Laminating and or steam bending teak?

[Patrick Walsh]

I want to build the chase pictured in the link but out of teak. I suppose i would not be able to bring the neds to such an abrupt taper. Other than that i think i should be able to make this peice out od wood and it retain enough structural integrity for normal use?

I can think of two ways to fabricate this out of wood.

The first idea is cutting smaller radiused sections to create the larger radius. If i do it in this way using mortis and tennon or a domino like floating tennon my concern is with how long the piece with last and stay strong.

Im inclined to think that building a jig and bending and laminating and glueing thin rips is the way to go. My concern with this approach is teak not liking glue so much.

I suppose steam bending solid stock is out of the question. I really know nothing about steam bending. I also do not have the equiptment. Common sense also tells me bending solid stock that thick is not gonna work.

Thoughts?

https://www.homeinfatuation.com/p/ozone-modern-outdoor-chaise

[Alan Schwabacher]

It seems to me the major use of steam bent wood -- and of teak -- is in wooden boats. I'd bet the guys who build them are the best ones to ask.

[Patrick Walsh]

Why i did not think of the boat connection to teak.

thank you!


It seems to me the major use of steam bent wood -- and of teak -- is in wooden boats. I'd bet the guys who build them are the best ones to ask.

[peter gagliardi]

Sawn and planed thin, then glued to a form would be easiest and strongest- nothing there requires steam, the bends are gradual and easy. Use an outdoor glue such as DAP brown resin glue or CP Adhesives #0503, and it will be pretty simple. If the wood is particularly waxy or oily feeling, wipe down glue surfaces just prior to gluing with lacquer thinner, and let evaporate off.

[John C Bush]

I have made steam bent, laminated fly fishing nets and I tried a few varieties of more exotic woods like teak, bloodwood and other colorful unknown hardwoods and had difficultiy with getting the teak to bond well with Titebond III. Wiped down with acetone before glue-up and still had delamination. I didn't try epoxy--didn't want to screw up the jigs. The minimal arch in your pic wouldn't require steaming and you could easily get 1/4"+ thick strips to flex in a clamped form. I used Dap resin glue--the powder you mix with water type--to build a cedar patio table and benches and the glue broke down after ~~10 years. Nice lines on the chaise--be sure to show pics when you get er done.

[Wayne Lomman]

If you are working with teak, a good quality marine grade epoxy glue such as West System is the only option, especially for outdoor exposure. It works with all oily species of which we have plenty in Australia. It is one of the first things I was taught doing teak fittings for ocean going yachts. Go with what John says and laminate the profiles from 1/4" strips.

I am probably sounding like a stuck record here but Titebond 3 will never work in this type of application regardless of the species used because it is not a structural glue. Check their website and you will find that they don't claim compliance with structural standards and a curved laminated beam is a structural application. Cheers

[Patrick Walsh]

1/4" laminations are what first came to mind. My concern was with regard to gluing teak. So long as people feel something like the West Systems epoxy will be sufficient i will go through with this project.

I just dont want to spend 100's of $$$$ on material only to have the joints fail.

Now i just have to source the nylon type fabric?

[Mike Cutler]

I want to build the chase pictured in the link but out of teak. I suppose i would not be able to bring the neds to such an abrupt taper. Other than that i think i should be able to make this peice out od wood and it retain enough structural integrity for normal use?

I can think of two ways to fabricate this out of wood.

The first idea is cutting smaller radiused sections to create the larger radius. If i do it in this way using mortis and tennon or a domino like floating tennon my concern is with how long the piece with last and stay strong.

Im inclined to think that building a jig and bending and laminating and glueing thin rips is the way to go. My concern with this approach is teak not liking glue so much.

I suppose steam bending solid stock is out of the question. I really know nothing about steam bending. I also do not have the equiptment. Common sense also tells me bending solid stock that thick is not gonna work.

Thoughts?

https://www.homeinfatuation.com/p/ozone-modern-outdoor-chaise


Patrick

No to the first idea. A system of smaller radiuses section glued together would not be strong enough.

Yes to the second idea. The closer you get the bent laminations to the correct shape, the stronger the total form.
That would not be a hard bend with teak as a single member. It will take a steamer though and would be a little bit of a challenging bend for a first timer.
If you combine the idea of bandsawing thin laminations, 1/8"-1/4", and then steam bending them as a single form, you're closer to what you probably want, and well within the abilities of someone trying to steam bend for the first time.
Steamers are very easy to build. Don't let that inhibit you because it doesn't take any exotic equipment. An old turkey fryer, or metal 5 gallon gas can, and some type of a propane burner, some high temperature hose, a sheet of foam board insulation, and you're in business. It's harder to build a bending form, than the steamer itself.;)

If it's going to sit outside, once you get it done, consider wrapping it in .5oz S-Glass, with and UV inhibitor in the resin. .5oz glass is very translucent and you would really have to get close to it to see that it was wrapped in fiberglass.

I'm not sure that the teak by itself will be strong enough in that form. One consideration is to have a stainless steel rod connect the two ends of each arc a few inches above the floor.

[Patrick Walsh]

As much as i would like to build the chaise out of teak only i am considering having a stainless frame fabricated exactly as shown in the picture. I could then laminate up the radius and various parts and fasten them to the frame.

