quill but only 2" travel; the X2 has no quill but full and quick Z travel.

The best Asian factory for small mills is Rong-Fu, from Taiwan. Their RF30/31 is higher quality than any of the above, but the round column presents some (solveable) challenges for some operations. These can be found used on craiglist, typically ~$1k with some tooling. This is the original "mill/drill", with 5" spindle travel.

The highest precision machines are the Sherline and Taig micro-mills; they are much smaller but USA quality. http://www.taigtools.com/mmill.html

Size comparisons: http://www.hossmachine.info/Mill_Comparisons.html

All of the options have their niche; the challenge is understanding the capabilities and limitations, and matching one's needs to the right machine. That generally takes a lot of research.

On cost, keep in mind you'll also need a vise, collets, chucks, cutters, etc. Then you'll want a DRO.

[Robert Engel]

Would a drill press, a milling bit and a clamp vise work if you could set up a system slide the vise under the bit?

[Tim Boger]

Would a drill press, a milling bit and a clamp vise work if you could set up a system slide the vise under the bit?

Hey Robert,

I would bet your suggestion would work, although I expect there'll be some here that will offer opinions why it won't.

My current drill press is a so it would require a new and improved DP to try and set up a very basic milling process. Considering that 99% of my workshop time is woodwork your thoughts interest me, I'd get a lot more use out of a new DP as compared to a Mill.

Thanks for your feedback
Tim

[John McClanahan]

Would a drill press, a milling bit and a clamp vise work if you could set up a system slide the vise under the bit?

I have a Powermatic 1150 drill press with new spindle bearings and a good XY milling table. The drill press isn't made for side cutting and it does a poor job, even in aluminum. If the DP has a tapered spindle at the chuck (most do, a JT-33 taper) there is a risk that the chuck will come loose while side cutting.


John

[Al Launier]

I'm guessing that the metal you want to machine is steel & if that is the case you would need to mill it. I wouldn't use a drill press because the spindle bearings are designed for axial cutting, rather than for radial cutting forces. It might work for very light cuts initially, but the bearings would wear out prematurely.

If the material you want to cut is aluminum, then you could cut it on your table saw with carbide sawblades, taking light cuts.

[Keith Outten]

Would a drill press, a milling bit and a clamp vise work if you could set up a system slide the vise under the bit?

In the past I have used a drill press to do light machining. I have a cheap XY vise that I mounted on the drill table, often to machine keyholes for signs and to make custom "T" nuts.

Agreed, a drill press is not designed for lateral machining based on the bearings but it can be done if its just a once in awhile deal. You can use a grinding stone instead of an end mill for the type of machining you want to do Tim...just go slow and take very light cuts.

Years ago I sold my drill press and replaced it with a mill/drill and I couldn't be happier. Generally speaking you can purchase a pretty hefty mill/drill for the same price or cheaper than a good quality drill press.
.

[Tim Boger]

In the past I have used a drill press to do light machining. I have a cheap XY vise that I mounted on the drill table, often to machine keyholes for signs and to make custom "T" nuts.

Agreed, a drill press is not designed for lateral machining based on the bearings but it can be done if its just a once in awhile deal. You can use a grinding stone instead of an end mill for the type of machining you want to do Tim...just go slow and take very light cuts.


Years ago I sold my drill press and replaced it with a mill/drill and I couldn't be happier. Generally speaking you can purchase a pretty hefty mill/drill for the same price or cheaper than a good quality drill press.
.

We're on the same path here Keith, I hadn't considered utilizing a small grinding stone / bit in a drill press. Interesting option.

Do you think a Mill / Drill is a compromise as compared to a drill press when considering the application a drill press is usually used for?

Does a Mill / Drill have a problem living is a dusty environment, more so than a drill press might?

