Wood River mortiser issues

[Wes Ramsey]

I guess I can't really complain because I got this mortiser for $100 barely (if ever) used, but I just finished my 3rd mortise in post oak and I'm not sure it will make it through the rest of the project. On the plus side it is easy enough to set up and the fence is square-ish with the table, though it has some up and down play when tight so I have to push it down each time I pull out the bit. I'm planning to add a wooden fence to take out the play and shim it square. The machine is heavy and feels solid enough - fit and finish are rough, but it seems useable and I like the extension wings.

However, one of the teeth on the handle hub broke on the first mortise. Another tooth broke on the next mortise. I tightened the retention spring and that seems to hold it together better, but the part is obviously weak and will almost certainly lose more teeth with use. Part of the problem was that the dovetail slot the head rides in was rough, which required more force to pull the handle down. I cleaned them up and put a light coat of grease on it and it rides better, but it still requires what I would consider an unreasonable amount of force to push a sharp chisel into the wood.

And the chisels are junk. I sharpened the 1/2" chisel and honed the flats to remove burrs. It was VERY sharp. However, on my first test piece all 4 points on the 1/2" chisel rolled out. I sharpened the chisel and auger and honed the outside edges again. On the next pass one of the points broke clean off. Next I tried the 3/8" chisel and got the same results. I know post oak is hard, but I didn't think it was harder than steel :eek:

This is my first experience with a mortiser so I read all I could and watched videos to figure out setup, sharpening, etc. As best I can tell I'm setting everything up correctly. Am I doing something wrong to have broken two chisels in two mortises or are they really junk? I haven't found many reviews on this machine, but most of them don't have anything nice to say about the chisels. I just find it hard to believe the OEM chisels are REALLY that bad...

Right now I'm torn between buying a nice set of new chisels for a like-new machine that's almost worn out or spending a little more for a whole new machine that comes with chisels. I may hedge my bet with a single new 1/2" chisel and hope for the best.

[Joe Jensen]

If you can get a replacement for the broken part I would give it a tune up. Smoothing the dovetails, etc is just a little bit of time. I suspect this same mortiser was branded many different brands and you may be able to get a part.

If not, I'd get rid of it and get a better machine.

[Robert Engel]

First, I would give it a shot and talk to Woodcraft about it. You may be surprised what they might do for "customer satisfaction" or maybe its still under warranty.

A dovetail key way should have set screws to adjust the play so I would check that sounds like its either gunked with grease or too tight.
Either way, teeth shouldn't be breaking off a gear. Probably a bad casting and/or lousy steel.

If cost effective, I would replace the part then do a thorough clean up, inspection and lube and try it again with a decent bit.

[Charles Taylor]

I'm pretty sure that mortiser is the same one that used to be badged Steel City. A kindly Creeker who lives nearby sold me his Steel City mortiser a couple of years ago. It's done everything I expect of it.

Unless the mortiser underwent another round of "value engineering" when it took on the WoodRiver name, it ought to be a capable machine. You can certainly get aftermarket chisels of better quality than the OEMs. If memory serves, there's a recent thread or two on that topic. You honed them--that's crucial; they must be kept sharp.

I'm wondering about the amount of force you say you're having to apply. You certainly have to give a mortiser more muscle than a drill press, but something is wrong (obviously) if you're applying enough to break gear teeth and chisel points. Is it technique, or defects in the machine, or something else? I can't tell. The fact that the chisels are breaking suggests that the excessive force is getting all the way to the workpiece. The drill bit should do most--not all, but most--of the work, and it will have a pace at which it works best.

Having said that...I noticed in the listing for the WoodRiver mortiser on that Amazin' retail site, one reviewer's gear broke almost immediately as well. Maybe it really isn't the machine it used to be, or maybe I don't work mine hard enough. :confused:

[Hoang N Nguyen]

I don't own a mortiser but have plans to buy one in the near future. In the mean time, I've been doing a lot of research as well as reading up on them. One thing I caught during my research is to let the drill bit lead the chisel by about 1/16" or so. This will allow the bit to remove the material before the chisel, in turn it will require less force to plunge the chisel into the wood. I'm not sure if you're already doing this or not but it may help with the issues you're having with the chisels.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

You shouldn't have to pull hard enough on the handle to break teeth off the sprocket!

