New Grinder Suggestions

[James White]

Hi All,

I think I would like to replace my 8" Delta variable speed grinder. It it has too much vibration. If i fiddle with it long enough I can get it smoother. But I don't need that headache every time I need to change wheels or it goes out of balance again. So the question is what is the least expensive slow speed grinder that is not plagued with vibration issues do to stamped steel flanges? There always seems to be that one brand/model that strikes the balance between cost and performance for most tools. So is there any consensus on 8" grinders?

This is what I have now. Or at least it looks like the one I have.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_82693-32764-GR450_0__?productId=3099945

James

[Roger Chandler]

This link will take you to the grinder I have........it is industrial rated with 3/4 hp, premium motor and bearings. It has been highly rated by Highland Hardware and others. It is out of production now, but there are still some on the market. This grinder has long enough shaft to accommodate a 1.5" CBN wheel on either side and still put the shroud and dust collection on the ends.......I have been VERY HAPPY with mine!

Because it is out of production, and Steel City has closed its doors, you might have to purchase another grinder if it failed for some reason, but everyone I have heard of getting one of these has nothing but high marks for it, and it runs so smooth and quiet, that it is a pleasure to use. Comes with wheel balancers already attached to the matrix wheels........I took those off because I got two new CBN wheels at the same time.......

This is a premium grinder for $299, and well worth it! I got mine off ebay from these folks, but you can order directly from them.....good to do business with!

https://www.utterguys.com/xcart/Steel-City-15430-8-Industrial-Slow-Speed-Grinder.html

[Clay Fails]

I have a Baldor 8100W which has 8 inch wheels at 1800 RPM. Plenty of power to run two 1.5 inch CBN wheels. Very smooth. I'm happy with it.

[David Delo]

The new Rikon 80-808 from Woodcraft has been good to me so far. It's $219.00 now but was 50 bucks less in price when it came out a few months ago. Not that impressed with the stock A/O wheels that it came with but I got it just for a pair of CBN wheels. Nice smooth running unit. The Steel City unit seems to have everyone satisfied also but I'm not sure about the quality of the stock wheels. Seems like the grinder mfg's put the cheapest wheel they can on for stock issue just like the bandsaw and table saw guys do.

[allen thunem]

i have a jet that works great

[Bob Bergstrom]

I have a Jet 1hp 3400 rpm. Much cheaper than the 1720. I put plywood spacer to fit in my CBN wheels. 1 hp gets them spinning quickly. And once I got useto the speed, I'm back turning quickly. Paid $220. with free shipping.

[Len Mullin]

James, did you ever consider purchasing a machined set of flanges for the grinder? I had a set made at a local machine shop, they made a big difference in my grinder.
Len

[Reed Gray]

Like Len said, it might be the flanges that are the problem, and not the grinder. I had to add spacers to my Baldor to get the CBN wheels on in the correct spot. I used stamped steel washers from the big box store. Even on the Baldor with the spin and bubble balanced wheels, I got side ways wobble till it got up to speed. I had some machined flanges/washers made, and they ran perfect after that. I think some of the standard grinding wheels are like that one piece of wood that you some times get, that no matter what you do to it, it never runs true or balanced. At least with the CBN wheels, it eliminates that problem.

I did get one of the new Rikon 1 hp 8 inch slow speed grinders. There is a review that I did about a month or two back if you search for it. Short version, plenty of power, base after taking the rubber pads off had to have one foot ground down about 1/8 inch to get it to sit on a flat surface without rocking. The wheel shrouds were not identical, and I had to ream out the screw holes on one side so I could slide my robo rest all the way up to the wheel. It isn't a Baldor, but is a good deal for the price.

robo hippy

[Bill Boehme]

Hi All,

I think I would like to replace my 8" Delta variable speed grinder. It it has too much vibration. If i fiddle with it long enough I can get it smoother. But I don't need that headache every time I need to change wheels or it goes out of balance again. So the question is what is the least expensive slow speed grinder that is not plagued with vibration issues do to stamped steel flanges? There always seems to be that one brand/model that strikes the balance between cost and performance for most tools. So is there any consensus on 8" grinders?

