First Lathe

[Charles McKinley]

Hi All,

Ken infected me with the pen turning virus at Ray's party in Indiana and I'm ready to take the leap.

Do I get the Jet Mini @ $350 w/ stand at Woodcraft or the Jet 12" @ $400 JT708352 on close out at Woodworker's Warehouse?

I've tried to find a used on but the ones I have seen are almost as much as a new one.

Thanks for your input,

:confused:

[John Davidson]

I have a Jet mini and I love it but I also have a Delta 1642 steel bed. If all you are ever going to do is pens and small projects then the mini should serve you well. But for the exctra $50 the bigger Jet opens up more possabilties and should be able to do everything that the mini can do. Unless the lathe needs to be portable I would go with the bigger machine. Just MHO

[Bill Grumbine]

Hi Chuck

If you have the room in both the shop and your wallet, go for the bigger machine. In almost every case, more money gets you more machine, and while both lathes are good starter machines, I think you will appreciate the larger swing and the variable speed of the bigger Jet. I owned one for 3 1/2 years, and I can't really say anything but good about the machine.

Bill

[Jim Becker]

"You can turn small things on a big lathe, but you can't turn big things on a small lathe." -Phil Brennion

[David Eisan]

Hello there,

Here is a used lathe I bought for $100 CDN (~$70 USD) and restored,

http://members.rogers.com/dfeisan/images/totalathe.jpg

Check out local auctions, I have found some good buys on old equipment everyone else passed on because it looked much worse than it was.

David.

[Ken Salisbury]

Originally posted by David Eisan
Hello there,

Here is a used lathe I bought for $100 CDN (~$70 USD) and restored,

David.

<p align="center"><B><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#008000" size="5">&quot;GREAT JOB DAVID !!!!!! &quot;</font></B></p>

[Charles McKinley]

Thank you for all of the great input!

David, That is a great job on your lathe. Unfortunatly the last few things I have restored have cost me almost as much as new and a couple more than new. I call it stepping over dollars to pick up dimes.

The final decision was the JET 1236!

Now to outfit it. I'll be posting questions on chucks and white wheels and soaking blanks and.........

The slippery slope just got steeper!

Thanks again

P.S. KEN IT ALL YOUR FAULT!!!! Iwas a happy member of the flat earth society until I ran into the likes of you! :D

[Ken Salisbury]

Originally posted by Charles McKinley
Thank you for all of the great input!

The final decision was the JET 1236!


P.S. KEN IT ALL YOUR FAULT!!!! Iwas a happy member of the flat earth society until I ran into the likes of you! :D

Charles ---- Good choice on the 1236 !! You will love it as do mine.

----- on the second point --> poo poo happens !!:D

[Don Farr]

On the restoration. Fenner power twist belts and all.
I love doing this kind of thing also.

[Wayne MacKenzie]

Not trying to burst any bubles or anything, but as I also looked around for a good entry lathe, it came to me that the exact same lathe as the larger variable speed 36" Jet, is the EXACT same machine as the "General Machinery" model but painted green instead of white. I do mean the exact same machine/manufacturer/ model ect... The only significant difference I found was the Jet model came with a beter live center, however, since #2 center kits are a dime a dozen, and one normaly would need more than one, I found this insignificant.

What was significant was the price difference. THe same darn lathe from Harbor Freight Tools online, is less than 1/2 the price of the "JET" offering.(Sale price was even lower $179.00 U.S. Considerring the Jet is a $550-$700 machine, I think it's incredible what we are asked to pay for a rubber stamp Name.

As I said, I'm cheap (THus I shop around) and though Harbor freight doesn't carry what one would consider mostly top of the line tools, they do indeed buy from the same manufacturers as Jet/Delta/ect..from the Tiwanese and CHinese factories for SOME items.

Hope this helps someone bewfore they get ripped.

[David Eisan]

Not trying to burst any bubles or anything, but as I also looked around for a good entry lathe, it came to me that the exact same lathe as the larger variable speed 36" Jet, is the EXACT same machine as the "General Machinery" model but painted green instead of white. I do mean the exact same machine/manufacturer/ model ect... The only significant difference I found was the Jet model came with a beter live center, however, since #2 center kits are a dime a dozen, and one normaly would need more than one, I found this insignificant.

Hope this helps someone bewfore they get ripped.

Let me see if I have this strait. You are saying that the General lathe and the Jet lathe are the same machine? Do you know if they are made in the same plant? The only difference is the live centre and the paint colour?

