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Dan Friedrichs
03-06-2016, 3:25 PM
I have a relatively new (2012) SUV (Land Rover LR2 - just a re-badged Ford Escape) that has developed an odd paint problem. It seems like the clear coat (and/or paint?) is flaking off, especially concentrated on the hood and front fenders (but also a few limited spots on the doors).

My first thought was to blame myself for my somewhat aggressive cleaning regimen - I admit to power washing it more than is probably good - but the paint failure is only occurring near the front of the vehicle - absolutely nothing wrong on the back panels (which also get power washed). Is this just from rocks, etc, weakening the paint? Or a manufacturing defect?

Unfortunately, while the newer LR's have a "finish warranty", this one does not. The dealer said, "Yep, looks like it needs a repaint", and the body shop said, "$8,500". :eek:

Can this sort of damage be fixed with some sort of touch up and buff? It is fairly extensive - perhaps 5% of the hood is affected.

Jim Koepke
03-06-2016, 3:36 PM
Is Earl Sheib still in business?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtjdHaMeiiQ

Looks like he did the original paint on this one.

jtk

Mike Hollingsworth
03-06-2016, 3:39 PM
The front's probably been repainted. Paint applied in a body shop is not as hard as factory paint.

Dan Friedrichs
03-06-2016, 3:54 PM
The front's probably been repainted. Paint applied in a body shop is not as hard as factory paint.

I don't think that's the case - I bought it brand new.

Tom M King
03-06-2016, 3:55 PM
Put a bra on it: http://www.carid.com/land-rover-bras/

Mel Fulks
03-06-2016, 4:26 PM
I would pay,no one is gonna get involved without money, to get expert check to see if it has been repainted. Between carrier damage and demos lots of things happen.

Dan Friedrichs
03-06-2016, 5:55 PM
I would pay,no one is gonna get involved without money, to get expert check to see if it has been repainted. Between carrier damage and demos lots of things happen.

Say I find out it was dropped off the delivery truck and repainted....will that change anything, for me?

Mel Fulks
03-06-2016, 6:17 PM
I think so. I sold cars for a few years and overheard some cursing and teeth gnashing over such things that makes me think the customer came out OK.

Dan Friedrichs
03-06-2016, 6:20 PM
I think so. I sold cars for a few years and overheard some cursing and teeth gnashing over such things that makes me think the customer came out OK.

Well, I do like a good teeth gnashing! Would a regular body shop be able to tell?

Mike Henderson
03-06-2016, 6:27 PM
That sounds like a lot to paint the forward part of a car. But I haven't had a car painted in quite a few years.

The good places can match the paint color, even if the part left unpainted has faded a bit.

Mike

Mel Fulks
03-06-2016, 6:44 PM
Even many years ago there were devises that detected body putty and its thickness at any particular spot. I THINK the shops can tell the difference in paint just as Mike wrote.

Frederick Skelly
03-06-2016, 7:08 PM
Yes, this kind of damage occurs on a not-infrequent basis, even on untouched factory paint jobs. I've heard various theories on why, but I've even seen it on Hondas. You should be able to have just the front painted. $8500 sounds high to me - but there could be a lot to it we don't know. For example, if the color is something complex, just the materials can get shockingly expensive. Could also be you're at a LR dealership so they are charging LR prices. I'd go get 3 more estimates. But I'd defintely get it fixed Dan. Before the paint below the clear oxidizes and gets crappy looking.

Scott Shepherd
03-06-2016, 7:25 PM
Looks to me like the clear coat failed. A good shop should be able to fix that without repainting anything if the paint isn't chipped at all. My parents had a Buick that did that. The repainted the entire car for free.

Interesting, in a google search for it, one person says that it comes from powerwashing it with the nozzle too close to the paint. Interested that came up and you said you powerwashed it a lot.

I still think they can put clear back on it, but that's my opinion.

Ole Anderson
03-06-2016, 7:41 PM
Dealers are typically the most expensive. Ask your insurance company for recommend body shops. You only need the affected body panels refinished.

