Why so many Radial Arm Saws for Sale?

[julian abram]

I've noticed for several months in the local papers, CL and other classified ads there are always 2 or 3 RAS for sale. Ratio wise seems like there are always more RAS for sale than other large shop power tools. Some of these are very reasonably priced. I've considered purchasing one at a bargain price but can't figure out what I could use it for except cross cutting materials. Any thoughts on Radial Arm Saws uses that justifies the space they would occupy in a home shop?

[Shawn Pachlhofer]

IMO - you answered your own question.

[Mel Miller]

Radial arm saws are on CL all the time, and can be as cheap as free. I got rid of mine years ago when the yellow Dewalt 12" mitre saws came out and never looked back.

[Jesse Bushman]

I've got one of the old 14" DeWalts. Took a while to get it back into shape after I bought it. Paid $300 for the saw, $200 for a VFD to run that 3 phase 5 hp motor, got a Forrest chop master blade, new bearings and a new table so have about a thousand sunk into it. It's silky smooth and extremely powerful. It's also very messy. I'll keep it just because hey, someday I might want to crosscut 5" timbers. But for most stuff that it does I'd rather use my Festool MFT and track saw. Cleaner and safer and every bit as accurate.

Gotta admit the old monster does have a certain beauty though.

[ian maybury]

I accidentally came into one of the well known small current model yellow ones as a part of a machine deal. Have to say that despite a lot of attempts (at intervals over ten years) i could never get much good of what despite being presented as a 'professional' tool felt like a bit of a toy. Underpowered, lacking in rigidity, hard to keep in adjustment, very sensitive to how the work was presented. Through cuts require cutting up the table! It certainly taught me lots about cutting forces and blade alignment. Not sure if it would have worked better if better built and more powerful, it might just have got scary. Most of the UK suppliers seem to have stopped selling them - could be they are on the way out..

[Peter Quinn]

I deal with a lot of rough lumber, much of it 8/4, the occasional dado that must come from above on long parts better suited to the RAS, so I keep a 14" desalt RAS in the shop. It was given to me free, I have about $500 into making it functional, it's a beast. Miter saws are great for thin flat stock and trim cuts. They don't handle rough lumber especially well, they don't handle dados at all, and 8/4 white oak in 9" widths? But a skill saw will handle this just fine, and a worm drive skill saw will handle just about anything, and a freehand router jig could do the dados. So it depends on your space, your volume, what your needs are. At work I consider the RAS essential to the custom woodworking process as rough lumber cross cut is the first process in most projects and we don't need 4-5 guys standing around waiting for some slower method. But in a home shop space might be more valuable than speed, or if you use mostly prepared 4/4-5/4 stock, a miter saw might get the job done adequately. It's about matching the method to the situation.

[Larry Edgerton]

Most of the ones you see for sale are junk. They were junk when they were new, so twenty years shoved in a corner didn't change that. That does not mean the concept is not valid.

Even when not junk, I do not think they are a tool everyone should own. They require knowledge and respect and if given that they can do the job they were designed for with no drama. But in the hands of the inept, they are dangerous. I suspect that is why the same ones keep being passed around.

I have had a 16" Delta Turret, and now have an OMGA. Both are good tools, but I have used some of the lower line models that you see for sale constantly and I find them scary. Just too loose for my liking.

[Jim Matthews]

How many crosscuts will a home user make in their lifetime?

There are better, safer methods to perform most of the other
cuts that an RAS can do.

Having a blade that turns to push the trunion toward the user?
That's just daft.

[Phillip Dejardin]

I've always wanted to pick up one off CL partly for nostalgic reasons. We had one in High School shop class back in the 70s, and I remember how much fun it was making cuts with that beast. Of course, as a teenager, operating dangerous tools was a kick...still is.

[Matt Day]

I guess we have another RAS rant thread.

To answer the OP's question, I'd guess that 95% of the saws for sale are Craftsmans which are not the best example of a good RAS.

The old Dewalt's and Deltas are much more desirable and better quality. I have a RAS instead of a CMS. The RAS can crosscut more, handle a dado blade, and takes up the same amount of room (assuming it's setup as a stationary tool).

To the OP, do some searching on here and try to learn a bit more about RAS's.

