Drilling holes in 3-1/2" beams....looking for suggestions

[scott vroom]

I'm running some PEX and need to drill 16 holes through 3-1/2" doug fir beams (8 holes @ 7/8", 8 holes @ 5/8").

I'm looking for suggestions on bits to do this fairly quickly. I'm thinking auger buts would be best, but I no longer own a slow speed drill.....the closest I have now is a 0-2500 RPM variable speed 1/2" corded drill with the handle attachment. And the 0-2,500 rating is BS because it doesn't start up at anywhere close to zero....I'd guess actual start speed is closer to 1K RPM's. How do they get away with those ratings?

I'm guess I'm going to need a 500 or 600 max RPM drill for the job. My son has a low RPM, high torque Milwaukee that we used to mix thinset in 5 gal buckets....but he moved out of state. IIRC it was max 600 RPM's.

Spade bits with extensions would do the job, but that's a lotta of work and would take considerable time.

Thanks

[Tom Ewell]

The Bosch DareDevil spades bits are pretty aggressive and fast, quite often use my cordless Festool C12 to bore out 2x4s.
Pickup one of the sizes you need and see how they work for your situation.

[scott vroom]

The Bosch DareDevil spades bits are pretty aggressive and fast, quite often use my cordless Festool C12 to bore out 2x4s.
Pickup one of the sizes you need and see how they work for your situation.

Hi Tom,

What's the useful life of the Bosch spade bit drilling through 1-1/2" stock? I've drilled countless holes in studs using Irwin bits and while they're cheap they dull fairly quickly if overheated which is frequent with aggressive drilling. I'll take a look at the Bosh bit.

thx

[Peter Quinn]

I'd be looking for a 6-8" ships auger and pushing it with either a cordless impact or an 18V drill. They make augers now with the quick connect hex drive, an impact actually pushes them pretty well. Obviously an electric drill with 1/2" chuck and 700 rpm's is probably a better choice, but a few fresh batteries will get it done. I wired my BIL's kitchen last year, brought the big slow drill for mixing thinset and drilling the holes through the plates, wound up drilling all the holes with my 14v impact! It fits in between joists better at 16" oc with a short auger, the electric drill takes a lot of angle and a longer auger.

[John TenEyck]

I've drilled dozens of holes for running hose and Romex through 2 x's and 4 x's with cheap Irwin spade bits with both corded and cordless drill motors. When they dull they are easy to resharpen on a bench grinder or even by hand with a file.

John

[Kent A Bathurst]

Get the auger bits, plus go to the BORG and rent the right tool - a honking corded drill designed for this task.

It will have the speed you need, the muscle to handle the auger bits, and the proper handles to keep your fingers from getting crushed by a runaway spin.

Along these lines - 350 RPM ......... http://www.milwaukeetool.com/power-tools/corded/1854-1

With the right tool you will be done accurately and safely in under an hour.

PS - do you need the 5/8" holes? Couldn't you just use the one 7/8" bit for all of them?

[scott vroom]

I'd be looking for a 6-8" ships auger and pushing it with either a cordless impact or an 18V drill. They make augers now with the quick connect hex drive, an impact actually pushes them pretty well. Obviously an electric drill with 1/2" chuck and 700 rpm's is probably a better choice, but a few fresh batteries will get it done. I wired my BIL's kitchen last year, brought the big slow drill for mixing thinset and drilling the holes through the plates, wound up drilling all the holes with my 14v impact! It fits in between joists better at 16" oc with a short auger, the electric drill takes a lot of angle and a longer auger.

Were those dbl plates? How much time per hole with that impact?

[John TenEyck]

Good grief, he needs to drill 16 holes. The cheapest of spade bits and nearly any 18V drill will do that.

John

[Phil Thien]

Good grief, he needs to drill 16 holes. The cheapest of spade bits and nearly any 18V drill will do that.

John

I'd do the self-feeding auger in the impact wrench. ESPECIALLY if I'm working overhead. No way would I push a paddler through 3-1/2" fir overhead.

http://www.amazon.com/IRWIN-Tools-Speedbor-6-Piece-3041006/dp/B000LQ905E/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1437009193&sr=8-3&keywords=auger+bits&pebp=1437009249661&perid=0786BKQX22C89C1GXJMT

[Jerry Bruette]

When I wired my cabin I used the Bosch Daredevil spade bits with my Makita 18V impact driver, extremely fast and easy if doing overhead. IIRC I bought the stubby version and they were long enough for the double plates. Just stay away from the nails,and use hearing protection.

