Need Advice on Retrofitting Leg Vise to Non-Roubo Style Workbench

[Hasin Haroon]

Hello all, been an avid reader of the forums here for a while, just took the plunge and became a part of the community. I was in the process of building a roubo hybrid when an option to buy a workbench for very cheap came up and I knew I couldn't pass up. I will still be building the other bench, but in the meantime I need some advice.

The bench is similar to this one: https://canadianwoodworker.com/webstore/wecs.php?store=wood&action=display&target=CWI-BW5928

The issue is that I would like to add a leg vise, but the front legs are not on the same plane as the top. I was wondering if it would be a good idea to glue an additional board to the front of the left leg to bring it in line with the top and then go about installing a leg vise as usual? If so is there anything I need to look out for, or additional reinforcement required, or would a good lamination do?

Appreciate the help!

[Phil Stone]

I just don't know if that bench is going to be a good platform for a leg vise. I think you'd need much more substantial legs, and as you've pointed out, the front legs need to be in the same plane as the front of the bench. It's like trying to put a snowplow on a Smart Car.

[Chris Hachet]

I would build a Roubo-ish base out of Southern yellow Pine, poplar, or whatever wood you can get your hands on that is dry, straight and stable. I would not use white pine for the leg that takes the leg vise, but you could even use white pine for the rest of the base and then paint the base. If your going to do any substantial amount of hand planing, a more stable base would come in handy anyways.

[Jim Koepke]

Howdy Hasin,

Welcome to the Creek. Your profile doesn't indicate your location. As usual for me, I am always curious about where people call home.

The bench I use currently is similar to the one in your link. In my opinion, your time would be better used making a new bench instead of trying to put a leg vise on the bench shown. This bench would be helpful in the preparation of material to build you new bench.

One problem with a light bench is it can move or be difficult working with lumber longer than the bench. My solution was an old 5 gallon bucket and a bag of cement:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?119667-3-Bench-Hold-Steady

The images are not working currently. I sent an email to the site admin to see if anything can be done. The description pretty much tells what was done to add weight to the bench and a few replies offer other advice. One was to use sand instead of cement.

But knowing the date helped me find the image in my files:

332446

One side of the bucket was notched out so it could sit on the lower rail.

One last idea you might consider is if the bench you are buying is of a good height for you, make your new bench to the same height. Then if you need a larger work surface you can push the old one up to the new one.

The other option would be to alter the old one to match the preferred height of the new one. Of course this would only work if there is enough room in you shop.

Have fun and keep us informed of your progress.

jtk

[Hasin Haroon]

Thanks everyone. I drove down to pick up the bench today and was very disappointed by it. It didn't look very heavy in the pictures but it certainly did not look as flimsy as it was. The construction was also very poor, the end cap was just glued on causing the boards to split. I decided not to buy it and go on building my bench. It's a struggle without a work surface but I'll keep at it.
The six hour drive wasn't all a waste though, I picked up an old Stanley 78 from a gentleman and got myself the leg vise screw and a quick release vise from LV.

[David Eisenhauer]

A good day then. Stay with the new bench and it will be ready one day.

[Derek Cohen]

Thanks everyone. I drove down to pick up the bench today and was very disappointed by it. It didn't look very heavy in the pictures but it certainly did not look as flimsy as it was. The construction was also very poor, the end cap was just glued on causing the boards to split. I decided not to buy it and go on building my bench. It's a struggle without a work surface but I'll keep at it.
The six hour drive wasn't all a waste though, I picked up an old Stanley 78 from a gentleman and got myself the leg vise screw and a quick release vise from LV.

If you do change your mind ...

Most benches, even very light ones, can be made rock solid and avoid racking by the addition of bracing. One way is to add a sheet of ply at the rear. Another is to bolt the top to a wall (I did that for 19 years).

Replace the end cap with with a new one held on with lag bolts in elongated holes.

With regards the leg vise, just add on a "spacer" (thick board) to the front of the leg, in line with the edge of the bench top. Build the leg vise into the spacer. That should be pretty easy.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Hasin Haroon]

Thanks Derek. I didn't buy the bench, mostly because it wasn't worth the asking price. Made some good progress on my own since however.
I'm a big fan of your website by the way!

[Chris Hachet]

Thanks Derek. I didn't buy the bench, mostly because it wasn't worth the asking price. Made some good progress on my own since however.
I'm a big fan of your website by the way!

And good luck with that...you can listen to the Edmunton Oilers play hockey while you chisel and saw away at the new bench....think of all the good times! Hocky and woodworking....now if only the Columbus blue Jackets were doing any better...

[Bill Houghton]

Sounds like your immediate issue is resolved. Your question, though, inspires a more general comment.

My grandfather's bench had a leg vise. The top was screwed down onto the 2x6 front leg where the vise was mounted, but with time and wear, the top could be moved a little by the pressure of the leg vise, so that the effective clamping force started 1-3/4" down (old, thicker lumber). If/when I get around to making a leg vise using his hardware, I'll notch the top so that the back jaw of the vise is continuous up to the surface of the top.

