Replace Craftsman RAS with DeWalt MBF?

[Paul Schaefer]

I currently have a Craftsman steel-arm RAS that's had the Emerson recall replacement of the table and guard. Works okay, but it seems like I have to regularly fiddle with the adjustments.

There's a DeWalt MBF for sale locally for $50. Looks like decent condition, but it's probably going to need some tune-up and adjustment before I use it.

My gut feeling is that it's worth buying the MBF and doing the tune-up rather than sticking with the Craftsman, but I'd like some feedback from the Creek. What do you folks think?

[Allan Speers]

A definite step up, if the bearings, motor, etc are all good. - but it could require a lot of work to bring it up to snuff.

Also, it's probably a 9" saw so you'd need new blades.

[John TenEyck]

The MBF uses a 9" diameter blade and has a 3/4 HP motor. It is a very high precision saw for work in thinner stock, a definite step up over the Sears in that regard. If it runs well it's worth $50 three or four times over. I personally would want a larger saw, at least a GW which uses a 10" blade and has a 1.5 HP motor, but if your work is primarily on 3/4 and thinner stock the MBF is a very good choice.

John

[Paul Schaefer]

I think I need to give some more information. My current Craftsman RAS is a dedicated crosscutter - hasn't been moved off 90 degrees in a couple years. I've used it to cut some tongues for tongue-and-groove joints, and maybe a couple dadoes, but it's mostly used to cut to length. Most of what I work with is pine, and the biggest I'm cutting is 2 x 'X' stock that's been jointed and planed to uniform thickness, so about 1.25" thick. The initial setup of the C-man was frustrating, and it seems like I need to re-adjust it every year or so when I'm doing some finished carpentry that absolutely needs to be square.

From what I've read, the MBF should hold its settings a lot better than the C-man. In John TenEyck's words above, 'high precision'. The C-man draws 11 amps according to the nameplate, and I've read that the MBF draws 10, so they should be pretty close in terms of power. I'd have to get a smaller crosscut blade, but I only have the one I'm currently using in the C-man, so I'm not throwing away a big investment there. My dado set is 8", not sure if I could use it in the MBF.

Basically, I'd be using the MBF to replace the C-man in its current function in hopes of making a big jump in precision (and drop in frustration) at a relatively low cost. Of course, this assumes that the motor and bearings in the MBF are okay - if it sounds rough, or the carriage doesn't slide smoothly, or anything else seems really out of whack, I'm not buying it.

[John TenEyck]

The MBF is a very well respected saw, I've heard some say it was Dewalt's finest effort in the small saw format. The one I've looked at was a gem. I think it only has a 12" capacity but if that meets your needs you'll like it. It's major shortcoming is in power. At only 3/4 HP it won't cut very fast through 1"+ hardwood; but in pine it will likely be fine. Carbide Processors (IIRC) makes several 9" blades that will fit that saw. I have one of theirs on my GWI and it cuts beautifully. You can't really tell if the bearings are good by looking at it or even running it; you can only tell if they are bad. Bearings typically last around 25 years, so if they haven't been changed within that time period they might need to be pretty soon even if it runs well now. Replacing them is not that hard to do yourself, actually. And it's easy to tell if the carriage rolls smoothly. If it doesn't that would be more of a show stopper to me than the motor bearings unless it's just gunk up in the ways. Run your finger along them. If you feel a divot that's what's causing it and I'd walk away. My saw actually has a divot in the ways. Fortunately, it's near the end of the arm so it's a non issue 95% of the time.

You might be able to sense that I'm a fan of the old Dewalts. I've had mine for over 20 years and would not want to be w/o it. I have it mounted in an 8' bench top with a calibrated fence/stop. For cutting pieces to final length it is without peer in my shop. I think I've had to adjust 2 or 3 times over that time frame and one of those was after I removed the motor to replace the bearings.