Thanks for your feedback Keith

[Bruce Page]

The drill press is not the right tool. It is great for drilling holes but can become dangerous if used as a milling machine. In most DP's the only thing holding the chuck in the quill is the Morse taper and that is fine for drilling. The MT was not designed for lateral forces and can become loose and fall out, particularly with the vibrations you'll have using an endmill. If that happens life can become very exciting.

[Tim Boger]

The drill press is not the right tool. It is great for drilling holes but can become dangerous if used as a milling machine. In most DP's the only thing holding the chuck in the quill is the Morse taper and that is fine for drilling. The MT was not designed for lateral forces and can become loose and fall out, particularly with the vibrations you'll have using an endmill. If that happens life can become very exciting.

Hey Bruce,

Thanks for the feedback, what I'm wondering is will a Mill / Drill tool be capable of doing both jobs well? Milling obviously, but how will it do compared to a mid priced stand alone Drill Press?

Tim

[Bruce Page]

Tim, I have a full size 2000 lb turret mill. I haven't looked into the bench top mills. As a one time machinist, a mill is 100 times more useful than a drill press but it can also be a money pit when you start adding the typical peripherals. I'm sure there are tradeoffs between the two, you'd just have to look at the specs and determine what is important to you.

[John K Jordan]

Hey Bruce,

Thanks for the feedback, what I'm wondering is will a Mill / Drill tool be capable of doing both jobs well? Milling obviously, but how will it do compared to a mid priced stand alone Drill Press?

Tim


Tim,

I have a friend with an older Rong Fu mill/drill (good brand) and he uses it for a lot of milling. It's a pretty heavy duty machine compared to a drill press or a mini mill. It does have some disadvantages over a mill in that just like a drill press you lose the indexing point since the column is round and the head rotates when raised. However, the quill on his is fairly long and MOST machining either of us have done did not need much vertical movement.

I found this on a machining forum: "If you intend to do very occasional milling and want a heavier duty drilling machine [the mill/drill] should be ok. If you really want a milling machine and have higher expectations, then you will probably not be happy."

My friend actually bought two identical used Rong Fu mill/drills at a good price, stripped and reconditioned one and offered the other to me. After using his I think I'll take it. Two mills, one heavier duty, would be quite handy.

JKJ

[Keith Outten]

We're on the same path here Keith, I hadn't considered utilizing a small grinding stone / bit in a drill press. Interesting option.

Do you think a Mill / Drill is a compromise as compared to a drill press when considering the application a drill press is usually used for?

Does a Mill / Drill have a problem living is a dusty environment, more so than a drill press might?

Thanks for your feedback Keith

This is just my opinion but a mill/drill is generally a big step up from a drill press. Granted I'm not recommending the very small mill/drills rather the ones in the 500 pound class like mine which is a Grizzly round column model that I paid about $850 for about 15 years ago. Even though the small mills will do the job you need right now I don't think they are a replacement for a shop drill press, the next step up in size will.

A dusty environment is not as big a problem as you would think. If you needed to machine very high tolerances as machine shops do it would not be the best place for a mill but that would be extremely rare in a woodworking shop.

I doubt any professional machinist would be happy with a mill/drill because they expect more performance and precision than the rest of us who don't have the necessary skills anyway. I haven't spent a lot of funds on accessories for my mill/drill because 95% of the time I use it as a drill press for woodworking and sign projects. I purchased a nice drill press vise for mine, I don't own one of the really nice milling vises. I build custom wooden tables for my mill, mostly for jigs and fixtures that I need for common/frequent jobs that I do. I route a lot of slots and keyholes in wood, metal and plastics and use my mill/drill for projects that a drill press could never do.

Because I built my own mill/drill stand I designed it so that the head of the mill can be swung over the edge of the stand so I can drill into the end of long table legs or metal axles, etc. I own my own welding machine so I used 6" by 6" by 3/8" steel angle iron for the stand which weighs almost as much as the mill/drill does.

An afterthought...I did purchase a power feed for my table a few years ago when Grizzly started offering them for my machine.