Bruce Wrenn
03-06-2016, 9:07 PM
Contact your insurer and see who they recommend for body work. Most shops doing insurance work now off lifetime warranty. When you are riding about, notice how many white GM / Chevy vans you see with paint on hood peeling. Seems like peeling paint was a standard on GM's white work vans.

Art Mann
03-06-2016, 10:44 PM
It is extremely unlikely that your vehicle was repainted or repaired in any way if it was sold as new. That practice is illegal. I doubt if Land Rover would take a chance on a heavy fine or being barred from selling in the US. I worked as an engineer for Chrysler Motors most of a career and watched a lot of product come and go. I was not in any way involved with paint but Chrysler had a serious clear coat failure problem on some cars and light trucks and it was nearly always on the hood or front fenders. In this case, it could very well be that the failure was at least partially related to pressure washing. I would not use high pressure washer except maybe in the fender wells and under carriage.

Rick Potter
03-07-2016, 3:20 AM
Getting old, I remember Earl Scheib ads for $19.95.

Jason Roehl
03-07-2016, 5:51 AM
According to a friend of mine who worked for a while as a supervisor for a company that checked the train car load-outs for Subaru here in Lafayette, a car can receive up to $1500 in damage, get fixed, and still be sold as new.

Looks to me in the pictures that you probably got some small chips in and through the clear coat, then your pressure washing probably exacerbated the situation. $8500 sounds really high to me. I'd shop around for estimates.

Dan Hintz
03-07-2016, 5:52 AM
It is extremely unlikely that your vehicle was repainted or repaired in any way if it was sold as new. That practice is illegal.

Dealers are allowed to fix "minor" issues without notifying the customer. I don't recall the value limit offhand ($500?), but I'm not sure who sets the value of the actual damage, and that's what really matters. Unfortunately, I believe my Z was one of those cars... in just the right light, you can see some overspray and a change in the way the pearl reflects the light. Someone likely bumped/scratched it as it was coming off of the truck. It was a special order, but suddenly took a few days after arriving before being made "available".

Malcolm Schweizer
03-07-2016, 8:29 AM
I have done hot rod paint jobs, but never worked professionally at it. I did manage a vehicle fleet, and I can tell you that $8500 is off the charts, insanely, waaaaay too high, even to strip the whole car and paint it. Also, for clearcoat you do not need to strip the whole car- just sand the clear off and respray it with clear. Removing emblems and trim is tedious, so labor will depend on how much has to be removed. The hood should easily be sprayed with minimum emblems to remove. Looking at the images you posted, if that's the worst of it you could get that hood shot with new clearcoat for maybe $500, and that's a high guess. Figure on $300 per gallon for good clearcoat, and that hood would take about a quart. There would be no need to blend because it's just clearcoat, and it's a hood that can be painted as one unit,but they may buff the car for you to make it all look shiny like the hood. So, let's say- because dealers like to charge high dollar for labor- $1000 top price to respray that hood with clearcoat and buff the rest of the car so that it all looks shiny.

Please, run as far as you can from that dealer.

Patrick McCarthy
03-07-2016, 9:03 AM
POWERWASHING a car????? Am I the only one that finds that incomprehensible?

Admittedly, I might be a bit anal, but I hand wash my cars. Hand wax them too.

If you have been POWERWASHING the bugs off the front, then I can only say it was a matter of time, and I am surprised more damage wasn't done.

JMHO YMMV

Jeff Monson
03-07-2016, 10:13 AM
I'd have to say its bad clear, or a poor repair. But in your case you got it new, and with all the areas pointed out, I would rule out the poor repair. I have seen a fair share of new vehicles that have had repairs done due to shipping damage but rarely the entire vehicle. GM especially and others have had clear issues on certain years that look just like yours (flaking off, poor adhesion). Unfortunately its not an easy fix. A good body shop will want to sand back the clear on the entire vehicle and respray it so they can put a guarantee on it. Otherwise putting new clear on any of what is left will result in more flaking. Body work has gotten super expensive (along with everything else), I find $8500 on the high side, but it would depend on your area. I know around here it would run $4000.00 easily at a reputable shop.

