Need Help Choosing a Finish For My Hickory Kitchen Table top

[Anthony Brown]

I have a Hickory kitchen table that I am building and I need help choosing a finish for the table top. I have 3 kids, but the youngest is 7, so the table will take some abuse, but not a ton. The kids have dedicated desks for doing homework, so that shouldn't be a huge issue either. With all of that being said, I still want to put a durable satin (preferably water-resistant) finish on the table top that is relatively easy to apply. At first I was thinking polyurethane, but after doing a bit more research, it seems people feel that's only good for floors and not table tops. I was also looking at Marine spar varnish, but I have seen that discouraged as well.

Could anyone point me in the right direction for what I am looking for?

Basically, here is my criteria:

1.) Durable and (preferably) water-resistant
2.) Fairly easy to apply
3.) Satin finish (if possible)
4.) Drying/curing/re-coat time isn't like 1 week (although this is a BIT less important)

Any help given would be great. Thanks!

[Prashun Patel]

Polyurethane can look a little plasticky, but it's durable enough for a table. It can also yellow over time. IMHO the objections are with its aesthetics not performance.

i do however find it easier to apply as a wipe on varnish than others I have tried.

I am a Waterlox original sealer finish fan for color clarity and durability.

[Prashun Patel]

I also just finished my own kitchen table in ensuro clear poly satin and it seems pretty durable. I sprayed it. I don't have a lot of history with it, but if you have spray equipment, it's hard to beat this in the ease of use category.

[Anthony Brown]

Thanks Prashun. I am very familiar with polyurethane and have used it before, so applying that wouldn't be an issue for me at all. If you had to choose between Waterlox and Polyurethane, which one would you choose? If Polyurethane is also pretty water-resistant then that may be the way to go, but Id still like your input.

Is it true that the cure time on Waterlox is like 1 month? I read a post on another forum from a Waterlox representative that whatever you use Waterlox on is good to use within 7 days, but other people have said it could take up to 1 month to cure/use. That may be too long for me.

BTW, what are people's thoughts on me using Minwax Polycrylic instead of polyurethane?

I do not have spray equipment, so whatever I use must be able to go on by hand.

[Andrew Hughes]

Hi Anthony, Most of my work I use shellac,My second choice is General finish.Mostly because I can get it quick it's sold in several stores close by.One of my favorite wipe on finish is a gel wipe on urethane.It goes on quick builds fast and dries fast.If you do try it wear a mask.After it dries it's safe.I used it last on a table for a lunch room at a doctors office.Last I heard its holding up well.
Someday I would like to try Waterlox it's not sold here in California.

[David Hawxhurst]

between regular poly and waterlox i would go with waterlox. waterlox takes 30 days or so for full cure, but is usable after 7 days.

[Anthony Brown]

Hi Anthony, Most of my work I use shellac,My second choice is General finish.Mostly because I can get it quick it's sold in several stores close by.One of my favorite wipe on finish is a gel wipe on urethane.It goes on quick builds fast and dries fast.If you do try it wear a mask.After it dries it's safe.I used it last on a table for a lunch room at a doctors office.Last I heard its holding up well.
Someday I would like to try Waterlox it's not sold here in California.
Thanks Andrew. Yeah I think I am going down the polyurethane route. I have used it before to create mirror finishes, so I know I will be safe simply brushing or wiping it on. I hear Waterlox is great, but since I have had some unexpected speed-bumps on this project I think it's better that I stick to something I have used before that's still durable.

[John TenEyck]

My experience with GF's Urethane Gel Topcoat has been poor. It is not very chemically durable. Acetone and DNA and ammonia containing cleaners will damage it, as will even water from a leaky potted plant if left for a few days. I would strongly advise against using that product on a table top. However, GF does make several excellent products, including their WB EnduroVar and Enduro Clear Poly, as Prashun mentioned, and their OB Arm-R-Seal. Arm-R-Seal looks great and is easily wiped on and impervious to nearly anything, but takes at least 3 weeks to fully cure. The WB products look great, too, IMHO. At 4 coats they will not look like plastic. They will cure very hard in a week. You can apply 3 coats of them in a single day. If you have spray equipment they would be my choice, if not, Arm-R-Seal or Waterlox or P&L 38.

