Joinery saw handles

[James Tibbetts]

I am blessed/cursed with fairly large hands and the obvious problems it creates with hand tool use. I'll be looking to buy some tenon and dovetail saws in the near future. Can you folks offer any insight into which producers tend to have handles on the larger side or offer handle sizing options?

[Jim Koepke]

You might try:

http://www.bontzsawworks.net/home/18-half-back-saw/

He has a hand sizing page.

Have you thought of buying a blade kit and making your own handle?

Here is a handle build for an old saw blade of mine:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?180712-Back-Saw-Build

jtk

[ken hatch]

Bad Axe also has different size totes available.

ken

[James Tibbetts]

I should have been more specific in my op. I'm remembered Bad Axe and Ron's offerings. All with excellent craftsmanship, but a bit pricey. I was hoping for something a bit more cost effective. May not be out there I guess.

[Tony Joyce]

If you're willing to do the work a kit may be the way to go. You can definitely save a lot this way. Try this site he has sizing options for handle templates and is reasonable on saw parts also.

http://www.blackburntools.com/

Tony

[Reinis Kanders]

Veritas saws in general are pretty good, the ones with open handle. Their tenon saws are a bit tight but usable. I have 4" wide hands and long fingers, but they are not thick hands which probably would make a difference. Gramercy carcase saw also fits me well, it is a bit bigger than Veritas one.

[Matthew N. Masail]

Another call for Veritas. The handles have enough meat in them that you could simply enlarge it if needed.

[James Tibbetts]

As always lots of good information and points to consider.

[Stewie Simpson]

Mark Harrell http://www.badaxetoolworks.com/ uses folded backs, and likes to undermine the use of slotted backs which is the preferred option of other backsaw makers.

Frankly, making a traditional folded sawback is an expensive process, based on design practices established centuries ago. Many sawmakers today will mill a slot into brass bar stock, and epoxy and/or pin the sawplate into place, making for a static sawback. While this is a perfectly serviceable method of attachment (and lowers production costs to boot), the static sawback leaves no room for error if the plate is accidentally kinked in use through poor handling. It is a little known fact that the traditional folded sawback allows for minute slippage if the plate is kinked in use, and also allows the user to retension the toothline at will (note my video demonstrating sawback retensioning here (https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10155115975690104&set=vb.390516585103&type=2&theater)). All backsaws were made in this manner until about 20 years ago, as the hand tool market reemerged worldwide, when it became apparent to many sawmakers that replicating the traditional folded sawback was an expensive process. The Bad Axe commitment to quality and traditional design trumps that mindset, and delivers to you a superior sawback design that has stood the test of centuries. Our adherence to traditional design—like Disstons, Simonds, and Atkins still around today—is why your Bad Axe will still be around long after the static-backed saws are discarded and forgotten.http://www.badaxetoolworks.com/why-bad-axe-tool-works.php

So what does Mark have to say about the Veritas Backsaws with their moulded spines. Nothing. http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.aspx?p=71464&cat=1,42884

[Ron Bontz]

James,
With respect to the infomercial above....Not worth my time.
However, I do not know what size your hand is without my little chart being filled out. But I suspect Issac ( Blackburns Tools ) could probably come up with something for you. , I almost forgot. The last I heard, Dominic ( TGIAG ) is selling folded saw backs, if that's your preference, as well as other parts. Best wishes. Ron

[Stewie Simpson]

I should have been more specific in my op. I'm remembered Bad Axe and Ron's offerings. All with excellent craftsmanship, but a bit pricey. I was hoping for something a bit more cost effective. May not be out there I guess.

Hi James. If craftmanship is not a high priority, and you want something cheap and nasty, have a look at the Veritas range of backsaws.

The other alternative would be to look on ebay for a 2nd hand backsaw. a pre 1930s Disston would be a good choice.