[Jim Dwight]

I used an Irwin speedbor max bit from Lowe's when I was wiring my garage. It was 1 inch in diameter. Due to hitting nails I had to get another when it got dull. I powered it by my Ryobi 18V drill in slow speed. It pulls itself aggressively through wood. I went through 5 or 6 2x4s (can't remember which) in a couple spots. I had to use an extension on the bit for that. The 5/8 should be easy for a decent cordless. The 7/8 would be easier than what I did. I think the bits were less than $10 each. You have to hang onto the drill when using these bits. There is a lot of torque. But you don't have to lean on the bit at all. Just hang onto the drill.

Later I drilled a lot of holes in doubled up 2x4s to put in 1 inch conduit for lumber support. I was going about 4 inches into the wood through the 7/16 waferboard on the wall. I used a couple spade bits for that. It was harder to drill straight holes but I couldn't find an auger bit the right size for the conduit. That was more work but went fine.

So my experience is either will work but I will use the auger type bits when possible.

[Robert Engel]

Scott,

I agree spade bits are a no go. They can be wrist breakers because they need high rpm's to work no good for working overhead.

I vote for a self feeding type auger bit (http://www.homedepot.com/p/Milwaukee-5-8-in-x-6-1-2-in-Spur-Auger-Bit-48-13-0725/203115333)your 1/2" drill should be able to handle it.

I agree with the poster: Rent a right angle hole hawg drill while your at the BORG it will make mince meat of the job!

http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/productImages/145/ec/ecaa85ab-3c27-4edc-a902-972499dbb801_145.jpg

[Marion Smith]

For this type of work I use my corded Dbl Gear Reduction 0-600rpm 1/2" Drill.
Do not use trigger lock.

[Tom Ewell]

Hi Tom,

What's the useful life of the Bosch spade bit drilling through 1-1/2" stock? I've drilled countless holes in studs using Irwin bits and while they're cheap they dull fairly quickly if overheated which is frequent with aggressive drilling. I'll take a look at the Bosh bit.

thx

Didn't count how many bores, just did the work, but I'd say more than the equivalent of what you're contemplating. I usually go with 3/4" size for wiring and the bit is still in the kit.

The Bosch bits have a screw pilot that pulls the bit through but you do have to make the final push once the pilot breaks through.

I've got plenty of long augers and a big drill or two but I don't take them out unless I'm doing a bunch of circuits. Not sure about your 4x stuff but the chips clear out real well on 2x4 (hem fir around here) and a long auger likes to keep on goin' once it breaks through, these little guys just rattle around once you punch through.

I've got an Irwin speed bore set too, the Bosch are at least as good if not better IMHO..... yeah it surprised me.

Needless to say, striking fasteners tend to take the edge off of them.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Good grief, he needs to drill 16 holes. The cheapest of spade bits and nearly any 18V drill will do that.

John

Well, yeah, I guess that pragmatism could play a role in the decision................:o

[scott vroom]

Well, yeah, I guess that pragmatism could play a role in the decision................:o

I'm sensing an opportunity to buy a new tool here, pragmatism be damned!

My son and I are building a house next year and I've been itching to buy a right angle drill, so even though I don't need it for this job maybe now's a good time to pick one up (for that matter when is it ever a bad time to pick up a new tool?). My son says most of the electricians and plumbers in his area use Milwaukee. But which model? I lean toward cordless....lower initial investment and lower long term operating cost.

[paul cottingham]

I have a Milwaukee corded d-handle that will drill through anything, and even though it is the oldest tool I own, (owned it since 1997 or so) it still works great. The really nice thing about this particular tool is that the brushes are replaceable as is (I believe) the trigger. So it will theoretically last forever.

This drill will put a 1 1/2" augur through a telephone pole faster than snot. DAMHIKT

i can't imagine the right angle drill will be any different, in fact, I think you can retrofit it onto the regular d-handle drill.
As an aside, I don't know if it's true or not, but I heard that the Milwaukee drills they sell at the BORG aren't the same (nor as durable) as the ones you pay slightly more for at, say, an electrical wholesaler. Something to think about.

[Gary Yoder]

I don't mean to be condescending but- 16 holes? It took more time to ask for advice than to drill the holes with ANY bit. I personally hate spade bits, I broke my hand two years ago with one.. Irwin speedbors and a cordless drill on low will work just fine. No need to buy two bits, just grab a 7/8" and go for it.

[Clint Baxter]

I'm sensing an opportunity to buy a new tool here, pragmatism be damned!

My son and I are building a house next year and I've been itching to buy a right angle drill, so even though I don't need it for this job maybe now's a good time to pick one up (for that matter when is it ever a bad time to pick up a new tool?). My son says most of the electricians and plumbers in his area use Milwaukee. But which model? I lean toward cordless....lower initial investment and lower long term operating cost.