John

[Anthony Brown]

My experience with GF's Urethane Gel Topcoat has been poor. It is not very chemically durable. Acetone and DNA and ammonia containing cleaners will damage it, as will even water from a leaky potted plant if left for a few days. I would strongly advise against using that product on a table top. However, GF does make several excellent products, including their WB EnduroVar and Enduro Clear Poly, as Prashun mentioned, and their OB Arm-R-Seal. Arm-R-Seal looks great and is easily wiped on and impervious to nearly anything, but takes at least 3 weeks to fully cure. The WB products look great, too, IMHO. At 4 coats they will not look like plastic. They will cure very hard in a week. You can apply 3 coats of them in a single day. If you have spray equipment they would be my choice, if not, Arm-R-Seal or Waterlox or P&L 38.

John
Thanks John, I will go down the polyurethane route. So between Minwax Poly and Enduro Poly or Arm-R-Seal I take it you recommend the Enduro Poly or Arm-R-Seal?

If so I will have to see where I can find some.

Thanks.

[whit richardson]

Ahhh we want durability but pretty too... for absolute durability go with epoxy! Can't be beat for durability. ;-)

But seriously if you can't spray a KCMA certified finish meaning something certified by an industry trade group for about bullet proof finishes or don't have a sprayer I'd agree a nice looking polyurethane is the best bet for holding up. A note about sheen... folks all seem to want something besides gloss these days but just understand that over time any finish exposed to people (includes kids) will get body oils on it and stuff that will make the sheen more glossy over time.

[ALAN HOLLAR]

Avoid spar and marine finishes for table tops or anything that gets much wear. They are tough but not hard, show microabarsions quickly and do not polish well. They are formulated to maintain the flexibility needed to account for large wood movements caused by weather exposure.

[Anthony Brown]

Thanks guys. I am going the poly route. It just seems like the best all-around decision and finish. My only question is is Arm-R-Seal that much better than the Minwax Fast Drying Polyurethane? I would prefer something that dries quicker in between coats, but if the Arm-R-Seal is a better product then I will go in that direction.

Thanks.

[John TenEyck]

I don't know if Arm-R-Seal is a better product than Minwax Fast Drying Poly, but my testing showed pretty much nothing affects Arm-R-Seal and it looks great so I have no reason to look elsewhere. But if you can spray I would use EnduroVar or Enduro Clear Poly, or Enduro Conversion Varnish if you want the best of the best and are willing to pay for it. All are WB and will dry very quickly with minimal odor. You'll be done in two days and can start using the table in 7 days. Enduro Clear Poly and Conversion Varnish are KCMA rated. EnduroVar is not but I don't know why because it tested equivalent to slightly better than Clear Poly in my testing. You can buy EnduroVar at Rocklers or Woodcraft (I think). You can buy all of GF's products at Homestead Finishing or WWHardware, and probably Amazon. Surprisingly, Rocklers had the lowest price when I bought a gallon of EnduroVar last week.

Don't confuse Minwax Polycrylic to be in the same league as the GF products I listed.

John

[Anthony Brown]

Thanks for the info John, Yeah I am FULLY aware that Polycrilic is not the same as the Polyurethane. I have no interest in using the Polycrilic at all. Since I don't have any spray equipment I decided that going the Arm-R-Seal route makes the most sense. Even the guy at the Woodcraft store said that he ditched the Minwax Polyurethane and is going exclusively with Arm-R-Seal, Shellac, and Waterlox for all of his needs. Arm-R-Seal does have a longer drying time which will extend my project time, but I haven't heard a bad word said about Arm-R-Seal yet, so I'm gonna roll with that.

I will let everyone know how things turn out.

Thanks for the advice!

[Mike Henderson]

The most durable finish (that is reasonable to shoot) is a pre-catalyzed finish.

Mike

[Anthony Brown]

Final quick question to all.

Since a table top is what I am applying the Arm-R-Seal to, is there any way in particular that I should "finish" the table top once it's cured. I have read about using paste wax, but I heard that essentially wears off and can get messy if I ever have to make a repair (especially with use on a table). Should I just use a very fine grit sand paper to knock the nibs down and then leave it be? I'm not looking for a gloss or mirror finish, I'm just wondering what my "final step" should be for the table top once the poly has cured for a few weeks.

