General purpose plane recommendations

[Kent Adams]

Lie-Nielson is having a hand tool show next weekend near me in Durham, NC. Being new to hand tools, I'd like to buy a plane while I'm there. Currently, I don't have any planes and I only want to buy one while I'm there. My only exposure to hand planes have been Youtube videos where I've watched a lot of Paul Sellers and Tom Fridgen. These craftsman make it all look easy and I know its not. Paul Sellers said during his bench build, that he can do all he needs to do to build it with a No. 4 block plane. I've seen other videos of people using a no. 7 jointer plane.

What I'd like to do is buy one plane that is general purpose, something I could joint or plane with. I can see the advantage of both a no. 4 and no. 7. I would think a no. 7 would be more forgiving of my lack of muscle memory to use planes and my lack of knowledge. However, a smaller plane like a no. 4 would be easier to make chamfers, with with smaller stock and such. However, I could see myself making a lot of mistakes with a no. 4 because of its smaller size, either using to little force or too much.

I would be working primarily with hardwood like cherry, maple and walnut. I would appreciate all opinions. I'm not looking for advice on buying other planes because of price. I don't have the opportunity too often to try out planes, so I'd like to purchase one of the Lie-Nielson's because I will have the opportunity to at least place my hands on one of those next weekend to get a feel for it.

I know absolutely nothing about hand planes, so if a No. 3 or different one you feel would be good for a beginner want to do some of what I wrote earlier is a better choice, please feel free to give me your opinion. Which plane would you like to have been your first to get a general understanding of all the different things planes can do?

[Allan Speers]

Kent,

First congrats on seeing the light! Working with hand tools is very enjoyable (except for that sharpening business) plus there's no noise, no dust. It's often even a faster process than setting up a powered rig.

However, there is no answer to your question. There's simply no one plane that can do it all, not even in a pinch. You first have to decide which tasks will be most critical to you, and that might mean looking at your current shop and seeing which tasks are not covered well by you powered tools. I HIGHLY recommend that you adjust your expectations here, and consider going home with at least 2 or 3 items. (plus some kind of sharpening rig. At an absolute minimum, you'll need an 8K stone.)

Short of knowing this, some of the most essential tools:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1: A smoother, meaning something in the 8" - 12" range, with a lightly-cambered blade set for a light cut. Your sandpaper will now last a lot longer. :)

Then, in no particular order:

A low angle block plane, used primarily for trimming end grain, but also useful for small touch ups here & there.

(And already, neither of these can really do the job of the other one.)


A jack or try plane, for removing more stock quickly. - You could theoretically not have one, at least in the beginning, but doing this job with a smoother will get old really fast. Plus, you'll end up spending too much time re-honing the blade. Plus, the jack plane's blade should have a medium camber, which the smoother does not. (You see? what you CAN use and what will give you proper service are two different things.)


A Jointer, but only if you intend to flatten the edges of long boards by hand. Jointers can be helpful also with flattening table tops etc but they are far from essential.


A pair of winding sticks. (You can also just make your own.) - Essential for face-planing larger stock.

A couple of very good hand saws. - I personally prefer Japanese style, but LN sells some lovely western saws that will serve you very well.

Last on my personal list of "absolutely essential" items is a shooting board, so you can cut oversized, then sneak-up on the final dimensions. (especially with miters.) A shooting PLANE is great to have also, but NOT essential.

[Kent Adams]

Thanks Allan for all of the recommendations. Perhaps it would be helpful to say I don't have a planer or jointer in my shop. So flattening and jointing would be big uses. How about to start with a skew low angle block plane? That seems to have multiple uses, but perhaps not the best for jointing long boards or flattening, so maybe a smoothing plane? I can set up my router table to joint ends, but there will probably be times when a hand plane would be a better tool. I have no way of flattening a board, but that seems to be a more advanced skill? So I guess, my most important need right now, if I had to choose one, would be to flatten. So maybe a no. 5 jack plane until I learn enough to buy a smoother. Between plane purchases, I could sand it smooth. Flattening just looks very intimidating to me from a skill curve.

[Robert Engel]

Kent, a block plane is definitely one of the first you want to get, but it will be useless in stock prep.

If I was going to buy 1 plane to start it would have to be a smoother, either a 4 or 4 1/2.
With a cambered blade it can function as a scrub plane or a jack plane for stock prep.
However, due to its length, no jointer function.