Dan Friedrichs
03-07-2016, 10:51 AM
POWERWASHING a car????? Am I the only one that finds that incomprehensible?

I've always wondered if that was a "very bad idea", but, it's no different than the coin-operated DIY bays at the car wash, no?

FWIW, I also power wash my wife's car, and it has no problems....

Dimitrios Fradelakis
03-07-2016, 11:02 AM
It could very well be a paint defect from the factory. Most single stage paints (color and clear in one) don't hold up very well and fade much quicker than a separate base and clear paint job. As others have said the price you have been quoted is way too high.

Terry Hatfield
03-07-2016, 11:21 AM
I've been in the body repair industry for 35 years in both the shop and the insurance setting. Currently manage a shop that is part of a 4 shop MSO. We work for a few dealers and it's not unusual at all for band new vehicle to be in our shop getting repairs. I'd doubt that the peeling clear is a factory finish but anything is possible. More likely it is some sort of transit damage or other issue that was not properly repaired but again, anything is possible. There is no way to re-clear those panels without some amount of color being sprayed also. $8500 is not unreasonable if we are talking about disassembly and stripping, color and clear, emblems and decals for the entire vehicle but I doubt the entire vehicle actually needs repainting. I would have a reputable shop...not the dealership where you bought it....look at it and offer an opinion before I did anything. If it is a repair then you have some footing for going back on the dealership to get it fixed. If it is truly a factory issue then I would contact Land Rover directly and start a complaint file with them. One way or the other that sort of clear coat delamination is not normal and is likely not caused by pressure washing unless you are literally holding the wand right on those spots at very close range.

Art Mann
03-07-2016, 1:44 PM
I can tell you that repainting at any location other than the factory is a violation of the law. The dealer can choose to break the law for expediency if he wants to.


Dealers are allowed to fix "minor" issues without notifying the customer. I don't recall the value limit offhand ($500?), but I'm not sure who sets the value of the actual damage, and that's what really matters. Unfortunately, I believe my Z was one of those cars... in just the right light, you can see some overspray and a change in the way the pearl reflects the light. Someone likely bumped/scratched it as it was coming off of the truck. It was a special order, but suddenly took a few days after arriving before being made "available".

Art Mann
03-07-2016, 1:56 PM
Come on Terry. Peeling clear coat is as common as sunshine. I have seen more warranty repairs for clear coat than I can even count. If you were repairing unsold new cars advertised for sale as new, you were breaking the law, whether you knew it or not.

Mel Fulks
03-07-2016, 2:11 PM
And some of the drive thru washes will damage paint first trip through. Some of the "strings " are made to last forever and are actually abrasive. That's the kind the place I worked had, no one would use it on the family owned car.

Bruce Page
03-07-2016, 2:22 PM
Getting old, I remember Earl Scheib ads for $19.95.
Me too. I had a 1960 T-Bird repainted buy Earl for $29.95. It actually turned out pretty good.

Jeff Monson
03-07-2016, 2:46 PM
I've always wondered if that was a "very bad idea", but, it's no different than the coin-operated DIY bays at the car wash, no?

FWIW, I also power wash my wife's car, and it has no problems....

Dan I pressure wash my vehicles also, coin op wash or my psi washer at home. Especially when the bug season hits, how are you supposed to remove them otherwise, gently scrub? I have not had the issue myself in the pics, but I have seen it quite often. You should be able to pressure wash the car without that happening.

Dan Friedrichs
03-07-2016, 3:21 PM
If you were repairing unsold new cars advertised for sale as new, you were breaking the law, whether you knew it or not.

I did some reading on this, because it's interesting. Apparently most states set a limit (as a percentage of MSRP) on the cost of repairs that are allowed to be done while still calling a vehicle "new" (and not disclosing the damage), or entirely exclude repairs to glass/tires/etc as needing to be disclosed. Presumably this is to allow for fixing a windshield that took a rock in transit, or to repair some scratches incurred during a test drive.

