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View Full Version : Trotec VS Epilog (yes, another thread)



Ivan Shuliak
03-16-2016, 8:54 AM
Hi,

I know, we've got lots of threads about which one is better but most of them got the same answers:
Choose based on support you get from your rep, Trotecs built like tanks, Epilogs are USA made etc.
But, having two of Epilog machines (Zing and Fusion M2) I want a Trotec machine, because most of you say Trotec is so much better. But why? Really?

I've tested the Trotec Speedy 360 before buying Fusion M2 and it cuts the files we normally cut much slower than Epilogs machine.
The files had lots of small details and that's where Trotec had problems. For example if we run the job at 100% speed it would take 28 minutes to complete, more than 3 times longer. The same file took 8 minutes on Epilog (Mini/Helix takes about 8min 30 seconds). When we adjusted Speedy's speed to 1% it would cut the file within 11-12 minutes, still 50% longer. Do you think it is a machine, or driver's issue?
Speedy 400 and SP500 machines are even slightly slower (close to Zing's speed).

Another thing is a Job manager. You always have to send a file to Job Manager on Trotecs machine first, then place them on the bed and then start the job. With Epilog you can send directly to machine from Corel Draw. No need to send it to Job Manager. Epilogs job manager gives you a preview of your job and the name of your file. Trotec doesn't have previews and you've got to rename the jobs as they don't transfer files names as job names. I know might sound as not an issue but when you have 100+ jobs to run through the day, it does make a difference.

Another thing - networking. It is very handy to have your machine connected to your network and not to one machine with USB. Not sure why Trotec doesn't have that option.

Yes, we don't engrave much, but is it really the only benefit from having a Trotec? Faster engraving, and, maybe, longer tube life?
I don't say Epilog is better. Every time I call their support I promise myself it will be the last my call to them - just useless. Also every day I find some new bug with the job manager and Fusion machine (Zing/Mini works just fine), Epilog says it's a "feature", not the bug.
Are there any owners of both brands working with them on daily basis? Which one do you like the best? I hope you can convince me to buy Trotec as our next machine but at the moment I can't see that selling point.

Raphael Weil
03-16-2016, 9:36 AM
I'm brand new to the Trotec but I can tell you:

-are you comparing apples and apples with speed? The Trotec tends to default at 500 DPI as per their instructions. But that's totally unnecessary in a lot of cases (like a 300 DPI file). 500 DPI will engrave twice as slow as 500 DPI. What was the Epilog engraving at?

-did they both have the same lenses? I do 1.5" lens on my Speedy 300, it does absurdly fine detail from 600 DPI files. I can show you pictures.

-There is a preview in Job Control, I use it all the time. It also totally shows the file name, not sure what you mean there.


From what I can tell, the support from Trotec is vastly superior to Epilog in my region. Everyone says as much who owns an Epilog and hears about Trotec ownership experience. What's more, most of the Epilog machines around me have had part replacements that you don't tend to hear happening with the Trotecs. I don't find Job Control perfect, but man I love engraving from it. I've never had so much control over settings coming from the Full Spectrum world.

Ivan Shuliak
03-16-2016, 9:56 AM
Hi Raphael, we didn't compare engraving speeds or quality between them, because I'm sure Trotec will be faster.
The most important for us was cutting and we played with settings as much as we could. I also left a file with Trotec to investigate further why Epilog takes 8 minutes to complete the job, but Trotec - 28. A day later they found that if you set speed to 1% it can do the job within 11-12 minutes.
When you send the job to job manager can you automatically have it names as a file name? From what we've been shown, you've got to type the job name when it is being transferred to job manager from corel draw.
Also what you need to do to see the previous? Epilog job manager just have them listed as thumbnails and it is very efficient in location the right job.

Ross Moshinsky
03-16-2016, 10:16 AM
1. Were both machines the exact same power?
2. Did you actually monitor the cut order?

My guess is the Epilog, for whatever reason, did your cut job in a logical way. My guess is the Trotec, for whatever reason, jumped around doing a little cutting here and a little cutting there. If that was the case, it will add a serious amount of time to the cut job because the laser is constantly "wasting" time moving while not cutting.

The reality is, the two machines, if they have similar power tubes, should run similar cut times. The only reason they wouldn't is inefficient path planning.

Ivan Shuliak
03-16-2016, 10:26 AM
Yes, I watched the Trotec machine. The power didn't really matter because it was card and we used 10% power.
Trotec took much longer time because... let me try to explain it somehow :) because if you imagine something as small as half of your nail with at least 3-5 bends on it, it wouldn't cut it smoothly from one node to another, but on the way between 2 nodes would do 10-15 moves up and down. It resulted in a line not being smooth but like saw teeth. When you put speed to 1%, it was then cutting without all those "rushed" unnecessary moves giving better quality and time

Ross Moshinsky
03-16-2016, 10:34 AM
Yes, I watched the Trotec machine. The power didn't really matter because it was card and we used 10% power.
Trotec took much longer time because... let me try to explain it somehow :) because if you imagine something as small as half of your nail with at least 3-5 bends on it, it wouldn't cut it smoothly from one node to another, but on the way between 2 nodes would do 10-15 moves up and down. It resulted in a line not being smooth but like saw teeth. When you put speed to 1%, it was then cutting without all those "rushed" unnecessary moves giving better quality and time

Trotec uses a weird scale for vector cutting. I may be slightly off on these figures but I think they recommend a max of 20% for cutting. 20% is essentially the equivalent of 100% on any other laser. So when you run at 1%, that could be the equivalent of 5% speed on your Epilog. It sounds like the settings need to be tweaked up a bit. Maybe running at 2.5% speed gets you right on the money. I don't know.

Did you use the default settings in the Job Manager software as a starting point? That's always smart with these machines. Then you can tweak it from there to get it to cut the way you want.

Scott Shepherd
03-16-2016, 10:42 AM
Yes, I watched the Trotec machine. The power didn't really matter because it was card and we used 10% power.
Trotec took much longer time because... let me try to explain it somehow :) because if you imagine something as small as half of your nail with at least 3-5 bends on it, it wouldn't cut it smoothly from one node to another, but on the way between 2 nodes would do 10-15 moves up and down. It resulted in a line not being smooth but like saw teeth. When you put speed to 1%, it was then cutting without all those "rushed" unnecessary moves giving better quality and time


Sounds like someone didn't know how to setup the Trotec correctly. On vector cutting, you will see very little difference between any machine, unless it's extremely intricate with lots of shapes and movement.

Ivan Shuliak
03-16-2016, 10:48 AM
Hi Scott,

I'm happy to send you the file :) If you manage to squeeze at least 8 minutes from it, you'll do a big favour to Trotec as we'll definitely be looking at buying their machine then :)
Job size is about A4, number of nodes 6400.