I bought a General International mortiser. During my initial tests, I was a little disappointed. Then I discovered two things.

1. the bit set up is important as pointed out by Hoang. It's also important to sharpen that leading cutting edge on the bit. I use a jewelers file and then a small diamond hone card.

2. SHARP is the word. I use the mortiser chisel sharpening kit form WoodCraft and the diamond mortiser chisel honing kit from Rockler. The Wood Craft kit will cut a new inner edge on the chisel. The diamond honing kit will hone it. THEN, I hone the outside flat sides of the chisel.

Once I began placing a heavy emphasis on sharpening the bits and chisels, my disappointment became pleasure. When I built my wife's swing, every major joint was a mortise and tenon. IIRC, it took me just over 2 hours to make the (again IIRC) 51 mortises in that swing and that included stopping to touch up hone the chisel about 2/3 the way through the process.

Proper alignment and sharp, sharp, sharp!

[Wes Ramsey]

After much pondering this may have partly been due to setup. I may have had the auger leading the chisel too much on the 1/2", which might have allowed it to deflect to the side, clipping the tooth that broke off. One could make a case for that causing all the points to roll up on the first cut. When I put the 3/8" chisel on I used the tip of a screwdriver to offset the shoulder, installed the auger with the point flush with the chisel points, then pushed the chisel in the rest of the way. It acted the same way, though it did last a little longer before the teeth broke. And it may not be me at all - the 3/8" auger bit had a respectable amount of runout, so frequent contact with the chisel isn't too much of a stretch.

I've read good things about the LV economy chisel set, so as soon as I can come up with $70 I'll order those and the sharpening cones. I'll just have to set the joinery aside for now and finish milling the rest of the boards and panels.

[John TenEyck]

Before you spend money on chisels take a look at my horizontal router mortiser:

https://sites.google.com/site/jteneyckwoodworker/current-projects/horizontal-router-mortiser

You can build it from the free plans provided for about $150.

Or there is an improved one, like this, complete with a Tilting X-Table which is the bee's knees if you want to mortiser chair parts:


336432

You can find more photos and captions here: https://picasaweb.google.com/110467763477797452963/NewHorizontalRouterMortiser?authuser=0&authkey=Gv1sRgCKCY8NuN7Y7KjgE&feat=directlink

Both will cut mortises faster and more accurately than any mortiser and no clean up is required. No chisel sharpening is required either. You can cut mortises at just about any angle in any grain orientation. The machine also cuts integral tenons, sliding dovetails, and dovetails and finger joints on the ends of narrow stretchers. You also can use it to drill dowel and hinge holes.

If you want to build one from the plans I'm happy to answer any questions. If you want to know more about the improved version, please send me a PM. There are nearly a dozen folks now who are happy they did.

John
(https://picasaweb.google.com/110467763477797452963/NewHorizontalRouterMortiser?authuser=0&authkey=Gv1sRgCKCY8NuN7Y7KjgE&feat=directlink)











(https://sites.google.com/site/jteneyckwoodworker/current-projects/horizontal-router-mortiser)

[Earl McLain]

I usually set my auger depth with a penny or a dime. Bought my Jet used, with a set of unused Delta chisels that were okay when sharpened. Then lucked into an unused set of Fisch--world of difference.
earl

[Wes Ramsey]

Before you spend money on chisels take a look at my horizontal router mortiser:

(https://sites.google.com/site/jteneyckwoodworker/current-projects/horizontal-router-mortiser)

Thanks John, but that's out of my reach right now. Requires a router, which I'm currently doing without.

[John TenEyck]

No problem.

I can't imagine wood working w/o a router. It's an incredibly versatile piece of equipment.

John

[Wes Ramsey]

No problem.

I can't imagine wood working w/o a router. It's an incredibly versatile piece of equipment.

John

It's easy - just make everything with square edges :)

I've had one before and will again, but for now I'll do without. I've got half a mind to finish up this project with Rockler beadlock floating mortises since I have the jig and stock, but I would rather them all be the same joint type.