A cordless right angle drill has considerably less power than it's straight relatives. Unless you plan on getting the cordless Hole Hawg, I'd stay away from cordless for your application. For right angle drilling, either model Hole Hawg or Milwaukee's right angle drill is more than sufficient to run ship auger bits all day long. And in much larger sizes than what you're talking about. The cordless Hole Hawg doesn't have the power of it's corded relatives, but will run ship auger bits that size easily. It will also run hole saws up to around 4", and self feed bits to about 2-1/8 adequately. Milwaukee is coming out with a new cordless Hole Hawg later this year with considerably more power to satisfy the needs of plumbers, (their current offering was designed for electricians.) I'm looking forward to putting one of them to work.

I have and use all those drills I mentioned here and would recommend any other than the cordless right angle.

Good luck with whatever route you take. (And enjoy your new tool.)

Clint

[ian maybury]

There's lots of other options, but another here to say the Irwin Speedbore (they have a different name here, but look to be the same blue 3 flute items with a hex shank) as linked earlier by Phil work well for punching holes in joists and the like. I've used them for a similar job. (running cables through joists) Despite their having been pushed for a short while in some of the UK mags they are not the sort of thing you would use in a drill press (not safe/controllable with that much self feed), or for controlled boring using a hand drill in cabinet work.

Best to check the lengths before buying, they could be a bit short to handle 3 1/2in beams.

The main issues to watch out for are the tendency to self feed pretty aggressively - a high torque/low speed power drill actually is advisable - although in safe and suitable circumstances a high speed mains drill will blast through. (better watch out for kicks/torque reaction though - they can take a lot of holding - and the exit will be whatever happens) Also that because of the aggressive cut they will stall a stock 18v (Bosch) cordless drill/driver unless the wood is soft and knot free in even the mid sizes (your fir is likely petty tough in comparison), and if the speed isn't reliably low they don't allow much control. The type of wood makes a big difference - i recently had to use a mains drill to get a 1in dia example through an iroko door frame.

The drills/augers(?) are short, presumably to fit between tightly spaced joists. The strong self feed is useful at times - for example if using a right angle drive to drill between closely spaced joists where you can't apply pressure. Suspect construction is the sort of work they are primarily meant for....

[Harold Burrell]

They make a cordless drill for this you know... ;)

[ian maybury]

:) Went through my mind too Harold. Not the greatest between tightly spaced joists while wobbling on the top step of a step ladder though...

[mreza Salav]

That's not a lot of holes, don't make the matter too complicated. A spade bit will do the job no problem. Just back up as you go frequently to clear the chips.
If you want to buy/rent a tool that's your call.

[Peter Quinn]

Were those dbl plates? How much time per hole with that impact?

There were bottom plates at an angle through mud sill and a bunch of joists some of which were doubled. I didn't time it so much but it went fast enough to be productive and not send me to the van for the bigger drill. I had a longer auger for the mud sill/ bottom plate holes, it was called a "nail biter", but I hit a big old framing nail, and it bit it.

I've had pretty good success using a regular spade bit with the impact, it goes much quicker and easier than with the regular drill. Never occurred to me to try until I watched the electrician who wired my garage panel rip about 20 holes in 2x6 to chase the lights in just a few minutes with his.

[Tom Ewell]

Can also go this route if you want to stand on the floor and guide the bit through top plates, joists etc. They can be a little awkward to handle at times but they have their uses.
http://www.mytoolstore.com/ideal/ide14-10.html

[Jeff Ramsey]

What's wrong with the old fashion way and a bit brace? When I drilled 3/4" dog holes in a 4" maple workbench, I used a bit brace. With sharp auger bits, it cuts cleanly with relative ease and no chip-out (although you might not be concerned with chip-out running pex). It's also easier on a drill; don't underestimate the strain that deep a hole puts on an electric/battery drill (and the heat build-up on the cutting surface of a bit). There's a reason why Amish, when erecting barns in PA, still use a bit brace to pin tenons in framing (and it isn't because they don't have electricity or cordless drills).

[Ole Anderson]

Ships auger are good but I just used a paddle bit with a self feed lead screw and it worked great. Don't remember the brand. Compatible with your drill. I don't recommend using an impact driver for drilling 3.5" beams with any kind of bit.

[Pat Barry]

Good grief, he needs to drill 16 holes. The cheapest of spade bits and nearly any 18V drill will do that.

John


I agree - my Makita 18V and some Irwin spade bits would do the job easy. So what if you go through maybe at most 2 spade bits. KISS

[John Lanciani]

I agree - my Makita 18V and some Irwin spade bits would do the job easy. So what if you go through maybe at most 2 spade bits. KISS

+1. I use my 18v DeWalt right angle drill all the time for this exact task. Spade bits are dirt cheap and tools are meant to be used. I might be a slow reader but I guarantee that I could drill the 16 holes in question faster than I could re-read this entire thread.


