Saw File Size

[lowell holmes]

I understand that 4" xx slim files are appropriate for filing certain tooth size. It is obvious that a 6" std file will leave a lot of unused file if you use it on small teeth. It is also obvious that an eight point crosscut handsaw teeth can't be shaped and sharpened with the 4" xx slim file.

My question is, what is the reason for the small file size other than conservation of your files. The small file sizes are not readily available. Since the file is triangular at 60 degrees, you can stop filing when your saw teeth are appropriately shaped and sharp.

With the issues concerning saw file availability, we pretty much have to buy what is available.:(

I just re-toothed a 14 tpi crosscut saw successfully with a 6" slim file. Inquiring minds want to know.:)

[Andrew Pitonyak]

I believe that the idea is to choose a file such that the tooth will rub against just less than 1/2 the length of a file side. This maximizes the use of the file. I expect that a larger file will make no difference (ie, it will work), but, if the larger file costs more you spend more money on files.

I also suspect that if the file is significantly larger, then the radius on the edges might matter and it may be more difficult to set into very small teeth.... but that is complete speculation...

[lowell holmes]

I believe that the idea is to choose a file such that the tooth will rub against just less than 1/2 the length of a file side. This maximizes the use of the file. I expect that a larger file will make no difference (ie, it will work), but, if the larger file costs more you spend more money on files.

I also suspect that if the file is significantly larger, then the radius on the edges might matter and it may be more difficult to set into very small teeth.... but that is complete speculation...

Your thoughts are parallel with mine. It's just that written instructions are pretty explicit about the proper file size. The larger files I've been able to get don't have much radius. I will say that the cost of files is getting to border on ridiculosus.

[Curtis Niedermier]

I think it has to do with the "other" three edges. Remember, a saw file is a six-sided file: the three obvious flat faces and the narrow edges. The really small files have much finer edges, I guess so the gullets are proportionate to the teeth, or something like that.

[Mike Brady]

You are correct that the corners of the file are sharper as the files decrease in length and taper, so you get a deeper gullet. With the scarcity of 4" files in xxslim, it is better to use a needle file for teeth smaller than 14 tpi. The bad new is that needle files cost twice as much ($15.) I use them just on by dovetail saws. I'm hoping to get at least a few sharpenings from each of them because they are longer and thus have more teeth.

For my longer saws I am going to try the new Nicholsons that come in the green packaging. My local Ace hardware has them and a couple of good sharpeners on forums have been complimentary of them. They are made in Mexico, but the two that I bought look very good, but I have not used them yet, since I have had them not even a full day. They cost a little over $6. ea.

[Patrick Chase]

I believe that the idea is to choose a file such that the tooth will rub against just less than 1/2 the length of a file side. This maximizes the use of the file. I expect that a larger file will make no difference (ie, it will work), but, if the larger file costs more you spend more money on files.

I also suspect that if the file is significantly larger, then the radius on the edges might matter and it may be more difficult to set into very small teeth.... but that is complete speculation...

Smaller files tend to have sharper corners, which yield deeper and better-defined gullets.

With that said you can usually get away with being a size too large. Using, say, a 5" 2XS on a 14 tpi saw (which would normally call for a 4" 2XS) probably isn't going to hurt anything, but substituting a 6" Slim for the same saw will likely compromise gullet geometry.

[Patrick Chase]

I believe that the idea is to choose a file such that the tooth will rub against just less than 1/2 the length of a file side. This maximizes the use of the file.

Opinions vary on that point. Isaac at Blackburn Tools argues that most of the real work is done by the parts of the teeth closest to the corners, and that those wear out long before the center of each face if you size the file such that each face is 2X the tooth height. If you look at his recommendations he goes closer to 1.5X. IIRC Stewie takes the same approach, which is why he used a needle file on his 10 tpi "Tiger Myrtle" saw.

I still use the 2X rule of thumb, though.

[Andrew Pitonyak]

For my longer saws I am going to try the new Nicholsons that come in the green packaging. My local Ace hardware has them and a couple of good sharpeners on forums have been complimentary of them. They are made in Mexico, but the two that I bought look very good, but I have not used them yet, since I have had them not even a full day. They cost a little over $6. ea.

Mr. Brady,

When you finally get around to trying those Mexico Nicholson files, please post your results.