Personally, I have a LN 4 1/2. I like the width and extra weight in my hands I get better results than a #4. But I would never use that plane for stock prep.

I also have their LA jack and it is a very good tool. But again, I don't think it is going to be a good choice for stock prep.

For that, I would lean toward a #6. I use it all the time in stock prep. You will also get some degree of jointing ability, at least on short boards.

So I think a scrub (you can make any cheap plane into a scrubber) and a #6 (with an extra heavily cambered blade) would get you started for stock prep.

You might consider WoodRiver's #6 to save some $$ and invest in a smoother at the LN sale.

Hope I haven't muddied the waters further.....

[Brian Holcombe]

Buy a smoother, learn how to use it and learn how to sharpen the blade. My suggestion is a #4 bevel down. Don't plan on dimensioning lumber with it.

If you are set to dimension your own lumber than you will need a jack, jointer and a smoother. You will also need a marking gauge, winding sticks and a straight edge.

You have high aspirations, which is good, I dimension my lumber by hand and use the jack, try plane and a smoother.

Sellers may use one size of plane, but IIRC he does use more than one plane.

[Kent Adams]

Thanks Robert for the recommendations. Would I have to create the camber myself? I'm quickly seeing the need for the approach both you and Allan are advocating.

60/1/2:
https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/adjustable-mouth-block-planes-

No. 6 (cambered blade?)
https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/bench-planes/standard-bench-planes-no.-6-fore-plane-?node=4065

No. 41/2
https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/bench-planes/no.-4-1-2-smooth-plane?node=4065

Here's one I found interesting for resizing tenons I might cut on the table saw as a begging and then refining with the plane. It might also work well with refining rabbets :
https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/block-planes/rabbet-block-plane-w-nicker?node=4072

I'm starting to rethink what I might want to do to start. Perhaps I should start with your suggestions to get a handle on how to use planes in general. No. 601/2, the rabbet block, Woodriver #6 and the 4 1/2. I'm thinking I can use these to make a bench which should give me a good workout and experience. If I have to make the cambered blades, that would be a non starter because I don't even know how to sharpen a blade.

Are blades included with the planes?

We're already at $1100 before the sharpening stones and bench!

[Frederick Skelly]

Edit: Brian has the right of it.

But you're going to the show and can try a #4, a #5 and a #7 for yourself. And there's just no substitute for "hands on" with hand tools.
Fred

[Kent Adams]

Fred, that's my thought too. Am I wrong in thinking that flattening is a higher order skill?

[Kent Adams]

Thanks Brian. What is a bevel down? Is that a low angle blade and is the difference between a 4, 4/12 and 5 just a matter of preference?

[Frederick Skelly]

Fred, that's my thought too. Am I wrong in thinking that flattening is a higher order skill?

I think I'd say yes, because you need to use 3 different planes to accomplish the objective. But one could argue that that smoothing is the higher skill because you are making finishing cuts.

I started out with a #4 and learned to do a lot of basic tasks with it - squaring smaller parts, smoothing, etc. I think learning to sharpen it well was a huge benefit for me - your smoother should take very fine shavings (0.004") and it has to be very sharp to do so.

Edit: You do not have to spend $1000 on stones to get that sharp. Search sharpening threads here and you'll get a ton of good perspectives and approaches.

[Brian Holcombe]

Kent,

A bevel down plane typically implies that it's a plane with a chip breaker. The low angle planes are usually bevel up planes.

To answer your second question, yes and no. Yes you can use either of them for the task at hand, but the setup for a roughing plane, a truing plane and a smoother plane are all very different.

Your goal is to flatten a panel. The steps involved are;

- Remove twist, which is primarily done with a heavily cambered roughing plane. This can be a number 5 (jack) and typically it is.

- Twist is removed cross grain, so you will have grooves across the board. At this point you will want to remove these tracks by taking long passes with the grain, this is a good job for a try plane or jointer. So in your case a #7, I say your case because my preference is for wooden bodied planes.

- Finally you will smooth the board with a plane set very fine for putting a finish on the board. Often times this will be a #4 plane.

This is a very lofty goal at your current point, but it's a good goal to have as getting there will have you running through all of the most important steps for beginning to use planes.

You will question your sanity the first time you do this then realize how long it took, but rest assured it can be made a very quick process with a bit of experience.