Ivan Shuliak
03-16-2016, 10:52 AM
Also, if you do "not optimized" vector sorting on Epilog, it will takes extra 30 seconds to complete the job (6% slower) because it will just from "here" to "there" all the time.
Also if you don't tick "send beziers and paths to driver" in Corel Draw's settings, Epilog will take also about 28 minutes, but not because of extra, unwanted movements, but just because it will cut slower.

Mike Null
03-16-2016, 11:27 AM
Your file is named in CorelDraw and sent to JC. There is no need to re-type anything.

Scott Shepherd
03-16-2016, 11:59 AM
You always have to send a file to Job Manager on Trotecs machine first, then place them on the bed and then start the job. With Epilog you can send directly to machine from Corel Draw. No need to send it to Job Manager. Epilogs job manager gives you a preview of your job and the name of your file. Trotec doesn't have previews and you've got to rename the jobs as they don't transfer files names as job names. I know might sound as not an issue but when you have 100+ jobs to run through the day, it does make a difference.

Not true. Select "Quick Print" and it'll send the job over and automatically start engraving instantly, without having to push a single button.

Sounds like someone wasn't all that familiar with Job Control that did the demo for you. Post the file, I'd be happy to try it, or PM me and I'll send you my email address.

Gary Hair
03-16-2016, 12:55 PM
Another thing is a Job manager. You always have to send a file to Job Manager on Trotecs machine first, then place them on the bed and then start the job. With Epilog you can send directly to machine from Corel Draw. No need to send it to Job Manager. Epilogs job manager gives you a preview of your job and the name of your file. Trotec doesn't have previews and you've got to rename the jobs as they don't transfer files names as job names. I know might sound as not an issue but when you have 100+ jobs to run through the day, it does make a difference.
Whoever told you any of this isn't familiar with Job Control. When you send the job from Corel it sends the name along with it. You can also see a preview in the job list window and you can see a WYSIWYG preview in the actually run window. You can select quick print and it will send to JC and it will run immediately.


Another thing - networking. It is very handy to have your machine connected to your network and not to one machine with USB. Not sure why Trotec doesn't have that option.
I'm not sure either. I have never had to use it but would be nice if it were available!



Yes, we don't engrave much, but is it really the only benefit from having a Trotec? Faster engraving, and, maybe, longer tube life?
I can't say from my short experience with my Trotec, but the ceramicore tubes are supposed to last much longer than the rest. Time will tell.

I have only had two co2 machines, a GCC and now the Trotec. The GCC was a real workhorse and I only sold it because my CPA said I had to spend some money or lose it in taxes... If the new GCC machines had any of the features that the Trotec has then I would have considered them, but they didn't. The Trotec price seems to be a bit higher than the rest but when you compare exact configurations then the difference is negligible. Plus, you can always use that as a negotiating tactic. I won't say how much I paid for mine, but I can say that I am 100% pleased with the price vs. any of what the competition had to offer.

Ivan Shuliak
03-16-2016, 12:58 PM
Thank you Scott, I've PM you, also it doesn't show that I have any sent messages. Can you please advise if you've received it?

Jiten Patel
03-16-2016, 1:03 PM
Ivan,

Send me the file and I will do a test on speed for you on our speedy 400.

We cut card all day and have pretty much mastered the speed vs quality issue.

Also if you are only cutting card, maybe a galvo would be a better investment for you for speed depending on the intricacy. To give you an idea of what we cut I have attached an image for you.

333915 333916

Ivan Shuliak
03-16-2016, 1:20 PM
Ivan,

Send me the file and I will do a test on speed for you on our speedy 400.

We cut card all day and have pretty much mastered the speed vs quality issue.


Hi Jit, I've just emailed it to you. Hope you'll do some magic with settings and will be able to get good results.
Your examples look really nice. Galvo would be great for our needs but the smallest size we do at the moment is about 10" x 12". Not sure if you can get that bed size galvo machine.

Rich Harman
03-16-2016, 2:58 PM
I don't have an answer for you but I can say that I've had the same experience with a Universal laser. The Universal had more power but would cut the exact same file about 1/4th (probably slower) as fast as my Shenhui. It was painfully slow. I think it had to do with the path having many short segments. They were 120 tooth gears, each tooth being about 1/8" with a proper involute shape. It didn't matter what speed we told it to cut at, larger features would cut normally.

Why my cheap Chinese laser can follow the path at speed just fine and the expensive mainstream brand can't, is a mystery to me.

Keith Winter
03-16-2016, 6:04 PM
I have been a big supporter of Trotec, but I would say I was very impressed with Universal's newer job control like software. I saw it last week show and I thought wow, this is very much like job control, it even had a few features I would definitely use and liked better than Job Control. Also Universal has the ability to cycle through and run jobs from the laser itself which is an advantage for repetitive jobs over Trotec. Does Epilog have the ability to scroll jobs and run them from the laser lcd screen itself like universal? If so that would be an advantage I would think.

I know your question was Epilog vs Trotec, however I would say in my opinion, it's now a closer race between Universal and Trotec, instead of Trotec vs Epilog. They all three are very nice lasers, but I think Epilog has fallen behind a bit. Trotec 1, Universal 2, Epilog 3 is how I would rate them, with universal making big gains in the past year or two closing the software gap. Epilog really hasn't closed the software gap Trotec has over the other lasers at all in my opinion. Also I see more complaints of Epilog issues on this board than Universal or Trotec. Leading me to assume (please correct me if I'm wrong) that they have more issues than Universals or Trotecs.



Hi,

I know, we've got lots of threads about which one is better but most of them got the same answers:
Choose based on support you get from your rep, Trotecs built like tanks, Epilogs are USA made etc.
But, having two of Epilog machines (Zing and Fusion M2) I want a Trotec machine, because most of you say Trotec is so much better. But why? Really?

I've tested the Trotec Speedy 360 before buying Fusion M2 and it cuts the files we normally cut much slower than Epilogs machine.
The files had lots of small details and that's where Trotec had problems. For example if we run the job at 100% speed it would take 28 minutes to complete, more than 3 times longer. The same file took 8 minutes on Epilog (Mini/Helix takes about 8min 30 seconds). When we adjusted Speedy's speed to 1% it would cut the file within 11-12 minutes, still 50% longer. Do you think it is a machine, or driver's issue?
Speedy 400 and SP500 machines are even slightly slower (close to Zing's speed).

Another thing is a Job manager. You always have to send a file to Job Manager on Trotecs machine first, then place them on the bed and then start the job. With Epilog you can send directly to machine from Corel Draw. No need to send it to Job Manager. Epilogs job manager gives you a preview of your job and the name of your file. Trotec doesn't have previews and you've got to rename the jobs as they don't transfer files names as job names. I know might sound as not an issue but when you have 100+ jobs to run through the day, it does make a difference.