Stewie;

[James Tibbetts]

Ron, thanks for chiming in. I'm a fan of your work... just beautiful. I was at Isaac's site yesterday and unfortunately he has a 2 year lead time for custom saws. I noticed you were booked up until at least the first of September.
Making my own or rehab an old Disston maybe the way to go for now. The look of the Veritas saws has never appealed to me.
Any more input is more than welcome!

[Curt Putnam]

I find the Veritas saw totes to be too small for my hands (4.25"). I still have and use all of their saws because they are such an incredible bargain. I lucked into a ready made dovetail saw that Isaac had (no wait.) Take a long look at Kevin Glen-Drake's dovetail saw. My druthers, in order, are: 1) - Ron Bontz or Isaac Smith (Blackburn Tools), 2) - Bad Axe. Stewie's saws probably fit in there somewhere - they are certainly pretty enough. If you don't want to suffer either the wait or the price from these guys then Veritas is your choice. IMO, both the Grammercy and LN saw totes are so small that they twist around in my hand without a death grip on them.

[Steve Voigt]

If craftmanship is not a high priority, and you want something cheap and nasty, have a look at the Veritas range of backsaws.

Stewie;

Amongst people who are knowledgable, people whose opinions I respect, I have never heard Veritas tools described as "cheap and nasty." Rather, I have typically heard them described as high-quality, affordable options.

Speaking of other things I haven't seen before...I'm familiar with most of the boutique toolmakers, and know a number of them personally. But I've never seen any of these fine folks repeatedly and publicly undermine other makers with baseless criticism and innuendo. With one exception, of course.

[Jim Davis]

Am I safe in assuming you are all aware that until the 1970s or so, nearly all saw handles were designed for three fingers through the hole and the index along the off side?

Just checking...

[Ron Bontz]

Am I safe in assuming you are all aware that until the 1970s or so, nearly all saw handles were designed for three fingers through the hole and the index along the off side?

Just checking...
Hmmm. I saw a guy try 4 fingers in a dovetail saw once. That poor little saw didn't know what hit it. :):)
I have written about this before so I won't go into detail. But people today are taller, heavier, etc. on average than they were in the 18th century etc. Along with that, of course, is the increase in finger length, girth, etc. So naturally the average saw totes would seem smaller from days gone by. This is not to say there were not exceptions to the rule back then or now. As we grow older our hands and fingers tend to increase in thickness as well along with our waist line. :( . I was once considered average height at 5'9". Now that is considered short. So I make at least 7 different size handles. I am guessing Issac, and Mark do as well. This is something a production maker of anything would have a difficult time doing while maintaining the proper percentages of the various sizes of handles, saws etc. So they go with the most average size. So how many custom size chisel handles do we see out there. Hmmmmm. Zero. :) It never hurts to ask a tool maker if they can make a custom template for you. CAD can be a wonderful thing. Try Mark or Issac if you like their saws. You never know until you ask. I have altered mine a time or two for someone. It's just a courtesy. Not every thing can be about money. :)
Well there goes my monthly quota for rambling too much. I'll shut up now and go away. Best wishes.

[Stewie Simpson]

Amongst people who are knowledgable, people whose opinions I respect, I have never heard Veritas tools described as "cheap and nasty." Rather, I have typically heard them described as high-quality, affordable options.

Speaking of other things I haven't seen before...I'm familiar with most of the boutique toolmakers, and know a number of them personally. But I've never seen any of these fine folks repeatedly and publicly undermine other makers with baseless criticism and innuendo. With one exception, of course.

Oh my ! :eek:

[Andrew Pitonyak]

My Lie Nielsen saw had a handle that bit into my hand so they put on a larger handle. The result is a bit large for my hand, but, it does not bite into my hand.

[Stewie Simpson]

Hi Andrew. I am not trying to sell you one of my backsaws, but am interested to know your hand size.

Stewie;

[Paul Sidener]

Have you thought about buying a kit from Gramercy, and making your own handle?