Colorado (my state), however, simply requires that all "material" damage be disclosed:
REGULATION 12-6-118 (3)(i). A copy of the completed contract form shallbe given to the purchaser when signed by both parties. A dealer, wholesaler,or auction dealer shall disclose on the contract form when a motor vehicle isknown by the dealer, wholesaler orauction dealer to be a salvage vehicleas defined in C.R.S. 42-6- 102(10.6),OR when a motor vehicle is knownto have sustained material damage atany one time from any one incident (1C.C.R. 205-1)

So, if it was re-clear-coated, I would certainly have some redress, but we'll see what the (independent) body shop says.

Chris Padilla
03-07-2016, 3:31 PM
On my 2006 Toyota Tacoma, every single piece of PLASTIC on my truck has the clear coat peeling. All the metal is fine.

My 2001 BMW suffered from plastic clear coat peeling as well although we did have a spot on the roof (all metal) that started in one spot and grew.

With all the EPA mandates, the old time (nasty?) paints are no longer used but they sure seemed to last longer. Clear coats seems to fail all the time.

Art Mann
03-07-2016, 4:22 PM
I did some research too and as you say and also discovered the laws vary from State to State. I thought it was Federal law. I saw some States (Georgia being one) that require the vehicle be disclosed as being repaired if the amount exceeds $500. Other States require disclosure if the amount exceeds 3% - 5% of the purchase price. I remember the law in Alabama being enacted because in 1978 I bought a new 2 door Chevrolet Malibu. Almost from the start, I noticed that the car had to be sitting still in order to roll up the passenger window. The window wasn't supported well enough to keep it from being blown outward at speed. I carried it back several times and finally concluded that the problem was non-repairable. At a later date, I removed the inside door panel and discovered extensive body work had been done and the window lateral support was missing. I also found a potato chip bag in there. At that time, the law said I had no recourse because it was out of warranty. I was too young and inexperienced to realize I could have sued the company or the dealership for deceptive practices. Later, the law was passed and I rejoiced greatly. I didn't remember that it was just Alabama. One thing I can say. That was the last General Motors vehicle I will ever own.


I did some reading on this, because it's interesting. Apparently most states set a limit (as a percentage of MSRP) on the cost of repairs that are allowed to be done while still calling a vehicle "new" (and not disclosing the damage), or entirely exclude repairs to glass/tires/etc as needing to be disclosed. Presumably this is to allow for fixing a windshield that took a rock in transit, or to repair some scratches incurred during a test drive.

Colorado (my state), however, simply requires that all "material" damage be disclosed:
REGULATION 12-6-118 (3)(i). A copy of the completed contract form shallbe given to the purchaser when signed by both parties. A dealer, wholesaler,or auction dealer shall disclose on the contract form when a motor vehicle isknown by the dealer, wholesaler orauction dealer to be a salvage vehicleas defined in C.R.S. 42-6- 102(10.6),OR when a motor vehicle is knownto have sustained material damage atany one time from any one incident (1C.C.R. 205-1)

So, if it was re-clear-coated, I would certainly have some redress, but we'll see what the (independent) body shop says.

Frederick Skelly
03-07-2016, 8:41 PM
One thing I can say. That was the last General Motors vehicle I will ever own.

Especially since you worked as a Chrysler engineer, for much of your career? :D
(Sorry Sir. I just couldn't resist. I once knew a guy who worked for Ford. When he bought a new Chevy, he got a letter from Ford HQ that literally said "Congratulations on your purchase of a new General Motors vehicle." And that was all it said.)

Brian Elfert
03-07-2016, 9:18 PM
Especially since you worked as a Chrysler engineer, for much of your career? :D
(Sorry Sir. I just couldn't resist. I once knew a guy who worked for Ford. When he bought a new Chevy, he got a letter from Ford HQ that literally said "Congratulations on your purchase of a new General Motors vehicle." And that was all it said.)

Ford really has someone going through motor vehicle purchase records to see what vehicles employees are buying? Ford no long makes minivans or large SUVs like the Suburban. Are employees expected to not buy the vehicle that suits them best?