Another thing - networking. It is very handy to have your machine connected to your network and not to one machine with USB. Not sure why Trotec doesn't have that option.

Yes, we don't engrave much, but is it really the only benefit from having a Trotec? Faster engraving, and, maybe, longer tube life?
I don't say Epilog is better. Every time I call their support I promise myself it will be the last my call to them - just useless. Also every day I find some new bug with the job manager and Fusion machine (Zing/Mini works just fine), Epilog says it's a "feature", not the bug.
Are there any owners of both brands working with them on daily basis? Which one do you like the best? I hope you can convince me to buy Trotec as our next machine but at the moment I can't see that selling point.

Keith Winter
03-16-2016, 6:14 PM
I would add to this, cutting isn't a great measure of the Trotec speed. Typically when cutting you are limited by the power of the laser much more so than how fast the laser can go. When cutting you are running at fractions of the total speed the laser can go when engraving. Great speed is not required to cut. Engraving is where the Trotecs excel, so if you are mainly cutting that levels the field significantly for all lasers no matter the brand and should run similar cut times just as Ross Said in this quote.


1. Were both machines the exact same power?
2. Did you actually monitor the cut order?

My guess is the Epilog, for whatever reason, did your cut job in a logical way. My guess is the Trotec, for whatever reason, jumped around doing a little cutting here and a little cutting there. If that was the case, it will add a serious amount of time to the cut job because the laser is constantly "wasting" time moving while not cutting.

The reality is, the two machines, if they have similar power tubes, should run similar cut times. The only reason they wouldn't is inefficient path planning.

Scott Shepherd
03-16-2016, 6:21 PM
I have been a big supporter of Trotec, but I would say I was very impressed with Universal's newer job control like software. I saw it last week show and I thought wow, this is very much like job control, it even had a few features I would definitely use and liked better than Job Control. Also Universal has the ability to cycle through and run jobs from the laser itself which is an advantage for repetitive jobs over Trotec. Does Epilog have the ability to scroll jobs and run them from the laser lcd screen itself like universal? If so that would be an advantage I would think.

I've said for years that I think Universal has the best software in the business. My perfect machine would be a Trotec with Universal's software.

Ivan Shuliak
03-16-2016, 6:23 PM
Hi Keith,
Yes, laser cutting speed should be about the same in theory, but they depend heavily on driver's side. You could tick a few boxes here and there and the machine will cut 3 times longer with the same speed and power settings.
I've never seen or test Universal machines, but will be at large show next month so will test as many vendors as possible :)
What I also like with Epilog, that they've got a dashboard and your jobs temporarily stored on the machine and you can scroll though them without the need to use your computer every time (probably that's what you meant with Universal).

Keith Winter
03-16-2016, 7:23 PM
Hi Keith,
Yes, laser cutting speed should be about the same in theory, but they depend heavily on driver's side. You could tick a few boxes here and there and the machine will cut 3 times longer with the same speed and power settings.
I've never seen or test Universal machines, but will be at large show next month so will test as many vendors as possible :)
What I also like with Epilog, that they've got a dashboard and your jobs temporarily stored on the machine and you can scroll though them without the need to use your computer every time (probably that's what you meant with Universal).

I mean there is a physical lcd pad on the laser you can scroll through on the universals and rerun the job from that. Trotec has no such feature.

Ali Kemp
03-17-2016, 12:48 AM
I would be curious to test this file too. I have an 80w speedy 400.

Ivan Shuliak
03-17-2016, 6:20 AM
I mean there is a physical lcd pad on the laser you can scroll through on the universals and rerun the job from that. Trotec has no such feature.
Yes, trotec doesn't have that but Epilog does and it is indeed very handy.

Keith Winter
03-17-2016, 8:47 AM
Ivan one other thing to look at. Since you cut a lot this might be important. The Trotec is at a disadvantage when it comes to smoke removal when cutting by the choice to use a 2" port on the downdraft table. This essentially cripples it's ability to remove the smoke from the bottom and it has to be dragged across the top of your material to the much more powerful top vents when cutting on the 400, there is simply not enough airflow from that 2" port. Universal on the other hand uses (two) 4" ports on their larger machines and has engineered them in such a way the downdraft table can take advantage of the full airflow of both ports. Top airflow can even be blocked increasing bottom airflow more. If you attempted to block the Trotec upper flow you would end up with a smokey mess because the one upper 4" port is completely separate from the one 2" lower exhaust meaning you'd only have a 2" port pulling smoke out unlike the universal where you'd get full pull from both 4" ports regardless of if the top is blocked off or not.

Scott Shepherd
03-17-2016, 9:23 AM
I believe all machines have their strengths and weaknesses. I haven't seen the perfect machine yet. I believe I can craft a file that will show the strengths of each machine and highlight the weakness of the competitors. I think ideally, we'd like to see features from the Epilog, Universal, and Trotec, all in one machine. There are things that each brand excels in, and that's why I believe it's near impossible to give someone an internet recommendation for a machine when we don't know any of the things they will do.

Just as an example, I've always said that I think the Epilog's driver system is superior for people that are into art and making unique things. You put it on the screen, you hit print, and it goes. The Universal always felt more like it was suited for mechanical people, like engineers, etc. If you want to control every little thing and be able to tweak things that wouldn't matter to an artist, then that's a better machine. I think the Trotec is like that as well. It you want to push the limits of what can be done, then it's incredibly powerful. However, most people don't have a clue what their machines are capable of.

I'd like to see the Trotec with Universal's software and a LCD screen on the machine, like the Universal PLS series (if they still put them on those machines- they seemed to remove them from some models).

It would also be REALLY nice if actual users had a LOT more input into the features. Sadly, that's not the case. I made my case for changes 3-4 years ago and I have yet to see them in the software.

Brian Leavitt
03-17-2016, 10:01 AM
The only things that really bother me about both Trotec and ULS (newer ones) is the fact that the PC has to be on and connected in order for either of them to run, and at least with ULS you can only run one machine per computer. Neither of these is the case with Epilog. I run all my lasers from one PC and I really couldn't have it any other way. Also, I can send a file to all of my lasers, shut off the computer, and still be able to run them without issue. Of course, my Epilog has not been without its problems. I got the Fusion when it first came out and I had a ton of issues with it. They were all finally sorted out a few months ago, and it's been great since then, but for a while there I hated Epilog.