FWIW I would never contradict any advice you receive from Bruce Page. Bruce is a professional machinist with a lifetime of experience in the trade. I'm a low level metalworker that knows my own limitations. I say this because I was an inspector many years ago and I have worked with dozens master machinist's on very high end projects from NASA, Shipyards and a whole host of local machine shops from New York state to Florida.

[John K Jordan]

...I'm a low level metalworker that knows my own limitations. I say this because I was an inspector many years ago and I have worked with...

Hey, like I'm a low-level weldor. I was a welding and NDT inspector for some years and although I now have four welding machines and a plasma cutter I know well the limitations thing! I do know a good weld when I see it though. I just don't see it in all of mine. :-)

We probably mill as much wood and plastic as metal, maybe more. Hard exotics mill are especially nice to mill. For example, when installing a used Robland sliding table on my cabinet saw I discovered a key component was missing, a critical bracket. This was unobtainable from the maker, distributor, or any place I could find. I cut the rough shape from a chunk of lignum vitae and we made a new bracket with the Rong Fu mill/drill. Works like a charm!

I also mill HDPE plastic which cuts cleanly and is so useful for building jigs, tools, and replacement parts. I found 4x8 sheets 1" thick at our local metal recycling place for almost nothing. Love that stuff!

I like the idea of your stand that allows end drilling/milling of longer pieces. That would be better than a drill press on a floor stand. I assume you mount a vice on the side or some fixture to clamp to. If possible, I'd love to see a picture of your stand. I think I have enough 4x6" heavy wall square tubing in my stash to build one.

JKJ

[Chris E Smith]

If you already had a metal cutting bandsaw I would rough it out to layout lines then finish with a file. I do this all the time with up to 1" mild steel square bar and cuts 2-3" long with excellent results. A sharp file would make quick work of the cleanup. I don't see any compelling reason for perfection, you are just trying to keep the carbide cutter from rotating but you can file to a wooden jig if you are compulsive like me. There are some aftermarket stands ( SWAG offroad makes one) that allow you to mount a Milwaukee Portaband vertically and use it like a vertical metal cutting bandsaw. That would be cheaper than buying a mill and the portaband is a handy tool to have. Use one of the carbide cutters and a transfer punch to center punch the screw hole location.
Alternatively you could use a cutting wheel in a 4 1/2" grinder to do the rough out then proceed with a file as above.
I think you might be surprised how well you can do this simply with a little careful layout and patience.
Chris

[Tim Boger]

If you already had a metal cutting bandsaw I would rough it out to layout lines then finish with a file. I do this all the time with up to 1" mild steel square bar and cuts 2-3" long with excellent results. A sharp file would make quick work of the cleanup. I don't see any compelling reason for perfection, you are just trying to keep the carbide cutter from rotating but you can file to a wooden jig if you are compulsive like me. There are some aftermarket stands ( SWAG offroad makes one) that allow you to mount a Milwaukee Portaband vertically and use it like a vertical metal cutting bandsaw. That would be cheaper than buying a mill and the portaband is a handy tool to have. Use one of the carbide cutters and a transfer punch to center punch the screw hole location.
Alternatively you could use a cutting wheel in a 4 1/2" grinder to do the rough out then proceed with a file as above.
I think you might be surprised how well you can do this simply with a little careful layout and patience.
Chris

Hey Chris,

The drill press I have is a 10 year old Ryobi .... it works ok but I'm ready and willing to replace it with something new. I don't do a lot of hole drilling as my focus is turning. I just recently became interested in making a couple of Carbide Turning tools and find it enjoyable ... so rather than learn how to become accurate with a hacksaw and a file I'm thinking a hobby level Mill / Drill will be in my future. The question right now is what Mill should I choose and how much will I need to spend to have a tool I won't be looking to upgrade immediately. Many reviews suggest a new mill owner will find many items that they can make and will wonder how they ever lived without it ... I'm not sure I'm that guy but do enjoy learning new skills ... might even be able to integrate some metal into my woodturning.
Tim

