Finally made good dovetails

[Eric Schubert]

Dovetails... I love the look of dovetails. But, the few times I tried making dovetails, they weren't that great.

I recently saw a class available at the local Woodcraft store and decided to jump on it, hoping I would come out of it really understanding how to make great dovetails. And, well... it seems it worked! I learned so many little tips that will help me tremendously with future projects. How to saw properly. Using dividers to lay them out evenly. Best practices for marking your lines. Tips on using a chisel. And, most of all, how to overlook minor flaws that really don't affect the final product. (Probably the biggest issue I have is seeing and trying to fix all of the little flaws.)

Everything really helped. It was definitely worth the cost of the class to see, in-person, how to make a proper set of dovetails. I feel much more prepared to make more dovetails.

Now... it's about time I start planning out that tool chest.

They're not perfect. I over-sawed in a few spots. And I accidentally split the wood while tapping everything together a little too hard. But I'm really happy with how these turned out.

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t314/Mr_Spiffy/Woodshop/20151121_180059_zpspb8agzxy_edit_1449089189144_zps 2ienclti.jpg

[ken hatch]

Eric,

Not bad, add a little glue and sawdust and by the time you clean up the surfaces the small "opps" will disappear. Good job, it helps to have someone show you the way.

ken

[Daniel Rode]

Nice work Eric! My early attempts did not look as good :)

[Mike Brady]

Those look very nice! Good proportions, square sawing, no gaps. Watch the over-sawing and make those half-pins a bit wider. Many people never get as good as you are already.

[Eric Schubert]

Thanks, everyone! We received guidance as we made these, obviously. But I'm really happy with how they turned out, especially considering my previous attempts.

Mike, is there a method or ratio for setting pin widths?

In this case, we simply made a half-pin around 3/16" wide on the edges, then used dividers to set evenly-distributed positions for the rest. (Set to ~1" wide, and set one leg on the 3/16" line, then walk across. Adjust until it walks right to the edge of the board, with the number of tails/pins we want.) This works, obviously. But if there are some guidelines for sizes, I'm all ears/eyes.

[ken hatch]

Thanks, everyone! We received guidance as we made these, obviously. But I'm really happy with how they turned out, especially considering my previous attempts.

Mike, is there a method or ratio for setting pin widths?

In this case, we simply made a half-pin around 3/16" wide on the edges, then used dividers to set evenly-distributed positions for the rest. (Set to ~1" wide, and set one leg on the 3/16" line, then walk across. Adjust until it walks right to the edge of the board, with the number of tails/pins we want.) This works, obviously. But if there are some guidelines for sizes, I'm all ears/eyes.

Eric,

Dividers work about as well as any method and are quicker than most. About the only rule to follow is; make 'em where they look good to you.

ken

[Prashun Patel]

I'd be proud if they were mine.

[Eric Schubert]

Thanks, Ken. I've heard skinny pins are more desirable, simply because they show off good craftsmanship (they're harder to make). I just want to start with good-looking average-sized dovetails and get good at them. I'll worry about skinny pins and irregular patterns later.

[Mike Henderson]

Just for interest, Eric, where are you located? I'm wondering which Woodcraft you took the class at.

Mike

[Eric Schubert]

Mike, I took the class at the store in Loveland, CO.

[Bill White]

Whoaa! Errors on the first attempts are NOT permissible. We will NOT accept anything less than perfect for the DTs.
You have gotta know that I'm just jerkin' your chain. I wish mine had been that well done.
Keep on keepin' on.
Bill

[Jim Koepke]

Eric,

Even after making dovetails for over a decade, I would be happy with the dovetails you made.

Sizing is of course up to the individual.

For my own work I like to make the half pins on the end a bit fatter. My pins and tails tend to be the same size.

My layout is derived from the size of chisel being used. The dividers are set to be about as wide as my paring chisel plus a little less than two saw kerf widths. This size is used to mark the base of the tails. That ends up being the narrow part of the waste in the pins.

For my most commonly used sizes of wood I have a couple of story sticks marked out. This makes it so they do not have to be redesigned for every time dovetails are going to be cut.

326259

jtk

[Eric Schubert]

I've yet to see story sticks for dovetails. I think they're a neat idea, and could really cut down on time and effort during layout. Thanks for sharing, Jim!

[David Eisenhauer]

Very good work. I have seen dovetails on some old furniture and chests that were way rougher than yours. As someone said, mix up a little glue and sawdust to fill the one oversaw and some of the barely visible rough saw edges of the tails and it is good to go. If that is the worst you ever do, you are sailing along.

[Reinis Kanders]

I think that having small half pins is actually good because that makes the corner glue joint closer to the edge.

[Mike Henderson]

I think that having small half pins is actually good because that makes the corner glue joint closer to the edge.
The problem with small half pins is that they're weak and it's easy to split the board there. You need to be very accurate and precise if you want to use small half pins.

Mike

[Adam Stevens2]

I'm about where you are, Eric. Getting even halfway decent looking dovetails is cause for celebration.

I just finished up a bastardised anarchist's toolchest, dovetailed every which way, and there are still definitely some inconsistent efforts. I would say that the last batch came out the best... too bad they're hidden inside the chest as tool trays.

[steven c newman]

The dovetails look good! My template is just an old 1/2" dovetail bit from a router. I can work the spacing as needed, then carry the lines around with a square..

Now, how about a "Homework Assignment"?
326287
Here is the pins, angle is 22-1/2 degrees for a sloped sided tote
326288
Then I use the pins to mark out the tails, then cut on the waste side, leaving the lines.
The result?

326290
something like this. Have fun with the Homework Assignment.....

[Eric Schubert]

Adam, I'm planning to make the anarchist's tool chest, also. I'm debating between that and a bench add my next project. But I'm leaning toward the chest, since it's more compact and has lots of dovetails for practice.

Steven, that's a very cool box. I may just have to try that! Very cool "homework assignment".

[Andrew Pitonyak]

Very nice looking dove tails, I am impressed. <enter evil mode> Now do that in a very hard wood like oak :D

You either have some innate talent (wish I did), or you have worked very hard; probably some of each and certainly the later.

[Simon MacGowen]

Congrats on your success. As I always tell people, the most effective way to learn to cut good dovetails is to take a class. As both a user and teacher of dovetail joints, I have seen huge improvements to people who were frustrated with their efforts and results. Many -- without the basic and good sawing skill -- attempted to cut dovetails and then got turned off by their initial experiences. While that is one way of learning how to cut dovetails, it is slow and ineffective -- except for a few.

Those who learned and cut "ok" dovetails on their own will also see much better joints after taking a class (provided of course whoever teaches it is a good teacher -- I have seen my share of teachers who are very good at the joint but not at diagnosing the students' problems and helping them jump the hurdle. And that is also the difference between learning under a good teacher and watching a DVD).

Your report confirms what I and other teachers have observed over the years about cutting dovetails.

Simon

[Eric Schubert]

Andrew, I'll admit that I have fairly good dexterity and I tend to be very picky about details. However, it really helped to have someone walk us through the process from beginning to end. I can only take some of the credit. Our instructor should get most of the credit. Without him, my dovetails would look just as bad as the previous few sets I tried to make.

I have to mention, one very small set of dovetails I attempted was in rosewood. WOW that stuff is hard! My chisels may grow legs and run away if I try using material that's that hard again.

Simon, echoing your own statements, I have to agree that the class helped me dramatically. I'd only tried making dovetails 2 or 3 times previously, and usually only a single corner to try it out. They were always pretty mediocre, at best. So, take the evidence as proof that instruction is a great way to improve your dovetails (or just about anything else you'd want to take a class for).