Gary Hair
03-17-2016, 10:55 AM
the fact that the PC has to be on and connected in order for either of them to run
That is good and it's bad, depending on your situation. My GCC had a job history that I could scroll through on the panel, and I used that quite a bit to rerun jobs. At first I missed that on the Trotec but it lost its draw when I saw that being connected had its benefits - WYSIWYG for one, and interactive settings changes for another. The biggest one, however, is the ability to move the carriage to where I need it on the job and then place the job in Job Control how I want it relative to that point - centered, top left, bottom right, etc. Can't do that with a disconnected machine.


and at least with ULS you can only run one machine per computer.
The Trotec is USB so you would only be limited by the number of USB ports on your computer. I figure if I have more Trotecs than USB ports then I can probably afford another computer...

Keith Winter
03-17-2016, 12:44 PM
Gary for people like us that appreciate the LCD job screen on the laser itself, you might be interested to know on the Universal it's not an either or type of thing. You wouldn't have to give up that lcd screen or give up job control. On the Universal you get both. Whereas on the Trotec you give up the lcd job screen on the laser, and on the Epilog you give up the Job Control software but gain the lcd screen. I've expressed my desire for them to add an lcd screen to the Trotec National Sales manager and many others at Trotec but they said that's not likely to happen. Maybe if enough people asked they'd consider it. However for now you really have to decide what's important to you...


The Trotec is USB so you would only be limited by the number of USB ports on your computer. I figure if I have more Trotecs than USB ports then I can probably afford another computer...

I think you're incorrect there. You must have a separate job control to run each laser, you couldn't have two lasers running from one machine I don't believe.

Now let me give you another possiblity. Hypothetically using a 2 laser setup you would need at least 2 pcs however YOU CAN use a third pc also if you'd like to make all the job control files and set it up with file sharing and the other two pcs actually running the lasers would pull the files from the third pc essentially making the two pcs attached to the lasers dummy pcs. Why you would want to do this you might ask? Let's say you had another 1 or 2 lasers. So 4 lasers total. If you had a 5th pc creating all the files you wouldn't have to train the operators of the pcs to actually do anything other than select the file and press play. So one guy could be making all the files, and the other could be changing out all the materials and pressing play for the next job. Or if you were a single operator you could make all the files in the morning on one pc and print them all in the afternoon. It's meant for a high production area. I've never tried it myself but all of this is possible according to Trotec if you were so inclined.

Keith Winter
03-17-2016, 12:51 PM
See my post above, you could use $350 pcs to power the lasers and one pc to create all the files. So all you're talking about is a few hundred dollars per pc extra. In the grand scheme of things I wouldn't eliminate Trotec for this alone, it's not as bad as you think. Additionally perhaps ULS has something similar I don't know.


The only things that really bother me about both Trotec and ULS (newer ones) is the fact that the PC has to be on and connected in order for either of them to run, and at least with ULS you can only run one machine per computer. Neither of these is the case with Epilog. I run all my lasers from one PC and I really couldn't have it any other way. Also, I can send a file to all of my lasers, shut off the computer, and still be able to run them without issue. Of course, my Epilog has not been without its problems. I got the Fusion when it first came out and I had a ton of issues with it. They were all finally sorted out a few months ago, and it's been great since then, but for a while there I hated Epilog.

Gary Hair
03-17-2016, 12:57 PM
I've expressed my desire for them to add an lcd screen to the Trotec National Sales manager and many others at Trotec but they said that's not likely to happen. Maybe if enough people asked they'd consider it.
That would take a major redesign of the laser and from what I've been told, they don't like to do big changes, they prefer small incremental changes. It wouldn't stop me from buying another Trotec, the other features make me forget about that very small loss.


I think you're incorrect there.
Wouldn't be the first time...


You must have a separate job control to run each laser, you couldn't have two lasers running from one machine I don't believe.
Considering that JC is interactive with the laser, you are absolutely right. But could you have multiple instances of Job Control running on one computer?


Now let me give you another possiblity. Hypothetically using a 2 laser setup you would need at least 2 pcs however YOU CAN use a third pc also if you'd like to make all the job control files and set it up with file sharing and the other two pcs actually running the lasers would pull the files from the third pc essentially making the two pcs attached to the lasers dummy pcs.

I'm doing that now. I have my main design computer and a secondary computer that runs my DCS UV printer and the Trotec. I have JC installed on both computers and process jobs on either computer, whichever is handy at the time. I guess it would be fairly easy to set it up so you save the files on your "design" computer and then place them in the proper folder for the working computers.

Keith Winter
03-17-2016, 1:22 PM
Considering that JC is interactive with the laser, you are absolutely right. But could you have multiple instances of Job Control running on one computer?

I wouldn't know how to begin doing that. Considering how cheap pcs are today < $400 and the $ in mistakes it could cause if it made the laser stall, skip, or something I think the safer bet is to just use different pcs. Also if you use two different pcs if say an employee accidentally infects it with a virus that craps out the computer while trying to download spotify (true story ) you're not 100% down. :D:p

Brian Leavitt
03-17-2016, 1:34 PM
See my post above, you could use $350 pcs to power the lasers and one pc to create all the files. So all you're talking about is a few hundred dollars per pc extra. In the grand scheme of things I wouldn't eliminate Trotec for this alone, it's not as bad as you think. Additionally perhaps ULS has something similar I don't know.

I wouldn't eliminate Trotec because of this, either, but I couldn't run more than one Trotec machine. In my situation here, I spend 80% of my day on the computer and I wouldn't have time to go between computers to get jobs running. I need to be able to set it up, hit print, and press start on the machine. Anything more than that takes time I don't have. I also never have exact repeat jobs since I do mostly personalized awards. Plus I'm the only laser operator. But that's just my personal situation. I didn't and wouldn't recommend against Trotec at all. Just for the way I run things it wouldn't make sense, and I prefer for my lasers to be able to process jobs themselves.

Gary Hair
03-17-2016, 1:45 PM
Also if you use two different pcs if say an employee accidentally infects it with a virus that craps out the computer while trying to download spotify (true story ) you're not 100% down. :D:p

You mean "ex" employee, right?

Scott Shepherd
03-17-2016, 2:33 PM
It's like I said earlier, it's what your workflow is. For our workflow, the individual computers at each laser works better for us. Now we can have 3 people working on different customer files if needed and no one has to get off the "design computer" or wait in line to get to it.

Everyone here can run Corel and for the most part, create their own files while other jobs are running. That works for us. Might not work for you, but it doesn't mean it's a bad system, it just means it might not be right for your workflow.

Ivan Shuliak
03-17-2016, 4:48 PM
Yes, that's exactly my case. I can't imaging controlling 3 machines from 3 different computers for example. Even if all jobs are stored on the server and shared between them.
I normally send first jobs to the machines, start them and then send another 5-10 jobs while the first ones are running. They are saved on Epilogs and then I just select the next job on the machine's display. I don't touch the computer for another hour-two then.