This is what I have now. Or at least it looks like the one I have.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_82693-32764-GR450_0__?productId=3099945

James

If you take both wheels off does it still vibrate? My guess is that it will run with no vibration at all. The problem isn't the grinder, but the wheels that are causing the problem. You can buy a more expensive grinder and continue to have the same old problem. Read this (http://www.geigerssolutions.com/Tuning-Up-a-Bench-Grinder.html) to learn more about the cause and cure of vibration. In a nutshell, the plastic bushings that come with a wheel are part of the problem. The large beveled washers are frequently another contributor, and finally the wheel may be slightly out of round. In the link that I gave, Don Geiger gives a step by step method to cure vibration problems and the cost is just a bit of paper and a diamond truing tool.

[Clay Fails]

Like Len said, it might be the flanges that are the problem, and not the grinder. I had to add spacers to my Baldor to get the CBN wheels on in the correct spot. I used stamped steel washers from the big box store. Even on the Baldor with the spin and bubble balanced wheels, I got side ways wobble till it got up to speed. I had some machined flanges/washers made, and they ran perfect after that. I think some of the standard grinding wheels are like that one piece of wood that you some times get, that no matter what you do to it, it never runs true or balanced. At least with the CBN wheels, it eliminates that problem.

I did get one of the new Rikon 1 hp 8 inch slow speed grinders. There is a review that I did about a month or two back if you search for it. Short version, plenty of power, base after taking the rubber pads off had to have one foot ground down about 1/8 inch to get it to sit on a flat surface without rocking. The wheel shrouds were not identical, and I had to ream out the screw holes on one side so I could slide my robo rest all the way up to the wheel. It isn't a Baldor, but is a good deal for the price.

robo hippy

Reed,
Did you have to cut a notch in the washers for the little nub on the Baldor shaft? Mine came with two large (aluminum ?) washers with notches for the nubs on the shaft. They're like you have on a table saw between the nut and the blade. I kept them on when I installed the CBN wheels, and the outer guards wouldn't fit without spacers. I still have a little wobble on the CBN wheels, but it doesn't seem to affect the grinding. Maybe getting someone to machine washers to fit like you did is a better idea.

[Robert Engel]

Reed you got your answer: don't buy a new grinder, figure out how to balance the wheels.

If you buy a new one you will have the same issues.

[James White]

Hi All,

Thank you for all of the replies. It looks like $350 is the threshold when shipping is factored in. I was hopping $250 would do it. With that said I do know it is the cup flanges that are the problem. What do you all think about the One Way balancer as a solution? One of you mentioned getting bushings made. But the one way system is $70. I cant see a machine shop making something like that for that kind of money. It would mean that I would have to buy a one new wheel with a 1" arbor hole. But the pink CGW wheel I have has a 1-1/4" hole. So that one should work.

James

[Roger Chandler]

Hi All,

Thank you for all of the replies. It looks like $350 is the threshold when shipping is factored in. I was hopping $250 would do it. With that said I do know it is the cup flanges that are the problem. What do you all think about the One Way balancer as a solution? One of you mentioned getting bushings made. But the one way system is $70. I cant see a machine shop making something like that for that kind of money. It would mean that I would have to buy a one new wheel with a 1" arbor hole. But the pink CGW wheel I have has a 1-1/4" hole. So that one should work.

James
The bushings can be a big problem. I had two high quality Norton 3x blue matrix wheels on my old grinder, and they are pretty much the high end of matrix wheels, and they plastic bushings made them wobble. I ordered drill bushings from McMaster Carr, and put them in the wheels........made a huge difference. They were not perfectly balanced, but almost so.

When I upgraded earlier this year to the Steel City industrial grinder and go the CBN wheels, the grinder came with machined washers for the wheels to ride against, and the matrix wheels that were on it already had wheel balancers on them.....a really sweet setup and the thing runs so smooth and quiet that you have make sure to remember you have it turned on!

