I need another sawset

[lowell holmes]

335470

These are my collection of sawsets. I think I need another one.:)

Left to right, they are Somax250, Tainter, and three Stanleys.

The one with the red handle is a 1960's vintage that belonged to my Father.

The 42X on the right is the one I use.

I started with the Tainter, then the Somax. Actually I inherited the red handle. It is a Stanley and it does quite well.
Then I just had to have a Stanley 42, so I ended up with two of them.
I'm not really sure of the model number of the Stanley in the middle.
I modified the 42X to accomodate fine tooth saws.

The Tainter was held in high regard back in the late 90's. It seems that house carpenters carried them and really was happy with them. I think I remember that the Seabees used them.

[Brent Cutshall]

I use and recommend a Millers Falls No.214. Wait I feel something foolish coming on.This is the M.F. 214, one of the most versatile saw sets in world, able to set teeth from 4 clean to 16 an inch. Now, in all this commotion, I can't recall if I've used all the settings or not, but you've got to ask yourself a question, do I think I need this saw set, well do you Lowell? I've always wanted to say that!:D

[Patrick Chase]

335470

These are my collection of sawsets. I think I need another one.:)

Left to right, they are Somax250, Tainter, and three Stanleys.

The one with the red handle is a 1960's vintage that belonged to my Father.

The 42X on the right is the one I use.

I started with the Tainter, then the Somax. Actually I inherited the red handle. It is a Stanley and it does quite well.
Then I just had to have a Stanley 42, so I ended up with two of them.
I'm not really sure of the model number of the Stanley in the middle.
I modified the 42X to accomodate fine tooth saws.

The Tainter was held in high regard back in the late 90's. It seems that house carpenters carried them and really was happy with them. I think I remember that the Seabees used them.

Weren't you telling us just a few days back that all you need to set a saw is a screwdriver?

[Derek Cohen]

Actually, Lowell, you do need another one! :)

An Eclipse #77. The Somax is a copy of the Eclipse, but not built as well. In particular, the anvil off the Eclipse is made of much harder steel, and I have not seen wear on any of mine. I prefer the Eclipse to the 42X. Having a few - they are quite common in Oz (look on Oz eBay) - the hammer was easily tuned for small teeth, and the anvil will take a fine set.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[lowell holmes]

I was responding to a post where the person had a fine tooth saw and needed to set the teeth. I was pointing out that a screwdriver set works.
I use the 42x on 12 -14 tpi. If I am working on a 20 tpi saw that needs to be filed rip (ala Frank Klausz) I will do the screwdriver set. My sets couldn't handle that fine tooth spacing.

Just curious, did you ever try a screwdriver set?

[lowell holmes]

I use and recommend a Millers Falls No.214. Wait I feel something foolish coming on.This is the M.F. 214, one of the most versatile saw sets in world, able to set teeth from 4 clean to 16 an inch. Now, in all this commotion, I can't recall if I've used all the settings or not, but you've got to ask yourself a question, do I think I need this saw set, well do you Lowell? I've always wanted to say that!:D

I don't need it, but now that I'm aware of it, I might have to get it. :)
I went to Isaac's web site. I like the looks of the M.F. 214.

[Derek Cohen]

....
Just curious, did you ever try a screwdriver set?

No - the Eclipse does a good and reliable job. How does one gauge the amount if set when using a screwdriver?

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Patrick Chase]

I was responding to a post where the person had a fine tooth saw and needed to set the teeth. I was pointing out that a screwdriver set works.
I use the 42x on 12 -14 tpi. If I am working on a 20 tpi saw that needs to be filed rip (ala Frank Klausz) I will do the screwdriver set. My sets couldn't handle that fine tooth spacing.

Just curious, did you ever try a screwdriver set?

Actually you were replying to somebody who had a 14 tpi saw: http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?242455-A-quot-problem-quot-with-LV-dovetail-saw&p=2548141#post2548141

Also, I've used both Somax and (more recently) 42X sets on 20 tpi saws. You just need to grind the plunger a bit.

I haven't screwdriver-set a saw. I like uniformity too much for that.

[lowell holmes]

No - the Eclipse does a good and reliable job. How does one gauge the amount if set when using a screwdriver?

