Heavy Duty Concealed Hinges

[Bill Orbine]

I'm designing and pricing kitchen cabinets for a client. The hinges for the kitchen are Blum concealed hinges. The design is shaker style with flat panel doors inset with frames on cabinet. . My client wants pantry cabinet with shelving mounted onto back of doors. That means possibly canned goods and heavy stuff. My concerns are mostly weight. My experience is that these doors tend to sag even if I use multiple euro hinges. Meaning that periodically, I have to go back and adjust them up.

I thought there be a hinge that similar to the type used in Sub-Zero fully integrated system. But I can't find any. Anybody know of such? Or is there another idea? The shelving rack must be attached to back of doors..... there will be adjustable shelving in the cabinet....no rollouts. I'd appreciate the input....Thanks

[Jamie Buxton]

I have a similar issue in an upcoming kitchen. Customer wants doors enclosing a laundry area. In the current design, the doors are 30" wide by 90" tall -- that is, a full-size interior passage door. I want to make them 1 3/8" thick, so they don't flap in the breeze, so they're going to weigh a lot more than the usual cabinet door. However, the homeowner does not want knuckle hinges like passage doors have. They want the hinges to be like the rest of the kitchen -- cup hinges. I dunno what to do. I've been looking at pivot hinges, like these -- http://www.hardwaresource.com/hinges/door-hinges/pivot-hinges-pivot-sets/ This class of hinges certainly can handle the load. The pivots are visible, unlike cup hinges, but they're not as visible as the standard knuckle hinges on passage doors. The pivots would be down at the floor/toekick, and up near the crown molding, mostly out of sight. They don't self-close, so I'd have to engineer that part too. grumble. Maybe the best answer is just to use a half dozen cup hinges on each door. grumble.

[Fred Heenie]

Multiple hinges, yes. More specifications required. Grass or Hettich commercial hinges, probably. A call to the Grass or Hettich rep for a visit definitely and your local authorized distributor can arrange for a meeting.. The shelf depth will also be an issue but one that can be accommodated.

[Jamie Buxton]

Multiple hinges, yes. More specifications required. Grass or Hettich commercial hinges, probably. A call to the Grass or Hettich rep for a visit definitely and your local authorized distributor can arrange for a meeting.. The shelf depth will also be an issue but one that can be accommodated.

When you say "Grass or Hettich commercial", what are you talking about? Both Grass and Hettich produce hinges they often call "institutional" hinges. They do use cup mounting on the door side, but the hinge knuckles are not concealed when the door is closed. http://www.grassusa.com/downloads/Grass_Institutional_Hinges14.pdf Is that what you're talking about?

[Bradley Gray]

Soss concealed hinges are available in really large sizes at cshardware.com

[Jamie Buxton]

Soss concealed hinges are available in really large sizes at cshardware.com

Yes, but while they are concealed, they don't work the way the usual cup-hinged cabinet door works. For instance, I don't think Soss hinges do overlay. As I see them, they do inset, and that's about it.

[Bradley Gray]

you are correct - inset only. I have used them for pantry units and I did have a fixed frame, but I was able to keep the fronts in the same plane with the overlay doors and no hinge showing.

[Jamie Buxton]

Aha! Sugatsune makes a heavy duty cup hinge. Sugatsune says that two of them can support a 55 pound door. In contrast, two of Blum's cup hinges are spec'd to support 15 pounds of door. To support 55 pounds, Blum suggests five hinges.

Tech: http://www.sugatsune.com/products/technical_doc/j95.pdf
Purchase: http://www.cabinethardware.com/Sugatsune-J95-Heavy-Duty-Concealed-Hinge-and-Plate-p/1439.htm

It is a full overlay hinge, but you can block it out to get half overlay, and block it further to get inset. 40 mm cup bore. It is a 95 degree opening, and that's all you get.