If you are prepared to spend for a new grinder, you owe it to yourself to seriously check this one out. I spent a good bit of time researching, and I feel like I got a great grinder that performs on a high level. Good luck if you go with the bushings!
Here is a link for the 5/8" shaft bushings, but they have all sizes;

http://www.mcmaster.com/#8491a562/=10cmnbp

[Wes Ramsey]

I've heard good things about the Raptor washers and bushings (https://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/t/97/Grinding-Wheels). You still have to true up the wheel, but if yours is like mine and won't stay true this should do the trick. I'm hoping to pick these up myself in the next few weeks.

[Reed Gray]

I did cut a slot in the bushings I used on my grinder. I have an article on CBN grinding wheels on my web site, and show some pictures there. The standard flanges don't work on the CBN wheels because they are made for wheels with flat sides rather than the CBN wheels which have a bunch of the mass turned out of one solid piece of metal.

As far as balancing systems and arbor holes go, well, you can replace the plastic bushings, get a balancing system, get a wheel dresser or two, or for not much more you can go with the CBN wheels. They never need to be trued up or balanced. They come with precision bushings. They never need to be cleaned. They never change size. There is no risk of them ever blowing up.

http://www.robohippy.net/featured-article/

robo hippy

[Reed Gray]

Oh yea, I think all of the big box stores carry the Rikon line of tools, and should be able to at least order one of those grinders for you, and it should come in on a load of other tools, so no shipping.

robo hippy

[Pat Scott]

I had a Norton 3X wheel on one side of my grinder and Norton SG wheel on the other side (I don't think the SG is available anymore). I had wobble with both wheels, and I agree the plastic bushings that come with the Norton wheels are worthless. I thought about getting the Oneway balancing system, but I thought I read somewhere that it won't work with the SG wheel (or was it the 3X wheel?), so I didn't get it.

I was able to buy a WoodTurners Wonders CBN wheel through my club for something like $125, so to me that was a no brainer. The WW wheel comes with a precision 5/8" hole drilled in it which was a perfect fit to the shaft on my Woodcraft grinder (meaning no bushing required). For $18 I also bought the Raptor bushings for the Norton wheel that I kept on the other side and they made a huge difference. I still have a little side to side wobble but no where near what it used to be. I did have to re-true the Norton wheel once I put the Raptor bushing on.

[James White]

Hi all,

I pulled the trigger on the One Way Balancing system. Lucky that I did not see the Raptor bushing option before placing my order. Since I would have never been able to make a decision. I do believe that the Steel City grinder that Roger posted is the sweet spot that I was seeking. Since it is the only grinder that comes with machined flanges. However at $350 I could not justify it. I typically only turn about twice a year. So CBN and or other options over $300 did not make sense to me at this time. I will let you all know how things turn out. I believe between the bushings, balancing and truing with the one way dresser that I already have. I should be able to get to a satisfactory place.

James

[Doug Ladendorf]

Just to throw another idea in here, a good used Baldor can be had for short money. I have three Baldor grinders/buffers and didn't pay more than $250 for any.

Doug

[Reed Gray]

I only see used Baldors right after I buy one brand new.....

robo hippy

[Bill Boehme]

Hi all,

I pulled the trigger on the One Way Balancing system. Lucky that I did not see the Raptor bushing option before placing my order. Since I would have never been able to make a decision. I do believe that the Steel City grinder that Roger posted is the sweet spot that I was seeking. Since it is the only grinder that comes with machined flanges. However at $350 I could not justify it. I typically only turn about twice a year. So CBN and or other options over $300 did not make sense to me at this time. I will let you all know how things turn out. I believe between the bushings, balancing and truing with the one way dresser that I already have. I should be able to get to a satisfactory place.

