Black Friday and Cyber Monday Prices & Ads

[Rich Riddle]

That time of year is quickly approaching. Quite a few websites exist to offer sneak peaks at Black Friday deals. Looking at the Black Friday ad for Sears one can notice that the current sales offer many lower prices than Black Friday sales. Might be the same for Cyber Monday sales.

[Frederick Skelly]

I've been told to expect 15% off JET and PM and probably 20% on their accessories in some sort of factory backed sale. Not unusual for them but still good news if you're in the market for their stuff.
Fred

[Rich Riddle]

Lower prices on stationary tools always goes well. Will have to take a look to see if any are needed.

[Dan Hintz]

I expect BF deals to be better this year than the last few... but nowhere near what they were 5+ years ago.

Besides, I've already purchased the majority of what I want over the last few years anyway. This year's selection involves only four things:
1) PS4 combo pack (about $300)
2) Dedicated laptop for dinking around with Kali Linux (about $300)
3) Smaller TV (40-42") for the bedroom to replace the 32" that's dying (about $300)
4) Big TV (75"?), UHD, for the living room after a power surge took out the RF transmitter on my current set (I estimate $4-5k)

I may put off the big TV as I don't really need a UHD set yet (no content). Anything beyond the top 4 is icing (though I'm willing to be convinced otherwise :D ).

[Dave Anderson NH]

Gee Dan does your wife read SMC? It looks like a Christmas list to me.:D

[Pat Barry]

I expect BF deals to be better this year than the last few... but nowhere near what they were 5+ years ago.


4) Big TV (75"?), UHD, for the living room after a power surge took out the RF transmitter on my current set (I estimate $4-5k)

I may put off the big TV as I don't really need a UHD set yet (no content). Anything beyond the top 4 is icing (though I'm willing to be convinced otherwise :D ).
Didn't you have a surge protector? Watch video from pushy salesperson thread (https://youtu.be/j6YEpXS_ugU)

[Dan Hintz]

Didn't you have a surge protector?

Yeah, but I only had the $200 one...

[Dan Hintz]

Gee Dan does your wife read SMC? It looks like a Christmas list to me.:D

We don't really do tons of gifts for each other anymore, but we always keep an eye out for special items. If we see something the other will like, we get it, so it's a more traditional giving where you know it means something to the receiver. For example, I'm getting her a pair of weeping angel throw pillows... inexpensive at $30, but if you're a diehard Whovian, it's a squeal moment. Last year on the islands I found a unique dragonfly necklace with matching ring (she doesn't do earrings, so I skipped those)... I think it was around $1,500 for the set, but I had to get it because I knew she would really like it.

Years ago she didn't buy me any tangible gifts for my birthday, but she did get me a day of turning instruction with Bill Grumbine (now a good friend). that was better than any tool she could have purchased, because it meant she paid attention to what I liked. That kind of thought is tough to buy, and I'm a really hard guy to buy for.

[Brian Elfert]

Yeah, but I only had the $200 one...

A $200 surge protector should be pretty good unless it cost $200 only because of a brand name like Monster. SurgeX and Zero Surge make some good stuff, but not cheap. I had a $500 SurgeX unit (Paid a lot less on Craigslist) I was going to use in my previous house. I sold it to my father to put on his furnace. He was losing control boards due to power surges.

[Rich Engelhardt]

Black Friday prices have been inversely proportional to the opening times of the retailers...

:D :D

How's that for a fancy way of saying that ever since the race to be first to open, "Black Friday" has spilled over into Thanksgiving Day - the actual sale prices have gone up.

I'm as big a Black Friday nerd as you'll find, but, I refuse to support any retailer that's open on Thanksgiving by shopping there.

[Brian Elfert]

A lot of people have noted that Black Friday sale prices aren't nearly as good as they were 10 or 15 years ago. They say by watching deals year round they get better prices than Black Friday. Maybe 20 years my brother convinced my mother to go with him for some Black Friday door busters. Back then the lines were way shorter and the deals seemed to be better.

