New old saw, how-to accessorize

[Bjorn Erling]

Just bought an Altendorf F90, I thought maybe I could get some suggestions on how to accessorize. I'm in need of advice for mitering but also other things like the micro jigg ripper. Suggestions?
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[David Kumm]

Look up Fritz and Franz to see a jig for small and narrow part ripping. airtightclamps.com for great pneumatic clamps. Accurate technologies for digital flip stop conversions. Dave

[Bjorn Erling]

Look up Fritz and Franz to see a jig for small and narrow part ripping. airtightclamps.com for great pneumatic clamps. Accurate technologies for digital flip stop conversions. Dave

Thanks. Micro jigg GRR-Rippers?

[Keith Weber]

Wow! That think looks like it's seen some use. Did it not come with an overarm blade guard? Looks like you have the miter scale on the slider. An auxiliary miter fence (similar to the extrusion used for your crosscut fence) would mount on the side rail and pivot about a hole in your sliding table. You could also get a Duplex miter fence that allows you to cut matching miters without moving the fence. Being in Sweden, it should be easier to get used accessories where you are, than in the US.

[Bill Adamsen]

Non tilt? A miter sled?

[Bjorn Erling]

Wow! That think looks like it's seen some use. Did it not come with an overarm blade guard? Looks like you have the miter scale on the slider. An auxiliary miter fence (similar to the extrusion used for your crosscut fence) would mount on the side rail and pivot about a hole in your sliding table. You could also get a Duplex miter fence that allows you to cut matching miters without moving the fence. Being in Sweden, it should be easier to get used accessories where you are, than in the US.

It has a huge blade guard that weighs about a ton that I haven't been able to set up yet ( those are the sellers pictures).
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The saw sure isn't pretty but was serviced a couple years back. It cuts really, really straight as well :)

I have actually set up a freight forwarding from the US, there's a lot more interesting stuff on for example your eBay than ours.

I I noticed the tracks on the slider are big and deep, about 21 mm across in the opening and about 31 mm wide in the bottom. Does that rule out normal sized track clamps etc? Is there a name for those types of tracks?

I looked at at the pneumatic clamping options but they came in at about $2000. I'm sure they kick butt, but hoping for a cheaper clamping option. I spent about $1400 for the saw (1/3 of which was shipping).

Which miter fence is good good bang for bucks.

[Bjorn Erling]

Non tilt? A miter sled?

No tilt. No miter sled included.

[Keith Weber]

Bjorn,

The tracks in your sliding table are called "T-Slots" (at least that's what I call them), and you can attach any accessories to them using "T-Slot Nuts". McMaster-Carr has them in just about any size you would need (http://www.mcmaster.com/). Search for "T-Slot Nuts" once on the site. I'm not sure if Altendorf has changed the size of the T-Slots or not over the years. Mine is newer, being a 2001 model. I've got one T-slot compared to your two.

I have two different miter fences for my F-45, as can be seen in the pic below.

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The one on the left is called a Duplex (Altendorf name). I would use this one if I were cutting picture frames since you can cut adjacent pieces on opposite sides of the fence, so you get a true 90° in your frame, even if your fence is not set perfectly at 45°. The long one on the left is a single-sided miter fence. I would use it to cut a large plywood panel at an angle.

The next pic shows a little more detail of the mounting method of the single-sided fence.

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It has a pin on the bottom (pretty much directly under the right black knob that fits into a fixed-location hole in the sliding table. The clamp with the black lever knob to the left, that holds the fence to the table slides forward and aft. The angle gauge built into the table gives you the angle so you know where to lock it down. I see that your saw has an angle gauge, so it probably has a pivot point as either a hole in the table, or maybe something that locks into the T-slot. I'm not sure how universal the modern Altendorf accessories to your older saw. I see that you have the round mounting rail, so maybe they kept it standard, but I'd suspect that it may have changed enough that you might not be able to throw a modern accessory on there with out a bit of modifying. You'd have to ask Altendorf about that. I'd say that you'd probably have a better chance of fitting a Duplex to your table than a modern single-sided because it is not dependent on a location-dependent hole.