James

This is for the benefit of others with the same question. The Oneway system will help to reduce vibration, but is a lot of money spent for what you could do for almost free. The Oneway wheel balancing system doesn't really fix the root cause of the problem ... it's just a band-aid and as the wheels wear down, the problem will gradually return. One of the worst things to do is grind the side of the wheels because the wheels are not the source of the wobble ... it's the beveled washers and to a lesser extent, the plastic bushings. Don Geiger's technique is easy to do and costs almost nothing. If you feel that you must replace the plastic bushings, I would suggest using Oilite® bronze bearings available at many well stocked hardware stores and some auto parts stores as well as online.

[Reed Gray]

Bill, I will disagree with you a bit about truing up the sides of the grinding wheels. The ones that came with my Rikon have what appears to be a ceramic or epoxy of some sort that is poured and molded to fit the grinder shaft. The wheels had about 1/8 inch of wobble, or plus/minus 1/16 inch. Especially on the cheaper wheels, the center hole is not very accurate, and if there are plastic bushings, this adds to the problem. It has been many hears since I have had that type of wheel on my grinders. If you really want to balance them out, both the face and the sides need to be trued up, and you need to mark the shaft of the grinder, and the wheel so they can line up if you remove the wheel for any purpose. Kind of like when you take some thing out of a chuck, you mark one jaw placement to get it back on right.

robo hippy

[Olaf Vogel]

Just to throw another idea in here, a good used Baldor can be had for short money. I have three Baldor grinders/buffers and didn't pay more than $250 for any.

Doug


years ago I took turning lessons. The instructor had the smoothest grinder I'd ever seen.
his advise was to find an old used grinder then add the Oneway balancer and fiddle til,it's perfect.

following his advise, I found a 1960(ish) Black and Decker 12", all cast iron, for $100.
I Set the wheels once and have never adjusted in 3 years. Except for the occasional surfacing.

I'll credit the balancing system. And about 140 lbs of metal...
Most modern ones are much lighter, don't have heavy shields and usually very poor eye shields.
and the problem is frequently just the wheels.

[Bill Boehme]

Bill, I will disagree with you a bit about truing up the sides of the grinding wheels. The ones that came with my Rikon have what appears to be a ceramic or epoxy of some sort that is poured and molded to fit the grinder shaft. The wheels had about 1/8 inch of wobble, or plus/minus 1/16 inch. Especially on the cheaper wheels, the center hole is not very accurate, and if there are plastic bushings, this adds to the problem. It has been many hears since I have had that type of wheel on my grinders. If you really want to balance them out, both the face and the sides need to be trued up, and you need to mark the shaft of the grinder, and the wheel so they can line up if you remove the wheel for any purpose. Kind of like when you take some thing out of a chuck, you mark one jaw placement to get it back on right.

robo hippy

You may be correct. I was assuming that all wheels are perfect width and flat with a well center hole like the Norton wheels I have used. My rationale for not side grinding a "good" wheel is that the only reason for wobble would be the bushings and cup washers not being as good as they ought to be.

If the wobble were caused by a common problem like a cheap plastic bushing and washers that aren't flat then "fixing" it by dressing the sides of a "good" wheel screws up the wheel if you ever decide to install a good metal bushing and machined washers. But, if the wheels are as you described then perhaps the best thing to do is clean up the sides because all the other solutions would only amount to the proverbial lipstick on a pig.

For those who are using cheap quality grinding wheels I would suggest that at some point in the near future it would be a good idea to upgrade the grinding wheels to Norton 3X or even better, CBN. I currently have Norton 3X wheels and they are nice. The nicest thing is that the amount of grinding particles that were getting into everything is reduced considerably. I still don't like the fine dust that hangs in the air. I have used a CBN wheel just once and now I cant wait for my matrix wheels to wear out, but like the Energizer bunny, they keep going and going and going . . . . .

[James White]

I had stopped in to a Woodcraft the other day and saw the Rikon 1hp unit ($200). It looks nice an robust. Can anyone who has one tell us what the washers are like? Are they stamped steel or machined?

James