Anyone read The Woodworker, The Charles Hayward Years?

[Frederick Skelly]

The table of contents looks interesting.

1) Has anyone read it yet?

2) Do you feel it was worth the $80 asking price for the 2 volume set?

3) Is there another book/set or author to which you'd say it compares favorably? For example, Graham Blackburn, etc?

I'm trying to decide whether to buy it while LV has free shipping.

Thanks guys!
Fred

[ken hatch]

Fred,

I have it, for now it is my bathroom read. It is an interesting read on several levels the first is the window it opens into turn of the Century wood working techniques. My second takeaway is just how much woodworking mags have changed. Is it worth $80 USD? My guess is, it depends on what you are looking for: Instruction, maybe. A look at where we came from, it is worth every penny.

ken

[Jim Belair]

I considered buying it until I read a comment that it was very repetitive- several articles on the same subject, sharpening scrapers, etc. Understandable since it is reprints of several years of magazine articles. The further point made by the same commenter (I can't recall who) was that it could have been distilled to one volume.

I will still take a look at it next time I'm in the store to see if it adds to the several historical WW books I already have.

[James Waldron]

The table of contents looks interesting.

1) Has anyone read it yet?

2) Do you feel it was worth the $80 asking price for the 2 volume set?

3) Is there another book/set or author to which you'd say it compares favorably? For example, Graham Blackburn, etc?

I'm trying to decide whether to buy it while LV has free shipping.

Thanks guys!
Feed

1) Have started a sequential read, going slowly in the evening. Most appreciated history when you go through that way. It's going to take a while to get through all of it - if I ever do.

1a) Have used it as a 'how to' reference based on what I'm doing. It turns out that it confirms a lot of what I've learned from others over time, but I've also learned a few new things that have been helpful and have had a number of points clarified and some of my thinking corrected (probably from not paying full attention to my master when I was supposed to be learning).

1b) The art work is a delight for those who wish to consider them as art.

1c) As someone who appreciates books the production values of these volumes are outstanding. Not everyone cares about such old fashioned things, so to each his own.

2) If any of the above are important to you, the price is very reasonable.

3) None of the contributors is Roubo, but taken collectively (and well marshaled and edited by Hayward and tidied up by the LAP folks) it's most comparable in my little library to the DVD of the complete set of Woodworker. And it's a lot more approachable than Roubo unless you are a student of early French literature.

If you don't buy it, you'll regret it. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but soon and for the rest of your life. It's easy to see that $80 doesn't mean a hill of beans in this crazy world.

Wait, I've been channeling Rick. Sorry.

[Tony Zaffuto]

Frederick,

My suggestion would be to search Amazon for a few of Hayward's books. Used Ones, in only good condition are cheap, and you won't think twice about dragging it into the shop. This way you can decide in due time if you want the compiled book of articles.

T.

[Frederick Skelly]

Ken, Jim, Jim and Tony,
Thanks for your thoughts here. I'm always looking for "how to" manuals (and use them as I try new things). I also enjoy the historical aspect of woodworking. I recently read a Hayward article about a woodworking shop in the 19th century, and was just drawn in by it. And as you said, the quality of work done by LAP is just beautiful. I have a couple others of theirs and they are truly quality products. Tony, I like your idea to try a used Hayward first. I'll do that today and if it suits, I'll circle back and buy both these new ones. I cant lose that way - LAP has free shipping.

Thanks again!
Fred

[Simon MacGowen]

You didn't say what other similar volumes you already have. If you have the Essential Woodworker, the Practical Woodworker and the like, you won't have much to lose if you pass this set. My local club has the two volume set. Vol. 1 is the basic stuff that has been covered in many other books and Vol. 2 is more interesting if you're into the techniques. If I were buying the publication, I'd skip the first volume. Yes, the duplication is distracting and may be they are there to fill the pages (?), but not necessary. I personally prefer one volume; the two as some have pointed out here or elsewhere can be combined into one bigger volume.

LAP is said to be working on other volumes and I hope they can improve on both the selection of the contents -- less is more -- when most of the topics have been covered and the number of pages.

Simon

[Alan Schwabacher]

The Hayward articles are quite repetitive, but have extra nuggets throughout. From the point of view of someone who has read a lot and used many of the techniques previously, I expect that I will be familiar with most of what I read. But as I go through the articles, I almost always find there is something I have not thought about, or perhaps just missed.

For instance, I have a Veritas depth gauge on my Stanley (71?) router plane. This morning I just noticed in one of the Hayward articles a description of how the Stanley depth stop is supposed to work: you set the blade to the final depth and the post acts as a sole in front of the cutter to limit cut depth until you reach final depth. It's so simple that now I can't imagine how I missed it, but I did. The books are full of such things.

