Advice on Faking Front Vise on Cheesy Bench

[Steve H Graham]

I moved my mechanic's vise off the left front corner of my bench, so now I want to add a vise that holds wood. I looked at products such as the Eclipse and Jorgensen vises, and it looks like they would be a bit difficult to install. My bench was not originally intended to be a woodworking bench, so it has a 1 1/2"-thick pine top supported by vertical two-by-sixes recessed under it. The distance from the bottom of the two-by-sixes to the top of the bench is 7", and the top projects out about 2 1/2" over the two-by-sixes.

To use one of these vises, I think I would have to cut through at least two two-by-sixes that hold up the top, and I would also have to build up the skirt area with new wood to make it flush with the side of the table.

Last night I was watching Youtube, the source of all knowledge, and I saw people talking about Moxon vises. I don't really know what that is, but the basic idea seemed to be that you put two acme screws or threaded rods through your bench, run them out through something resembling a section of two-by-six, and add two handwheels on the outside to push the wood against the bench.

I am not all that excited about investing time and effort in a bench I will probably swap out in a year or less. It occurred to me that I could save myself money and aggravation by making something similar to a Moxon vise.

Here's the thing I don't understand (or at least one of them): why do these vises have stationary screws and handwheels that move? That seems like a bad idea. The screws are always hanging out in your way. Wouldn't it make more sense to make the screws turn so they recede into the bench as you tighten the vise?

I was thinking about running to Home Depot, the source of all high-end woodworking equipment, and picking up a couple of 5/8" stainless threaded rods with some matching nuts. I could mount two nuts under the table for the screws to run through, and I could weld some type of handles on the outboard ends so I could turn the screws. The cost would be something like $20.

Am I begging for a disaster, or is this a genius idea that will save me money and aggravation?

[Ted Reischl]

About the screws sticking out all the time: Mostly those vises are used to hold wood on edge so they do not have a lot of thread sticking out. Also notice that most of them are units that can be removed from the bench with a couple of clamps.

The reason they do not turn the screw in and out is that it would require a garter to get the jaw to follow the screw when it is loosened. I have never seen a regular vise that did not use a garter of some sort.

Now, if it were me, I would just forget about adding the vise to your existing bench and get on with building your new one.

Frankly, most of us overdo it when building benches. I will agree that classic woodworking benches with big stout maple legs and a 4 inch thick top have a ton of "cool" factor. I am sort of halfway with mine. It has the maple top and the great wooden vises that I built about 20 years ago. But I used this very hard pine I scavenged that is 5X5 and was used to transport heavy machinery from Japan. I did not do the whole trestle thing because I hate chips and dust collecting under my bench. Instead I made these huge bridle joints with a large lag screw through them. My brother used to refer to my bench as the size of an "aircraft carrier". I put a tool trough on it with plates to cover it up. Handy for things I rarely use.

If I had to build another bench today I would use mostly pine (SYP for weight) and skin the top and bottom with about .5 maple. The maple so that the bench dogs do not wallow out the holes over time. I would most definitely put wooden vises on it again with wooden screws. A lot of guys think that steel acme screws are wonderful. The problem with steel screws and nuts is that they do not have much "gription". A wooden screw vise will hold an object without having to apply a ton of torque to keep the screw from loosening. They are also nice when you slip with a sharp cutting tool.

I have been around woodworking long enough to have learned that the "experts" who write books, articles, etc are in the business of making a living writing. All this stuff about a bench should be X by Y by Z because blah, blah, blah is just that, blah, blah, blah. You make your bench the height you are comfortable with. You make the top the size you need for the work you do. Mine is 79 X 39 X 38 tall. That 39 inches allows me to toss large cabinets up there without them hanging off the edges.

My other big piece of advice is to locate your bench so you can walk all the way around it. Against a wall is not as convenient. Though I had a shop where I had to do that. Grrrrr.

Well, enough of my 2.5 cents. Keep us posted on your bench!

[Steve H Graham]

Thanks for the help. It would be nice to have a bench designed with woodworking in mind, but I think for now I'll try to make this one function. I figure it will be easier to make a new bench if I already have a bench.

[Ted Reischl]

You are right about it being easier to make a bench if you already have one.

[Steve H Graham]

I decided to see if I could make this work. I hacked out a recess in the bench. Learned a couple of things about what not to do while routing with a flush bit.

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[Steve H Graham]

I don't know if this project will work, but I'm pretty happy so far. I got rid of two crappy two-by-sixes that were cluttering my back yard, and I turned them into something that looks pretty cool, whether or not it works. I also learned how to sharpen a card scraper, make a carbide burnishing jig, and use the scraper and some hand planes to make the bench square enough to hold this thing.

If it works I may get really cocky and try to make a half-nut gadget for a quick-release feature.

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[glenn bradley]

I'm late but, I was just going to suggest a Wonder Pup and some dog holes.

http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=31129&cat=1,41637

[Steve H Graham]

Clearly I need those, too.

I have gone around and around trying to figure out what to do about screws. I picked up some 3/4" rod with 60-degree threads, but I am advised that it's a bad idea, because it won't work well with quick-release half-nuts, and the relatively fine pitch will take forever to open and close. I gave up and ordered some acme threaded rod and a couple of nuts. I am thinking the coarser thread may make a quick-release mechanism unnecessary. I guess I'll find out.

Here's my next design question: should I cut a shallow recess across the jaws, about 2" from the top? I am thinking it's probably not possible to distribute pressure really well over a jaw that's over 5" high, so maybe I should alter the jaws so the pressure is concentrated in the top 2". I figured maybe it would be smart to take a few thousandths off. But maybe wood is flexible enough to make that unnecessary. Danged if I know.

[Allan Speers]

Clearly I need those, too.

I have gone around and around trying to figure out what to do about screws. I picked up some 3/4" rod with 60-degree threads, but I am advised that it's a bad idea, because it won't work well with quick-release half-nuts, and the relatively fine pitch will take forever to open and close. I gave up and ordered some acme threaded rod and a couple of nuts.......


I think by now you could have built an entire new Roubo bench. :)

[Steve H Graham]

I feel like I'm getting a lot of mistakes out of my system on this bench before working on a new one.

[Robert Engel]

I didn't like the idea of the screws sticking out either, so I built a Moxon with screws that are not stationary by double nutting the handwheel and a captured nut behind the inner chop. I made mine a benchtop unit, but it could easily be built into an existing bench. Covered the captured nut and added a guide block with at bushing.
I got all the hardware from Enco I believe I don't have over $40 in it.

Works great. Just have to figure out how to add something to keep it from racking so I can used the dog holes to surface clamp.
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[Steve H Graham]

I like the bushings. I should check out those handwheels. Enco had a 20% off deal last night, but I guess I blew that.