[Justin Ludwig]

327398 and 327399

Both of those "scooby doo" doors are 3-0 and loaded with pictures and books now. They both have 7 Blum soft close hinges. I had to go back after they moved in and loaded them down and make some adjustments. A year later, they are still true with no racking.

[Bill Orbine]

327398 and 327399

Both of those "scooby doo" doors are 3-0 and loaded with pictures and books now. They both have 7 Blum soft close hinges. I had to go back after they moved in and loaded them down and make some adjustments. A year later, they are still true with no racking.

Probably, the failure of the adjustments to stay true depends on the frequency of often the heavily laden door gets used. Kitchen pantry doors laden with weight most certainly get used often every day. So, do these "Scooby-Doo" doors encounter heavy daily use like pantry doors?

It seems the Sugatsune J95 concealed hinges may top the list. So far, the Sugastune boast the highest load ratings. I will continue to keep my eyes peeled and hope more information comes along until I begin this project in 2016. I appreciate those who helped. Thank You.

[Lee Schierer]

All the pantry doors I have seen and the ones I made used piano hinges to support the weight of the doors and things placed on the doors. Cup hinges may not have enough weight bearing capacity to support canned goods unless you use a lot of them.

[Fred Heenie]

Yes Jaime, The exposed knuckle and lack of soft close are the cost a stronger hinge. Some has mentioned the Sugatsune also an option.

[Justin Ludwig]

So, do these "Scooby-Doo" doors encounter heavy daily use like pantry doors?


I doubt they do. It's a closet that houses a gun safe.

Why not use traditional passage way hinges? Mortise 4 slots instead of three and use a 3" screw in the top two hinges that will grab a stud.

[Bill Orbine]

I doubt they do. It's a closet that houses a gun safe.

Why not use traditional passage way hinges? Mortise 4 slots instead of three and use a 3" screw in the top two hinges that will grab a stud.

Cabinet design calls for concealed hinges. If this were a pantry closet, I'll use traditional hinges in a hurry no problem, and yes, I do drive longer screws into studs at times. Anyway, I looking at using Sugatsune hinge type J95 if something else doesn't come up. These are rated for 55lbs a pair and 88lbs for 1-1/2 pair. I just might do 2 pair per 60" high door. It's looking like I'll pull the trigger and offer Sugatsune to my client. If I do used the Sugatsune, I should come back here and offer my review.

[Justin Ludwig]

A review would be awesome. I've never used those hinges, but always keep an eye out for upgrades/possibilities.

[jim mills]

Bump...
Any followup on this thread. Im doing a pantry with inset doors with storage on doors, so need heavy duty hinges.

[Bill Orbine]

I'm working on the kitchen now. I'll soon order the hardware.... Mostly Blum stuff with Sugatsune hinges for the pantry doors. I just found out Sugatsune now offers a full inset hinge that just came out. That would be better than the overlay design that Sugatsune currently offers and suppliers have in stock. The upside to full inset hinges is I don't have to do a pack out for framed cabinets and inset doors. The trouble with the full inset hinges is that it's so new the suppliers have yet to list the hinges in their stock for ordering.

In the next week, I'll be placing orders for the hardware and I'll probably call the Sugatsune distributor direct and see if I can get them.

Soon well have a follow up I hope.

[jim mills]

Thanks. I checked them out on their website. The 95deg. opening is a deal breaker for me. I want a 180 deg. Guess I will have to rethink using butt hinges.

[Bill Orbine]

I'm not to privy to the 95 degree hinges either. But not much choice in the matter. Customer understands the limitations. I can use 135 degree hinges or even 170 degree hinges, but these hinges have more mechanical pivots that wear out of adjustments and most of these hinges don't accommodate 1 inch thick door. Which is why I'm asking if anyone knew of a good hinge similar to Sub Zero's fully integrated refrigerator doors. I recall seeing something like this a long time ago and I might have used it. But I think even these hinges are somewhat limited in the opening... I don't know.