[Joe Calhoon]

RAS is probably not a good choice for the home shop. Like Peter, I like them for rough cutoff. We have had a few through our shop that never held accuracy till we picked up a Graule. It holds accuracy but the downside is you cannot put a dado or grooving blade in this saw. Graule makes a separate trenching saw for this purpose.
315776

The one thing a RAS will do better than most other saws is trenching on tapered sills. We keep our old Dewalt set up with a Systematic dado just for this purpose. It is tough to keep square and needs to be checked often. but good for trenching in the sill.
315777

End cuts can be done easily on the shaper but the mid ones a bear to do on a table or sliding table saw.
315778

Almost every door and window shop we visited in the UK had dedicated trenching saws set up with shaper type adjustable groovers for this purpose. This would be the best setup for doing a lot of this type work.

315779315780

[glenn bradley]

Those that love them wouldn't be without them. The rest of us question the value for the footprint required. The same can be said for CMS, SCMS, shaper or drum sanders for that matter. the real estate you are willing to commit to a tool varies with the value of that tool to your work. I have a CMS that gets used about once every 2 years. If I didn't have a shed to store it in, it would be gone. On the other hand I made great concessions to jam a drum sander into my little shop :).

[ian maybury]

Interesting that a saw design that started life being pitched as almost a single machine multi-use woodworking centre (so far as I know) has ended up getting most use as almost a dedicated single function machine.

As ever it sounds like proper engineering makes all the difference - that it's not a machine to cut corners on...

[Jim Dwight]

I have a 8 foot long cabinet with a 12 inch dual bevel CMS and an old Ryobi RAS on top. I use the CMS when cutting within it's 8 inch capacity and the RAS when the board is wider. The RAS is accurate if I remember to bias my pressure a little to the left when allowing it to pull through the stock. It needed a negative hook blade to stop trying to move quicker than it could through wood. The nice thing about the RAS is it can sit closer to the wall than any SCMS I've seen. It can sit as close as my 12 inch CMS (Hitachi) so the pairing works well.

In addition to crosscuts 8-12 inches I use it for roughing tenons on long boards (like cross pieces for headboards). Either multiple cuts or fewer cuts with a narrow dado setup (won't do 3/4, OK at 1/4 or a bit more) gives me something to trim to final size with the shoulder plane.

Some people managed to break the plastic housing for the Ryobi so there is a recall. Probably not something to look for used. If you find one that isn't cracked and put a 8 1/2 inch negative hook blade on it, it will work. Probably about the same quality as most Craftsman RAS.

They will do decent work but switching to make angle cuts is a PITA and ripping seems dangerous to me. Square cross cuts is their sweet spot and to do them you have to tune the saw and use it with the right technique.

[Jeff Ramsey]

How many crosscuts will a home user make in their lifetime?

There are better, safer methods to perform most of the other
cuts that an RAS can do.

Having a blade that turns to push the trunion toward the user?
That's just daft.

I make crosscuts with every project I start, and mostly use my very old Rockwell RAS that cuts dead square on both planes. It's safe, and the blade direction just requires the proper technique. Were I to replace it, I'd buy an OMGA. The only other option I'd consider is a cross-sled. A RAS can have its place in a shop providing it's good quality. I would say most of the RASs found on CL aren't very good quality.

[Rod Sheridan]

Nope, no justification in my shop for a RAS or a compound miter saw............Regards, Rod.

[Doug Ladendorf]

There was a time when radial arm saws were extremely popular for the home shop. As mentioned they were billed as a do it all machine. Craftsman sold a ton of them over the years along with various attachments. Now they have fallen out of favor and those shoved in corners are littering Craig's List. I have a 1969 Craftsman which I consider to be one of the good ones. Later saws they started adding more plastic, cutting corners, adding cheap electronics and moving production overseas. Many from the 60's and older are great workhorses than don't need as much alignment maintenance.

[Gary Muto]

Interesting that a saw design that started life being pitched as almost a single machine multi-use woodworking centre (so far as I know) has ended up getting most use as almost a dedicated single function machine.

As ever it sounds like proper engineering makes all the difference - that it's not a machine to cut corners on...

Jack of all trades, master of none?

[Bill Ryall]

I have had a RAS in my shop off and on. My current one is a very early 1960's 9" DeWalt I got for "get it the h*ll out of here and oh by the way I'll help you load it" Excellent mechanical condition, just needs a table. I'll keep this one. I have vowed to never be RAS-less again.
I, however, am not a typical homeowner shop either. I'm somewhere between hobbyist and full time furniture/cabinetry shop. I do a lot of smaller short production runs of various things, and I have found it a key part of an efficient operation.