Keith Outten
03-08-2016, 9:08 AM
Is there a way to repair minor scratches in clear coat?
Maybe purchase clear coat and spray it with an airbrush?
.

Frederick Skelly
03-08-2016, 8:41 PM
Ford really has someone going through motor vehicle purchase records to see what vehicles employees are buying?

No. They saw his Chevy in the parking lot. :eek:

George Bokros
03-09-2016, 7:58 AM
Some years ago the Ford plant in Cleveland gave all employees that drove Ford Motor vehicles preferred parking places in the employee lot, drivers of other manufacturers vehicles had the parking spots further from the entrances.

Mike Hollingsworth
03-09-2016, 10:01 AM
POWERWASHING a car????? Am I the only one that finds that incomprehensible?

Admittedly, I might be a bit anal, but I hand wash my cars. Hand wax them too.

If you have been POWERWASHING the bugs off the front, then I can only say it was a matter of time, and I am surprised more damage wasn't done.

JMHO YMMV

PowerWashing is the ONLY way to go. On Factory Paint there is NEVER a worry.
No wiping the dirt into the paint = no swirls.
I've handwashed my cars once a week for 45 years and discovered the PowerWash a couple years ago.
It's a big help in California as it uses 30% of the water.

Every detailer I've known has one in the back of their truck.

Jerome Stanek
03-09-2016, 11:20 AM
When I worked as a subcontractor for Ford I got a contractor discount if I bought a Ford. At the time it was better than their X plan. I also got to park close to the area I was working in the fellow that was doing some other stuff had a Chevy and he had to park pretty far away.

Chris Padilla
03-09-2016, 5:24 PM
Some years ago the Ford plant in Cleveland gave all employees that drove Ford Motor vehicles preferred parking places in the employee lot, drivers of other manufacturers vehicles had the parking spots further from the entrances.So that means that the non-Ford owners got a bit more exercise! Good for them. :)

Rob Damon
03-09-2016, 6:49 PM
Real world example:

I purchase a brand new 1988 I-ROC Z from a local dealer on a Saturday evening. Got it home and on Sunday morning I was brushing it out and put my hand on the passenger side seat and was cut by glass. Monday morning I contacted the dealer and asked how it would have gotten in there and they said "not sure" but bring it by and we will vacuum it out. Picked it up Monday night and looked around inside and saw no glass but look down inside the door and there was a lot of glass from the window. My thought was the glass was broken during delivery and I asked again what is going on?

After two weeks and after taking with a lawyer (no help), I had a meeting with the manager. The car had been delivered safely to the dealer but one of the employee's was driving it too fast around the lot and came around a corner and another vehicle hit the passenger side door and the front quarter panel, thus shattering the glass (minor damage as he puts it.)

I demanded they give me a new car and they said no and the law was technically on their side. In Virginia, they can repair vehicle damage at "dealer cost" and not retail cost and as long as it does not exceed a certain amount, they did not need to disclose it. I went back to the lawyer and she said, I could sue or take them to small claims court but he is a prominent dealer that has most of the local lawyers on retainer (including her) and we would need to go outside the area. In the end we would spend more money on lawyers to get new car that what is was worth. She suggested I come up with a list of add on or corrections that they could do that would make it easier to swallow.

So I ended up with a 7 year extend warranty, new door, new front quarter panel, all repainted to match. Needless to say we used to buy all of our cars from that dealer but never again.

Jerome Stanek
03-09-2016, 6:49 PM
So that means that the non-Ford owners got a bit more exercise! Good for them. :)

But when the shift was over you should see the line waiting to get out. The ones that had Fords were the first to leave. I lived just down the road from the Ford and Chevy plants and at quitting time traffic would back up for miles

Dan Friedrichs
09-09-2016, 5:03 PM
Thought you all might like an update on this:

Land Rover admits that the vehicle was damaged in transit and was repainted by them. The dealer claims they didn't know about the damage, so they couldn't have disclosed it to me. Land Rover claims they are free to do any repairs they want prior to delivery. Land Rover even has essential said that they agree the repaint was poor quality, and that's why it's failing. However, because the vehicle is beyond the warranty mileage limit (although it's well within the year limit), the "best they can offer" is to cover 25% of the repair costs (estimated at $2500).

