What are the different ways to rip-cut (joint) the roundover part of a 2x4x8'?

[Minh Tran]

Hi there,

I'm building a workbench top using 2x4x8's that are laid on their sides. The faces and edges need to be squared.
I've tried some of the following:

Hand Planing
Pros: Nice, smooth & glossy finish (on a 2x4), quiet
Cons: Takes too long (1-2hrs/pc)
Comments: I'm new to planing. Squaring two sides just by using is a bit of a hurdle. I've read on the SMC forum about a squaring guide
attachment (what is it called again?) that attaches to the side of a hand plane at 90° to the sole of the plane. But I haven't built/tried it yet.

Table Saw
Pros: Fast, I already have a table Saw
Cons: Occasional burn on the side of the blade, not a clean cut (requires sanding/planing), dangerous.
Comments: I'm trying to look for/come up with a jig design to support a 2x4 length-wise to minimize risk.

Jointer
Pros: Fast (3-5 mins per face)
Cons: High cost (+cost for debris collection system), loud
Comments: I could drop $60-$100 for membership (per month) at a makerspace to use their jointer but this isn't cost effective in the
long run.

Power Hand Planer
Pros: Less effort
Cons: There's still a learning curve to this device
Comments: Haven't actually tried this route.


I'll likely build a jig for my table saw but I wanted to see what others have in mind. I do plan to invest in a jointer in the long run but not
anytime soon (school loans, blah blah).

Best,
MT

Also, unrelated question: What is a hold-down twist clamp (one that lets you fix the base of the clamp to the top of horizontal surface and clamps towards the same surface) called?

[John Donhowe]

Hands down, the table saw is the easiest way to go. It shouldn't be too dangerous if you have infeed and outfeed support for your pieces. If you're getting burns regularly, you're blade might be dull or dirty, or the fence might not be parallel to the blade.

You didn't say how you set up the fence, but if you set it so that the body of the 2x4 was in the gap between the blade and the fence, I see how you could get burn marks and also feel more in danger. I'd set up the fence barely to the right of the blade (~1/8" gap), so that you're trimming off just the round over, and most of the 2x4 is to the left of the blade. You'd have better control, and less likelihood of binding between blade and fence.

Even if you have burn marks on the edges, they won't show anyway, since you'll be gluing them together, right?

[lowell holmes]

I would use my jointer (which you do not have) , otherwise rip it on table saw.

If it were just a board or two, I would probably use a hand plane, but more skill is required.

[Minh Tran]

Hands down, the table saw is the easiest way to go. It shouldn't be too dangerous if you have infeed and outfeed support for your pieces. If you're getting burns regularly, you're blade might be dull or dirty, or the fence might not be parallel to the blade.

You didn't say how you set up the fence, but if you set it so that the body of the 2x4 was in the gap between the blade and the fence, I see how you could get burn marks and also feel more in danger. I'd set up the fence barely to the right of the blade (~1/8" gap), so that you're trimming off just the round over, and most of the 2x4 is to the left of the blade. You'd have better control, and less likelihood of binding between blade and fence.

Even if you have burn marks on the edges, they won't show anyway, since you'll be gluing them together, right?

Spot on! The table saw fence isn't reliable because the end on the outfeed side of the fence is unsupported (it's a cheapo craftsman table saw). This is one of the biggest reasons why I don't use my table saw
often - the fence sucks and I haven't got the equipment nor the knowledge to tune it. I'm currently building a cross-cut sled so I can actually control squareness of the cut. Unless the sled is 8' long, I can't mill larger pieces as easily.

In the past, I've wedged the 2x4 between the fence and the blade so that the body of the blade comes into contact with the cut piece. This is probably what has caused the burn marks (the blade is lightly used).
8' is fairly long and it's hard to keep it against the fence once it's been through the cut. It never occurred to me to ask for help (to keep the cut end against the fence). Doh!