[John TenEyck]

I've had an old Dewalt GW-I for over 25 years and would never think of parting with it. I use it both for rough cutting stock and final part dimensioning, as well as cutting tenons and dados on occasion. I have it installed in an 8' long bench with a stop block on the fence that makes cutting one or 100 parts to length a snap. A simple dust collection box at the back captures 99% of the sawdust. It is extremely accurate over it's 12 - 14" capacity and the way I have it set up fast, easy, and safe to use. For compound miter cuts my chop saw is easier to use. For all other cuts, the RAS is preferred, by far.

John

[Jim Matthews]

I would say most of the RASs found on CL aren't very good quality.

That's sort of the point. To get a good one, you must fork over more green than a more versatile, modern machine.
Since most home users are just rough cutting with these, and doing joinery on a TS or Router table
crosscutting can be done with a circular saw or jigsaw.

[Jeff Ramsey]

That's sort of the point. To get a good one, you must fork over more green than a more versatile, modern machine.
Since most home users are just rough cutting with these, and doing joinery on a TS or Router table
crosscutting can be done with a circular saw or jigsaw.

I recently completed a replica of a period piece that required me digging into my large-size mahogany stock; 12/4 12-16" thick, with some lengths of 10'. All preliminary and finish length cuts were made on my RAS (with the proper blade). I have a cross-cut sled for my Unisaw, but decided the longer cuts were more conveniently done on my RAS, and continued with final finish cuts as well on my RAS. I do many finish length cuts on my RAS. I think the $ needed for a good RAS today is still worth it. It augments my shop; it doesn't replace anything.

[Cary Falk]

Most of the Saws on CL arn't very good. I think Craftsman single handedly destroyed the market. I restored a GWI a few years ago. I love the look of it. I wouldn't put it in the Jack of all trades master of none category. It's a great tool for crosscutting. I would never touch all of the other functions it "can" do. All that being said, mine does not get used a lot. I have quite a few seldom used but when you need it you need it tools. It is on a rolling cabinet that has a lot of storage so that is probably why it stays in my garage. Did I mention I have a soft spot for how it looks?

[Steve Kinnaird]

Remember that many of the Craftsman RAS have a recall on them for the blade guard.
Emerson Tool Company was replacing them and the cut platform, but has change the remedy.
Here is what they are doing now:



Emerson Tool Co. (ETC) is providing $100 to owners of Craftsman® 8-inch, 8¼-inch, 9-inch, and 10-inch Radial Arm Saws. Sears sold the 8-inch, 9-inch, and 10-inch saws from 1958 through 1992. The 8¼-inch saws were sold from 1990 through 1995. 12 inch saws are not eligible for this recall.


These saws were sold without a guard that covers the entire blade. Some consumers have contacted the blade or have been hit by wood kicked back by the saws, resulting in amputations, fractures and lacerations.


The owner MUST return BOTH the Radial Arm Saw Carriage and Motor Assembly to Emerson to receive the $100 rebate. Emerson, provides the box and pays for shipping.

[Allan Speers]

IMO, the one thing a RAS does really well can be accomplished with a track system and a larger circular saw, for instance a Eurakazone system with the 10-1/4" Makita CS. (I here mention the EZ system only because it allows you to use any CS you want.)

This would allow to to cut 12/4 stock, with great safety, and then also be useful for all sorts of other tasks as well.

[Garth Almgren]

Remember that many of the Craftsman RAS have a recall on them for the blade guard.
Emerson Tool Company was replacing them and the cut platform, but has change the remedy.
Here is what they are doing now:



Emerson Tool Co. (ETC) is providing $100 to owners of Craftsman® 8-inch, 8¼-inch, 9-inch, and 10-inch Radial Arm Saws. Sears sold the 8-inch, 9-inch, and 10-inch saws from 1958 through 1992. The 8¼-inch saws were sold from 1990 through 1995. 12 inch saws are not eligible for this recall.


These saws were sold without a guard that covers the entire blade. Some consumers have contacted the blade or have been hit by wood kicked back by the saws, resulting in amputations, fractures and lacerations.


The owner MUST return BOTH the Radial Arm Saw Carriage and Motor Assembly to Emerson to receive the $100 rebate. Emerson, provides the box and pays for shipping.