Regards from Perth

Derek

Derek, On the matter of screwdriver set, I didn't imagine nor invent it. A pretty good woodworker, Frank Klausz, demonstrates it in his video "Hand Tools, Tuning and using chisels, planes and saws"
He demonstrates taking a mail order dovetail saw and making a good saw out of it. I bought an 8" Garlick and Sons saw off of the wall of a Woodcraft Store several years ago. I gave the saw Frank's treatment. To this day, it is a sharp, fast cutting, and straight cutting saw. It is my wall hanger saw. I keep my Lie Nielsens in air conditioned spaces and take them out when I want to use them. The wall hanger cuts as well as the expensive saws.

These teeth are 18 tpi. He joints the tooth line, removes all of the set, and sharpens the saw rip cut. Then he resets the teeth by placing the saw in a saw vice and starting at the heel of the saw, he carefully places a thin bladed screwdriver between the back two teeth and twisting. This action sets the teeth to opposite sides from each other. The amount of set is gentle and consistent. You can see the set as you set it. You go to every other set of teeth and repeat the action until you've done the whole blade. You may have to gently joint the sides of the teeth, but I don't remember doing it.

It is an honest fast cutting 8" saw to this day. The dvd is well done featuring an extremely talented woodworker. Screwdriver set is his concept, not mine.
Others that read this string are aghast at the concept, but it does work. Frank's dvd is one of my favorites.:)

[Patrick Chase]

Derek, On the matter of screwdriver set, I didn't imagine nor invent it. A pretty good woodworker, Frank Klausz, demonstrates it in his video "Hand Tools, Tuning and using chisels, planes and saws"

Frank Klausz is an amazing woodworker.

I wouldn't say I'm "aghast" at the idea of setting with a screwdriver - I just know that it takes a fair amount of muscle memory to do anything like that consistently. The same goes for hammer-setting.

[Phil Mueller]

Hi Lowell, I'm interested in how you go about modifying a saw set. Do you file the plunger, and if so, how do you go about that? Appreciate any and all details you could provide.
Phil

[lowell holmes]

Hi Lowell, I'm interested in how you go about modifying a saw set. Do you file the plunger, and if so, how do you go about that? Appreciate any and all details you could provide.
Phil
Phil,
I removed the plunger from the set and filed both sides until it is half as thick. That allows the set to work on the small teeth. It does not create any issues for larger teeth. If you will inspect the upper part of the set, it will become clear what to do. There were enough changes in various models, I can't speak to all of them.
The movable lever can be removed to gain access to the plunger.

It can be accomplished in about an hour. If I remember more, I will post it.

Check this link, it will help
https://paulsellers.com/2014/03/refining-sawsets/

[Phil Mueller]

Thanks Lowell!

[lowell holmes]

Frank Klausz is an amazing woodworker.

I wouldn't say I'm "aghast" at the idea of setting with a screwdriver - I just know that it takes a fair amount of muscle memory to do anything like that consistently.
Actually, I found that looking at the teeth while setting them, you see the limit of the set. I didn't find any issues with keeping the amount of set uniform.
Also, gentle jointing of the sides of the teeth pretty much makes the amount of set uniform. :)

[george wilson]

I don't like jointing the sides of saws. It makes the teeth's tips of unequal width. Rather than joint the edges,I'd recommend squeezing the saw's teeth in a smooth jawed machinist's vise(BUT smooth jawed ones are HARD to find! I removed the jaws of some vises and ground off those infernal rough surfaces myself. All they are good for is marring everything you clamp in them).

You can add tape to the sides of the blade to keep from squeezing the teeth too flat. I did that just the other day,in fact.

[george wilson]

Search "Is this the world's finest saw set?" to see an old,wonderful saw set that I am lucky enough to have. It will set VERY TINY small teeth,indeed,as well as regular size crosscut and rip saw teeth. Made about 1902. Cost $1.00 back then,and nickel plated with rosewood handle. Made like a piece of surgical equipment. How they made it for a dollar is astounding! Even though a dollar was worth much more ($20.00?) back then,its quality is amazing.

[lowell holmes]

I don't like jointing the sides of saws. It makes the teeth's tips of unequal width. Rather than joint the edges,I'd recommend squeezing the saw's teeth in a smooth jawed machinist's vise(BUT smooth jawed ones are HARD to find! I removed the jaws of some vises and ground off those infernal rough surfaces myself. All they are good for is marring everything you clamp in them).

You can add tape to the sides of the blade to keep from squeezing the teeth too flat. I did that just the other day,in fact.

I just learned something else from George.:)
Something about stoning the side of teeth never has set right with me, but I've done it on occasion.