Shooting Plane Advice, Please

[Doug Hepler]

Hello All,

I am trying to decide between the LV/Veritas shooting plane and the LV/Veritas miter plane. If you use either, please share your impressions with me. I'd also like links to reviews of these two. The shooting plane is about 6" longer and about 2 lb heavier than the miter plane, and has a skewed bed. Both are low angle bevel up planes. I like the skewed bed on the shooting plane but 16" seems a bit long.

I make furniture, mostly. I work in domestic hardwoods and occasionally softwood. I have no table saw. I use a hand saw and a good miter box. Initial cuts are done with a carpenter's (circular) saw with a cutting guide or a band saw. I find that I often need a couple of passes with a plane on my homemade shooting board to square up drawer parts, mitered edge banding, etc. A 12" deep drawer is about as large as I ever make.

Until now I have used a modified a Stanley #4 with a hot dog and low-angle block planes. I want a new plane because I am convinced that a plane that combines low bed angle and mass will be easier to use. At five pounds the miter plane seems heavy enough for my work, but I won't know until I get one.

Mid-$300 is a lot of money to me. I'd like to get just one plane, and I'd like it to be the "right" one.

All suggestions welcome.

(I also posted this on Woodnet so if you see it there, it's me!)

Doug

[Cody Colston]

You will get more, and better advice posting this in the handtool forum.

[Tom M King]

328227I own the shooting plane. I haven't had the miter plane in my hands. The shooting plane works like a dream. Having one that runs in a track makes it foolproof, and easy. You don't need to buy their track. Set the iron to take a thou or half. Hold piece against sole of plane in front of blade, and push the plane forward. Foolproof every time. I own some hundreds of planes, and this is the only new plane I own. I'm looking forward to having a job that also needs the left handed one to give me an excuse to buy it. I made the board in the picture out of some scrap Corian I had, but later wondered why I bothered. That was on a job where we inlaid hundreds of pieces in a floor. It made getting perfect fits easy. You might notice there is a thumb smudge right in front of the hump. After a while the spine became the most natural place for me to put my hand to push the plane. The tote just gets used for toting the plane.

This will be night and day difference over your no. 4 rig.

[David Dalzell]

I own the LV shooting plane. I have had it for about one year now. It is everything I hoped for in a shooting plane. I got it with the PM-V11 iron. This blade lasts a long time between sharpening. I use it both for squaring up cuts and for edge jointing of boards. The weight provides a lot of momentum. However for edge jointing I get better results when I move the plane somewhat slowly down the board edge. I have never regretted the purchase. Actually it wasn't my purchase; it was a Strongly Hinted for Xmas gift last year.

[Patrick Chase]

I have the Veritas shooting plane. I don't have the miter plane, but its size and cutting geometry are very similar to a #9 (though obviously the ergonomics are very different). I see two big differences:

1. Size. The shooting plane is 16" long with a 2-1/4" blade, the miter is 10.5" long with a 2" blade. Generally size/mass is good in a shooting plane as it helps to "power through" the entrance of end-grain cuts.

2. Skew. The shooting plane is designed to cut in only one direction (though it's available in RH and LH versions) and therefore has a skewed blade. The miter (like the #9) is designed to cut both ways and has a straight blade. This makes a BIG difference in tough end-grain cuts etc - I've shot with both straight- and skewed-blade planes, and the the skewed planes are much less prone to being jerked around - they just sail through the work unless you take a completely rank cut.

In case you can't tell, I'd stick with the dedicated shooter.

The other plane you might want to consider is the L-N #51. That one is about the same size as the Veritas shooter and also a skewed-blade shooter, but with bevel-down mechanics.

[Paul Sidener]

I have used both. I prefer the shooting plane, with a O1 steel iron. The steel is my preference, because it is easier to sharpen. The tote is more comfortable to use. The weight and skewed iron, make it easier to use. There is not much difference in price. It seams to give you more tool for the money. That being said, both tools will do a good job.

[Curt Putnam]

I think Patrick nailed the differences. Note that the larger plane takes the same blade as the other Veritas BU bench planes so there is the potential for synergy there. Given my understanding of your work and the two planes, I do not think you can go wrong with the big shooter. I see the smaller one as being very useful for smaller scale work.

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Doug

I've not used the new Mitre Plane, but have the Shooting Plane and can offer the following observations.

On one level these planes may be used for the same task - shooting end grain, such as sizing/squaring drawer fronts. The Mitre Plane will appear to be a little more versatile, insofar as it can be used on the left and right sides. The Shooting Plane is probably the more powerful of the two, but the main feature is that it is a dedicated shooter with a skewed blade, and this will add up to a smoother, less effortful action.

What is seemingly missed is that the Mitre Plane is more than for use on a shooting board. It is as versatile on a Mitre Jack, where the Shooting Plane would be unbalanced.

In the end a choice will come down to whether you want the best dedicated shooting plane, or whether you want something more versatile.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Patrick Chase]

[snip]

What is seemingly missed is that the Mitre Plane is more than for use on a shooting board. It is as versatile on a Mitre Jack, where the Shooting Plane would be unbalanced.