[Bruce Page]

Tim, with my background I can't help but be a little biased toward a milling machine. If you have the patience and interest to learn you will be amazed in what they can do. But, as I mentioned earlier, metal working can be an expensive road if you really get in to it. I have made several tools for my woodworking hobby from custom indicator holders for my Biesemeyer fence to zero clearance throat plates for the table saw & band saw, to a custom dust port for my Woodmaster drum sander, and many others.
Here's a custom router base I made several years ago that gets used on almost every project: Shop made micro-adjustable plunge base (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?29281-Shop-made-micro-adjustable-plunge-base)

[Tim Boger]

Tim, with my background I can't help but be a little biased toward a milling machine. If you have the patience and interest to learn you will be amazed in what they can do. But, as I mentioned earlier, metal working can be an expensive road if you really get in to it. I have made several tools for my woodworking hobby from custom indicator holders for my Biesemeyer fence to zero clearance throat plates for the table saw & band saw, to a custom dust port for my Woodmaster drum sander, and many others.
Here's a custom router base I made several years ago that gets used on almost every project: Shop made micro-adjustable plunge base (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?29281-Shop-made-micro-adjustable-plunge-base)

Beautiful work Bruce, I love learning how to use new tools ... with little to no knowledge this is the Mill / Drill that I'm considering.


http://preview.tinyurl.com/gnmapmd

[Jared Sankovich]

I can't imagine not having a Mill and a lathe in my shop.

[David Malicky]

The BF20 (G0704) is one of the best choices in this price range, if your emphasis is milling. As a drill press, it is more rigid than a regular DP, but the quill stroke is only 2". Of course, the head can also go up/down, but it won't have the feedback or speed of a quill.

At a similar price, the Rong Fu RF-31 is much better as a drill press, and both better and worse as a mill. It has 5" quill stroke, much more iron and rigidity (650 lb vs 250 lb), a bit more swing (16.3" vs 15"), more headroom spindle-to-table (18" vs 13"), and higher quality. The round column is the only limitation for milling, since moving the head disturbs the alignment. But users have come up with many good solutions to this. Or, with just a little work-planning, there's usually no need to move the head during a setup.
Enco and Penn Tool have it for ~$1400, but Enco occasionally offers 20% off on machinery.
http://www.use-enco.com/1/1/3566-rf-31-1-e-rong-fu-mill-drill-combinations.html
Specs (first column): http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=545&PMCTLG=00

If you prefer the BF20 design's square column, variable speed, and/or lighter weight, and are flexible on price, I'd also look at the Precision Matthews PM-25MV. This is an upgraded and bit bigger BF20. The belt drive will be much quieter than the gears of other G0704s. The owner of that company (Matt N) is very good at finding/spec'ing machines with better features, especially for home shops.
http://www.machinetoolonline.com/PM-MV-BenchMills.html
(http://www.machinetoolonline.com/PM-MV-BenchMills.html)
All 3 of those are very good choices -- just depends what works best for you.

[Keith Weber]

Tim,

You never mentioned how many of these things you are trying to make. This thread has somehow drifted into you needing a mill to do this job. Metalworking is an expensive hobby. You could buy hundreds of those lathe turning tools off the shelf for what you'd invest in metalworking equipment to do projects like this with ease. Benchtop mills are great until you've used a real mill (read 2500 lbs.) or a 2000 lb. lathe. Then it just seems like a glorified drill press. Benchtop mills really lack the mass and rigidity to do anything other than very light cuts at a pace any higher than painfully slow. I've got lots of friends with benchtop mills and small lathes. They usually end up in my shop holding a very crudely cut part, asking if I wouldn't mind making them the part they're holding, but only a nice one.