David.

[Jim Becker]

What was significant was the price difference. THe same darn lathe from Harbor Freight Tools online, is less than 1/2 the price of the "JET" offering.(Sale price was even lower $179.00 U.S. Considerring the Jet is a $550-$700 machine, I think it's incredible what we are asked to pay for a rubber stamp Name.

If you are refering to the 34706 lathe ("Central Machinery", not "General Machinery") it is not the same as the Jet 1236. It's very similar, but not the same. The tool post is 25mm metric, rather than 1", the motor is less powerful, no matter what the "rating", the quality of the fasteners, while usable, are substandard. The locking mechanism for the tailstock is also prone to slipping and requires constant readjustment. It's a copy of the older Jet lathe style, but not an identical machine.

How do I know this? I bought one as my first lathe. It worked but generated enough frustration that I sold it for a significant loss after only 6 months.

So don't assume it's the same machine. Is it a good value for the money? Yes. Is it a machine that is going to allow you to do a little turning? Yes. Is it a machine you're going to want to continue to turn on for any length of time? No. IMHO, the Jet, Delta or Fisch midi-lathes are a better value as a first lathe/traveling lathe/secondary lathe.

"The most expensive tool is one you need to replace early and/or often"

[Tom Sweeney]

WOODTURNING!
These guys are insideous I'll tell ya - Ken, Bill, Jim - the whole lot of them should be arrested for corrupting us innocent flat workers.

You live close to Lee Schierer don't you?? He's looking for someone that wants a bunch of turning wood - pear I think.

Good call on the larger lathe - Pens might be pretty cool - but turning bowls is a serious addiction :D

BTW - great job on that lathe resto David - way cool :cool:

[Wayne MacKenzie]

If you are refering to the 34706 lathe ("Central Machinery", not "General Machinery") it is not the same as the Jet 1236. It's very similar, but not the same. The tool post is 25mm metric, rather than 1", the motor is less powerful, no matter what the "rating", the quality of the fasteners, while usable, are substandard. The locking mechanism for the tailstock is also prone to slipping and requires constant readjustment. It's a copy of the older Jet lathe style, but not an identical machine.

How do I know this? I bought one as my first lathe. It worked but generated enough frustration that I sold it for a significant loss after only 6 months.

So don't assume it's the same machine. Is it a good value for the money? Yes. Is it a machine that is going to allow you to do a little turning? Yes. Is it a machine you're going to want to continue to turn on for any length of time? No. IMHO, the Jet, Delta or Fisch midi-lathes are a better value as a first lathe/traveling lathe/secondary lathe.

"The most expensive tool is one you need to replace early and/or often"


I'm afraid I don't see any difference between the two other than what I mentioned as well as the power switch placement, as they seem to be both from the same castings (As evidenced by the same dimensions and apearance of the casted parts)not to mention the headstock lock and gearing under the belt covers are identical. A very nice gentleman from the woodcraft stoor was very acomidating to let me take the coverscrews off and inspect the "Older style" Jet lathe on display. You did point out an obvious difference in the toolrest support, but that also seems innocuous.

As for tailstock slippage, perhaps the machine you recieved was defective? As I have encountered no problems while turning or advancing the tailstock with apropriate force. Note: that aside the posibility that your tailstock lock may have been defective, ANY tailstock friction mechanism will give/pushout as you advance the tailstock spindle with sufficient force given that the stock itself can withstand the pressure and translate it as leverage to the otherside.

Now as to the fasteners (i.e. screws/bolts/nuts..ect..) I couldn't agree with you more. Harbor Freight could have definately done their homework better and asked the exporter to have the machines delivered with a higher grade of nuts/bolts..ect ,However it is a small matter to replace these items with about was less than $5.00 US of same from my local Hardware store.


General M's http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=34706

Jet's "Older Model" http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00006ANS3/b/002-5834808-8894443?v=glance&s=hi&me=ATVPDKIKX0DER&vi=pictures&img=14#more-pictures

As you may allready know, Jet, Delta, General Machinery, Grizzly, as well as several other distributers are exactly that... "DISTRIBUTERS" for the most part. They are no more "Manufacturers than you or I. They simply buy from Tiwanese and Chinese (And others) manufacturers and either dress up i.e. Paint, and add their own windowdressing to the machinery or just straight out resale as is (General does bare minimum product modification while Grizzly goes to great lengths.)