Thanks!

[Prashun Patel]

If you brush it all on, then you may need to denib or level the final surface. But if you sand to 400 or 600 before the final 2 coats and then wipe those last coats thin, then you may find you don't need to do anything to the final finish - especially if you are using semigloss or satin. You can crumple a brown paper bag and rub it on the surface once it's thoroughly dry.

[Anthony Brown]

If you brush it all on, then you may need to denib or level the final surface. But if you sand to 400 or 600 before the final 2 coats and then wipe those last coats thin, then you may find you don't need to do anything to the final finish - especially if you are using semigloss or satin. You can crumple a brown paper bag and rub it on the surface once it's thoroughly dry.

Thanks. The paper bag thing is exactly what the guy at the Woodcraft store mentioned as well. Just thought I would double-check with the experts on here, but it sounds like he knows exactly what he is talking about as well.

Thanks again for the advice!

[Anthony Brown]

One last question for everyone. What is the "official" cure time for Arm-R-Seal? On the General Finishes website one area says 30 days, but the FAQs at the bottom of that same page says 14 days for full cure time. I see no contact link or phone number on their website for me to reach out to General Finishes and ask for myself.

I have also heard that after 7 days any Arm-R-Sealed piece is OK to use. Are there any "dangers" in using something before the full cure time is up?

Thanks.

[Prashun Patel]

If the finish is not fully cured, it has not reached maximum hardness. That means it is susceptible to scratches from things as soft as fingernails. It also means it's prone to sticking if you put things like magazines or newspapers or plastic feet from potted plants on it.

Now, all 3 of those things can still affect a fully cured finish, so you're best to always treat it as respectfully as possible.

All this being said, I put my pieces into service as soon as they stop smelling. That is usually a sign they are fully DRY and the solvent has fully evaporated. It is not evidence of full cure. I just make sure to be gentle with use during the first few weeks; I don't leave anything standing on the surface for prolonged periods, including cloth mats.

The exact cure time varies depending on your ambient conditions of temperature, humidity, and air flow.

For rubbing out, (that is, leveling and then polishing back to a shine) full cure becomes necessary. So, the couple times I did that, I put the table into use, used it for a while (3 months) and then did the rub out. And I've often put the piece into use with the intention of rubbing out later, but have found that regular use rubs down a glossy, dusty surface sufficiently for my eyes and fingers.

If all you want to do is denib the surface, then you can do the paper bag thing as soon as the surface has dried for a day or two and stops feeling 'draggy' to your fingers.

[John TenEyck]

I try to wait a week after applying the last coat of Arm-R-Seal before putting the project into service. In my testing Arm-R-Seal takes at least 3 weeks to fully cure, but I just never seem to be able to wait that long. Gentle use for a month is a very good idea. I counsel people not to leave anything lying on a horizontal surface like a table top, especially anything made of plastic as the plasticizers in them often will leave a permanent shadow. Plastics are bad even after the finish has fully cured.

John

[Anthony Brown]

Thanks for the info guys. My project will have been sitting "curing" for 2 weeks on Tuesday. Maybe since I have waited this long I can wait another week for full cure. It sounds like either way I should be fine for gentle use. I'm just getting a slight bit impatient because I live in Michigan and temps are dropping in the 40's right now (my piece is sitting in my garage). It's not necessarily "freezing" temps, but it is a bit cold outside. I only want to move this thing one time, as it is quite heavy, and the risk of damage due to droppage is fairly high, so once I bring this top in from the garage, it's going to it's final "resting place" for good. No more moving it around.

EDIT: Just looked at the forecast and it's supposed to warm up next week into the mid-to-high 60's pretty much every day, so that does help some.

[Prashun Patel]

Ithink you are fine to move it inside.

[Anthony Brown]

Ithink you are fine to move it inside.

Thanks Prashun. The more I think about it the more I am inclined to move it inside. I will probably still wait until Tuesday only because I have an extremely busy weekend ahead and the top is going to require a bit of assembly with the base.

I may be able to do it on Monday if I get time.