Keith Winter
03-17-2016, 5:32 PM
You mean "ex" employee, right?

Haha! If I fired everyone that did something stupid I wouldn't have any employees. ;) Nor would anyone else. Getting someone to care about their work is hard these days...

Kev Williams
03-17-2016, 6:14 PM
my gawd, I can't even wrap my head around the idea of a separate computer for each of the 14 machines I have in this house...http://www.engraver1.com/gifs/nilly.gif

Scott Shepherd
03-17-2016, 6:57 PM
my gawd, I can't even wrap my head around the idea of a separate computer for each of the 14 machines I have in this house...http://www.engraver1.com/gifs/nilly.gif

Sure you can Kev!......

333999

Keith Winter
03-17-2016, 7:43 PM
Photo above from Kevs place last week? :)

Kev Williams
03-17-2016, 11:10 PM
Can't be my place, THAT place is neat & tidy... ;)

Jon Colley
03-18-2016, 11:28 AM
Most of our customers in Canada running multiple systems use one central PC and run the others headless via remote desktop software. If you have a Pro version of Windows, it's included and works well, but there are free alternatives such as VNC. One of our customers switched all of his systems (7) that were from a competitor to Trotecs and he is quite happy running like this.

Ivan Shuliak
03-18-2016, 3:16 PM
Most of our customers in Canada running multiple systems use one central PC and run the others headless via remote desktop software. If you have a Pro version of Windows, it's included and works well, but there are free alternatives such as VNC. One of our customers switched all of his systems (7) that were from a competitor to Trotecs and he is quite happy running like this.
Hi Jon,
Nice to hear from you. Would you be able to send my file to Austria and ask why Speedy machines cut it in 12 minutes and Epilog Mini/Helix/Fusion cut in 8 minutes (even 6 minutes 45 seconds after nodes optimisation).
I'm sure it is something to do with drivers and how they process small curves. It is almost twice slower.
Or would you advise me to contact them directly?
So many customers would benefit from it.

Keith Winter
03-18-2016, 4:54 PM
Ivan it's very likely a problem with your file as many others have said in this thread. Likely the ordering of your layers. If you want to post your file, if it's in Illustrator I can take a look, or if it's corel I bet one of the hundreds of corel users could take a quick peak.


Hi Jon,
Nice to hear from you. Would you be able to send my file to Austria and ask why Speedy machines cut it in 12 minutes and Epilog Mini/Helix/Fusion cut in 8 minutes (even 6 minutes 45 seconds after nodes optimisation).
I'm sure it is something to do with drivers and how they process small curves. It is almost twice slower.
Or would you advise me to contact them directly?
So many customers would benefit from it.

Scott Shepherd
03-18-2016, 6:11 PM
I confirmed Ivan's findings with his files.

Ivan Shuliak
03-18-2016, 6:57 PM
Ivan it's very likely a problem with your file as many others have said in this thread. Likely the ordering of your layers. If you want to post your file, if it's in Illustrator I can take a look, or if it's corel I bet one of the hundreds of corel users could take a quick peak.
Hi Keith, unfortunately it is not a file, but just a type of job. It has got lots of details and Trotec machines (drives) just can't handle them at the moment at the speed they could. Scott checked the file, and it took 12 minutes on his Speedy 300 machine whereas it takes about 6m 45s now on my Fusion M2.
PM me your email address and I'll happily send the file across to you as well.

Keith Winter
03-18-2016, 7:03 PM
That's interesting. Scott what is it with the file that's causing it you think? Ivan I'll pm you. Please also send the lens size you are using and all details on the material you are cutting

Ivan Shuliak
03-18-2016, 7:16 PM
Emailed.
1.5" and 2.0" lenses. Don't make any difference really.
It is card. We cut it at 41% speed on Fusion at 15% power (75W tube).

Kevin Groenke
03-19-2016, 11:23 PM
If you're interested in somebody running this on a ULS (6.150D) send the file (.ai, .dwg. or dxf) and I'll try to give it a run.

-kevin

Jiten Patel
03-20-2016, 6:26 AM
I can confirm the 12 minutes too. The Epilog seems much faster which is very unusual?! Any insight into this would be great as we are thinking about getting a new machine. Saying that we are probably going with another galvo (150-200w) with potentially a moving head for a larger cutting area.

Keith Winter
03-21-2016, 11:30 AM
Looking at the file, it's a tree with many many branches. It's all combined into a compound path when I import it into my Illustrator 5.1 and then it appears grouped into tiny sections of the tree and one group that does the outside. Dozens of tiny sections. Curiously they are all black which is engrave on a Trotec, instead of the red I was expecting. What was this created in Ivan?

I would speculate the problem in speed has to do with all the tiny groupings, they are likely going to cause the laser to pop all over the file in tiny sections. I didn't run the file, but when I've seen this before it causes the laser to jump around on the file in Trotec Job Control. If they were all moved to one layer and then all the paths closed that should speed it up dramatically. Then again Job Control (ideally) should be optimizing the file and running it in logical (fastest) order when it runs it. My chinese laser does, it's curious that Trotec doesn't.

Steve and Jit did you come to similar conclusions about the file?

Jiten Patel
03-23-2016, 6:59 AM
Hi Keith,

I ran it as it was and then cleaned up the file using some plugins (reduced nodes) and un-grouped and release all compound shapes. Slight improvement but nothing to write home about. I am still very surprised at the Epilogs performance which to me doesn't make sense. Maybe a side-by-side comparison of the file actually cut from both machines would give some insight?

EDIT: What I was getting at with the last point was to see the quality of the cut from each machine. The trotec can perform quicker with the compromise of quality which for us isn't an option.

Matt McCoy
03-23-2016, 11:57 AM
I love a good drag race with data. I'm sure I'm not the only one that appreciates the time folks took to post their results.

Ivan Shuliak
03-24-2016, 9:06 AM
Looking at the file, it's a tree with many many branches. It's all combined into a compound path when I import it into my Illustrator 5.1 and then it appears grouped into tiny sections of the tree and one group that does the outside. Dozens of tiny sections. Curiously they are all black which is engrave on a Trotec, instead of the red I was expecting. What was this created in Ivan?
The file is created in Corel and all the parts welded together to make sure it is one long curve.
I've exported it to AI as you've requested, but didn't change the black lines (I use them on epilog instead of red ones).
The way laser handles vector depends on drivers. On Epilog machines if you run the job without vector sorting optimisation it cuts the file within 8 minutes. If you run it with vector sorting optimisation (so it doesn't jump from point to another) I will complete the job in 7m 30s roughly. If you optimise the file itself and reduce the nodes from 6500 to 4600 (roughly), it completes the job within 6 minutes and 45s.
We could cut quicker but the quality is getting worse. 40% speed gives you about the same quality as 5% speed (all tiny cures are smooth and look nice).