Also, be aware that a mill is only a downpayment towards having a functional machine. Accessories, end mills, vises, indicators, collets, clamps, center/edge finders, rotary tables, etc., will easily cost as much or more than the mill. While I could cut the notch in your turning tool with my mill in a couple of minutes with my mill, I could also make one nearly as nice with my much, much cheaper 2"x48" belt grinder -- and it would also profile and sharpen your non-insert style turning tools.

If you want to take up metalworking as a hobby and don't mind forking out some cash, then by all means fill your boots. If you're just looking for a few insert turning tools, you'd have more money in your pocket if you just bought them, or just bought a nice little belt grinder and a nice set of Nicholson metal files.

[Tim Boger]

Tim,

You never mentioned how many of these things you are trying to make. This thread has somehow drifted into you needing a mill to do this job. Metalworking is an expensive hobby. You could buy hundreds of those lathe turning tools off the shelf for what you'd invest in metalworking equipment to do projects like this with ease. Benchtop mills are great until you've used a real mill (read 2500 lbs.) or a 2000 lb. lathe. Then it just seems like a glorified drill press. Benchtop mills really lack the mass and rigidity to do anything other than very light cuts at a pace any higher than painfully slow. I've got lots of friends with benchtop mills and small lathes. They usually end up in my shop holding a very crudely cut part, asking if I wouldn't mind making them the part they're holding, but only a nice one.

Also, be aware that a mill is only a downpayment towards having a functional machine. Accessories, end mills, vises, indicators, collets, clamps, center/edge finders, rotary tables, etc., will easily cost as much or more than the mill. While I could cut the notch in your turning tool with my mill in a couple of minutes with my mill, I could also make one nearly as nice with my much, much cheaper 2"x48" belt grinder -- and it would also profile and sharpen your non-insert style turning tools.

If you want to take up metalworking as a hobby and don't mind forking out some cash, then by all means fill your boots. If you're just looking for a few insert turning tools, you'd have more money in your pocket if you just bought them, or just bought a nice little belt grinder and a nice set of Nicholson metal files.

Hey Keith,

Thank you, you've really helped to put this in perspective.

I think the truth of the matter is I don't really want to get into metal working but more that I'd like to be able to produce a professional job on the turning tools I have begun making ... I can't see making more than 5-6 a month as I'd prefer making ornaments and other turned goodies.

I'll research the belt sander you're referring to, sounds like a more practical approach to what I'm after.

Like so many other tool junkies the lure of a overly fancy gadget (with respect to my needs) is tough to get out of my mind ...

Thanks for your feedback

Tim

[Mike Heidrick]

You need a buddy with a mill it sounds like.

[Tim Boger]

That would be danged handy ... yep.

I just finished a tool this morning and with a bit more focus than previous attempts it came out looking pretty good.

Tim

[Keith Weber]

I'll research the belt sander you're referring to, sounds like a more practical approach to what I'm after.

The grinder that I have is a Kalamazoo 2FSM. It's a 1/2 hp unit with a Baldor motor. I'd consider it a middle of the road, US-made grinder. On the upper end you can get Burr Kings and Feins, that will turn a 1/2" steel rod into dust in no time, but expect to pay $thousands for those. I think I paid about $325 for the Kalamazoo. Enco has them in their sales flyer ever so often, and you can combine that with their frequent 15-20% off offers they send you if you're on their e-mail list.

It's a handy tool to have in the shop. I can't remember ever using my regular wheel grinder since I bought it. You can change out the belts in seconds, and they range from 36 grit to 320 grit. Cheap, too -- about $2 or so for a belt. I have a metal bookshelf next to the grinder with about 3 belts of each grit on the shelves. I use it to profile and sharpen metal lathe cutters, take the burr or edge off pieces of metal, re-sharpen center punches, shorten screws and bolts, etc. The flat metal platen and the soft grind of a non-backed belt above it allows you way more flexibility than a regular grinder. The tool rest on the Kalamazoo isn't the best thing out there. It's bad enough that I think about machining a better one all the time, but good enough that I keep putting it off for another day.