No direspect intended just carefull scrutiny (recent I might add) that might point towards a decent value out there.

[Jim Becker]

As you may allready know, Jet, Delta, General Machinery, Grizzly, as well as several other distributers are exactly that... "DISTRIBUTERS" for the most part. They are no more "Manufacturers than you or I. They simply buy from Tiwanese and Chinese (And others) manufacturers and either dress up i.e. Paint, and add their own windowdressing to the machinery or just straight out resale as is (General does bare minimum product modification while Grizzly goes to great lengths.)

No direspect intended just carefull scrutiny (recent I might add) that might point towards a decent value out there.

Jet, Delta, General International and Grizzly all have their own engineers on-site at the various overseas (and domestic) machinery fabricators they use. The machines are built to specification for each brand and there are some differences there as well as in quality control. It is not true that they just slap their name and paint on their machines. It is true that some of those engineers have been less effective lately, at least for one or more of those manufacturers!

Relative to the two "versions" of the machines in question, the HFT unit is made in mainland China and I believe that the Jet 1236 was made in Taiwan...different factories and different fabricators/companies. The design itself has been around for a long, long time; neither Jet nor HFT (or Grizzly with its G5979 "clone" and some others like the Yorkcraft, etc) did any kind of innovation on that particular design.

Again, I'm not saying that the HFT lathe doesn't provide value--it's one of the few HFT tools I've even "recommended". (Their DPs are also good buys). But from my own personal experience both with the 34706 that was in my own shop (I've also turned on several Jet 1236s) as well as the observations of several friends who also bought the machine, I believe I can safely say that it was not built nearly as well as the Jet. They all had the same problems, so it wasn't my machine. I got what I expected for $239 delivered to my door...a servicable machine. But in hindsight, I should have bought one of the midi lathes to start out as it would have reduced my real cost over time.

[Wayne MacKenzie]

Relative to the two "versions" of the machines in question, the HFT unit is made in mainland China and I believe that the Jet 1236 was made in Taiwan...different factories and different fabricators/companies. The design itself has been around for a long, long time; neither Jet nor HFT (or Grizzly with its G5979 "clone" and some others like the Yorkcraft, etc) did any kind of innovation on that particular design.


I see your point and it is well noted. Quality control and the "SPecs" as you say the redistributers ask of the plants indeed show a difference in expectations. As for the design being around for a long time, I see were a person of your vintage would better be able to spot those trends than us hwo are relatively new to this venue and in my case "Hobby",and I thank you for passing on your insight. (I could use all the help I can get my hands on).
I still think the differences are more cosmetic as there is only so many ways you can clamp something or bolt it together/cast it 's parts ect.. but then I have always been a fixer upper kind of person. A chuck and bolt replacement or even motor replacement if needed was more a way of life for me rather than a choice as my history is of humble beginings.

Since we have a conversation going Mr Becker, I might ask your help in choosing an "economical" yet fully functional #2 mounted chuck would you suggest?

(Practical purposes only no fancy advanced or flowery bells and whistles needed)

[Jim Becker]

Since we have a conversation going Mr Becker, I might ask your help in choosing an "economical" yet fully functional #2 mounted chuck would you suggest?

(Practical purposes only no fancy advanced or flowery bells and whistles needed)

Well, you can go "Value" and pick up something like the basic NOVA or one of Grizzly's chucks. But I'm going to suggest you at least consider investing in a better chuck, if only because they will be easier to use with single key operation. The low-end chucks generally use two tommy bars to tighten...and most of us just don't have three hands (no matter how big our egos...) --one to hold the blank and two to grasp and work the bars. The nice thing about the better chucks which use a single key is that they can easily be adapted to your next lathe by simply changing a $20 insert to match the requirements of your tools spindle threading. In the long run, they are less expensive since you don't need to replace them. You can also add an assortment of different jaws, depending on your needs. I believe the basic NOVA supports this, but don't thing many (or any) of the bargan chucks do.

The basic chucks will cost you betwen $60 and $150. The better chucks, such as the OneWay Talon, SuperNOVA, etc., will run just about $200. Pick your poison. Yea, it's hard considering an accessory that costs as much or more than your lathe, but welcome to turning. It's the way it is.

On the other hand, you can turn almost anything without a chuck. Faceplates with or without glue blocks will serve the same purpose and help you to hone your turning skills better. Jam/friction chucking is the way to go when working with small objects and/or turned boxes. Fast and cheap. Etc., etc.