Keith Winter
03-24-2016, 10:19 AM
The file is created in Corel and all the parts welded together to make sure it is one long curve.
I've exported it to AI as you've requested, but didn't change the black lines (I use them on epilog instead of red ones).
The way laser handles vector depends on drivers. On Epilog machines if you run the job without vector sorting optimisation it cuts the file within 8 minutes. If you run it with vector sorting optimisation (so it doesn't jump from point to another) I will complete the job in 7m 30s roughly. If you optimise the file itself and reduce the nodes from 6500 to 4600 (roughly), it completes the job within 6 minutes and 45s.
We could cut quicker but the quality is getting worse. 40% speed gives you about the same quality as 5% speed (all tiny cures are smooth and look nice).

Ok so I think my Illustrator analysis doesn't really help the case then. The file I received had nearly 10,000 points and dozens of little groupings. Something must have been lost of messed up in translation from corel to Illustrator. It sounds like there is a definite issue that Scott and Jit saw. I trust both of their judge and analysis explicitly. Trotec needs to see the file, I think if they figure out what's going wrong here, it could have benefits for all of their customers. AND it may help them sell more lasers because they can advertise it as even faster at cutting.

Kevin Groenke
03-24-2016, 6:00 PM
Hello Ivan,

I'm still willing to test the file on a ULS PLS 6.150. I pm'd you my email address.

-kevin

Ivan Shuliak
03-25-2016, 4:51 PM
Hello Ivan,

I'm still willing to test the file on a ULS PLS 6.150. I pm'd you my email address.

-kevin
Hi Kevin,

Sorry about the delay. I've just send two files (standard and optimised). Interesting what ULS machine can do.

Michael Lockwood
03-26-2017, 4:33 AM
Hi Keith, I note you have a Thunder laser 130 ref , would appreciate your thoughts on how good the machine is, faults and repairs needed and how long there tube last please. Reading a lot about lasers before jumping in the deep end. Kind regards Mike , from U.K.

Robert . Payne
03-27-2017, 8:10 AM
I have been a big supporter of Trotec, but I would say I was very impressed with Universal's newer job control like software. I saw it last week show and I thought wow, this is very much like job control, it even had a few features I would definitely use and liked better than Job Control. Also Universal has the ability to cycle through and run jobs from the laser itself which is an advantage for repetitive jobs over Trotec. Does Epilog have the ability to scroll jobs and run them from the laser lcd screen itself like universal? If so that would be an advantage I would think.

I know your question was Epilog vs Trotec, however I would say in my opinion, it's now a closer race between Universal and Trotec, instead of Trotec vs Epilog. They all three are very nice lasers, but I think Epilog has fallen behind a bit. Trotec 1, Universal 2, Epilog 3 is how I would rate them, with universal making big gains in the past year or two closing the software gap. Epilog really hasn't closed the software gap Trotec has over the other lasers at all in my opinion. Also I see more complaints of Epilog issues on this board than Universal or Trotec. Leading me to assume (please correct me if I'm wrong) that they have more issues than Universals or Trotecs.

Curious Keith is this a new piece of software that isn't currently out on their production machines? I absolutely *hate* Universal's software but generally speaking I think all 3 of the bunch have horrible interfaces (and no shortcut keys :'().

As a software developer my dream would be any one of these manufacturers that would open source the GUI portion of their software for improvements!

Tim Bateson
03-27-2017, 9:04 AM
Epilog has a very good Job Control too... I find very little use for it, so I don't.

mike wallis
03-30-2017, 12:34 AM
I have a Trotec Speedy 300 (100 watt), before that I had a Epilog Mini. The Trotec is faster in engraving speed however... The software is no comparison to Epilogs. You would think that being a direct connect via USB that the Job would come over fast on the Trotec. It's slow. It's slow transferring to the job control and then slow transferring to the laser. It takes around 1-5 minutes from the time I print in Corel to the time it actually starts engraving the file. This is with the quick print option enabled. With my epilog the files would come over and ready to print in a matter of seconds. Another issue I have is the lack of direct control to adjust the power and speed while the laser is already running. I'm told it can be adjusted from the job control while running but I can never seem to get it to adjust (Maybe something I'm doing wrong). On the Epilog you can simply control the power from the laser control panel.
Lastly I'm not a fan of needing a dedicated computer to run the Laser. If the computer freezes for whatever reason then you could lose product and time. On the Epilog it's all self contained. Once the file comes over it will run even if the computer freezes. Trotec rant over...

Scott Shepherd
03-30-2017, 7:58 AM
The software is no comparison to Epilogs. You would think that being a direct connect via USB that the Job would come over fast on the Trotec. It's slow. It's slow transferring to the job control and then slow transferring to the laser. It takes around 1-5 minutes from the time I print in Corel to the time it actually starts engraving the file. This is with the quick print option enabled. With my epilog the files would come over and ready to print in a matter of seconds. Another issue I have is the lack of direct control to adjust the power and speed while the laser is already running. I'm told it can be adjusted from the job control while running but I can never seem to get it to adjust (Maybe something I'm doing wrong). On the Epilog you can simply control the power from the laser control panel.
Lastly I'm not a fan of needing a dedicated computer to run the Laser. If the computer freezes for whatever reason then you could lose product and time. On the Epilog it's all self contained. Once the file comes over it will run even if the computer freezes. Trotec rant over...

You need to call tech support and get that addressed. When I hit print, by the time I minimize Corel and Maximize JCX, the job is there, so we're talking seconds. If you are getting minutes, you've got something going on that needs to be corrected.

Yes, you can adjust power on the fly with the Trotec.

I've said for years that you can find a weakness in every manufacturers system and say that one does something better than the other. That hasn't changed. However, unless you do that one thing all day as your business, you need to compare the overall benefit of one versus the other. When you stack up benefits over a years time, then cost benefits start to become real and those things need to be considered. Over the years I could have easily provided you with a file that would make any of the big three show their weaknesses. The point isn't that each system has a weakness in their system, but whether or not those weaknesses get addressed when reported. Everything I've reported to Trotec has been addressed.

It is my belief that there isn't a more powerful Job Control system on the market than Trotec's JCX. I will also say that many people don't even scratch the surface on what it can do or how to use it to it's potential. You may or may not need that power in your Job Control.

Keith Outten
03-30-2017, 8:20 AM
Mike,

Every file I have ever sent from my computer to my Trotec Speedy 300 went in just a few seconds. I can tell you that soon after I got my Trotec the USB cable failed and I replaced it, that's the only thing that comes to mind that may be a reason for my file transfer speeds. I don't remember the original USB cable being slow but it was too long ago. I never use the quick print option.