John

[Mike Schuch]

I grew up learning wood working from my father on a Delta turret arm radial arm saw with a 3/4 hp motor and 10" blade. It did everything we needed it to do and did it very well! We would occasionally bind the blade and stall it when ripping but never had an issue cross cutting. I would not buy a RAS less than 10". The blade selection and price for 9" and 8" blades would turn me off to saws smaller than 10".

Having learned woodworking on a RAS... a RAS is now the center of my shop. My RAS is a 1947 Redstar 16" 7.5hp turret arm RAS that is the grand father of all the Rockwell/Delta turret arm RAS's. Do I need 7.5hp and a 16" blade? Heck no! Do I really enjoy having a 7.5 hp motor and 16" blade? Heck yes!!!

A really nice upgrade to a Craftsman RAS (My first stationary power tool was a Craftsman RAS) is a 12" RAS from Delta, Rockwell, Dewalt, Original saw or any of the other industrial RAS designs. In my neck of the woods you can pick up an industrial RAS really cheap with a little bit of looking and a little bit of patients.

[Bill Neely]

My dad had a Dewalt RAS that he bought when I was 12, about 1954, I have no idea what model it was just remember him using it in the garage.

[Brad Patch]

,
I currently have a Craftsman steel-arm RAS that's had the Emerson recall replacement of the table and guard. Works okay, but it seems like I have to regularly fiddle with the adjustments.

There's a DeWalt MBF for sale locally for $50. Looks like decent condition, but it's probably going to need some tune-up and adjustment before I use it.

My gut feeling is that it's worth buying the MBF and doing the tune-up rather than sticking with the Craftsman, but I'd like some feedback from the Creek. What do you folks think?

You have been given some excellent advice. I started out with a Craftsman radial which was a gift from my late father. Sadly, it required constant fiddling, belatedly I came to the conclusion it was hopeless, and although I hated to do it I took advantage of the recall. I now have a Dewalt MBC, a far superior saw in all respects. Don't try and cut wet 2x4 material, but on smaller scale work, with a sharp blade, it works very well.

[Roy Turbett]

I replaced my late 70's vintage Craftsman with a DeWalt GWI simply because I couldn't keep it aligned. The DeWalt MBC (1/2hp), MBF (3/4hp) and GWI (1 1/2hp) and other older cast iron DeWalts all have the same basic design that are known for being easy to tune and holding their alignment. They are also fairly easy to rebuild.

That said, before getting rid of your Craftsman, read Jon Eakes book "Fine Tuning A Radial Arm Saw" available as an ebook on his website. In it he discussed the concept of taking "end of play" into account when tuning and using the saw. You may find that this solves your alignment problem and allows you make consistently accurate miter cuts as well. I didn't read the book until after I got rid of my Craftsman.

[Paul Schaefer]

Roy - that might be worth a try. Eakes' $15 book is certainly cheaper than any of the MBFs I've seen on CL. I did the adjustment procedures listed in the Cman's owner's manual, but never went beyond that. Does he make any claims about his methods being able to fix the problems that people have with their Craftsman RASes?

[Roy Turbett]

Does he make any claims about his methods being able to fix the problems that people have with their Craftsman RASes?

No. He basically describes how to compensate for any error. What he says is that every RAS has a certain amount of play in it and he provides instructions on how to take the play into account when tuning and using the saw. The way you do this is to apply slight pressure in one direction to move the arm or yoke until it reaches the "end of play". Whenever you use the saw, you simply apply the same pressure in the same direction when you change angles.

The design on the older DeWalt RAS's is superior to the Craftsman because you can remove virtually all play when you adjust the wedge that is seated in corresponding machined grooves for the preset detents. The Craftsman has a spring loaded ball that seats in a slightly larger hole for the preset detents. This is done so the ball can be retracted when changing miters. Over time, one or more of the detent holes can enlarge so you may be not be able to consistently move from 90 degrees to 45 degrees using the preset detents. In theory you should still be able to produce the same margin of error and take this into account when setting the miter.

[jack duren]

if your patient you can usually find a good Delta 12" saw pretty reasonable. Unlike the 10" saws where the problems exist in accuracy...