I've seen more Duplexes for sale at European auctions/machinery dealers than I have in the US. It's rare to see them on eBay. People tend to hang onto them just in case they ever need them.

The other option is to make your own single-sided miter fence. As a simple, make-do option, you could buy a long piece of aluminum angle, drill a hole in it on the right side, which would be your pivot point. Through that hole would go a knob into a T-Slot Nut with a threaded stud coming up from it. On the left side you could router or mill a slot in the aluminum angle and have the same setup, but the slot would allow you to move the fence to whatever angle you wanted. One T-Slot nut would go in your right T-Slot, the other in the left T-Slot. It wouldn't be the best thing, but it would definitely be inexpensive and usable. You would have to be able to set your angle using a protractor, though.

Or you could buy a couple of Incra Build it Brackets (http://www.incra.com/jig_fixture-build-it_system-brackets.html#prettyPhoto) and make a wooden fence containing a couple of Incra tracks to hold stops for repeatability. So many options!! It just takes a little creativity.

[Bjorn Erling]

Which sixe t-slot nuts would be best?

[Bjorn Erling]

13/16 / 21mm?

[Keith Weber]

Bjorn,

If you were asking me specifically, I'm on a work trip for the next 2-1/2 weeks, so I can't measure mine right now -- but there's no guarantee that they'd be the same given the many changes to the saw over the years, anyway. Your slot has a bit of a different profile to mine judging by the pics. You'd have to measure them. They should be loose enough to slide freely, but not so loose that they don't get a good bite on the edges. Everything on the saw is metric, so I'd assume that the T-slot nuts are as well.

[Rod Sheridan]

332928I'll second the Fritz and Franz accessory. here's mine on my small slider..........Rod.

[Jim Becker]

Very nice addition to your shop and that's going to be a handy tool once cleaned up and working!

You have the basics. I find it very useful on my slider to have some intermediate support toward the other end of the wagon. My MiniMax has a miter setup that generally serves that purpose, but any flat surface attached to the wagon and sticking out 12-16" will do the job. You can make it easily removable, depending on how the slider wagon is designed. Cam clamps to hold down materials are a must, especially when something isn't "naturally perfectly flat". I also use a shop-made parallel ripping jig for taking boards to width after straight-lining them on one side. This enables precision on the edge without going back to the jointer...a flattened board on the slider wagon will have a perfectly perpendicular edge to the face when ripped this way without any of the minor variations that come from ripping along the fence and pushing through the cut with your hands. You can't do it well for narrow rips, but it's great for typical solid stock and sheet goods in that 4-15" range of width. And repeatable. A lot of what you'll want for the slide will ultimately depend upon what and how you use it. You're going to love that nice fence with stops on the slider, too...absolutely repeatable crosscuts every time.

[Jim Becker]

332928I'll second the Fritz and Franz accessory. here's mine on my small slider..........Rod.
That's one that's on "my list" for sure...

[Jim Becker]

I have two different miter fences for my F-45, as can be seen in the pic below.

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The one on the left is called a Duplex (Altendorf name). I would use this one if I were cutting picture frames since you can cut adjacent pieces on opposite sides of the fence, so you get a true 90° in your frame, even if your fence is not set perfectly at 45°. The long one on the left is a single-sided miter fence. I would use it to cut a large plywood panel at an angle.

I like the idea of that 90º angle setup...adding that to "the list", too!

[Brian Hood]

I like the idea of that 90º angle setup...adding that to "the list", too!

Jim,
have you seen this tool? http://www.lambtoolworks.com/products.html (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/www.lambtoolworks.com/products.html) Simple but it allows very quick accurate setting to 90 degrees with removable thumbscrews and all the other common angles with drop pins. Also allows you to verify you are square to about .002/ft in about 15 seconds.