One other note, if it were me I'd drill the holes larger that you said and use the appropriate pex bushings to prevent chafing down the road as the pex expands and contracts.

ETA; a standard 6" spade bit is plenty long do drill through a 3.5" beam, no need for an extension.

[scott vroom]

What's wrong with the old fashion way and a bit brace?

Thanks to all for the suggestions. I should have provided more job info. The beams I'm drilling are exterior cantilevered roof beams in a mid-century post and beam style home built by Eichler. Attached is a picture (not of my house but similar) that shows the cantilevered beams extending beyond the wall on the left side.

I'm retrofitting my home with a hydronic radiant heating system that I designed, with Runtal panel radiators in each room. For those familiar with hydronic heating, I'm installing a single zone parallel reverse return system in a loop around the house perimeter to which the various emitters will be connected.

Because this style home was build on a slab and has no attic space (T&G roof decking nailed to the tops of the beams and beam trusses), there are only 2 practical methods of delivering piped water:

1) Run piping over the roof top. This would require drilling holes through the double plate to get the emitter supply and return tubing into the walls, or

2) Run the piping along the exterior wall, at the top right beneath the roof decking. This would require drilling holes through the 3.5" beams mentioned in the OP. Holes would also be drilled into the exterior wall to run tubing for the emitters. The exterior tubing would be protected by a simple insulated soffit cover.

Option 1 would require expensive copper tubbing since UV breaks down exposed PEX. It would also require the installation and sealing of roof jacks on the tar and gravel roof where the emitter tubing enters each of the 7 rooms.

Option 2 would allow the use of less expensive PEX, and would avoid having to patch in roof jacks. I've chosen this option.

So now you know the rest of the story. My plan is to drill the beam holes as close as possible to the exterior siding to minimize the protrusion of the insulated soffit that will cover the tubing. A bit brace isn't a bad idea, but it would not work in my application as it would force the hole to far out from the wall.

Thanks again to all....I've picked up some good options I hadn't considered.

[Erik Christensen]

I would rent a commercial right angle drill & use a plumber's auger bit. You are going to be on a ladder drilling overhead to do that job. One thing about the commercial right angle drill I have is - when you put it in slow speed you engage the clutch - you hit a nail and it won't break your arm and toss you off the ladder. Worth the rental fee on safety alone - the fact that you do a better job in a fraction of the time is just a bonus.

[Jerome Stanek]

Scott,

I agree spade bits are a no go. They can be wrist breakers because they need high rpm's to work no good for working overhead.

I vote for a self feeding type auger bit (http://www.homedepot.com/p/Milwaukee-5-8-in-x-6-1-2-in-Spur-Auger-Bit-48-13-0725/203115333)your 1/2" drill should be able to handle it.

I agree with the poster: Rent a right angle hole hawg drill while your at the BORG it will make mince meat of the job!

http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/productImages/145/ec/ecaa85ab-3c27-4edc-a902-972499dbb801_145.jpg

Just make sure you hold on good and tight one of our electricians was drilling holes for romex and the bit grabbed and broke his arm.

[scott vroom]

Just make sure you hold on good and tight one of our electricians was drilling holes for romex and the bit grabbed and broke his arm.

Just curious, what tool was he using, what type bit, and at what RPM was he drilling?

[ian maybury]

It's one to watch out for i think with any fast cutting drill approaching 1in and up. I've sprained a wrist quite badly using just a standard mains powered drill in this situation. The problems arise if it grips and kicks when you are not braced to hold it - next moment and your wrist is bent to some odd angle it's not meant for.

The other basic is that if a drill uses simple gearing to drop the speed right down then the torque will increase in proportion to the reduction in RPM. Meaning that a simple geared low RPM power drill would potentially have far more torque than we are strong enough to hold - even if we are ready for it. I'm not familiar with what's out there in the specialised trade space, but i'd imagine that it's an issue that makers of professional drills intended for low RPM use must consider - and add slipping clutches, or use electrical speed reduction methods that deliver reduced torque at low RPM settings.

They probably won't mention it, but there's likely a maximum torque number that's deemed safe in a hand held power drill. Maybe even a UL or similar standard. Which may be higher in the case of a definitely professional and appropriately equipped drill....

[Jerome Stanek]

I don't know the exact model but it was a D handle Dewalt. My partner broke his finger using my PC 1/2 inch hammer drill using a 3/4 paddle bit in a cabinet when it grabbed and knocked his hand into the side.