In the end a choice will come down to whether you want the best dedicated shooting plane, or whether you want something more versatile.


The OP's question appeared to suggest he wanted a dedicated shooter, and that's how a number of us answered, but obviously the tradeoffs are different if you're looking for a more general purpose plane.

I do have a question, though: Why would the miter plane be particularly suited to use with a mitre jack? It seems to me that basically any bevel-up plane would be equally useful for that, since the plane registers to its base rather than its side. The movable side handle wouldn't buy you anything there, and having a second knob in place of the tote doesn't appear to be advantageous either.

[David Bassett]

I recall a long discussion about the relative merits of these planes when the Miter plane first came out. You should be able to search for Veritas Miter plane and find it (in the Neanderthal forum.)

As I recall, the consensus(*) was: Shooting plane for just shooting, Miter plane for shooting plus other stuff, and other bench plane for other stuff with occasional shooting were the best choices.

(* for as much consensus as ever happens on a discussion forum.)

[Patrick Chase]

I recall a long discussion about the relative merits of these planes when the Miter plane first came out. You should be able to search for Veritas Miter plane and find it (in the Neanderthal forum.)

As I recall, the consensus(*) was: Shooting plane for just shooting, Miter plane for shooting plus other stuff, and other bench plane for other stuff with occasional shooting were the best choices.

(* for as much consensus as ever happens on a discussion forum.)

Or shooting plane plus jack to cover everything very nicely :-). I can't imagine that somebody would be looking at something as specialized as either the Miter plane or the Shooter if they didn't already have some bench planes. That's why I asked Derek about his mitre jack comment - I was checking to see if I was missing a reason why you'd want something in between, say, a 62 or 62-1/2 and the shooter.

[Derek Cohen]

The OP's question appeared to suggest he wanted a dedicated shooter, and that's how a number of us answered, but obviously the tradeoffs are different if you're looking for a more general purpose plane.

I do have a question, though: Why would the miter plane be particularly suited to use with a mitre jack? It seems to me that basically any bevel-up plane would be equally useful for that, since the plane registers to its base rather than its side. The movable side handle wouldn't buy you anything there, and having a second knob in place of the tote doesn't appear to be advantageous either.

Hi Patrick

I think that we are mostly in agreement. There is no need for the Mitre Plane if you already have a shooting plane and also a LA plane, or any other plane you prefer on end grain. For example, I would use a LA Jack, or even a block plane at a pinch, on a mitre jack, with the Shooting Plane dedicated to a shooting board. I do not mind an extra plane for special tasks. For someone that plans a single purchase for shooting, the Mitre Plane is a serious contender.

Regards from London

Derek

[Doug Hepler]

Sincere thanks to each of you -- it looks like the shooter will suit me best. The length is a bit much for me but I value the skewed blade bed. You have to fly with the plane that is available.:).

Just for the record, I have an adequate set of hand planes including bench, block, & specialty; BU & BD, LA, etc. Since I mostly work with hand tools, the little things begin to matter after a while. It's not that the price of this plane will break the bank. But I am frugal in my marrow bones and $300 will buy a lot of other cool stuff. I have thought about this for months. Time to act. WW is still cheaper (and more satisfying) than drinking or golf -- and I get to keep/sell the results. So, no worries.

Happy New Year to all

Doug

[Tom M King]

Good choice!

[Mark Kornell]

... WW is still cheaper (and more satisfying) than drinking or golf...

Amen!!!

------

[john zulu]

Here is a picture of the LV shooting plane in action. The wood is resak. Very hard piece of tropical wood. Would do well for your needs. I have not tried the LN plane so I cannot comment on that. I have no issue with the plane. But having a shooting board is a MUST.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/36427803@N04/13008132405/

[Patrick Chase]

Here is a picture of the LV shooting plane in action. The wood is resak. Very hard piece of tropical wood. Would do well for your needs. I have not tried the LN plane so I cannot comment on that. I have no issue with the plane. But having a shooting board is a MUST.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/36427803@N04/13008132405/

The LN is a common pitch BD plane with Bed Rock mechanics, though still with ~20 deg of skew. It's not going to be quite as easy as the LV for end grain work like that, but it gives some additional options for edge-shooting.

[Hilton Ralphs]

The Shooting Plane is no one trick pony as most think it is. You can use it to edge joint as the handle swivels and it even accepts the Veritas right angle fixed and variable fences. Firmly clamped down with an hole on the bottom, you could use it as a Spill plane. Just push the wood from the front.

The Miter Plane curiously has a set of holes near the bottom that I can't find a reference to on their website. Maybe this will also accept their fences?

[Derek Cohen]

The Shooting Plane is no one trick pony as most think it is. You can use it to edge joint as the handle swivels and it even accepts the Veritas right angle fixed and variable fences...