I stopped counting how much I've spent on handtools, but the primary planes I use and the tools needed to get them sharp can be had for a reasonable amount of money.

[Allan Speers]

Thanks Robert for the recommendations. Would I have to create the camber myself? I'm quickly seeing the need for the approach both you and Allan are advocating.

60/1/2:
https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/adjustable-mouth-block-planes-

No. 6 (cambered blade?)
https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/bench-planes/standard-bench-planes-no.-6-fore-plane-?node=4065

No. 41/2
https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/bench-planes/no.-4-1-2-smooth-plane?node=4065

Here's one I found interesting for resizing tenons I might cut on the table saw as a begging and then refining with the plane. It might also work well with refining rabbets :
https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/block-planes/rabbet-block-plane-w-nicker?node=4072

I'm starting to rethink what I might want to do to start. Perhaps I should start with your suggestions to get a handle on how to use planes in general. No. 601/2, the rabbet block, Woodriver #6 and the 4 1/2. I'm thinking I can use these to make a bench which should give me a good workout and experience. If I have to make the cambered blades, that would be a non starter because I don't even know how to sharpen a blade.

Are blades included with the planes?

We're already at $1100 before the sharpening stones and bench!


I like your new idea, of getting the planes specifically needed to build your bench. Work-oriented purchases make the most sense, and you certainly will need a good bench. Large & heavy is the way to go. Since you intend to do a lot of hand-jointing, consider building a bench with a "sliding deadman." (Google it.) I don't have one yet, but it's high on my to-do list.

If you don't have good chisels, that's another consideration, as you'll most likely want to build the bench with a mortice & tenon design. One good "pig sticker" should be included. (Oval bolster chisel) - though good vintage ones are plentiful & cheap on Ebay.


"We're already at $1100 before the sharpening stones and bench!"

But you are replacing maybe $3,000 worth of noisy power tools!

- And that's a VERY nice starting collection. I think though that I'd get the LN rabbet block instead of the lovely 60 1/2. It's nice to have both, but you have to rabbet or shoulder plane, & you will want something to trim tenons with. Plus, that's a very handy little plane in general. I'd love to have one. (I have the 60 1/2 & will be buried with it. That and my Trussart steel Telecaster. :) )

[Michael Fross]

All great advice. I'll add a general thought. If I only had one bench plane to own it would be a #5 jack plane. A touch long to smooth, way to short to joint longer boards (like a bench), but it can do most thing pretty well. It's the plane that is always on my bench.... well, that and a small block plane. An extra blade would be very useful to grind into a camber or different angle, but that would be my pick.

Secondly, outside of joinery planes or block planes, I prefer bevel down planes. These are the more traditional style and one I prefer. There is nothing wrong with Bevel Up planes, it's just a preference and both have pros and cons (although I feel their differences are minor and it's more about preference.) That's why it's important to be able to try the planes. I suggest talking to the LN guys and get their opinions while you try out all the fantastic tools. But remember their goal is to sell tools :).

You can certainly find vintage planes for little money and with a little elbow grease they can work as good as new. Especially if you change out the blade. There is a lot of great advice here and on the web (and in books) on how to do that. I find great enjoyment in reviving an old tool and allowing it to perform well as it was born to do. My favorite plane is an old doorstop someone gave my brother when he heard I like "old crap like that." After fixing it up, it's fantastic and works as well as any of my LN planes.

I've been woodworking for quite some time and I always enjoyed it. However, until I started doing handtool work, I never loved it. I use both now and it's the best of both worlds, but nothing (to me) is as enjoyable as sitting at the bench doing detailed hand tool joinery. Radio is on, no hearing protection. No dust protection. Just you, a simple chisel or plane, and the wood. Perfection.

Michael

[Kent Adams]

but nothing (to me) is as enjoyable as sitting at the bench doing detailed hand tool joinery. Radio is on, no hearing protection. No dust protection. Just you, a simple chisel or plane, and the wood. Perfection.

For me, I'd add a beer in that scenario, otherwise YES! :D

Thanks for your recommendation.

[Robert Engel]

Kent -

That's a very nice selection of premium planes.
I don't have the rabbet block but its definitely on my list for tuning large tenons (like in a workbench).
On smaller tenons I think a shoulder plane is the tool of choice.