[Mark Fisher]

Hopefully someone can learn from my mistake......You need to understand how the load from clamping in the vise is transmitted back to the vise screw. On the Roubo bench, the leg goes all the way up to the top meaning that if you clamp a small piece at the top, the load goes through the leg. If the leg and top are separate parts, you are also loading up whatever connects the top to the leg also. I made a modification to Will Meyer's Morovian bench to put the leg vise onto the leg. The top was connected to the legs by some 1/2" dowels.....not nearly strong enough. They sheared right off the first time I cranked down on the vise. I ended up going with some 3/4 pieces of ground shaft (a few dollars at McMaster) which now seems to be working out. They are longer and larger diameter to put less compressive stress on the wood which seems like a good thing in addition to resisting the shear force. I felt kind of silly as soon as it happened! Anyway, so far so good. Anyway, my point is that the leg vise puts different loads on the bench components that other vises and you need to account for that.

[Chris Hachet]

Hopefully someone can learn from my mistake......You need to understand how the load from clamping in the vise is transmitted back to the vise screw. On the Roubo bench, the leg goes all the way up to the top meaning that if you clamp a small piece at the top, the load goes through the leg. If the leg and top are separate parts, you are also loading up whatever connects the top to the leg also. I made a modification to Will Meyer's Morovian bench to put the leg vise onto the leg. The top was connected to the legs by some 1/2" dowels.....not nearly strong enough. They sheared right off the first time I cranked down on the vise. I ended up going with some 3/4 pieces of ground shaft (a few dollars at McMaster) which now seems to be working out. They are longer and larger diameter to put less compressive stress on the wood which seems like a good thing in addition to resisting the shear force. I felt kind of silly as soon as it happened! Anyway, so far so good. Anyway, my point is that the leg vise puts different loads on the bench components that other vises and you need to account for that.

I am using a 3/4 inch Oak dowel with the Bench Crafted leg vise, after a lot of use so far so good. Yeah, a leg vise puts a lot of strain on a bench...

[Bill Houghton]

Hopefully someone can learn from my mistake......You need to understand how the load from clamping in the vise is transmitted back to the vise screw. On the Roubo bench, the leg goes all the way up to the top meaning that if you clamp a small piece at the top, the load goes through the leg. If the leg and top are separate parts, you are also loading up whatever connects the top to the leg also. I made a modification to Will Meyer's Morovian bench to put the leg vise onto the leg. The top was connected to the legs by some 1/2" dowels.....not nearly strong enough. They sheared right off the first time I cranked down on the vise. I ended up going with some 3/4 pieces of ground shaft (a few dollars at McMaster) which now seems to be working out. They are longer and larger diameter to put less compressive stress on the wood which seems like a good thing in addition to resisting the shear force. I felt kind of silly as soon as it happened! Anyway, so far so good. Anyway, my point is that the leg vise puts different loads on the bench components that other vises and you need to account for that.

I was trying to say that in a different way. That's why, were I building a leg vise, I would extend the fixed jaw of the vise up to the top of the bench, cutting away the top to allow it.

[Mark Fisher]

Mine were 1/2 oak with a simple tail vise screw (http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=41664&cat=1,41659) from Lee Valley. The Benchcrafted stuff was tempting, but the cost difference was more than I could deal with! The 1/2 dowel was OK until I really torqued down on it. At that point, I was putting in a McMaster order for something else and I figured a little overkill wouldn't hurt anything.

[Hasin Haroon]

Thanks for all your informative replies folks. It's often painful to watch the Oilers, woodworking heals those wounds.

I have another question regarding the leg vise on the bench. I am building my bench out of yellow pine, mostly to save costs. I plan a maple board at the front, and dovetail that in to a mahogany end cap however. I was planning on leaving the front board a bit deeper than the rest of the bench, (3.5" vs 3"), and rabbeting the front legs to fit this apron/board. The vice chop will be oak or maple.

Mark's point got me thinking about the stresses from the leg vise (see the attached drawing). Would the forces result in the maple board/apron being pulled apart from the rest of the top eventually if I build it the way I outlined above? If so, I will just make the front board equal in depth to the rest.

Thanks in advance!332887

[Hasin Haroon]

I will be building mine with a the same vise screw, was considering an oak dowel but maybe I should reconsider!

[Chris Hachet]

Thanks for all your informative replies folks. It's often painful to watch the Oilers, woodworking heals those wounds.

I have another question regarding the leg vise on the bench. I am building my bench out of yellow pine, mostly to save costs. I plan a maple board at the front, and dovetail that in to a mahogany end cap however. I was planning on leaving the front board a bit deeper than the rest of the bench, (3.5" vs 3"), and rabbeting the front legs to fit this apron/board. The vice chop will be oak or maple.

Mark's point got me thinking about the stresses from the leg vise (see the attached drawing). Would the forces result in the maple board/apron being pulled apart from the rest of the top eventually if I build it the way I outlined above? If so, I will just make the front board equal in depth to the rest.

Thanks in advance!332887

I don't think that it would. And I would actually prefer a bench of SYP in some ways to a hardwood bench. I have had both. Planning on adding another bench to my work shop early next year....and I will be using pine to build it.