Hi Hilton

That is true ... in theory. In practice, it is unbalanced for that purpose. Anyway, I cannot imagine that someone would purchase a shooting plane for use as a jointer .... "Honey, if I get the Shooter, I can joint with it as well!" .. nah .. :)

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Patrick Chase]

Hi Hilton

That is true ... in theory. In practice, it is unbalanced for that purpose. Anyway, I cannot imagine that someone would purchase a shooting plane for use as a jointer .... "Honey, if I get the Shooter, I can joint with it as well!" .. nah .. :)

Regards from Perth

Derek

If anybody wants to try that line on their significant other then Veritas has given them at least a fig leaf of cover: The shooter comes drilled and tapped for the same fence as the jack rabbet. At least they're modest enough to not advertise that as a feature, though :-).

[John Schtrumpf]

Hi Hilton

That is true ... in theory. In practice, it is unbalanced for that purpose. Anyway, I cannot imagine that someone would purchase a shooting plane for use as a jointer .... "Honey, if I get the Shooter, I can joint with it as well!" .. nah .. :)

Regards from Perth

Derek
I would agree with that. I do however sometimes use my Veritas shooter when flattening the face of a board, as a try plane?. The extra width is interesting in this case, as it also somewhat flattens across the board, as well as lengthwise.

[john zulu]

I am sure you can use it as a try plane... But I don't think the handle can take that kind of punishment. Check the cast at the bolt of the handle......... It is limiting.... The shooter does not have a knob to hold too.

[Chris Hachet]

A vote for the shooting plane. I do not own it yet, but I have had it in my hands and lust it like nothing else....

[John Schtrumpf]

... The shooter does not have a knob to hold too.
I can't grab the knob as I normally would on a plane, because the side gets in the way. But after trying it with a knob from one of my other planes, I bought a Bubinga Knob for a L-A Smooth Plane.
328593

[Patrick Chase]

A vote for the shooting plane. I do not own it yet, but I have had it in my hands and lust it like nothing else....

I have the Veritas shooter, and it's one of the planes I would least like to part with. It gives relatively smooth cutting action thanks to the high blade skew. When I bought it I thought I might be making a mistake by choosing it over a more traditional #51-style plane, but given the sorts of surfaces that are shot I think that LV made the right call by going with a BU plane (and I say that as somebody who's come to prefer BD planes for a majority of uses).

[Patrick Chase]

I can't grab the knob as I normally would on a plane, because the side gets in the way. But after trying it with a knob from one of my other planes, I bought a Bubinga Knob for a L-A Smooth Plane.
328593

I was wondering how long it would be until somebody popped up and said they'd done that. That would probably be useful when working edges with a jointing board, which isn't an unheard-of use for a shooter (though I prefer to use a #7 or #8 with my jointing board).

As an added bonus you get some additional skew for free when planing with the tote and knob inline :-).

[john zulu]

I was wondering how long it would be until somebody popped up and said they'd done that. That would probably be useful when working edges with a jointing board, which isn't an unheard-of use for a shooter (though I prefer to use a #7 or #8 with my jointing board).

As an added bonus you get some additional skew for free when planing with the tote and knob inline :-).

Hmmm... Ideas are blossoming.

[Prashun Patel]

Last day free shipping.
Gift card for Xmas.
Just bought one...
Shoot!

[Doug Hepler]

Thanks to all who responded to my question. Here is my followup. Or maybe this is just a stealth gloat (of course it is).

I bought the LV shooter. It was all that other owners said it would be. Of course, like all LV planes, the fit and finish are elegant. The tote ships loose and needs to be tightened in the position you want. (LV sends an Allen wrench in case you don't have one!) I gave the iron a few strokes on 15 and 5 micron paper and tried it out. (The back of the iron is flat out of the box.) This plane is so much easier to use than the workarounds I had tried (a LA block plane and a #4 with a hot dog). It is a pleasure to feel it slice through end grain. I think the skewed iron makes a big difference.

People speak about the "bang" when a shooting plane contacts the workpiece. There is no "bang" because this plane cuts instead of banging into the work. Actually, it will cut 3/4" stock smoothly when I start the cut right at the workpiece and just give it a push.

I was concerned that the plane would be too long for my 12" shooting board and narrow planing bench against a wall. Not so. The mouth is placed just far enough back to register the plane on the shooting board before I start the cut on all but the widest workpieces. I did not get the shooting rails and I don't think I'll need them because the plane is easy to control.

I had been thinking of this as a shooter, but I tried it out as a jointer. It cuts with the grain "like buttah". I won't be needing my jointer plane fence any longer.

Others have said it before: I'm glad I bought it and wish I had had it to use on my last project.

Doug

[Jim Koepke]

Or maybe this is just a stealth gloat (of course it is).

It is a gloat worthy acquisition.

If I didn't already have an LN#62 for shooting, I would likely give the Veritas shooting plane consideration. Alas, when my decision was made the Veritas shooting plane wasn't available.

jtk

[Patrick Chase]

I had been thinking of this as a shooter, but I tried it out as a jointer. It cuts with the grain "like buttah". I won't be needing my jointer plane fence any longer.


One handy thing about that plane is that it uses the same blades as the bevel-up smoother, jack, and jointer. If you need to work mixed grain you can therefore swap in a high-angle blade just as with those other planes (assuming you have one or more of them).

I personally don't like BU planes for jointing - I use an LV custom 7 or an L-N 8.