[Jim Becker]

Jim,
have you seen this tool? http://www.lambtoolworks.com/products.html (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/www.lambtoolworks.com/products.html) Simple but it allows very quick accurate setting to 90 degrees with removable thumbscrews and all the other common angles with drop pins. Also allows you to verify you are square to about .002/ft in about 15 seconds.
No, I hadn't see that but I'm intensely interested. It's always a struggle to get the outrigger on my saw absolutely square to the blade so I tend to leave it on the saw full-time...and that takes up valuable space sometimes. Something like that square that can key onto the wagon is a great idea! Thanks for posting it!

I like their parallel jig, too, but enjoy the cost of my "scrap-plywood" version better. LOL

[Keith Weber]

I find it very useful on my slider to have some intermediate support toward the other end of the wagon. My MiniMax has a miter setup that generally serves that purpose, but any flat surface attached to the wagon and sticking out 12-16" will do the job. You can make it easily removable, depending on how the slider wagon is designed.

I agree completely with what Jim said. It is so nice to have a secondary support near the rear of the slider. It gives a lot of extra support when handling larger sheets of plywood. Altendorf call theirs the STEG (not to be confused with the STIG from the car show, Top Gear.) It moves anywhere along the slider with a simple rotation of the lock-down knob.

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Aside from supporting larger panels, perhaps my favorite use for the STEG is as a butt pusher. If you're crosscutting a piece of ply, say 24" in width, once you're finished your cut, rather than try to pull the slider back, you can just back up and your butt cheek against the STEG does all the work -- leaving both hands free to hold onto or move the work piece.

[David Kumm]

I'll second the recommendation for Brian's square. Very nicely made and a go to tool. I do a quick check on my first cut to verify with it too. Airtightclamps is also making a parallel stop that flips out of the way and mounts on the side of the STEG that is worth a look. Dave

[Keith Weber]

Airtightclamps is also making a parallel stop that flips out of the way and mounts on the side of the STEG that is worth a look.

David, do you have a link or pics of that? I can't find any info on it.

[Bjorn Erling]

Very nice addition to your shop and that's going to be a handy tool once cleaned up and working!

You have the basics. I find it very useful on my slider to have some intermediate support toward the other end of the wagon. My MiniMax has a miter setup that generally serves that purpose, but any flat surface attached to the wagon and sticking out 12-16" will do the job. You can make it easily removable, depending on how the slider wagon is designed. Cam clamps to hold down materials are a must, especially when something isn't "naturally perfectly flat". I also use a shop-made parallel ripping jig for taking boards to width after straight-lining them on one side. This enables precision on the edge without going back to the jointer...a flattened board on the slider wagon will have a perfectly perpendicular edge to the face when ripped this way without any of the minor variations that come from ripping along the fence and pushing through the cut with your hands. You can't do it well for narrow rips, but it's great for typical solid stock and sheet goods in that 4-15" range of width. And repeatable. A lot of what you'll want for the slide will ultimately depend upon what and how you use it. You're going to love that nice fence with stops on the slider, too...absolutely repeatable crosscuts every time.

Thank you. Do you have a pic of that parallel ripping jig?

Fence with stops really is great, I've used it now to crosscut 20 pieces of 2x4...

[Bjorn Erling]

Have checked the slots more thoroughly; it seems hard to get functioning t-bolts or nuts for this size, and also hard to use any of the existing miter gauges or accessories that use t-tracks (the bolt dimension goes way up with 21mm-13/16 sized nuts/bolts, they don't fit into anything but shop made custom jigs.

Had this idea though: why not try and fit a miter and/or t-track into the existing channels?

They look like this btw:
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Should not not be impossible to fit t-tracks in there. Would make using a numb of accessories easier (though not in the same class as the real Altendorff stuff of course, but they are very expensive even used)

[David Kumm]

Have T nuts made. Easy work for a machinist. you will find that when you get into old machines, you need a good machinist. Dave

[Bjorn Erling]

Are the JESSEM Clear Cut TS Stock Guides - for Table Saw any good? Good enough to merit the price?

[Bjorn Erling]

Made these two simple toggle clamp jigs to keep pieces in place while ripping and to keep boards against the fence.
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