Not sure what to do, here...

Jon Nuckles
09-09-2016, 5:58 PM
Dan,
That is terrible and no way to treat a customer of a brand that is supposed to imply quality. Take a look at your State's consumer protection laws to see if they provide a remedy. Maybe see if someone in the attorney general's office can advise you over the phone. Any chance your local newspaper or television news has a consumer advocate feature that would be interested? The bad publicity would be some incentive for them to dig a little deeper.
Hope you get justice.
Jon

Matt Meiser
09-09-2016, 6:22 PM
(Land Rover LR2 - just a re-badged Ford Escape)

This has no relation to the Escape. The LR2 was based on Ford's EUCD platform and shares more common lineage with the 2013 Fusion than any other North American Ford. In 2012 Ford was building Escapes based on their CD2 platform.

John Blazy
09-09-2016, 6:38 PM
Hi Dan,

I was a finish chemist for five years in 100% solids UV cured coatings, which is way higher tech than common 2K auto urethanes, and I have two patents in polymer science, so I know a bit about intercoat adhesion, especially since I use 2K Automotive urethane in my business now. That said, there is no way that properly applied clear coats should fail like that.

The best way to prove improper application is to look at the surface of the base coat where the top coat peeled off. better yet, take a razor an intentionally peel about an inch or so of the peeling clear coat to see the surface of the virgin base coat. If you see that the base coat surface had been scuffed with steel wool or scotch brite, then they at least did that part correct, because any base coat over a couple days old has hardened and requires some mechanical adhesion for the topcoat. If its glossy, indicating no scuffing, then that is mostly why its peeling, unless they used Bulldog adhesion primer (likely not, and it only marginally aids adhesion). There are several other things could have caused the failure like incorrect hardener ratio in the 2K urethane, or they wiped the degreaser on with a contaminated cloth (simple mineral spirits will destroy adhesion), which could be found in any auto shop (but only an idiot would wipe without virgin cloths). Pre-wiping a surface with lacquer thinner using certain paper towels with inks in them will melt the inks and/or binders in the PT, and contaminate the surface as well (not likely, but happened to me once).

So regardless of the cause during their re-coat, a correctly applied 2K urethane will bond like mad, almost as good as the factory clear coat, especially if it was scuff sanded, which it should have been.

Which brings me to the next idea. 2K Auto urethanes are quite inexpensive. I buy Nason 496 - 000 for $65.00 per gallon and the hardener for another 40. 4:1 ratio, easy to mix and real easy to spray. I personally would have no problem spraying this outside on a non-windy day with a good respirator after masking off most of the rest of the car and all the trim, because I am experienced with spraying large panels and my boat, etc., but you may not feel comfortable with that (not to mention bugs landing in the clear).

The real trick is to scrape off ALL the clear coat off the entire hood and panels to avoid sanding the basecoat, then simply scuff the basecoat for adhesion, wipe with lacquer thinner and spray the 2K urethane. But if you scraped up to a point where you had to leave most of the clearcoat that is sticking well, then you would need to sand with 220 - 320 then 600 and feather the clear down without cutting through the base coat. Once you sand through the base coat you are screwed.

So maybe call a body shop and see if they would give you a good price for spraying the clear if you prepped the surface for them by scraping off the clearcoat, because you never know if the body shop you contract to coat your Land Rover will go through the correct application - they might skip the scuff step to save labor, and the finish will look awesome, but might peel in another three years.

Seems like $2500 is a pretty good estimate. Maybe if you (and your contracted body shop) can prove that the finish was applied improperly (without scuffing), then you have a better case against Land Rover, and might get them to cover more than 25%.

Mel Fulks
09-09-2016, 6:39 PM
Agree with Jon. Companies often don't really keep up with state laws, and NEVER give you good legal advice. It's worth a little more research, I hope you get a better deal than what they are currently offering.

