Willow Curve and Urology Stent

[David Ragan]

Hi Guys,

I finally broke down and ordered the Willow Curve for my knee pain-osteoarthritis. It will arrive in a few days. Has anyone tried this?

And, can anyone tell me what to expect from a ureteral stent for kidney stone lithotripsy and having a dang stent clear the stone fragments? I'll have to carry the stent around for a couple of weeks, until it is removed. What fun.

Anyone have experience with these miracles of Modern Science?

"How does that make you FEEL, David?"..........."Hopeful:), and scared:eek:"

[Kent A Bathurst]

Not fluent in Klingon - - sorry, cannot understand the question.

[Judson Green]

The stent wasn't a problem for me but the string (one end tied to the stent the other taped to my thigh, by which to retrieve the stent when its time was up) hanging out of my wee-wee was NOT fun at all. There's rope burns and then there's ____rope burns____.

The doctor said removing the stent was a DIY project. So a week or so later I tugged on that string, very not cool, painful and weird and at some point I peed. The stent must have been opening a valve at some point in the removal process. Not fun but neither are kidney stones.

[mike holden]

Maybe things have changed in the last ten years, but the stent was inserted under anesthesia. I did not have a string attached. The stent did not bother me much, but I had to pee OFTEN. Walked from my office to the men's room, from there to my car where I kept a urinal, drove to wherever and relieved the pressure again. etc. Otherwise no problems through six rounds of lithotripsy.
Judson's talk of self-removal made me cross my legs. I had the choice of having it removed in the doctor's office, or going back to the hospital and having it removed under anesthesia. I chose the Dr.'s office - MAJOR MISTAKE!! The pain was excruciating! the only pain I have ever felt greater than the kidney stones.
Your mileage may vary, today's technology may be better, but IF they offer you the choice of anesthesia for removal of the stent - TAKE IT!
Mike
I feel your pain, really I do, I dont like it

Most surprising thing in retrospect was the size of the stent tubing, about the size of 14gage wire insulation (without the wire of course)

[David Ragan]

Not fluent in Klingon - - sorry, cannot understand the question.

Dang, Kent......can I not editorialize at all?


Mike and Judson-

Thats what I thought. I'm telling him that (1) no string, and (2) stent has to be removed with conscious (IV) sedation. or general anesthesia.

Anyone have experience with the 'Willow Curve'?

[Bill Orbine]

Willow Curve is too new.... but there was one comment somewhere I can't recall that the Willow Curve "uses a special power called placebo".

I'm not convince, yet and I'm highly skeptical Almost seems as you could use a heating pad, maybe. I'm sure the trekkies will love it.

[David Ragan]

Please let me say, my previous comment about Spock notwithstanding, I was never really a Star-Trek fan.

(This is my thread, so it's OK to go on a tangent, right?)

If I were a fan of Sci-Fi, it would be Kubrick's Classic. Nothing like it. Talk about a seminal work of fimmaking, taking science way beyond current understanding, and futuristic design? 2001 was it.

Star-Trek was "OK", that was it. I have enough juvenile tendencies without a fascination w a 1960s Sc-Fi show. (no offense to Trekkies out there:D)

It looks like physics may ultimately validate some of the ideas and concepts of Star Trek, but that is a whole nother meeting.

Thank you for your attention to this important Public Service Announcement.

[Art Mann]

I had to have a stent left in place for several days on two different occasions after I had kidney stones mechanically removed under full anesthesia. I found the experience miserable both times. I could not find a position either vertical, sitting or lying down that I could maintain for any amount of time without some serious irritation. The experience might be better with your procedure. I doubt very much whether the physician will consent to removing the stent under general anesthesia. About the most you could expect is a big dose of Valium or something like that. It is typically an office procedure and takes only a second (think needle nosed pliers). Afterwards, the pain is all gone. I hope the lithotripsy works. The alternative is considerably more difficult to endure.

[Bert Kemp]

I hope you post back here about the Willow Curve, I have pretty bad knee pain also. I see theres a 90 day money back guaranty lets hope it works.

[David Ragan]

I feel better. He said that I could have no string, and a general to get it out.

Willow should come any day. I am skeptical. Did I say I'm skeptical? But, if it worked, even to get the pain down by 50% where I didn't have to wear these Thermacare things every single day, and I felt like standing on that slab floor in the shop--That would be GREAT.

No joke-one of the main reasons why I have struggled with being in the shop that last few months is the dang knee.

Of course, I'll post how that goes. And i truly hope the placebo effect is in full force. Also the Hawthorn effect.

[David Ragan]

We got it yesterday.

It's some kind of deep heat alien technology.

There is published data in mainstream Orthopedic and Rehab Medicine journals-have not read it.