Mike Null
03-30-2017, 11:08 AM
Mine is about the same as Steve's and Keith's. By the time I enlarge JCX the file is there. I also agree with Steve that JC has more power than msot of us will ever use. My work is pretty simple, repetitive stuff and I don't scratch the surface of what JC can do.

mike wallis
03-30-2017, 3:00 PM
You need to call tech support and get that addressed. When I hit print, by the time I minimize Corel and Maximize JCX, the job is there, so we're talking seconds. If you are getting minutes, you've got something going on that needs to be corrected.

Yes, you can adjust power on the fly with the Trotec.

I've said for years that you can find a weakness in every manufacturers system and say that one does something better than the other. That hasn't changed. However, unless you do that one thing all day as your business, you need to compare the overall benefit of one versus the other. When you stack up benefits over a years time, then cost benefits start to become real and those things need to be considered. Over the years I could have easily provided you with a file that would make any of the big three show their weaknesses. The point isn't that each system has a weakness in their system, but whether or not those weaknesses get addressed when reported. Everything I've reported to Trotec has been addressed.

It is my belief that there isn't a more powerful Job Control system on the market than Trotec's JCX. I will also say that many people don't even scratch the surface on what it can do or how to use it to it's potential. You may or may not need that power in your Job Control.

I'll try giving them a call about the speed. In my opinion the job control software makes Windows 7 slower or bog down. I've installed it on two computers and after installing there was a noticeable slow down.
Another issue I have is when using the quick print feature for the first time in the morning (Job control closed). After sending to job control if all your previous jobs from the day before are not deleted job control tries to load every job onto the plate and start engraving automatically. I call tech support and they are aware of the issue. The only way around it is to make sure that all the jobs from the previous day are deleted in the job panel. It sure would be nice to bypass the job control all together, I have yet to have a need for it.

Scott Shepherd
03-30-2017, 3:45 PM
I'll try giving them a call about the speed. In my opinion the job control software makes Windows 7 slower or bog down. I've installed it on two computers and after installing there was a noticeable slow down.


Two things, one, something is wrong, JCX shouldn't slow any computer down, it's not a resource hog by any means. I've never seen any performance issues. There are some things to check. One question, what engraving mode are you sending jobs over as? Black/White? Color? Also, what's the nature of what you are doing? I don't need details, but are you engraving photographs, text, large, small, two words, two thousand words? Just some general idea would help.

Second thing, why are you using quick print? It's only saving you one double click of the mouse. Not a problem using it, but you're the first person I've ever seen that uses quick print for everything so I'm a little curious on your work flow. You might be doing it the best way, or maybe we can help you find a better way.

Mike Null
03-30-2017, 4:09 PM
I use Win 7 Pro. It is my all-purpose pc--books, email, Word,Excel and the laser plus 3 printers. I do not have the issue that you are describing. I believe you have identified the wrong culprit.

Scott Shepherd
03-30-2017, 6:45 PM
Mike, can you check something for me? Let me know what settings you are using (mode- black/white, color, photograph, etc), and also go to your local hard drive in Windows Explorer and find the "Program Data" folder. Go into that, go into "Trotec", then which ever job control version you are using "10.5.1" or whatever it is, then into "Spool". Sort the files by size and tell me what size your top 5 largest files are.

Let me know, when you get time. Of course it's possible you have no jobs in there, so we'll have to go another direction if that's the case.

mike wallis
03-30-2017, 9:00 PM
Two things, one, something is wrong, JCX shouldn't slow any computer down, it's not a resource hog by any means. I've never seen any performance issues. There are some things to check. One question, what engraving mode are you sending jobs over as? Black/White? Color? Also, what's the nature of what you are doing? I don't need details, but are you engraving photographs, text, large, small, two words, two thousand words? Just some general idea would help.

Second thing, why are you using quick print? It's only saving you one double click of the mouse. Not a problem using it, but you're the first person I've ever seen that uses quick print for everything so I'm a little curious on your work flow. You might be doing it the best way, or maybe we can help you find a better way.

Hi Scott,
We engrave mostly photographs (Wood/Granite) on sizes that range between 4x6" to 18x24". The resolutions range from 333 dpi to 500 dpi when printing. For the engraving mode it's usually "Color" but at times we use "Floyd". The small files take between 30 sec to 3 min to come over to Job Control. Larger ones can longer.
For the "Quick Print" feature we use it for just that, quick printing. It is suppose to eliminate a step by needing to go into the job control. For me it's a no brainer to skip the job control since I never need to adjust anything in there. If I have 15 jobs to do that day and I "quick Print" then I've save steps and time. If there is a better way I would be open to trying.

mike wallis
03-30-2017, 9:02 PM
Mike, can you check something for me? Let me know what settings you are using (mode- black/white, color, photograph, etc), and also go to your local hard drive in Windows Explorer and find the "Program Data" folder. Go into that, go into "Trotec", then which ever job control version you are using "10.5.1" or whatever it is, then into "Spool". Sort the files by size and tell me what size your top 5 largest files are.

Let me know, when you get time. Of course it's possible you have no jobs in there, so we'll have to go another direction if that's the case.

Will Do Scott. I'll go into it tomorrow and let you know.

Thanks

Scott Shepherd
03-30-2017, 9:45 PM
Mike, I wouldn't use color with photograph mode. That could cause some issues like you are seeing, I believe. I'd have to test a few things but I'd make that change and try it and see if it resolves the speed issue.

I might be wrong, but that's where I'd start.

Scott Shepherd
03-30-2017, 9:54 PM
Also, I thought QuickPrint sent the job over, started it running, and deleted the job off the plate when done. If that's happening, how are you having jobs left on the plate to move to the queue that get pulled back onto the plate when starting up in the morning? Are you using a combination of QuickPrint and sending jobs to the queue?

mike wallis
03-31-2017, 12:05 AM
Mike, I wouldn't use color with photograph mode. That could cause some issues like you are seeing, I believe. I'd have to test a few things but I'd make that change and try it and see if it resolves the speed issue.

I might be wrong, but that's where I'd start.

Hey Scott,
I forgot to mention that we use "Standard" for the process mode. Our setting typically look like this

Process mode: Standard
Resolution: 333-500dpi
Halftone: Color, Floyd or sometimes Order Dithering

We use color mode because it is basically is a pass though (Does no Processing) to the image. This works well when you have already used an image processing software such as photograve and you do not want the print driver to change the image any further. Note that I process using an action in Photoshop which converts to a halftone image. I've found that when I use one of the other halftone settings other than "color" after the image is processed I sometimes get strange patterns in the final engraving.