Yeah, I got my guard and table replaced under the recall, but it sounds like they're tired of doing that and are now only giving out the $100 if you render the saw unusable by sending them the motor.

[Garth Almgren]

I've noticed for several months in the local papers, CL and other classified ads there are always 2 or 3 RAS for sale. Ratio wise seems like there are always more RAS for sale than other large shop power tools. Some of these are very reasonably priced.
I'd bet that most of those were bought 25-45 years ago and as others have said were of questionable quality to begin with; they do a lot of things, but they also do a lot of things that seem to scare the heck out of people. You've got original owners who feel like they've gotten their mileage out of it over the years, and 2nd generation owners who inherited it and don't know what to do with it. The supply seems inexhaustible and the demand is pretty low, so the prices usually reflect that.

[Steve Kinnaird]

I currently have 3 RAS.
All Craftsman, all different models.
I was lucky enough to get the replacement parts (New Deck & Blade Guard) for all of them.
I picked them up for around $50 each and with the new parts have been able to sell them for around $125 to $150.
I have sold 4 upgraded unit over the last 2 years.

[Mike Chalmers]

I have a Sears 10", 11 amp RAS I bought in the 90s. I do all of my crosscutting on it, and have a 12' table, 10' on the left, 2' on the right. I have to true it up about twice a year. 15 minutes unless I am replacing the cutting table as well. Makes solid miter joints, and moves back to a true 90 when finished. I may just be lucky, but I find the tool to be a great asset to my shop. Cross cutting on my table saw is inaccurate, and downright dangerous. I know a sled would fix most of that.

[Jim Becker]

If I had the shop space and an Original Saw, old heavy Dewalt or old heavy Delta came my way, I'd enjoy having it around. But as has been noted, the vast majority of RAS "out there" are lower end products that are just not that desirable. Some are even dangerous due to un-answered recalls.

[Peter Quinn]

If I had the shop space and an Original Saw, old heavy Dewalt or old heavy Delta came my way, I'd enjoy having it around. But as has been noted, the vast majority of RAS "out there" are lower end products that are just not that desirable. Some are even dangerous due to un-answered recalls.

Those Original Saw machines are really quite good. My local lumber yard set up two of them in the last few years, a 12" in the molding room and a 20" in the yard, to replace older machines, insurance company required it. They have anti climb mechanisms, braking motors, I want to say 8 bearing roller heads? Very rigid, decent safety, I'm impressed. And they start around $4K and go way up from there. A good cabinet saw like saw stop is at its base a pretty crude mechanism machining wise compared to a RAS, sort of like an upside down slider. I can't imagine what people expected to get for $375 from sears?

[Jim Matthews]

10 feet?

What's that, a sixty pound, hundred dollar board?

Yikes.

Most of my boards are 8 footers, light 4/4 maybe 9 inches wide.
I can wrangle those myself.

I doubt I could get a ten foot long board into my shop
without a flag man and an excavator to make a pathway.

[Jeff Ramsey]

10 feet?

What's that, a sixty pound, hundred dollar board?

Yikes.

Most of my boards are 8 footers, light 4/4 maybe 9 inches wide.
I can wrangle those myself.

I doubt I could get a ten foot long board into my shop
without a flag man and an excavator to make a pathway.

I bought out old stock from an old cabinetmaker outside of Philadelphia years ago who sold his entire shop, and I still have quite a bit left. It's quite heavy to hoist around! He had the largest cast iron 10" jointer I ever saw. I've no idea how someone would have gotten that out of his under-garage basement shop (I don't know how he got it in). He also had a complete collection of all of Stanley's planes (less #1); they were in a show case that a salesman used to bring to his Philadelphia cabinetmaking shop. That's the only group of tools he wouldn't sell.

[Rod Sheridan]

Good comments Peter, and I believe people expect to get a good table saw for $375 dollars also.

That might have been true in 1950...............Regards, Rod.