Yes blades are included with the planes.
With LN you will have zero lapping to do on the back I just usually put a little polish on them.
You will, however, need to ease the corners to avoid blade tracks.
I would recommend getting a spare blade for your cambered blade.
Either LN or LeeValley have good blades. (Surprisingly, the stock blade on the WR's are thicker than LV but not nearly as flat).
LN has some very good sharpening videos.

As far as the $1100 -- you're just getting started ;).

The workbench build will be a great experience and give you alot of practice. Great way to start its not fine furniture.....

Ah yes, the sound and smell of shavings, being connected to the wood, some 70's rock on the radio and a cold Heinicken -- thats what I call therapeutic ww'ing. Doesn't get better than that!!

[Kent Adams]

Thanks Brian for the advice. I called LN and they also affirmed your advice on the #4. I think I'm going to add the block rabbet plane as well after I get the feel of both at the show and then just learn slowly how to use the planes and sharpening, which I imagine will be a big part of the learning process. Once I get the feel of these planes, then I'll expand to others in order to build a bench.

I must say, the hand tool folks seem much more passionate about what they do from what I can tell and very willing to share and help newcomers. I do like the idea of being able to get physical with the wood, without the loud noises of my machines as well as the dust issues with power tools. I'm wondering if working with hand tools is similar in satisfaction as long distance running? I know this may seem like a strange analogy, but there is a very real difference between the personalities of sprinters and distance runners. Distance runners often enjoy the process of improvement in times (it takes a longer amount of time and work to improve your times in distance running) more than the sprinters. I was at one time a competitive marathoner and the amount of training for a marathon is much different than it is for short track runners.

[Roy Lindberry]

Lie-Nielson is having a hand tool show next weekend near me in Durham, NC. Being new to hand tools, I'd like to buy a plane while I'm there. Currently, I don't have any planes and I only want to buy one while I'm there. My only exposure to hand planes have been Youtube videos where I've watched a lot of Paul Sellers and Tom Fridgen. These craftsman make it all look easy and I know its not. Paul Sellers said during his bench build, that he can do all he needs to do to build it with a No. 4 block plane. I've seen other videos of people using a no. 7 jointer plane.

What I'd like to do is buy one plane that is general purpose, something I could joint or plane with. I can see the advantage of both a no. 4 and no. 7. I would think a no. 7 would be more forgiving of my lack of muscle memory to use planes and my lack of knowledge. However, a smaller plane like a no. 4 would be easier to make chamfers, with with smaller stock and such. However, I could see myself making a lot of mistakes with a no. 4 because of its smaller size, either using to little force or too much.

I would be working primarily with hardwood like cherry, maple and walnut. I would appreciate all opinions. I'm not looking for advice on buying other planes because of price. I don't have the opportunity too often to try out planes, so I'd like to purchase one of the Lie-Nielson's because I will have the opportunity to at least place my hands on one of those next weekend to get a feel for it.

I know absolutely nothing about hand planes, so if a No. 3 or different one you feel would be good for a beginner want to do some of what I wrote earlier is a better choice, please feel free to give me your opinion. Which plane would you like to have been your first to get a general understanding of all the different things planes can do?

Kent,

I am a big fan of Sellers and have learned a lot from him. The only reason that he can get away with just a #4, however, is that he buys pre-dimensioned lumber. This means he is just dressing the surfaces, not dimensioning rough lumber. With that said, your question can only really be answered by knowing what kind of work you do. I do mostly small cabinet work, and I find that a jack/scrub, a jointer and a smoother are my most used planes. For me, that means a #5 with a pronounced camber, a #8 with almost no camber, and a #4 1/2 with a slight camber. Others would prefer similar sizes, but set up for the same functions, based on the type of work they do, and their own physical size.

Since you are only looking to buy one plane, here are my recommendations. If you want to work like Paul Sellers and buy basically pre-dimensioned wood, then just get a smoother and be done with it. Most people like a #4, but I prefer a #4 1/2 for most smoothing tasks.

If you want a larger range of work options, buy a jack plane. You can go either bevel up (#62) or bevel down (#5) on this, but buy two blades. Camber one for rough work, leave one very straight (maybe dub the corners) for jointing/flattening/smoothing. Of these two planes, I would recommend the #62 because of its ease of changing mouth opening, ease of changing blade, and ease of changing the cutting angle by simply honing a microbevel on the iron. Lateral adjustment is a bit harder on this one for the beginner.