You need a buddy with a mill it sounds like.

That's so true. I always tell people that everyone always told me that if you want to make new friends, join a gym, a club, take a class, etc. Forget that! If you really want to make friends, buy a milling machine! People will be lined up at your door to be your friend. LOL! It's like boats. Boats are great, but the best boat in the world is a buddy's boat!

[Tim Boger]

Great info Keith, I'm all over the internet this morning looking at these belt grinders ... thank you very much for your feedback, tremendously helpful.

Tim

The grinder that I have is a Kalamazoo 2FSM. It's a 1/2 hp unit with a Baldor motor. I'd consider it a middle of the road, US-made grinder. On the upper end you can get Burr Kings and Feins, that will turn a 1/2" steel rod into dust in no time, but expect to pay $thousands for those. I think I paid about $325 for the Kalamazoo. Enco has them in their sales flyer ever so often, and you can combine that with their frequent 15-20% off offers they send you if you're on their e-mail list.

It's a handy tool to have in the shop. I can't remember ever using my regular wheel grinder since I bought it. You can change out the belts in seconds, and they range from 36 grit to 320 grit. Cheap, too -- about $2 or so for a belt. I have a metal bookshelf next to the grinder with about 3 belts of each grit on the shelves. I use it to profile and sharpen metal lathe cutters, take the burr or edge off pieces of metal, re-sharpen center punches, shorten screws and bolts, etc. The flat metal platen and the soft grind of a non-backed belt above it allows you way more flexibility than a regular grinder. The tool rest on the Kalamazoo isn't the best thing out there. It's bad enough that I think about machining a better one all the time, but good enough that I keep putting it off for another day.



That's so true. I always tell people that everyone always told me that if you want to make new friends, join a gym, a club, take a class, etc. Forget that! If you really want to make friends, buy a milling machine! People will be lined up at your door to be your friend. LOL! It's like boats. Boats are great, but the best boat in the world is a buddy's boat!

[John Sanford]

I have a 14" Jet Bandsaw that I could put a metal cutting blade on but I've read that the blade speed may be an issue .... actually, I'm not certain a metal cutting blade is even available for that saw.

Yes, there are metal cutting blades available, as Jet has made (and may still make) a 14" Metal / Wood cutting bandsaw. The saw used a stepped pulley system, a la a drill press, to reduce the speed to a practical rate for metal cutting. If you don't reduce the speed, then it's not a good idea to attempt cutting anything other than brass, copper or aluminum with your bandsaw.

I doubt that you could get an accurate enough cut with any bandsaw you can put on a benchtop, BUT my metal work experience is minimal, so I could be wrong. The amount of cleanup you would have to do after would be barely less than the work involved in using a Dremel / die grinder / bench grinder to make the cut.

As indicated, a benchtop mill would be a much, much better solution.

[David Kumm]

Maybe not totally on point, but I replaced my drill press with an older Millrite. Made by Burke and then bought out by Powermatic. Doesn't take up much more room and a pretty decent mill for someone who does mainly wood stuff. Mixing metal and wood has it's own series of issues but I'd like the guys who really know metal working to chime in about the Millrite, or clausing type of smaller sized mills. Dave

[John K Jordan]

Mixing metal and wood has it's own series of issues...

I got a second drill press for metal to keep the oil away from the wood!

JKJ

[Keith Pleas]

I've mentioned this before - take a look at a Portaband with a replacement insert from Swag Offroad chucked into a vice. Used Portaband off CL and your into this maybe $150.

[Tim Boger]

Excellent link Keith, thanks!

[Keith Pleas]

Excellent link Keith, thanks!
I have done literally one YouTube video and it is exactly this set up. Just search under my name. I would do it for you but I am driving in my car at the moment.