[jack forsberg]

I am going to have to agree with Joe that there is a place for the good RAS and trenching saws. The UK trenching saw are 1 1/4" arbor and will hold stacks up to 4.5" wide and will take spindle moulder tooling as well .But the biggest difference is they are not limited to the power of a 120 volt plug of the SCMS. Guards are not plastic and if set up proper are safe. The larger saws are heavy and do not climb cut

here is a wadkin CC trenching saw i got for $250

http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad111/tool613/wadkin/ImageUploadedByTapatalk1383183956095126_zps5cf7986 3.jpg (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/tool613/media/wadkin/ImageUploadedByTapatalk1383183956095126_zps5cf7986 3.jpg.html)

these are the trenching heads

http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad111/tool613/wadkin/T2eC16JHJIUFHINDykylBSRHsykIFw60_58_zpsb1e72d8b.jp g (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/tool613/media/wadkin/T2eC16JHJIUFHINDykylBSRHsykIFw60_58_zpsb1e72d8b.jp g.html)


http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad111/tool613/wadkin/cc2_zpsdcb20b35.jpg (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/tool613/media/wadkin/cc2_zpsdcb20b35.jpg.html)

http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad111/tool613/wadkin/WadkinJPtrenchinghead001_zps1a0f3299.jpg (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/tool613/media/wadkin/WadkinJPtrenchinghead001_zps1a0f3299.jpg.html)

here is one in a Delta 40C
http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad111/tool613/wadkin/wadkintrenchinghead028_zpsa8ad7ab4.jpg (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/tool613/media/wadkin/wadkintrenchinghead028_zpsa8ad7ab4.jpg.html)


here is how clean they cut

http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad111/tool613/wadkin/wadkinhead002_zps981368c3.jpg (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/tool613/media/wadkin/wadkinhead002_zps981368c3.jpg.html)

http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad111/tool613/wadkin/wadkinhead004_zps8cb829c2.jpg (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/tool613/media/wadkin/wadkinhead004_zps8cb829c2.jpg.html)

here is one cutting a tenon in a delta.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFRP-K3DFNM

[John TenEyck]

Today I needed to cut some 60 degree bevels on the ends of 2 x 8 PT lumber for my new deck. I have no idea how I could have done it without my RAS. Of course, I could have done it with a handsaw, but I could not think of one other power option. It's just an incredibly versatile machine.

John

[Mike Chalmers]

My current supply of pine is all in 12' lengths, with most of the boards between 10 - 12" wide. One monster was 17" across! The long table is priceless.

[Henry Kramer]

I use my 1956 DeWalt MBF for just about every project. Table saw for ripping and large plywood cuts and the RAS for all of my cross cuts. A long bench on either side of the saw so 16' stock can be cut down was how I was taught.

[julian abram]

Yes, you guys hit the nail on the head, 99% of the ones I see are the cheaper models of Craftsman, Delta or Rockwell, usually priced $50-150. I not sure I've actually seen one of the true heavy duty "industrial" type saw for sell locally. I guess what really got me to thinking about it was a free offer to haul off a Rockwell unit. I looked at it and even ran the motor. It's missing some parts, but even for free not sure I want to give up space in my small shop, much less buy parts and spend labor getting it in good operational condition. It's in storage so I have some time to think about it. Thanks for all the good input!

[Mike Schuch]

When I was growing up my father had a 10" Delta Turret arm RAS as our primary woodworking tool. We did everything on that RAS. I now have a 16" Redstar turret arm RAS and could not imagine doing woodworking without it. I think it all depends on which tools you are comfortable using.

My first RAS was an old Craftsman RAS... I was pretty disappointed with it after having grown up with the Delta turret arm RAS.

[Rick Potter]

My DeWalt 7790 crosscuts perfectly square every time, and anything up to 16 1/4" gets crosscut on it. Wider stuff gets the Track saw. I cannot remember when I last used my table saw for crosscuts, and have never felt the need to build a sled.

The RAS is also the perfect tool for drawer joints, using a dado set, as well as using a dado for any shelf unit up to almost 16" wide.

I will never get my OMGA set up. Too bad, because it will crosscut 37" wide. I have just lost interest in it. It's a beast.

[Henry Kramer]

What type of saw do people use to cut long boards if they dont use a RAS? To cut a 10'-12' or even 16' board to length on the table saw would require a lot of room not to mention a balancing act. A Skil saw isnt that accurate. Do people use their sliding miter saw for cross-cuts? Every lumber yard that I have been to uses a RAS for cutting long lumber.

[Larry Edgerton]

.

I will never get my OMGA set up. Too bad, because it will crosscut 37" wide. I have just lost interest in it. It's a beast.