Roger Feeley
09-14-2016, 8:12 PM
Kid down the street had his blazer painted with Rhino Liner. It looks fantastic.

Frederick Skelly
09-14-2016, 8:54 PM
Kid down the street had his blazer painted with Rhino Liner. It looks fantastic.

Hey Dan! I'll kick-in the first $100 if you'll use it toward painting your Land Rover with Rhino Liner! :D Anybody else wanna help?

(Tell your wife it's a special gift for her, since you just got a new tablesaw!) ;)

Matt Meiser
09-14-2016, 10:00 PM
Rhino posts pictures on their Facebook page all the time of Rhino-coated trucks. All the rage right now for off road (or pseudo off road) vehicles.

Dan Friedrichs
09-14-2016, 11:04 PM
You guys are hilarious :)

Minor update, if anyone cares: I went back to the dealer and offered to pay for 1/3rd the cost, if they'd pick up 1/3 and twist Land Rover's arm into paying for the remaining third. They immediately agreed.

In my research on the legality of this, there is an interesting case involving BMW and a $4M "punitive damages" award (which eventually went to the supreme court and was reduced). But the end result is that BMW has a policy of disclosing any damage of any amount done to a new vehicle in transit. I should be buying my next car from them, apparently...

Frederick Skelly
09-15-2016, 6:31 AM
Minor update, if anyone cares: I went back to the dealer and offered to pay for 1/3rd the cost, if they'd pick up 1/3 and twist Land Rover's arm into paying for the remaining third. They immediately agreed.

That seems reasonable to me. It's not a perfect deal, but it's reasonable and you'll have it resolved once and for all.

If you havent already, I'd ask if they will be painting the front half or the whole vehicle. I'd also ask if there will there be any warranty on the new paint. For example, if it happens again what are they going to do about it? And if it peels somewhere they didnt repaint as part of this deal, what happens?

Good luck!
Fred

Garth Almgren
09-15-2016, 2:12 PM
Is Earl Sheib still in business?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtjdHaMeiiQ

Looks like he did the original paint on this one.

jtk
Ugh. I had my old Mustang painted at Earl Sheib once with the $199 special. Orange peel over the entire surface, and all the paint had peeled off within 2 years. For a brief time it had some cool tiger stripes of dark and light blue on the hood and roof, then the rest of the dark blue peeled off.

Then I had it sanded, some dents and creases worked out and filled, and then repainted at Maaco. That paint job has held up ok (for a $299 paint job + body work).

A really professional job will definitely cost in the $8000+ range for a full repaint.


I got a pair of half doors on Craigslist for my Jeep that I wanted painted to match the tub, so I went to a real autobody shop. I don't think they really wanted my business because they quoted me $1000 per door and refused to just give it a quick spray with a generic color. I went out and got a couple cans of spray primer and metallic spray paint that was close enough (my Jeep doesn't need to look pretty).

Dan Friedrichs
10-06-2016, 11:43 AM
Final update: after 6 months of arm-twisting, Land Rover is going to pay 80% of the cost, the dealer is going to pay 10%, and I'm going to pay 10%. It's going into the shop soon. I guess persistence pays off...

Mel Fulks
10-06-2016, 12:03 PM
That's good news. Hope they do it right.

Kurt Kintner
10-06-2016, 12:58 PM
It could very well be a paint defect from the factory. Most single stage paints (color and clear in one) don't hold up very well and fade much quicker than a separate base and clear paint job. As others have said the price you have been quoted is way too high.

Color and clear coat cannot be mixed, as the color is lacquer and clear is enamel base (Oil and water thing)... Maaco is famous for lying about that....
And Never clearcoat with lacquer, it will check every time....
I've painted many cars over the years, and can't believe the quotes people get ... Granted, many shops that have new buildings have a lot of debt to service... Best to stay away from them...
The best shop here is a Peter Tumbledown place that puts out beautiful work that people can afford...
He painted the hood on my old F-150 with PPG base coat / clear coat for $400 ....
Shop around .....