Remember that planes will do nothing but frustrate you without a workable sharpening setup. I use Sellers' method of diamond stones and a strop, and it works very well for me. Others prefer oilstones, ceramics, or other water stones. If you are buying L-N, you will probably get irons of A2 steel, so I'd stay away from oilstones.

Good luck with your search, and I hope whatever you get will make your woodworking more enjoyable.

[john zulu]

If you are going for LN and this is your first plane. Buy the #5 plane or the low angle jack plane. #5 is good for stock preparation and can be used for smoothing at the end. There is a lot of planes to get but these 2 should be good enough to start your journey.

For pre-war Stanley it is very acceptable. Just need some repair or touch up before using them.

[Kent Adams]

however, is that he buys pre-dimensioned lumber.

I thought so! His bench build looked like pre-dimensioned lumber and everyone on that video was asking him if it were and he didn't answer. However, he gets a lot of questions so I chalk it up to overload.

I'm going to give a look at the 4, 4 1/2 and 5. I'm definitely going to buy a 4, but may buy one of the other two as well. The consensus seems to buy a couple of blades and camber one. I have no experience honing a blade, let alone cambering a blade. Is cambering something I could learn from a video? I have no access to hand tool WW'ers.

[Phil Mueller]

Kent, I recently went down this path. I started, as many suggest, with a LN #4. My main goal was to flatten stock. In skilled hands, I'm sure the #4 could work...but was difficult for me. I sold the #4 and purchased a #62. Still climbing up the learning curve, but it is a pleasure to use.

Once comfortable with sharpening ( a lot of practice on garage sale chisels), I purchased a yard sale Stanley #4 and refurbished it to work well. I use it primarily to clean up glue joints before the LN.
Since then, I purchased a LN block plane, Veritas shoulder plane, Veritas jointer plane, and Veritas router plane. All as I needed them for one project or another.

I'm in the midst of building a workbench and have put all to good use.
As already mentioned above, sharpening is key, as well as a number of other tools; chisels, mallet, shooting board, brace/bits, hand saws, etc.
I've really enjoyed the neander way. Next up is learning to sharpen a saw...once the bench is finished.

Good luck and enjoy the show.

[Frederick Skelly]

Hey Kent?
If you are a reader, here are 3 good books that will answer many of your questions, in what I'll say are my personal order of reading them:

1) The Handplane Book, by Garrett Hack. This is an overview of planes and how to use them.
2) The Perfect Edge, by Ron Hock. This is an excellent intro to sharpening, by a man who makes highly-respected plane irons for a living.
3) Handplane Essentials, by Chris Schwartz. This is a collection of articles and blogs he wrote over the yesrs. I got value from it after reading the previous two. One could argue you should read this first, because Schwartz is a very easy-to-read guy and these are sort of vinettes on different topics, rather than the more lengthy, methodical approach used by Mr. Hack. Your call.

Hope it helps you get some of your questions answered.
Fred

[Jim Koepke]

I'm going to give a look at the 4, 4 1/2 and 5. I'm definitely going to buy a 4, but may buy one of the other two as well.

It is a good idea to handle all of the planes you can. You will likely see the #4 and the #4-1/2 are close to being the same plane. I would not suggest buying both of them for starting out in hand planes.

You mentioned a table saw. If you use it to rip long boards, a #5 might be a good start to remove the saw marks. The #5, often called a Jack plane, is a bit long to be the perfect smoother and a little short to be the perfect jointer. It is so common in the world of used tools because craftsman who only wanted to carry one bench plane in their tool kit were able to use it as either a smoother or a jointer along with a few other needs. It is possibly the most versatile size plane. It is able to make a perfectly smooth surface or to perfectly join an edge.

At all the LN events I have attended people were allowed to handle and actually use the planes. It would surprise me if you can't feel the "right one" in your hands during a test drive.


I think learning to sharpen it well was a huge benefit for me - your smoother should take very fine shavings (0.004") and it has to be very sharp to do so.

Sharpening is the heart of hand tool wood working. It is also a target that moves as one learns more about sharpening. There are more theories and ideas in the world of sharpening than there are grains of sand on all the beaches. At least it seems that way. Somehow most of the produce great results.

My suggestion is to work toward getting a repeatable edge on a blade before venturing off into all the sharpening tricks.

You may find it best to purchase a honing guide at the tool event along with a set of stones.