Not just a beast, a very accurate beast. The only thing I don't like about mine is that it is three phase which was no problem in the old shop, but at the new one I have to start the converter every time I want to use it. If I had known I was going to move I would have bought the single phase model. Does yours have the power feed arm?

Larry

[julian abram]

What type of saw do people use to cut long boards if they dont use a RAS? To cut a 10'-12' or even 16' board to length on the table saw would require a lot of room not to mention a balancing act. A Skil saw isnt that accurate. Do people use their sliding miter saw for cross-cuts? Every lumber yard that I have been to uses a RAS for cutting long lumber.

Circular saw with a speed square as a guide.

[Rick Potter]

Larry,

No arm on mine. I picked it up several years back (RN 900), and am facing the fact that I am getting older, and need to reduce the 'some day' tools. Mine is three phase also, but I bought a brand new single phase motor for it. Never mounted it. Decided I will never let go of the DeWalt anyway.

[Larry Edgerton]

If you decide you want to sell that single phase motor let me know what you want for it. I am never going to get three phase power coming in here and it would be nice to get more use out of it. Mines a RN700 but I believe they share the same motor.

Larry

[Kent A Bathurst]

What type of saw do people use to cut long boards if they dont use a RAS? To cut a 10'-12' or even 16' board to length on the table saw would require a lot of room not to mention a balancing act. A Skil saw isnt that accurate. Do people use their sliding miter saw for cross-cuts? Every lumber yard that I have been to uses a RAS for cutting long lumber.

12" CMS [non-slider]. 6' infeed and 3' outfeed Biese tables, but they sit on a bench that is > 14' long, so I can set up blocks to hold really long stuff, as/when needed.

[Allan Speers]

What type of saw do people use to cut long boards if they dont use a RAS? To cut a 10'-12' or even 16' board to length on the table saw would require a lot of room not to mention a balancing act. A Skil saw isnt that accurate. Do people use their sliding miter saw for cross-cuts? Every lumber yard that I have been to uses a RAS for cutting long lumber.

Eurkazone track system with a 10-1/4" circular saw attached. Easy-Peasy, dead-accurate, and safe.

I also use the EZ "miter square" attachment, for quick and perfect cross cuts.

[John Lanciani]

...with a 10-14" circular saw attached...

Yeah, everyone has a 14" circular saw saw laying around. I'll stick with my RAS, and out work you 10 cuts to 1. No track, no trying to square it up and clamp it down, no hefting the mythical 14" circ saw...


It's been said already in this post but more than ever I'm convinced that the people who are against radial arm saws have never used a good one. A good RAS is safe, fast, versatile, and 100% accurate.

[Allan Speers]

Yeah, everyone has a 14" circular saw saw laying around. I'll stick with my RAS, and out work you 10 cuts to 1. No track, no trying to square it up and clamp it down, no hefting the mythical 14" circ saw... .

10-1/4" John, not 14". I mistakenly left out the "/"

I'm convinced that the people who are against track saws have never used a good one. :)

[John Lanciani]

I'm convinced that the people who are against track saws have never used a good one. :)


I own a full Festool setup; a track saw is fantastic for sheet goods and site work, its not the right tool for crosscutting solid wood in a shop. Not to mention dados, compound angle cuts, etc...

[Allan Speers]

Not trying to argue with you John, but I wouldn't do certain jobs with a Festool, either. Specifically, ripping long, thick stock. The track isn't stiff enough, and the CS doesn't have enough cut-depth. The EZ track is very stiff, so easy to rig on top of a long board. I've been doing this for 10 years, both ripping and cross-cutting. As for accuracy, if a woodworker can't lay-out an accurate line, they should find another hobby. For smaller cuts, I now use the EZ-ONE table, which I find much easier & safer to use than my old Unisaw.

Now when you mention dados & compound miter cuts, sure, I agree, a tracksaw is a terrible choice, but there are other options besides a RAS. (incuding the above-mentioned EZ ONE table.) Now, If one does a LOT of compound cuts, and has the space, then sure, a good RAS would be great to have, but IMO only a production shop would need this.


And FWIW, I'm FAR from some Eurekazone groupie. I've actually been banned from their forum by Dino, because I asked too many hard questions of various product flaws. - But if you can find ways to tweak their stuff, it's the best system going.