No, burns won't show and they won't matter but I can't live with myself knowing that I've avoided the problem :).

Best,
MT

[Prashun Patel]

Be very careful of kickback.

Get your saw into alignment, use a proper ripping blade, make sure you have a guard and splitter installed.

If u glue up the pieces one at a time it isn't so critical that the pieces be perfectly jointed.

[Adam Herman]

I would use my table saw as well, if i had quite a few to square, set up feather boards to hold down the 2x and an outfeed stand. It sounds like a look at Craigslist for a used, more precise table saw may be in order. I found my ridgid ts3650 for 300 a couple years ago, I see a few delta's around my area for 150 to 300 as well. sell your saw for 100 or so. power Hand planers are good if you need to size a door or something that is already square, but the surface is very short, so you can easily get waves in it. I find my table saw gets as much use as my miter saw and having one that i can setup very precisely is essential.

[Raymond Fries]

My vote is for tablesaw as well. I made two benches from the 2 x 4 material. A 24 TPI blade worked great.

Good luck with your project.

[Warren Wilson]

I use a roller stand for an "outfeed table" when ripping long pieces. You can get one for about $15 from harbour freight. Or buy two at that cost and have an infeed table as well! (Are you making the cut on the side of the board away from the fence? Your notion of "jamming a 2x4" between the fence and the material you are cutting prompts this question).

[Eric Schmid]

If you are buying framing lumber and trying to true up an edge and a face for joining I don't think your table saw rip fence is going to be much help as the first step. There are straight line jigs, but that's not going to help with the face. Since you say you are trying to square a face with an edge I assume you are joining these boards into a single glue up (or dry assembly)? And not just trying to remove the round over.

If you are feeding bowed, twisted and/or cupped lumber with the table and rip fence as reference, you are going to get the same out the back side of the blade. It also can be dangerous especially if the safety components are not in place and the safety of the saw is in question to begin with.

I think you are on the right track with the hand plane; true a face then an edge. Obviously a jointer can be faster; if you have one that is already set up correctly. Start by getting one face reasonably flat (or completely flat depending on your requirements). There are a number of ways you can true one edge once you have one face flat; hand plane, circular saw or router with edge guide or combination of these.

A powered hand plane will get you close quickly or make a huge mess quickly depending on the skill of the operator. They are prone to snipe on the infeed and outfeed ends, so starting with longer lumber than the final dimension is a good idea.

[glenn bradley]

Ripping 2x4's on a tablesaw is a recipe for kickback as is ripping any material that does not present a true milled surface to the table/fence junction. The table and fence are straight and true (we hope). Running irregular material past them will force the material in and out from the blade; you really, really don't want to do that. Lower the blade and run your material along the table/fence as if ripping and you will see what I mean. I rip any irregular material with the bandsaw (much more forgiving) and then mill the faces.

Joint a face, plane to thickness, joint and edge and rip to width. Otherwise you are forcing non-true surfaces together. The glue may hold but, the resulting tension will cause things to move about, now and in the future. Of course, once it finally settles down you can resurface the bench top and it should stay flat for some time.

[Bob Cooper]

May not be useful advice but I'd vote for 3/4" sheet goods rather than 2x4 lumber if you don't have a jointer and a planer. If you wanted you could sandwich a layer of 2x4 inside the sheet goods.

[william watts]

Glenn said it, you need a true edge to run against the fence.

I used a craftsmen saw for years. Unlike your fence, it locked on both ends, but would pull out of alignment when locked. A work around for me was to push the fence into alignment and put a clamp on the far end. It's worth the trouble especially on long, repeating rips. Sometimes I need to make do with what I have. Since moved on to a better saw.

[Lee Schierer]

First off, you need to align your table saw. I think you will have surprising results after you do that. It isn't that difficult to align your TS. Spend $20 and get a dial indicator, mount if to block of wood with a wood screw and clamp or mount that block of wood to your miter gauge. It will take about an hour. less than the time it takes you to hand plane one board and get out of square results.