One big trend with electronics doorbusters is to sell crappy brands with low specs for low prices. It looks like a deal, but when you consider the specs and the low quality you are getting what you paid for. Walmart this year says they will have hundreds of most of their doorbusters per store. How good of a deal are the items really if Walmart can afford to sell hundreds of them? They probably aren't loss leaders if they bought a million of the item to stock each store with hundreds of the item.

It seems like people mostly buy only the cheap items so how are the stores making any money? Some years ago I went to Microcenter the afternoon of Black Friday looking for memory they had on sale. There was a line outside the store to get in hours after they opened. I had to wait like ten minutes. They had the memory, but I had to wait like 20 minutes to check out. It turned into nearly 45 minutes for what should have been 10 minutes max on a normal day. I was already there so it didn't make sense to go back without my item.

[Rich Engelhardt]

We hit the "mother of all BF sales" a few years back when we went to a Wal Mart @ 5:30 AM.
(in my best Yoda voice) - Impressed I was with the military precision the seasoned shoppers attacked the sale!

They hit the store in a group of three or more, all with coupons and ads cut out from other stores for price matching.
One took the shopping cart(s) and proceeded to go right to the checkout line and stand there with the cart(s), while the others fanned out and gathered the items.
The line holder sorted through the items and ads and matched them up while the others continued to shop.
The checkout lines were long, but, they weren't stalled - they all moved at a very brisk pace.

Line holders still waiting for their shoppers gladly let others go in front of them in line.

Everything was very peaceful, cheerful and upbeat.

The only hint of anything wrong was when some woman freaked out trying to cross from one side of the store to the other across the checkout lines.
Several people left their place in line to escort her and assure her nothing was going to happen to her.
All those people returned to their original place in line w/out anyone objecting to them "cutting in".

As a veteran of a dozen or so Black Fridays, I've never witnessed anything even close to the mad rush and chaos the media claims happens.
Every single store I've opened on Black Friday has hosted a very friendly and very upbeat crowd of shoppers.
The camaraderie of standing in the predawn chill waiting for the stores to open w/the other shoppers is great.
IIRC, last year Home Depot came out and distributed free coffee and doughnuts to the people in line.
(personally, I think that was a ploy to cut down on the rush to the limited supply of lost leader items since - - half the people in line made a bee line for the restrooms after the doors opened :D )

[Dan Hintz]

A $200 surge protector should be pretty good unless it cost $200 only because of a brand name like Monster. SurgeX and Zero Surge make some good stuff, but not cheap. I had a $500 SurgeX unit (Paid a lot less on Craigslist) I was going to use in my previous house. I sold it to my father to put on his furnace. He was losing control boards due to power surges.

Watch the video, Brian... and then read my comment ;-)

[John Sanford]

I've seen one pretty good Black Friday deal so far, at least one that I'm interested in.

Ace Hardware is going to have a 6 pack of Irwin (nee Vise Grip) Quick Grips for 14.95. 2x 12" Minis, 2x 6" Minis, and 2x Micros. This is the best package deal I've ever seen on 'em. It's the addition of the Micros that pushes it into great territory.

[Barrett Sammons]

A lot of people have noted that Black Friday sale prices aren't nearly as good as they were 10 or 15 years ago. They say by watching deals year round they get better prices than Black Friday. Maybe 20 years my brother convinced my mother to go with him for some Black Friday door busters. Back then the lines were way shorter and the deals seemed to be better.

One big trend with electronics doorbusters is to sell crappy brands with low specs for low prices. It looks like a deal, but when you consider the specs and the low quality you are getting what you paid for. Walmart this year says they will have hundreds of most of their doorbusters per store. How good of a deal are the items really if Walmart can afford to sell hundreds of them? They probably aren't loss leaders if they bought a million of the item to stock each store with hundreds of the item.