A comparable book is hard to specify, since what you get out of the book depends on what it has in it that you don't already know. To someone new to hand tools, a more cohesive source would be valuable such as Aldren Watson's "Hand Tools, Their Ways and Workings". This book also has excellent clearly drawn illustrations and advice from someone who knows what he's talking about, but is a better book to read start to finish. Wearing's "The Essential Woodworker" is the other similarly comprehensive introduction I know with clearly drawn illustrations.

I much prefer the drawings to photos, but for those who prefer color photos in an introduction to hand tool woodworking, a good place to start (though less comprehensive) is Peter Korn's Woodworking Basics: Mastering the Essentials of Craftsmanship. This is much more limited than the other two books, but covers and contrasts hand and power tool approaches, taking you through several projects made both ways.

[Don Slaughter]

I started a 'front to back' read when I first got it but finding skipping around in it very pleasurable. I love the quality of the book and very happy with the content. It really seems to inspire me to focus more on the process an execution of tasks. I am happy to own these 2 volumes and have no regrets for purchasing it.

Don

[chase standifer]

If you read LAP Blog entires on these you will find that the repetitiveness was on purpose. The idea wasn't just to print the knowledge compiled in the magazine but to process and preserve the entirety of the work as it was written in format that will last longer than issues of magazines. One of Schwarz's missions is to preserve handwork knowledge and the goal here was to also preserve the these articles in their contemporary format and as a whole.

[James Waldron]

About all that repetition:

Anyone who has nothing to learn about woodworking tools or methods has no business reading these books at all. Silly waste of money and time.

For the rest of us, there's a lot in these books to learn and the more advanced one's skills, the more important the variety of points of emphasis and detail in the "repeated" articles in the book. The idea that these are mere repetition is a fallacy. Each article on a given topic do have a lot in common, but down in the details or out in the shop, there are differences that give (or withhold) clarity for each individual reader. One may not really enable the use of the tool or technique, while another informs and infuses the reader with enthusiasm. Different teachers find different responses in differing pupils.

An overly narrow field of vision can limit our perceptions.

[Chuck Nickerson]

I considered buying it until I read a comment that it was very repetitive- several articles on the same subject, sharpening scrapers, etc.

The article topics are repetitive but not the nitty-gritty details within the articles.

For me the books are well worth the $80, but then I spend freely for knowledge.

[Jim Belair]

I do have a few other Hayward books and have enjoyed much of his knowledge from them, I just choose not to get this set. If you don't have any Haywards and want to support the Schwarz venture, go for it.

[Peter Evans]

I have most of the original Woodworker magazines (loose and/or in bound annuals, the annuals do not include the advertisements), and enjoy them immensely. So I will not be picking up the LAP collection(s). However the LAPs are a good way to get the best of the magazines I suspect, and printed at a much higher level.

Cheers
Peter

[Matthew Springer]

I haven't had a lot of time to read the books (kids, etc) cover o cover, but I've heavily scanned them. They're good, I really enjoy them. The format make sit pretty easy to skim an article or two before I fall asleep.

They are very definitely a series of magazine articles, so yes, there's a moderate amount of repetition as others have noted. This is OK with me since I have raging ADD :-)

The writing is quite good. There's a lot of subtle stuff in there. If you hang out here long enough, you probably already know most of what's in them, but it's nice to get it all in one place with a consistent voice. FWIW, if you need a straight up Neander reference, Essential Woodworker (the other lost art book) is probably a better choice.

For the hayward books, in addition to the WW, there's also a couple sections on leaded glasswork reflecting the popular styles of the 20s-30s gothic revival.

[Frederick Skelly]

Well, I finally made up my mind after reading the excerpts posted on the LAP website. I ordered
Volume I: Tools and Volume III: Joinery. I may buy Volume III - don't know yet. And I haven't seen a table of contents or an excerpt of Volume IV. Anyone have it yet?

LAP does a beautiful job on their books and as soon as mine arrived I knew that they were worth the money. They are full size books - basically textbook size. Volume I has over 400 pages. Yes, there's repetition, but as someone else said, there are different nuggests in each article.

I figure I'll read Volume III as I need it - keep it mainly for reference. But Volume I is already yielding valuable sharpening tips that I can apply immediately. In his first article, I realized that I havent been getting the burr off my edge consistently and how to

I'm glad I bought them. For me, they're worth the money.

Fred

[Ted Phillips]

I've got all four volumes - and LOVE them. Aside from supporting Lost Art Press (which is a great resource for us craftsmen), it is an invaluable reference guide. I read all four volumes once, cover-to-cover. Now I go back and read specific sections as I need them. And often browse the book before beginning a project - to see if there are any tips that can help my techniques on that build.

I highly recommend purchasing them.

[Frederick Skelly]

Thanks Ted!

All: In case it helps, I got a note from LAP yesterday saying that they'd post an excerpt of Volume 4 this week.

Fred

[lowell holmes]

I went online and ordered it.

[Frederick Skelly]

I went online and ordered it.

That's great! Please let us know how you like it!