The above is kinda a major project though and i could see building and it in such a way costing me nearly as much as the $3700 price tag of the chaise in the link.

For whatever reason I am the type that would rather spend the same amount building something that could be purchase for the same price. Why im not quite sure?

If i made it out of solid teak i am thinking i would have to add some heft to the frame in the way of wood. Imop this would greatly take away fro the ascetic of the design. I could also add some stainless wire or rod but that would take away from the design imop.

Dont anyone get their panties in a knot over a this project yet. I have two exterior passage doors to make out of teak prior to this project. Also a bench that has been put on hold as a result of my litttle garden building habit and the arival of spring and summer. My best guess Is his project happens late winter early spring next year.

The sadest part about this and im a bit reluctant to admit is that this will mostly serve as a dog bed for my two dogs. In their defence one of the of them has terrible environmental allergies and he cant lay anywhere outside on the ground without major consiquence.

[pat warner]

Had a pal that made bent (x coopering) modern rockers from teak & aluminum. Many failed, unexpectedly. He did not use epoxy.
He did make the same in other woods (cherry, walnut, oak), however.
And those did not fail. You might want to make 2.
The second one in your next favorite wood.
Teak is great with stainless and aluminum and epoxy.
(Fasteners hold well in teak.)
And that epoxy thrower should be experienced.

[Chris Fournier]

Bent lamination is the path I would take not steam bending. Having that SS frame fabricated would make the $3700 price of that chaise likely look pretty reasonable...

[Erik Loza]

Bent lamination is the path I would take not steam bending..

+1 ^^^^...

My colleague, Sam, made a bed for himself and his wife using bent-lam strips, ripped on the banddaw. Three species: Poplar, Maple, and Lyptus. I think there is some science in that fact. Varying softnesses allowing for more flexibility but don't quote me on it. for I believe he used a poly glue. It's been years but I do remember that it foamed like crazy. Photos of him, trimming the hardened form...

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i315/erikloza/Mini%20Max%20Bandsaw%20Works/BSStraightline014.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i315/erikloza/Mini%20Max%20Bandsaw%20Works/BSStraightline003.jpg

Erik

[Wayne Lomman]

Patrick, given that most of the concern seems to be about structural integrity, you could consider a composite curved beam for example use a teak core and pre-polished stainless steel flat bar for the top and/or bottom layers. It is not expensive to get flat bar rolled to the correct radius. You can bond the timber and steel by getting the glued face of the stainless coarsely sand blasted before gluing with epoxy. I prefer to work with timber but detailed joinery seems to include a lot of steel, copper, stone, ceramic, aluminium, GRP, carbon fibre etc. these days...Cheers.

[Mel Fulks]

Took Wayne's suggestion to look at Titebond 3 glue specs. They describe tests which seem to be structural,am I missing something ? I have heard of some companies not wanting to pay for testing to be cleared for structural use simply because it is expensive and they thought that just wasn't needed for their market. I don't see any reason to not use it for a lounge chair.

[Jamie Buxton]

Bent lamination would be straightforward, except for teak's reputation for rejecting glue. I'd build it in white oak, using epoxy for the adhesive. White oak stands up well outdoors, especially when properly finished. I'd use a spar varnish like Epiphanes, and plan on revarnishing it ever couple of years.
But be aware that a wood structure that slender is going to flex when you sit in it. Basically you have a couple of wooden 2x3s six feet long, and you're placing your weight in the middle. They'll bend. I'd add a horizontal stretcher near the floor. It prevents the arc ends from spreading apart when you sit on the chair. It doesn't have to be wood. It could be chain or aircraft cable.

[Mark Gibney]

I've made bent lamination pieces for furniture and I've used Gorilla Glue - it's cheaper and easier to use than epoxy, and it's easier on your jointer or planer blades if you need to run the pieces thru your machines.

About the sizing of the components of your lounge - I take designs I'm working on to a friend of mine who is a really good furniture designer / maker called Todd Ouwehand, and one thing he said about something I showed him was that he felt the pieces were too thin, that when he looks at furniture he wants it to look like it's made from wood, and not wood that wants to look like metal. And he makes a lot of very delicate, beautifully balanced pieces, so he's not someone with a bias towards thick heavy furniture. Maybe if would be good for you to make full sized drawings of the lounge with different dimensions of the components and see how you feel about it before committing .

And I like the idea of white oak people have suggested, over teak, but I don't enjoy working with tropical woods. Friend of mine made a suite of bedroom furniture from teak for a client recently and he said it dulled all his cutters real fast, and every three passes thru his machines he had to wipe off the oily build-up.

[Mark Gibney]

Just came across Thomas Moser's chaise lounge and it looks similar to the one you linked to -

http://www.thosmoser.com/category/lounge_seating/product/63/chaise/

[Wayne Lomman]

The TB3 quoted tests are for water resistance and compliance with chronic health standards. The data sheet says it is not to be used for structural or load bearing applications. This means it is OK where the joint carries the load and the glue keeps it tight eg glued mortise and tenon is strong because of the joint, not the glue. I use TB3 every day, just not for anything really important. If it is anything like out doors, a structural beam, a bench top, or getting 2 pack poly on it, it has to be a 2 pack glue every time. I learned this the hard way. Cheers!
http://www.titebond.com.au/PDFs/TitebondUltimate_data.pdf