Scratches On Walnut Top

[Doug Berg]

Hey all. Been keeping my eye on this forum for a while and I'm finally posting. Thanks in advance for all the advice.

I recently made a coffee table with a metal base and black walnut top. This past weekend my landlord moved some things and put some nasty scratches in the table top..... Total bummer right?

The table was sanded to 220 and had 3 coats of Minwax Tung Oil on it.

What do I need to do to remove these scratches? I'm thinking I will need to re-sand the whole piece and re-apply the tung oil (which I will probably use 100% tung from old masters). My plan would be to use the ROS and start with 120, work up to 220, and then hand sand with 220, maybe 400 this time. Then re-apply 2-3 coats of Tung.

Can anyone provide me with advice? Are there any tricks I should know? Any other procedures?

I will attach photos in the next message.

Thanks Everyone

[Doug Berg]

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[Prashun Patel]

Before you do that, you can try steaming those scratches: Put a towel or sheet down, mist it with water, then iron with progressively hotter steam. The less heat the better, but it's not really that critical. I did a whole kitchen table this way and despite blasting it with the iron on the hottest setting, I didn't damage any of the color underneath.

After that's done, the grain will be raised, so re-sand the top with 220. I'd do it by hand, or wet with mineral spirits. If you sand dry on the ros, you risk getting gums and corns that can leave sanding swirls.

Once the grains knocked down, apply your finish of choice.

Even if you're not able to remove the scratches completely, you may reduce them to 'good enough'. At the worst, if you have to resand, you'll at least reduce the amount of effort required. To that end, when you sand out dings and scratches avoid the desire to sand aggressively in one spot. Every three/four strokes, feather out our sanding to the surrounding areas. Never tip your ROS, and don't press hard. If you stop feeling it cutting, don't press hard, change paper. I respect how hard it is to avoid these temptations. I STILL cheat.

[Doug Berg]

Thanks for the advice. That is exactly the sort of trick I was looking for. Couple quick questions... can I simply sand the scratches with 220 and mineral spirits, or should I sand the entire top?

I will definitely give this a try, but I don't have high hopes. One of the scratches is deeper than it appears in the pictures.... I own a kitchen design studio and also sell tables and art. I can't expect my clients to buy a piece that has a top with blemishes.


Before you do that, you can try steaming those scratches: Put a towel or sheet down, mist it with water, then iron with progressively hotter steam. The less heat the better, but it's not really that critical. I did a whole kitchen table this way and despite blasting it with the iron on the hottest setting, I didn't damage any of the color underneath.

After that's done, the grain will be raised, so re-sand the top with 220. I'd do it by hand, or wet with mineral spirits. If you sand dry on the ros, you risk getting gums and corns that can leave sanding swirls.

Once the grains knocked down, apply your finish of choice.

Even if you're not able to remove the scratches completely, you may reduce them to 'good enough'. At the worst, if you have to resand, you'll at least reduce the amount of effort required. To that end, when you sand out dings and scratches avoid the desire to sand aggressively in one spot. Every three/four strokes, feather out our sanding to the surrounding areas. Never tip your ROS, and don't press hard. If you stop feeling it cutting, don't press hard, change paper. I respect how hard it is to avoid these temptations. I STILL cheat.

[Prashun Patel]

I advise to at least give a light sanding to the rest of the top. The reason is that NOT doing so will mean the non-sanded parts will absorb different amounts of finish than the sanded parts. I don't know about you, but this leads to frustration for me, as I put too much on some areas, and then not enough on the others; any time saved by not sanding the whole things is eaten by me fussing with the finish application after.

If this were my table, after I got the scratches to an acceptable level, I'd sand the whole thing with 400, then 600. It just makes the oil go on so evenly and gets to a sealed surface with fewer coats than with a table sanded only to 220.

This flies in the face of conventional wisdom, but I urge you to try it once and lmk what you think...

[Dan Hahr]

I've always been the old that kilns will steam walnut to even out the sapwood. This kind of subdues the purples and deep Browns of walnut. If it's already been steamed, it's probably not a big deal. Anyway, I've had enough bad luck trying to patch mistakes so I'd just scrape and sand it flat and start over with the finishing. You might need to plane it if the scratches are too deep.

Also, pure ting oil and Minwax ting oil finish are not even close to the same thing. Minwax is just thin varnish. Nothing wrong with it but not similar to real ting oil.

Dan

[Jamie Buxton]

.. Are there any tricks I should know? Any other procedures?..

First, shoot the landlord.

[Doug Berg]

First, shoot the landlord.