What Fred calls a fine shaving is a bit thick for my smoothing cuts. (Maybe it is a typo.) With a freshly sharpened blade I have been able to get shavings in the 0.0005" range. That is half of a thousandth of an inch. This has been done with some of my old Stanley/Bailey planes and my LN planes.

It isn't often that such a thin shaving is required, but it sometimes helps.

My age may also have something to do with shaving thickness. Some folks here have mentioned taking some rather thick shavings. My strength gives out on shavings much thicker than about 0.016". And my work is mostly in soft woods such as fir and alder. (alder is classified as a hard wood, some of it is fairly soft.)

Good luck and let us know what you bring home.

jtk

[Frederick Skelly]

No Jim, I'm sorry to say it wasn't a typo - 0.003 is the best I've been able to get, so far. But, like you said, it's definitely a moving target. But my work has definitely gotten better because of learning to sharpen even this well. With help from you and others, I'll get better still!
Fred

[Nicholas Lawrence]

We're already at $1100 before the sharpening stones and bench!

You don't have to buy everything from Lie Nielsen or Lee Valley. A rehabbed Stanley will run you maybe a quarter of the equivalent premium tool.

[David Bassett]

Lots of great advice, from folks with more experience than I, above. I'm exploring the same path you are and have a couple thoughts and data points that I think may help you fill in the picture.

First, I got to the local L-N event and they were incredible. I suggest explaining your situation to them and asking them which plane to start with. Ask them to show you! If the shows are similar they will break out, and adjust, planes letting you feel the trade offs. (E.g. this is a roughing plane, this is a #4 set up to rough and it'll work but not as well. This is a #5 set up to smooth.... Etc.) Also ask about sharpening. At the event I was at they had a dedicated sharpening bench. They were running demos, between making sure the demo tools were in top shape, the whole time I was there.

As described above which planes you want / need depend on what your doing. The low-angle block plane seems most recommended and is my go to for touch ups, small jobs, etc. It is small and general purpose, so not ideal for the major stock prep jobs. I notice the L-N Block Rabbet Plane mentioned. I'd read about it and was anxious to see it. I think it is now off my list. The demonstrator said it is their most versatile plane, since it is able to serve as a block plane and as a shoulder plane, but it is also his most hated. The extra blade width, which allows you to plane shoulders, exposes the blade and means you need to be careful to not cut yourself when holding it. I guess jack-of-all-trades master-of-none applies. He, (personally, not L-N overall,) recommend it only if it will truly be your only plane. With more than one he thought a block plane and a shoulder plane were much more useful. Something to checkout when you're there.

There are a couple other points I read that may also help. First Chris Schwarz wrote a column about using one plane with multiple blades. He suggested a #5 "Jack"(-of-all-trades) plane tuned up. To use it for roughing, open the mouth and use a heavily cambered blade. To smooth, use a slightly cambered blade with a close set chip-breaker and a closed mouth. For flattening, use the slightly cambered blade, but with a medium depth cut and medium mouth setting. basically the same advice as above, given for a #4, but with a longer base line. (Sounds like an adjustment hassle. :-) ) The other point that stuck in my mind, (maybe Schwarz again?), was that coarser planing can be more easily done with sloppier less premium planes, so refurb'ing a used #5 for your coarse plane and using the savings to get a more refined #3 or #4 for your fine smoother made good budget sense.

Good luck and have fun at the event.

[lowell holmes]

I started with a #4, #5, and a #7. They pretty much did any and every thing I needed. I added a #3, #5 1/2, and #6. I find use for the #3 all the time. It pretty much has replaced the #4.
The #6 never gets used.

[David Eisenhauer]

Lots and lots of very good advice above. Two things I will repeat - 1) When you go to the LN show, try out a LN-guy-setup/prepped plane in the #4, #4-1/2, #5 (may as well try the #6 and #7 if possible) sizes and see which one (if any) "feels" right or best in your hands. The one that "feels" right to you is the one to get. 2) Start researching on sharpening and get serious about that fairly soon as sharp tools are a must for hand tool working (more so by far than for power tools) and more folks are probably turned off by trying to make a dull hand tool work than by poor technique. In my shop, a Stanley #5 is my favorite, but the others are used for what they do as well and I use a combination of diamond and water stones for sharpening. The sharpening system you choose will work for chisels as well as plane irons. Don't worry too much about this "cambering" being discussed as it can be done to various degrees and is something that you will develop the knowledge of soon. I feel that if you start with a well made and setup plane, like a LN/Veritas/etc, then it becomes easier to buy older used planes that will require some fettling due to the knowledge gained by using something that works correctly immediately. Have fun.