It seems like people mostly buy only the cheap items so how are the stores making any money? Some years ago I went to Microcenter the afternoon of Black Friday looking for memory they had on sale. There was a line outside the store to get in hours after they opened. I had to wait like ten minutes. They had the memory, but I had to wait like 20 minutes to check out. It turned into nearly 45 minutes for what should have been 10 minutes max on a normal day. I was already there so it didn't make sense to go back without my item.

That has been my experience as well. If you check sites like SlickDeals regularly or set alerts, you can find awesome deals, especially on electronics. I use 3 1920X1200 monitors for work and have picked up nice ones cheaper than I've seen on Black Friday. Also, a lot of the Black Friday electronics are stripped out versions to get you into the store.

[Garth Keel]

As I get older I am more likely to just watch the sales. I seem to have run out of room for new stuff!

[Mike Chance in Iowa]

We're going to participate in this sale http://optoutside.rei.com/ :cool:

[Richard McComas]

There's no amount of saving that will get me in town on Black Friday.

[Kev Williams]

I don't do BF sales, haven't left the house on a BF for probably 20 years. The wife buys stuff all year long hitting clearance racks everywhere. She gets crap almost for free at Kohls after stacking up all the discounts. I remember one trip we got me a nice winter coat, 8 or so pairs of jeans, a few T-shirts, bag of socks, underwear, couple of button shirts, socks & few unmentionables for her, all for less than $90. She finds stuff all year for the grandkids for next to nothing just keeping her eyes open...

My biggest pet peeve with BF and marketing in general this time of year is the absolute worthless junk put up for sale for the sole purpose of something to buy as gifts. This year's #1 ridiculous item is the "dual breakfast sandwich maker"... REEELLY?? This thing is bigger than a George Foreman grill, and all it'll do is heat up an egg and a bagel or muffin?? So what has to go to make room for this albatross?? The toaster oven, toaster, microwave, the Kitchenaid mixer, the 2... make that THREE coffee makers, the induction cooktop, the 3-across slow-cooker, the retro popcorn maker... Naaaahhh...

About 10 years ago or so, just for xmas, Black & Decker put out this hand-held cheese grater. Did anyone else buy one of these? It basically a handle with a small reciprocating grater, moved up & down about a half inch, about 5 strokes per second. The idea was you grate a little cheese only when you need it. Uh huh. When you turned it on and put it against a piece of cheese, the grater just stuck to the cheese, and now your hands are moving while the cheese and grater did nothing. Trying to hold the grater and cheese still enough that cheese would actually shred just stopped the thing. Had less power than a nose-hair trimmer. I paid $11 for that piece of trash, and lost all respect for B&D...

Glad I have everything I ever wanted. Well, except the Bentley Continental... ;)

[Robert Engel]

Woodcraft has Jet parallel clamps on sale 50% off.

[Rich Engelhardt]

Ace Hardware is going to have a 6 pack of Irwin (nee Vise Grip) Quick Grips for 14.95. 2x 12" Minis, 2x 6" Minis, and 2x Micros. This is the best package deal I've ever seen on 'em. It's the addition of the Micros that pushes it into great territory.Bear in mind - those aren't the "real deal" Vice Grips anymore, those are the made in China Irwin Owned vice grips.
They are night and day different from the old reliable ones.

Irwin bought out Vice Grip then shipped the manufacture over to China.

[Jim Laumann]

I've been told to expect 15% off JET and PM and probably 20% on their accessories in some sort of factory backed sale. Not unusual for them but still good news if you're in the market for their stuff.
Fred

Yup - was at a tool store yesterday - told the same thing. Made a call to Rockler - told same by them too.

[Brian Elfert]

Bear in mind - those aren't the "real deal" Vice Grips anymore, those are the made in China Irwin Owned vice grips.
They are night and day different from the old reliable ones.