I must say that it does help. Significantly. P<.05 (OK-that is the standard by which all science is judged, the odds that your outcome would be achieved by chance alone is <5%. I always thought that's kinda arbitrary-but nobody asked me.) Of course, one person is simply a 'case report', or anecdotal. Interesting, but doesn't matter. UNLESS-you are that case report, then it matter a lot, right?

So, it helps. Only one day and I sat with it for like 3 hours last night and today.

We shall see how well it works over next week, and if it turns out to be a $500 heating pad.

[ken masoumi]

The ad says it works to relieve shoulder pain as well as knee/wrist etc. I do get shoulder pain often, (old work related injury), I wonder if it would help.

[David Ragan]

Hey Ken,

Here it is. How's that for a picture? Will easily go on a shoulder.

The red lights oscillate, and may just be a gimmick.

It reads 110* and 23 minutes left on the cycle. I was on my feet, and squatting a lot today for that shavehorse, I walked over and took this picture, and didn't think about the knee. Good.

317662

[ken masoumi]

Thanks for the pix,I hope it'll work as advertised.please let us know if you still like it after a while.

[Phil Thien]

If the Willow Curve doesn't work out, I suggest trying this "Bio Hating System" which apparently works by vaporizing your knee, making it completely irrelevant:

http://www.amazon.com/Joinmax-Infrared-Thermal-Therapy-English/dp/B00YOI2XQI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1437312612&sr=8-1&keywords=knee+hating+pad

[Phil Thien]

On a more serious note, one of the doctors at the Medical College of Wisconsin works with NASA and the U.S. Navy to develop light-based treatments intended to speed healing of wounds (and not just surface wounds). It all seems like garbage to me but it works, they know it works, they're using this thing called the scientific method which clearly is more dependable than my gut-check.

And I know the guy and he is very bright (a neurologist), and isn't a quack at all (although I don't think they have any quacks at MCW).

So I'll be interested in hearing more feedback from you on the Willow Curve.

[David Ragan]

If the Willow Curve doesn't work out, I suggest trying this "Bio Hating System" which apparently works by vaporizing your knee, making it completely irrelevant:

http://www.amazon.com/Joinmax-Infrared-Thermal-Therapy-English/dp/B00YOI2XQI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1437312612&sr=8-1&keywords=knee+hating+pad

I went there. No ratings. Everybodys gotta start somewhere, I suppose. Read the description. When the grammar is off. I dunno, it doesn't inspire confidence.




On a more serious note, one of the doctors at the Medical College of Wisconsin works with NASA and the U.S. Navy to develop light-based treatments intended to speed healing of wounds (and not just surface wounds). It all seems like garbage to me but it works, they know it works, they're using this thing called the scientific method which clearly is more dependable than my gut-check.

And I know the guy and he is very bright (a neurologist), and isn't a quack at all (although I don't think they have any quacks at MCW).

So I'll be interested in hearing more feedback from you on the Willow Curve.

I'm waiting to see how it does during the week.

the goal here is so I don't have to wear these Thermacare wraps @ $3 each.

Scientific method? Oh, also maybe that Quality thing that Edward Deming brought to Japan after WWII (My thread, my tangent?).....my mind went there last week when I met two older guys who both had full careers in Detroit, and both volunteered how sad it is that Detroit was now less than vibrant and beautiful. I know this is a rather vague connection. My point is that we do things because they work, right? (do what theyre supposed to, folks get well, a saw cuts wood, a garment holds up, a Ford Pinto can be rear-ended without bursting into flames, etc). My Ford Ranger will is 20 yrs old this summer :D

Scientific Method, P<.05......and..........you make a product, does it actually work? Do the paint stay on? etc, etc. I have met oodles of engineers who work for American Corporations who came to them and said John Doe engineer, we need you to shave 7 cents off the cost of every ____ that we make. One of them told me it keeps him up @ night worrying about it.

Anyway, MCW is a great place. I got a MPH from there in the 90s, worked my tail off. I learned a lot, also.

I didn't learn enough to keep my mouth shut yet, though.

[David Ragan]

The Willow Curve is indeed, IMO, a deep heating device. It does a great job for that. But, now I realize that i'm going to have to do the rehab exercises to get rid of this pain.

And, got back to the house couple of hours ago from the kidney stone buster and ureter stent placement @ hospital. Have significant pain and spasm. But, have lots of pain meds, so-I'm good for the time being. Bring on the water, recliner, and streaming video.

I thought I'd be able to take my bad knee down into the shop this weekend. LOL.

While I'm under the influence of all this medicine, and feeling sentimental-I would like to express my genuine appreciation for all the folks who have talked with me over the past many months, humored me, and given of themselves. Of course, this includes administration and moderators who keep it all on track.

The vast majority of you all are exceptional kind, giving folks. thanks:)!