[Scott DelPorte]

My most used plane is a LN 4 1/2. It has their high angle frog (cant remember what the angle is) to give it a little better performance on figured wood. It is a fine plane and I use it for smoothing and jointing. If I had to live with one plane, I would probably be with the group that advocates for either the #4 1/2 or #4 in a "standard" bevel down configuration. I would also say that blade sharpness is really the ticket to good work with a handplane. I think I could probably joint better with a really sharp block plane than a dull jointer. Be patient with yourself and learn how to sharpen well.

[Allan Speers]

My most used plane is a LN 4 1/2. It has their high angle frog (cant remember what the angle is) to give it a little better performance on figured wood. It is a fine plane and I use it for smoothing and jointing. If I had to live with one plane, I would probably be with the group that advocates for either the #4 1/2 or #4 in a "standard" bevel down configuration. I would also say that blade sharpness is really the ticket to good work with a handplane. I think I could probably joint better with a really sharp block plane than a dull jointer. Be patient with yourself and learn how to sharpen well.

Good thoughts.

- but just so the OP understands: A higher bevel angle, while good for difficult woods like figured Maple, burls, and that horrid stuff they grow in Australia (:rolleyes:) is not the best choice for more "polite" species, such as the OP specifically mentioned. Best to start with the standard 45º planes, plus one low angle block, then try other angles as / if needed.

The LN 4 1/2 might be my choice in a metal smoother, if I could afford one, but with the standard 45º frog.

One could of course buy both frogs, but I detest have to chance ANYTHING, even different blades. I'd much rather spend the money once for a duplicate plane and leave it set up.

Or maybe another way to look at it is, the 4 1/2 being wider, heavier, and with a thicker blade, is sort of tailor-made for difficult wood, so it might make sense to get it with the 50º frog, and then have a #4 for general smoothing. (Or even a #3, if I were doing a LOT of work every day.) I dunno, can't say, as I overall prefer wooden planes, especially the "Nordic" types with the horn-like from handle.

[Joe A Faulkner]

This thread reminded me another thread that started about 9 months back - Jerry wanted to get into hand planes.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?225966-Slippery-slope-bought-planes-bad-decision

Nine months later he had acquired and rehabbed so many old Stanley planes that he offered several for sale.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?234373-STANLEY-bench-and-block-planes-FS-Too-many

From his post, you can see that for less than $300 you can probably get set up with a decent #7 or #8 jointer, #5 jack and a #4 smoother. All of which would be most useful if you are going to do a bench build. Whether you go the second hand route or the brand new route, you absolutely must have some type of sharpening system or friends with sharpening systems, because even a brand new LN is not ready to use out of the box - at a minimum you will need to flatten, sharpen and hone the iron. Maybe if you buy one at a woodworking show, you can get the rep to do this for you, but eventually the iron will need to be touched up.

+1 on reading Garret Hack's The Handplane book and also on checking out some sharpening resources as well. In the context of fine woodworking, there's not much point in purchasing sharpening equipment unless you have an edge tool and there isn't much point in purchasing edge tools unless you have a sharpening system. So to get started with handplanes or chisels, a sharpening system is either a pre or co-requisite. Once you start taking shavings with a your first plane, like 98-99% of us who have gone before you, you likely will add to your kit a number of others.

[Jim Koepke]

Once you start taking shavings with a your first plane, like 98-99% of us who have gone before you, you likely will add to your kit a number of others.

Them plane shavings can be mesmerizing.

jtk

[Graham Haydon]

Hi Kent,

My advise to someone new with low experience with hand planes would be a brand new #4 from a source like LN, LV or WoodRiver. Buy a second hand #5 by a maker like Stanley, Millers Falls or Record.

The new smoother will be ready to go and provide a benchmark. The #5 might be ready to go too but easier to diagnose issues if you have one that works. After using them for a while you'll get to know what fits you best. Resist the temptation to splurge if you're looking to discover what works best for you but on the other hand they are attractive objects so splurge if you must.