If your saw is well aligned, the chances of a kickback are greatly reduced and the quality of the cut surface will also improve. With a quality 24 tooth rip blade you can clean up your 2 x 4's in less than an hour. Use feather boards to hold the 2 x 4 tight to your fence in front of the blade. Use a push stick to push the board through the final few feet of cut. Don't stand in the line of fire and insure that there isn't any thing that can be damaged behind you if the saw should kick back. Set your saw with the fence to the right of the blade so the straight 2 x 4 is against the fence, trim off just the round over and trim all your pieces with the saw in this set up. Then move your fence to trim the opposite side and again trim all your pieces.

Second point, Don't buy the cheap studs or precuts at your local big box store. Buy the premium grade which will be straighter and will have fewer knots. Better still visit a real lumber yard and buy their better grade 2 x 4's. Your bench will turn out much better.

[Robby Tacheny]

**Better option

Benchtop Planer:
Glue up 7 at a time and run them through a planer. You'll end up with nice square edges. Then glue your 10.5" blocks together. The end result should require very little clean up.

or

Just make a jig and run them through the planer to edge joint them. Get 1x8 and a 2x6. Rip the 2x6 in half and glue/nail/screw to each side of your 1x8. Now you have a sled to position your 2x4 for edge jointing on the planer.

Robby

[Mike Cutler]

As someone that has had to do this on a recurring basis, a Track saw is the quickest way to do it for a single board. Robert's method is a good one also, but that's going to be a somewhat heavy piece of material coming out of the back of the planer, and will require rollers and support.
My house was built in 1921, and all of the studs and joists are true measurement. If I want a "2x4", I have to start with a new 2x6 and rip it to width.

Getting a piece of "square" material out of a 2x4 is going to take some work. the tracks will out an initial straight edge on the material, but then if it need to be square, it will need to go to a jointer, and then a planer.

Follow Lee's advice and buy quality lumber. There is nothing in a big box store that you want.

[Mark Gibney]

Making a bench top is a big project, and just because you are working with relatively cheap materials it doesn't make it easier to do, just easier to accept the frustrations of it not working out.

For something like this I would reconsider joining your local woodworking club, or even finding a woodworking school in your area. They will have the equipment you need and hopefully people there who can give you some guidance on what to do.

Where are you located?

[Susumu Mori]

Hi Minh,

I did exactly the same; used 2x4 (actually 2x8 ripped in the middle) to build a workbench.

The problem is to establish two reference surfaces (one face and one edge). Without them, the tablesaw with a rip fence doesn't work well.

So, I guess you need to use a jointer first. Doesn't have to remove the roundover section completely for the initial two faces but unless your 2x4s are very straight, jointing one face and one edge usually remove most of the roundover part.

Once two faces are established, you can use a tablesaw, but because you have only less than 4 inches of width, tablesaw ripping could be unnerving. My preference is a bandsaw, followed by a jointer or planer. The bandsaw needs to be well tuned, though.

Susumu

[Frederick Skelly]

**Better option

Benchtop Planer:
Glue up 7 at a time and run them through a planer. You'll end up with nice square edges. Then glue your 10.5" blocks together. The end result should require very little clean up.
Robby

I agree with Robby. I did this and it worked very well. I recommend it.

Please be aware that regardless of how you do the edge jointing and glue-up, you will probably still have some high and low spots in places, and so need to flatten your new top after glue-up. The easiest way is to find a person or cabinet shop that has a wide enough planer or sander. The traditional and harder way (DAMHIKT) is to use a long straight edge and a #7 or #8 hand plane.