This seems to work well however I'm always open to suggestions.

mike wallis
03-31-2017, 12:10 AM
Also, I thought QuickPrint sent the job over, started it running, and deleted the job off the plate when done. If that's happening, how are you having jobs left on the plate to move to the queue that get pulled back onto the plate when starting up in the morning? Are you using a combination of QuickPrint and sending jobs to the queue?

That would be great if it did that and I even contacted tech support who said that it will not delete the job after it's finished. It seems like it would be a simple fix/update to have it automatically delete it after the job is done. To me it seems the Trotec software is setup for more of a production system where companies use the same files every day and not for one off items that are constantly flowing through job control.

Scott Shepherd
03-31-2017, 8:12 AM
That would be great if it did that and I even contacted tech support who said that it will not delete the job after it's finished. It seems like it would be a simple fix/update to have it automatically delete it after the job is done. To me it seems the Trotec software is setup for more of a production system where companies use the same files every day and not for one off items that are constantly flowing through job control.

It used to do that Mike, that's why I mentioned it. That's actually why I never used it much, because it would run 1 cycle and delete itself. Looks like they have changed that so it doesn't delete itself after running now.

I opened JC and sent a job over with QP and it worked perfectly. It didn't pull any jobs from the queue. Sounds to me like something is corrupt, which could explain the long send times.

One thing I found years ago, when we were beta testing it was that some jobs were huge in the spool file, which would slow the processing down. We were seeing jobs that were very small end up being 100mb or more when they hit the spool file. That was some bug in the color setting. If you selected anything other than color, the file size was small, select color and some files, not every one, would get massive for no apparently reason. That was addressed before they even released the first version to the public though, and I haven't seen that issue since then. I did a quick check of my spool files and I don't see anything like that, and we use color all the time.

What version of JCX are you running? Sounds like a reinstall of the software might be due because you aren't getting normal behavior.

As far as one offs or production, I'd say we do a mix of both and haven't had any issues running 1 off jobs all day long. Maybe if we can get the QP working right and the send times fixed, you'll feel it's up for your 1 off jobs all day long.

Just to clarify, what you are seeing isn't normal by any means and it needs to be fixed! :)

mike wallis
03-31-2017, 10:35 AM
It used to do that Mike, that's why I mentioned it. That's actually why I never used it much, because it would run 1 cycle and delete itself. Looks like they have changed that so it doesn't delete itself after running now.

I opened JC and sent a job over with QP and it worked perfectly. It didn't pull any jobs from the queue. Sounds to me like something is corrupt, which could explain the long send times.

One thing I found years ago, when we were beta testing it was that some jobs were huge in the spool file, which would slow the processing down. We were seeing jobs that were very small end up being 100mb or more when they hit the spool file. That was some bug in the color setting. If you selected anything other than color, the file size was small, select color and some files, not every one, would get massive for no apparently reason. That was addressed before they even released the first version to the public though, and I haven't seen that issue since then. I did a quick check of my spool files and I don't see anything like that, and we use color all the time.

What version of JCX are you running? Sounds like a reinstall of the software might be due because you aren't getting normal behavior.

As far as one offs or production, I'd say we do a mix of both and haven't had any issues running 1 off jobs all day long. Maybe if we can get the QP working right and the send times fixed, you'll feel it's up for your 1 off jobs all day long.

Just to clarify, what you are seeing isn't normal by any means and it needs to be fixed! :)

Try closing job control first. Then print using the quick print feature. Using quick print, the job control will automatically open for you (It's designed to do this). If you have jobs left in the job panel it should load all the jobs and start print every job on the plate. When I contacted Trotec support on this they confirmed that this is an issue. We try to close job control after every working day because we noticed that when left open day after day it tends to have odd issues.
The work around is to either clear all the jobs every day out of the job control or manually start job control before print your first file for the day. In my opinion it should be at the top of Trotec's list to fix.

We are using JC version 10.4.1.0. I've got a fresh load of job control on a different computer which I'll try running today if time allows. I'm hopeful that it will solve at least the printing speed issues. Also I'll do some testing between printing in color mode and alternate modes to see if it might be the culprit.

My point for the the one off jobs is that you simply do not need job control in most cases. In comparison if I printed a paper document to my ink jet printer I do not need to go to a separate print manager after selecting my print settings in the print driver. It simply prints the job. In the case of printing to the laser from corel, I see the layout and design in Corel before I print, I don't need to see it again in job control.

Scott Shepherd
03-31-2017, 11:03 AM
Try closing job control first. Then print using the quick print feature. Using quick print, the job control will automatically open for you (It's designed to do this). If you have jobs left in the job panel it should load all the jobs and start print every job on the plate. When I contacted Trotec support on this they confirmed that this is an issue. We try to close job control after every working day because we noticed that when left open day after day it tends to have odd issues.
The work around is to either clear all the jobs every day out of the job control or manually start job control before print your first file for the day. In my opinion it should be at the top of Trotec's list to fix.

We are using JC version 10.4.1.0. I've got a fresh load of job control on a different computer which I'll try running today if time allows. I'm hopeful that it will solve at least the printing speed issues. Also I'll do some testing between printing in color mode and alternate modes to see if it might be the culprit.

My point for the the one off jobs is that you simply do not need job control in most cases. In comparison if I printed a paper document to my ink jet printer I do not need to go to a separate print manager after selecting my print settings in the print driver. It simply prints the job. In the case of printing to the laser from corel, I see the layout and design in Corel before I print, I don't need to see it again in job control.

I'll try that and see if I can replicate it.

I'd update your JCX, you're at least 1 version behind, maybe 2 or 3. I think I'm 1 or 2 behind and I'm on 10.5.1.

What did you find in the spool file?

Gary Hair
03-31-2017, 11:50 AM
We are using JC version 10.4.1.0.

Not that I think they have fixed it yet, but the current version is 10.6.1.2. It might be worth updating.

mike wallis
03-31-2017, 1:39 PM
I'll try that and see if I can replicate it.

I'd update your JCX, you're at least 1 version behind, maybe 2 or 3. I think I'm 1 or 2 behind and I'm on 10.5.1.

What did you find in the spool file?


Hey Scott,
here's the spool file info.
357345

Scott Shepherd
03-31-2017, 1:46 PM
Thanks Mike, that takes that out of the equation. Nothing wrong at all there. Still something going on, I'm at a loss right now. I'd upgrade to 10.6 and see if that resolves any issues. Just check with them first and make sure you don't have to update the firmware too.

mike wallis
03-31-2017, 7:47 PM
Thanks Mike, that takes that out of the equation. Nothing wrong at all there. Still something going on, I'm at a loss right now. I'd upgrade to 10.6 and see if that resolves any issues. Just check with them first and make sure you don't have to update the firmware too.

Thank Scott. I'll be reloading the computer as well as updating the job control. Based on everyone's feedback that should do the trick for the speed issue. I'll post back my results