Trust me... The thought crossed my mind. I walked into my studio Saturday morning and saw they had set things on the table. I went home and told my Fiance that I guarantee there will be scratches on the top when I look at it Monday morning... Sure enough, scratched in 3 different places.

[Doug Berg]

Update.... So I have the table top back to an acceptable level... sort of. I ended up sanding the entire top with 220 and mineral spirits, and then sanding with 400 and mineral spirits. It took a lot of sanding but I was able to sand out both scratches so they were nearly gone. Once that was finished I gave the table 24 hours to dry, and I was a little disappointed when I returned. The table looked so dry and dull, especially in the spot where the scratches were. I figured this was normal though, I did just spray about 1 pt of mineral spirits onto the top of the table. Anyways, I then coated with 4 coats of tung varnish. I decided to just use the minwax tung varnish again, I had already purchased it. I figured the dryness would go away with the tung varnish, but the table top still looked dull, especially where the scratches were. So I bought some Minwax special dark waxing paste and applied a coat of wax. I don't think I let the wax dry long enough on the first or second application, because I had a really hard time getting the surface to have an even "waxed shine". So I walked away from it for the weekend and returned today. Today I applied another coat of wax and I've been buffing it out for the last 30 minutes or so. I'm getting a more even shine today, but I'm still having trouble getting it perfect. Some areas look great, and some areas either look like they do not have enough wax on them, or the wax needs to be buffed out more.... I'm not sure. I am buffing with a mico-fiber cloth, and it makes me wonder if a power buffer is really what I need, or if I just need to give it a little more elbow grease.

I greatly appreciate that help and opinions. This is my first table that has a "nice" table top on it, and hopefully there are many more to come in the future.

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I advise to at least give a light sanding to the rest of the top. The reason is that NOT doing so will mean the non-sanded parts will absorb different amounts of finish than the sanded parts. I don't know about you, but this leads to frustration for me, as I put too much on some areas, and then not enough on the others; any time saved by not sanding the whole things is eaten by me fussing with the finish application after.

If this were my table, after I got the scratches to an acceptable level, I'd sand the whole thing with 400, then 600. It just makes the oil go on so evenly and gets to a sealed surface with fewer coats than with a table sanded only to 220.

This flies in the face of conventional wisdom, but I urge you to try it once and lmk what you think...

[Conrad Fiore]

How many coats of the Minwax did you put on? Its possible that the "dull" areas are from where the finish was absorbed into the wood and not enough finish was applied to make everything even with a film.

[Doug Berg]

How many coats of the Minwax did you put on? Its possible that the "dull" areas are from where the finish was absorbed into the wood and not enough finish was applied to make everything even with a film.

I have 3 coats on now, but I don't think I allowed the first 2 coats enough time to "dry" before buffing them out. I think it is very possible that the dull areas need more wax, but this is my first time using wax so I'm really not sure.

[Prashun Patel]

I wouldn't have relied on wax to do that. You'll find that in a few months, the dull spots re-appear (or that the shiny parts mute down to the point where it all matches anyway).

I would have continued with a coat or two more of varnish.

[Conrad Fiore]

I have 3 coats on now, but I don't think I allowed the first 2 coats enough time to "dry" before buffing them out. I think it is very possible that the dull areas need more wax, but this is my first time using wax so I'm really not sure.

No, I was referring to the number of finish coats (tung varnish) you applied, not the wax.
As Prashun mentioned that the wax should have been just a final "touch" for the varnished surface.

[Doug Berg]

No, I was referring to the number of finish coats (tung varnish) you applied, not the wax.
As Prashun mentioned that the wax should have been just a final "touch" for the varnished surface.

I had applied 4 coats of varnish when I changed to the wax. The 4th coat did not seem to make any improvement from the 3rd coat. At that point the "dry" looking spots had mostly disappeared.

[Conrad Fiore]

And the time between the last coat of varnish and the first coat of wax?

[Doug Berg]

And the time between the last coat of varnish and the first coat of wax?


about 72 hours

[Conrad Fiore]

about 72 hours

That may have been a little early to wax but I don't know if that would be the cause of your problem. Usually you would finish with the varnish to where it looks like a good finished product. The wax would only be a very small amount of additional shine and protection.
FYI, usually the problem when waxing is waiting too long before buffing and the wax becomes too hard to buff out. It is usually corrected by the addition of more wax and buffing sooner so that some of the solvent in the wax softens up the previous coat.
Why don't you let it be for about two weeks and then try another round of wax and buffing.