What sized shoulder plane for my first?

[Mike Dowell]

Hey everyone! I've got an opinion question to ask of you. I currently own (2) hand planes(4 if you count the two low quality ones that I never use). They are:

Stanley 4 1/2 and the Lee Valley Apron block plane. I'm about ready to pull the trigger on a Veritas shoulder plane from Lee Valley, but I Can't decide between the medium and large.

http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=68490&cat=1,41182

Any reason in particular I should be considering one over the other? Also, by all means, if there's a plane I've overlooked, please make that suggestion too.

Thanks!

[Robert Engel]

I ordered a LV large sent it back and got the medium and after 1 project regretted doing it.
I kept it and ended up getting a large from LN.

Diff is mostly the mass. The large is definitely a much heavier tool (which can be an advantage).

For me, it seems I reach for the large one 90% of the time unless its rabbet or stub tenons.

[Jim Koepke]

Just my
324970.

Looking at the two it seems the medium is designed to be useful cleaning the bottom of dados made for the common size of material available for shelving and such.

The large shoulder plane would be more useful at smoothing the cheeks of a tenon or tuning rebates.

As far as tuning a shoulder on a tenon, how wide will your tenon shoulders be?

jtk

[James Pallas]

I have an LN medium. It works fine on most shoulders except for small one under 1" . It is good for most rebates. I don't use it for tenon cheeks, on those I use my large router or if big one like you would use on a bench or something similar I use a 78.
Jim

[Chris Griggs]

If you want to use it on tenon cheeks you definitely want the large. That said I prefer my lv medium for just about everything else, so I'd get that size if you have other means/preferences for trimming tenon cheeks.

[paul cottingham]

I have a LV 1" shoulder i use for everything and i love. If i only had one shoulder plane it would be the 1". I do have the 3/4" whhich i use a great deal as well. But the one inch is my go to.

of course, this really is contingent on what kind of woodworking you do. I do a lot of traditional joinery, M+T, rabbets, the like.

[Tom M King]

Large......

[Shawn Pixley]

I'll be contrary. Medium. I don't us it for cheeks (router plane) and seldom cut greater than 3/4" shoulders.

[Pat Barry]

Hey everyone! I've got an opinion question to ask of you. I currently own (2) hand planes(4 if you count the two low quality ones that I never use). They are:

Stanley 4 1/2 and the Lee Valley Apron block plane. I'm about ready to pull the trigger on a Veritas shoulder plane from Lee Valley, but I Can't decide between the medium and large.

http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=68490&cat=1,41182

Any reason in particular I should be considering one over the other? Also, by all means, if there's a plane I've overlooked, please make that suggestion too.

Thanks!
What do you need one for? If you can answer that you should be able to decide easily. If you can't I bet you don't need one.

[Mike Henderson]

I like the LV medium.

Mike

[glenn bradley]

I probably use the LV medium more often and it is a joy to use. I have the large as well, and for . . . well, larger things like tenon cheeks, it is preferred. I find the medium handy for more things and if I could only have one, that would be it. I find the large superior for tenons.

[Tom M King]

Mine are Records that I bought new. I've never owned a medium one. I have a large and small. The small is great for when you need it, but the large has been used twenty times at least for every use of the small. It all depends on what you are doing.

[Larry Frank]

I have the LV medium one mainly for utility work cleaning dado grooves and such. I have arthritis in my hands and the peg thingy really makes a difference holding it. Love this plane.

[Mike Dowell]

Thank you all for the input. I don't really *need* one if I'm being honest. But, there have been many times when I've wanted to clean up a right angle inside corner. Of course, now I can't remember all the times I've said "man, I really need to get a shoulder plane for this", but I'm sure there have been many. I've got some Lee Valley gift cards so I was thinking of treating myself and a shoulder plane popped up as a good idea.

[Robert Engel]

Already posted but I'll post again something to think about.
The think is, shoulder planes are supposed to be for tweaking ..... tenon shoulders & rabbets, right?
Not really for tenon faces, but that's what a lot of us use them for. Thing is, the only advantage is getting in the corner.

