Flat bottomed holes, you make my barrel hinge go down.

[Prashun Patel]

I need to drill some holes for barrel hinges on a cabinet. This is an edge-face connection. The hinge holes in the door will be close to the thickness of the door - so close that if I use a bit with spur, it will penetrate the face.

The holes are 12mm in diameter. I could not find non-spur bits in 12mm.

My only thought is to grind the point off my brad point bit. Any clever solutions to this????

[Ole Anderson]

Start the hole with your spur point bit, then come back with a spur-less bit to bring them to the proper depth. Ideally, use a forstner bit as it will not wallow out the hole. Buy two and grind the point off one. http://www.amazon.com/CMT-537-120-31-Forstner-32-Inch-Diameter/dp/B000P4HLEY/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1457445600&sr=8-1&keywords=12mm+forstner

[Malcolm McLeod]

2 possible:
1- use brad-point or forstner bit to start the hole, then switch to a same-size forstner with the point ground off (now piloted by the OD of bit).
2- use a machinist's end-mill

[Tom Ewell]

Plunge router, 12mm bit?

[pat warner]

Too risky, use 3 smaller barrel hinges.
No wood left to support the barrel.

[glenn bradley]

Plunge router, 12mm bit?

Ding, ding, ding; this would be my preference as a plunge router's depth can be better controlled than many drill presses built after WWII . . . OK, that's an exaggeration but, sloppy depth is my #1 modern DP peeve. A simple jig to center the router on the edge will do you.

Material holding can be a concern here so the router solution may not be as much of a winner for some. A pair of 12mm bits, one with the center spur ground off and a drill press is an equally good option. Precise setup at the DP now becomes the controlling factor.

[Jamie Buxton]

I'd do it with the plunge router, with an edge guide. The edge guide gives precise positioning.

[Tom Ewell]

Too risky, use 3 smaller barrel hinges.
No wood left to support the barrel.
good point if in a 3/4 frame

[mreza Salav]

Too risky, use 3 smaller barrel hinges.
No wood left to support the barrel.

.............
+1

[Bradley Gray]

+1 on smaller hinges. Barrel hinges are held in place by wedging the barrel.

[Prashun Patel]

Let's talk about the hinges being too large...

As Bradley says, the hinges are wedged into the hole, so there is moderate pressure on the sides of the hole. In fact, SOSS says there's a maximum amount of clearance on the sides that's about 2mm on each side (or else the hinge won't open properly). If 2mm can withstand the pressure of that wedge, then I am unclear why the bottom of the hole needs to support anything? They say it's even ok to overdrill the hole depth, which means the bottom can't be exerting any pressure on the bottom of the hole.

Anyway, I'll still have about 1/8" clearance on the bottom of the hole. These are 1/2" diameter hinges, and my cabinet is smallish (doors are 7"x24") . Pat's the Man, and I respectfully take his advice, but I think I'm going to be ok on this if I can just get a flat hole on the bottom. I'll grind off the tip of a brad point bit and have at it.

THANKS!!!

[Jamie Buxton]

Come to think of my long-ago experience with barrel hinges...A big issue is making the hole-to-hole spacing the same on both the door and the case. I'd make a template for the holes, and a template guide in the plunge router. The template can also control the spacing from the edge of the door and edge of the case to the holes.

[Prashun Patel]

I did a test run on a couple pieces and with a properly set up drill press fence, it came out fine.

[Steve Peterson]

Dang you Prashun. I have an old Queen song stuck in my head now. :)

I can't believe no one else noticed.

Steve

[Tim Cooper Louisiana]

I was just about to say that this thread title is genius, and I couldn't believe that it wasn't getting the credit it deserved!

[Prashun Patel]

What's funnier is that I have also been googling solutions to this, and found on a Machinist's forum someone made a similar reference.

[Earl McLain]

I noticed the Queen reference in the title right away--and it will be in my head all afternoon. Thanks Prashun!!

[Tom Ewell]

Ah, I get it now :)
doh!

[Steve Peterson]

I was just about to say that this thread title is genius, and I couldn't believe that it wasn't getting the credit it deserved!

I agree. That was one of the best thread titles ever.

Steve

[Prashun Patel]

Here's what worked for me:

I ground the point off the 15/32" brad point bit on my slow grinder. This took about 30 seconds.
I then put it in the drill press and set the stop to the desired stop.
Then I removed the 15/32" bit, and chucked up the next smaller bit. That bit (happily) when chucked up to the shoulder drills about to the same depth as the wings of the 15/32" bit. I had to use the smaller bit to drill a starter hole because without the spur, the 15/32" will wander. Anyone who has installed barrel hinges will attest that the fit has to be perfect.
Next, I re-chucked the 15/32" bit and drilled to depth. Step drilling like this in super small increments reduces the wanderlust of the spurless bit. The trick is being dead on concentric, so it's important to pre-set the depth of the final bit before drilling the pilot. Otherwise, you'd have to adjust the depth or table height, either of which (on my substandard dp) can adjust the bit position.

The barrel hinges are actually 12mm. The 15/32" hole makes such a tight fit, I was afraid of forcing it into the hole, so the final step is to chuck the 15/32" bit in a hand drill, and drill the hole at slow speed. Plunging a couple times by hand widens the hole just enough to allow a good friction fit for the barrels. I couldn't even feel it cutting, but when I removed the bit, there was telltale dust at the bottom. It was a good illustration about how less accurate hand drilling can be than press drilling.

Worked well.

Now I just have to figure out how to put the spur back ON the 15/32" bit... ;)

I know, that hole is mighty close to the edge. However, the wedging happens in parallel to that edge, not into it. Also, the tight clearance is actually required or else the door corner will not clear the case without beveling.

[Chris Padilla]

If you saved the metal dust/shavings from the grinding of the spur, you ought to be able to glue it back on.

Doesn't everybody do this in case one grinds too much metal off? I know I do. Saved me many times.

;)

[Keith Westfall]

I don't understand the need to file/grind off a drill point. It's not like it will show or anything.

What am I missing?

[Prashun Patel]

I am mounting the hinge to the FACE not the edge of the door. The door is sufficiently thin that the spur would poke through the front side if I drilled deep enough to accomodate the barrel.

[Pat Barry]

I thought the title made no sense at all.

Edit: just kidding of course. I didn't even know what a barrel hinge was until I googled it because of this thread.

[Keith Westfall]

am mounting the hinge to the FACE not the edge of the door

OK, that makes sense - thanks

[David Tolsky]

First thing I noticed! You beat me to it! The Queen song

[David Tolsky]

We need more clever topics like that!

[Bob Vaughan]

Consider an End Mill (http://www.walmart.com/ip/48374752?wmlspartner=wlpa&adid=22222222227035884109&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=76435227634&wl4=&wl5=pla&wl6=177519827314&veh=sem) You'll have to clamp things down.

[glenn bradley]

Here's what worked for me:

That worked out great Prashun. Thanks for the pics.