Irwin bought out Vice Grip then shipped the manufacture over to China.

Realistically, what are the differences between so-called "real deal" Vice Grips and the Irwin Vice Grips? Certainly it would be better if they were still made in the USA, but are people complaining because the design changed, or because they are no longer made in the USA? Is the actual use and function of them different? I have a Tool Shop brand pair of "Vise Grips" and I have no idea what a vintage USA made pair would do better. (No idea why I didn't buy the USA made ones at the time, but production may have already gone to China.)

I know there is a huge love for Vise Grips made in the USA a long time ago at a certain factory that is long gone. I'm not certain if they actually work any better, or if people just like them because the design is different than newer Vise Grips.

[Matt Day]

Woodcraft has Jet parallel clamps on sale 50% off.

I don't see that sale on their site now. When will that start?

[Rich Engelhardt]

Realistically, what are the differences between so-called "real deal" Vice Grips and the Irwin Vice Grips?
Use a big honking pair of Channel Locks to squeeze the (real deal) Vice Grips closed on a tie rod, then slip a section of steel pipe over them and stand on the pipe to loosen the tie rod.

Now try that - - or better yet, don't even think of trying that - - with the Made in China ones.

A bit easier test is to just look at the teeth on the jaws of each one.
The old American made ones have nice sharp/hard/tough teeth.
The made in China ones - -don't.

Now, find a grungy old rusty pair of "real deal" ones and look at the teeth. despite the spot rust, the teeth are every bit as sharp and good as a clean pair.

Easier yet?
Just heft a pair of old American made Vice Grips, then heft a pair of the China made ones.
I can feel a significant difference in both heft and balance. (YMMV)

The sad thing really is that a lot of the newer designs are quite innovative.
It's a real pity the old quality isn't there to back up the innovative designs.

As for the old real deal ones, I have 3 or 4 pair of older ones that - -honestly - - I would trust my life on them.
If I had to clamp them to something and use them as a step or something to support my weight & if they failed, I'd fall and die, I wouldn't hesitate a second to use a pair of old made in the USA vice grips.
I doubt if you could pay me enough to risk the same with a pair of made in China ones.

Edit to add - - if you go to the Irwin site and read the reviews, there's a lot that mention how the older ones were a much better and stronger build.
I've found that to be 100% accurate.
The older - USA made ones, didn't have any slack or twist to them, no matter how hard you clamped them down.

[Frederick Skelly]

I don't see that sale on their site now. When will that start?

November 27 to December 24 Matt.

[Matt Day]

Wow, that's a long sale! Thanks

[Greg R Bradley]

Realistically, what are the differences between so-called "real deal" Vice Grips and the Irwin Vice Grips? Certainly it would be better if they were still made in the USA, but are people complaining because the design changed, or because they are no longer made in the USA? Is the actual use and function of them different? I have a Tool Shop brand pair of "Vise Grips" and I have no idea what a vintage USA made pair would do better. (No idea why I didn't buy the USA made ones at the time, but production may have already gone to China.)

I know there is a huge love for Vise Grips made in the USA a long time ago at a certain factory that is long gone. I'm not certain if they actually work any better, or if people just like them because the design is different than newer Vise Grips.
The new ones are terrible but might be fine for light use. We use lots of them in a tool manufacturer and they last weeks compared to the previous ones that lasted a year or two. One of my partners just spent some time chasing good ones and thinks he came up with an alternative to the originals but they are $35. I'll post the name and source after I talk with him.

Edited to add: Oops, looks like Rich already covered that.

[Dick Strauss]

Matt,
Just one point of correction...according to the WC ad I got in the mail recently, the Jet parallel clamps are only on sale from 11/27-11/30 and it does say "quantities are limited" (whatever that means).

[Larry Frank]

Vise Grips.. they were invented in Dewitt, Nebraska by a Danish blacksmith named Petersen in the 1920s. My dad was a steel salesman and called on him and his sons.