I'm planning to add the rabbet block plane LN offers to my repertoire and looking back, I would get it before the lg. shoulder plane.

This is for the kind of work I'm doing. Your req's may be different.

I've found I rarely deal with tenon shoulders over 3/8" but I frequently deal with tenons over 2" long so I'm using the lg shoulder plane mostly for fitting tenons faces.

In summary, I think the best combo for tenon work is a medium shoulder plane and a block rabbet plane.

As far as other planes in your arsenal, in addition to the 4 1/2 (which I have the LN version of and absolutely love) I find a standard #4 to be useful also. Sometimes the 4 1/2 just gets a little heavy. I keep a back bevelled bladed on the #4 and I like it for adverse grain.

The other plane I use probably 75% of the time is a #6 Wood River, and I also love that especially for face planing boards under 18".

A bevel up jack plane I find very handy for endgrain work like paring dovetail ends in drawers, although a LA block is good, too.

In addition to a block plane (both regular and LA) a small block plane like a 102 is quite handy, also.

The only other plane would be a 7 or 8 jointer.

What I've done is purchased planes as I think I need them for a project, for example, spokeshaves or apron planes.

Hope this helps.

[Jim Koepke]

Thank you all for the input. I don't really *need* one if I'm being honest. But, there have been many times when I've wanted to clean up a right angle inside corner. Of course, now I can't remember all the times I've said "man, I really need to get a shoulder plane for this", but I'm sure there have been many. I've got some Lee Valley gift cards so I was thinking of treating myself and a shoulder plane popped up as a good idea.

Good thing we didn't start out with your fantastic financial fortune. It would have turned into a "How to spend Mike's money" thread.

I do not know about your work or planned projects. In my work, my most used speciality planes of which Lee Valley has an equivalent are as follows:

Rabbet plane Record #778.
Plow Plane Stanley #45 and #50
Both of those are often followed by my side rabbet planes Stanley #98 & #99. Carefully used they can clean up the side or base of a rabbet. They can be used to cut a rabbet. They can also be used to trim shoulders on a tenon.

If I was currently in the market, a skew rabbet or a skew plow would be on the list.

I do have and use a shoulder plane, a Stanley #93. It is possible to do all of its work by some other means if need be. It is often handy for what it was made to do, registering off of one surface to make another at a perfect 90º.

jtk

[Bill McDermott]

Mike,
Two bits to add to the mix.
I have and use a vintage #92 (3/4") shoulder plane. It's great. I often find myself using it with the nose removed, to get into inside corners when using a chisel feels uncontrolled. I have never felt like I needed a larger version... because:
I also have a LN Rabbet Block Plane. It was one of my first planes. Since your collection is small, you may find the same thing I did... a well made, sharp rabbet block plane is a versatile tool. The 1 3/4" blade get's right into corners and can trim very narrow shoulders, but also serves as another general purpose, low-angle block plane.

[Ryan Baker]

I have a LV medium, but I would recommend the large.

As for the Stanley 90 series planes, I really hate those things. Can't get them to work worth a darn. Uncomfortable to use. Not worth anything but melting down for scrap IMO.

[Mike Henderson]

As for the Stanley 90 series planes, I really hate those things. Can't get them to work worth a darn. Uncomfortable to use. Not worth anything but melting down for scrap IMO.

I definitely agree with that. My experience is exactly the same. Going to the LV shoulder plane was a revelation.

Mike

[And for use, the LV is a lot more comfortable to use than the Stanley, Record, or LN.]

[Prashun Patel]

+1 . I wish i had the bigger one too. Unless u do dados i think the bigger and massier the better.

[Nicholas Lawrence]

I use a router to clean out dados. I do not have a shoulder plane. I look at getting one every couple of years, and somehow something else always seems more useful/versatile for the money. A plow or beader is very handy (the Stanley 45 or Sargent 1080 will do both), as is a router.

[john zulu]

I have the LV medium shoulder plane. It is a good size for cabinet work. Great control for tenons.
I recently acquired a LN rabbet block plane. It is a good candidate to replace a shoulder plane when need. I do find it more versatile as it can handle a multitude of tenon and shoulder shavings.