Fred

[John Seybold]

I agree with everybody who says you need to establish a straight edge and a flat face first before ripping away the other side on your table saw. But we obviously don't have enough neanderthals on this thread! If you pick your 2x4s carefully, they'll be pretty straight already, and with a jointer plane (like a #7) you can get your reference edge and face in just a few minutes. You don't need to plane it down to a perfect surface, as long as there are enough flat spots along the length of the board that there are always two flat spots in contact with the fence and table. Start with the face and knock off the high spots; then do the edge the same way. The only thing that will take time at first is getting a 90 degree angle between the two. Once you have enough reference surface, shave away the other side with your tablesaw, then flip the board around and take another 1/8" off to clean up your partially jointed edge. You might just have enough blade to do the faces the same way; if not, you'll need a planer. A benchtop model would be fine. I did this kind of thing for years (and still do it with boards too big for my jointer). It's amazing how fast you can do this operation with a hand plane, as long as you stop when you've done just enough.

[Michael Weber]

Never tried this, just thinking out loud. I'd attach the wide side of the 2 by 4 to a long piece of thin plywood wider than the 2 by 4. A few screws from the bottom of the plywood countersunk a bit to clear the table top. Overhang the edge of the board enough so you remove enough material to leave a clean edge. Run the opposite plywood edge along the fence. This will leave one straight edge regardless of how crooked the material is to begin with. This is a common technique for getting a straight edge on bowed or crooked hardwood lumber. The edge of the plywood (or other known straight material is the reference edge against the fence. Use the newly cut edge against the fence then to get the second edge straight and parallel. Crank the blade up, screw one of the now straight edges to the plywood and repeat the above for the long edges of the 2 by material. Again, just thinking and not sure it would work but may be worth trying. Of course this assumes your saw blade can be cranked up enough to rip the 2 by material in one pass after the edge material has been removed. That why I thought thin plywood might be needed but maybe not depending on your saw. If this is not really practicicle someone will let us know

[Anthony Whitesell]

Have you tried a circular saw and straightedge?

To change directions on you, I will now toss you a curveball. I suggest you use 2x8x16s. They will provide better quality lumber than a 2x4x8. The tree must be of larger and better quality to produce a 2" thick, 8" wide, and 16' long boards. Then split the 2x8x16 into four 2x4x8 pieces. Then glue each of the four pieces together and flatten the top of each section, then glue the 4x sections together. The second glue-up will be able to provide a flat top with little to no clean up (maybe some sanding for glue squeeze out.

Splitting the 2x8 will provide two 2x4 with the square edge you are looking for. You will still have the problem with the rip cut. I don't exactly understand the problem with the table saw. Anything longer than about 4 feet requires outfeed support. If the fence is having a problem staying put, I suggest clamping a piece of wood behind the fence to prevent it from moving. I often have this problem when trying to cut down 4/4 x 12"+ by 8' long boards from my mill. There is too much weight and leverage against the fence and latches. To keep a long board such as these against the fence, a featherboard or two is a must.

(I believe I pulled the basis for this from the bench build posts here of yesteryear. This is how I went about building my bench.)

[Charlie Velasquez]

Seems there are a lot of ways to skin this cat. Might as well give you mine.

First the disclaimer; this was edge gluing of 6/4 stock, not face gluing.
No jointer, was not into planes back then.

I glued up stock as is. Gave a very poor glue line but was pretty solid. Then I ripped down the glue lines and reglued.

[lowell holmes]

Seems there are a lot of ways to skin this cat. Might as well give you mine.

I glued up stock as is. Gave a very poor glue line but was pretty solid. Then I ripped down the glue lines and reglued.

I've done that. It works. It helps if you have a Woodworker II blade.

[Brian Henderson]

Tablesaw. Make sure everything is properly aligned, make sure you have a splitter/riving knife and make sure you have a hold-down on your fence so that the board cannot lift up. The reason you're getting burning is because your feed speed isn't consistent or your blade isn't sharp. If you stop feeding to reposition your hands, you will get burning as your blade causes friction against the piece while it isn't moving. Don't do that. Make sure that you are feeding at a constant rate throughout and that you have sufficient support at the back for the length of the board. Roller stands work great for that.