[Steve Meliza]

Buying a LN plane is certainly not a bad idea if you're flush with cash, but I can't help but think that you could just as easily pop into Ed Lebetkin (edlebetkin@gmail.com)'s tool store (http://www.woodwrightschool.com/the-tool-store/) above the Woodwright's School (http://www.woodwrightschool.com/) in Pittsboro and get three or four excellent planes for the price of a single LN. I'm sure Ed would be happy to listen to your needs and then show you some quality ready-to-use planes. I purchased a Stanley #4 from him for $75 that needed a little touch up to the blade then was ready to use. I forget the exact type, but it is pushing 100 years old and has beautiful rosewood handles.

Think about it, for $155 you can take the Nov 15th class on hand planes (http://www.woodwrightschool.com/bench-plane-skills-w-bill/) which Roy Underhill will be teaching (Bill is out with health issues), then at the end of the day have enough cash left over to pop upstairs and buy two or three planes with the knowledge and experience to know which ones you want to start with. The more I think about it the more envious of you I am.

I have become an avid follower of Paul Sellers and a big believer in his methods as they work and are based on a lifetime career and a traditional apprenticeship. One thing to keep in mind about his tool suggestions is that he is trying to make woodworking approachable to everyone by using as few tools as possible and as inexpensive tools as possible. Sometimes he shows three ways to accomplish a certain task so that if you can figure out how to use the tools you do have rather than rushing out to buy whatever tool you saw him using. So while you do see him using a #4 for almost everything if you watch long enough you'll see he uses two #4 planes (one is setup as a scrub plane) and he will use a #5 for edge jointing. If you sign up for a free account you'll be able to view many of his free videos including the one on edge jointing (https://woodworkingmasterclasses.com/2014/05/edge-jointing/). He also has a video on thicknessing rough stock which where the #4 set up as a scrub comes in. However, as others have pointed out he does the "donkey work" with machines so when he starts a project his material mostly needs machine marks removed and cut to final length.

You mentioned the Paul Sellers workbench which I am in the middle of building and will have finished soon. He purposely chooses 2x construction lumber for the low cost and minimal dimensioning required. It is a skill building project because you can focus on using just the #4 to create clean, tight joints and if you fail to get a seamless glue joint it isn't a big deal. In one of the workbench videos you can see that the leg was cut to length with a chop saw. Someone asked about it and he acknowledged the use of the chop saw and that they had intended to now show that bit, probably so that viewers wouldn't think they needed to rush out and buy a chop saw. I assure you that using his techniques shown in the video you can make those leg cuts by hand and with an excellent result. Oh, and trimming the end of the leg after sawing is done with a wickedly sharp #4 Stanley.

While I'm typing up this novel let me add that I've used several sharpening methods and jigs and was never happy till I tried the Paul Sellers method. I already had oil stones and a leather strop else I would try the diamond plates he uses. But none the less, on my oil stones I can quickly put on an edge freehand in a few moments that will cut end grain shavings of doug fir. And it wasn't like it look a long time to get to that skill level. I encourage you to keep watching his videos and give his methods and tool suggestions a try, they've never disappointed me.

[Kent Adams]

Thanks Steve, I had completely forgot Roy Underhill's school is practically just "down the street". I think I'll sign up for that class and take the new plane with me. Also, while there, go upstairs and check out the used ones. Someone mentioned it would be good to have a reference plane to start out with to see how one should perform if you're going to buy used and have no experience like me.

Edit: Class is full :mad:

[Allan Speers]

Kent,

I was gonna' mention getting a few used ones, but didn't want to dissuade you from your LN shopping spree. Plus, if you can afford LN (or LV) it's really a good investment. What you should understand about vintage planes:

Properly refurbed and set up, they are fine tools. The big differences with LV / LN are the thickness & composition of the blades, and the ease of adjustment. Also, with some (especially LV) there are subtle ergonomic improvements, but this is only a major factor with a very few models. Them old Stanleys made a heckuvalotta' furniture.

As and even PM-V11 blades can be retrofitted into most vintage Stanleys, and you are still WAY under the cost of a new plane.
As for ease of adjustment, that can't be modified. However, you can buy 2 good vintage Stanleys, with modern retrofitted blades, for the cost of one LN, and have them set up 2 different ways.

The downside is that it can sometimes take a LOT of time to properly tweak an old plane, and you do sorta' have to know what you're doing. Plus, if you put an A2 / PM-V11 blade into a Stanley #5, you won't get that back if/when you sell it.

If I had the money (I do not) I'd use only modern planes, with the exception of a couple of vintage woodies that I just love.