[Kevin Perez]

I have the LV medium and use it for stub tenon cheeks on doors and for small tenons on small furniture aprons. Love it. Absolutely love it. I bought it also for dadoes, but haven't really used it for that.

[Tony Zaffuto]

I have an LN large, a LV medium and a Preston small (not the infill, but about7/16" width).

I use the large LN most of all, with the mass making it very adept in use. Next is the small Preston. However, I would not ever get rid of the LV, because there are times it is the only one that would work (such as cleaning the bottom of a 3/4" dado).

So, buy 'em all! Seriously, probably the LV first, as it will do everything the LN will do, but the LN will not do everything the LV will (because of the width). But the LN still remains the one I use most.

[Mike Holbrook]

I bought a medium quite a few years back but it has seen very little use. Some people use a shoulder plane a good deal some almost never use one. The point being it isn't as versatile a tool as several other "specialty" planes. I think you might use a LV or LN skew rabbit, skew block, plow plane, router plane more than a shoulder plane. The planes I mention can save you from needing a router and router table to do grooves, dadoes,.raised panels, tongue & grooves, laps...You can do most of what you might use the shoulder plane for with chisels and one of the planes i mentioned. Think about what you actually plan to use the tool for. I just bought a LV skew rabbit because I want to make raised panels, larger dadoes without a router or router table. It is nice to have the ability to set depth of cut and a nicker to score the edge, neither of which the shoulder plane has. My buddy lost part of a finger on his router table and they are extremely bad about making dust that covers everything in the shop and does not do ones lungs much good either.

Plus you don't have a jack or jointer plane yet if I understand correctly. I bought a shoulder plane early on too, but I don't often take the time to get it out when I have block, rabbit, plow, router planes and chisels out to do the majority of the work. You could buy a used Stanley and see if you use/like it.

[paul cottingham]

Mike is on to something here. I love and use my shoulder planes. But....i could see most Neanders using their rabbet planes much more, and they have more overall utility. Same with a plow.

[Derek Cohen]

Hey everyone! I've got an opinion question to ask of you. I currently own (2) hand planes(4 if you count the two low quality ones that I never use). They are:

Stanley 4 1/2 and the Lee Valley Apron block plane. I'm about ready to pull the trigger on a Veritas shoulder plane from Lee Valley, but I Can't decide between the medium and large.

http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=68490&cat=1,41182

Any reason in particular I should be considering one over the other? Also, by all means, if there's a plane I've overlooked, please make that suggestion too.

Thanks!

Hi Mike

I own and use all the LV shoulder planes. The one that gets least use is the Large (1 1/4" wide), which I purchased about 2 1/2 years ago, thinking that it might make a good all rounder. In fact, I find it larger than I need. Perhaps I will grow into it.

The two I use frequently are the Small (1/2") and the Medium (3/4").

In the main, I use a chisel to tune tenon shoulders. However this is less easy when there is such a small amount to pare away that a chisel has difficulty registering in the line. Sometimes I can use a square and a knife to slice the waste away. If not, I use the 1/2" Small shoulder plane. This size gives the most control on a shoulder. Rarely are shoulders wider than 1/2".

If I were to recommend one shoulder plane - and I guess I am - it would be the 3/4" Medium. I find this plane invaluable for fine tuning rebates (and of course it does shoulders as well).

The LN rabbet block plane was mentioned. This is a good plane for breadboard ends, may be used on tenon cheeks, but is too wide for shoulders or rebates. An alternative for breadboard ends is the LV Jack Rabbet Plane, which is also preferred for raising panels. It is also too wide to comfortable use it on rebates.

Tenon cheeks? If there is just a smidgeon to remove, then a rasp or the LN Joinery Float is used. I would only use a plane if there is a significant amount to remove (Large LV shoulder - in a pinch but not well balanced on cheeks; LN rabbet block - better balance; LV Skew Block planes - cut more cleanly; LV Large router plane - if the cheek is out-of-parallel).

Regards from Perth

Derek