[John Lanciani]

Not trying to argue with you John, but I wouldn't do certain jobs with a Festool, either. Specifically, ripping long, thick stock. The track isn't stiff enough, and the CS doesn't have enough cut-depth. The EZ track is very stiff, so easy to rig on top of a long board. I've been doing this for 10 years, both ripping and cross-cutting. As for accuracy, if a woodworker can't lay-out an accurate line, they should find another hobby. For smaller cuts, I now use the EZ-ONE table, which I find much easier & safer to use than my old Unisaw.

Now when you mention dados & compound miter cuts, sure, I agree, a tracksaw is a terrible choice, but there are other options besides a RAS. (incuding the above-mentioned EZ ONE table.) Now, If one does a LOT of compound cuts, and has the space, then sure, a good RAS would be great to have, but IMO only a production shop would need this.


And FWIW, I'm FAR from some Eurekazone groupie. I've actually been banned from their forum by Dino, because I asked too many hard questions of various product flaws. - But if you can find ways to tweak their stuff, it's the best system going.

The OP asked about radial arm saws, not track saws. A track saw is not a replacement for a RAS no matter how hard you try to justify it. It's like saying a swiss army knife is a replacement for a meat cleaver. Both will get the job done...

[Kent A Bathurst]

If I had the shop space and an Original Saw............

Never had an RAS, never had the interest.

But - turning Jim's comment around, if somehow I fell into an OSC, I would damn sure find the shop space for it. Those things are masterful works of machinery art, IMO.

[Jon Grider]

I'll take seriously the RAS negative comments IF the poster has actually owned an old cast iron DeWalt , Delta ,OMGA, Red Star,etc. that was tuned well. If you've tried them and don't like them, OK. If your RAS experience is with a 1970's or newer Craftsman, I can't blame you for having a negative viewpoint on them. I own three that I use regularly. One is in my garage for crosscutting large boards to rough length before hauling into the basement shop. One is in my basement shop for finish crosscutting, and one I keep in the garage for hauling to the work site. My regulars are a DeWalt 1030 round arm, a DeWalt 1400 square arm, and a Delta 900 turret. I prefer any of them to the Hitachi 12" slider I bought from the borg a few years ago. With a negative hook blade and proper caution, a well tuned RAS is a safe and efficient way to crosscut wide pieces of wood. They make my work flow more efficient and I would sorely miss any of them

[Rod Sheridan]

What type of saw do people use to cut long boards if they dont use a RAS? To cut a 10'-12' or even 16' board to length on the table saw would require a lot of room not to mention a balancing act. A Skil saw isnt that accurate. Do people use their sliding miter saw for cross-cuts? Every lumber yard that I have been to uses a RAS for cutting long lumber.

It takes the same amount of room to cut a board using an axe, a handsaw, a radial arm saw or any other saw. You always need a space longer than the board.

I have a sliding table saw and use it for cutting long boards, no need for a CMS or a radial arm saw............Regards, Rod.

P.S. A few of the mills I buy lumber from have swing saws, it's what we used in industry to break down material for the gang rips. Of course there was no requirement for accuracy in a lumber mill.

[Roy Turbett]

RAS fell out of favor because CMS and SCMS are highly portable, are faster to setup for cutting miters, and cut left and right hand miters equally well. RAS also have more moving parts that must be in allignment for the saw to perform well.

That said, I have a fully restored 1956 DeWalt GWI (10-12" blade 1 1/2hp dual voltage motor), Sawstop Professional 5 HP tablesaw, and a Bosch 10" SCMS. The RAS is built into a bench and has the smallest footprint of the three saws. At 90 degrees, it is accurate to .004" over 48" (verified by using the 5 cut method). Unlike my 1979 Craftsman, it stays in allignment and remains accurate when used for both ripping and miter operations. It is also easier to use for jointer operations than my Sawstop because I can clamp a board to the bottom side of my homemade track and use the front of the table as a fence. This keeps the workpiece fully supported for up to an 8' long cut and IMO eliminates the need for a jointer. It also cuts dados which my SCMS can't do. It also has the best dust collection of the three saws and was the least expensive (About $200 for the saw and parts). If space ever becomes an issue for me and I have to choose one saw to keep, it will be the DeWalt RAS.

[John TenEyck]

10-1/4" John, not 14". I mistakenly left out the "/"

I'm convinced that the people who are against track saws have never used a good one. :)

Try tipping your track saw 60 degrees to put a 30 deg bevel on the end of a board. Let me know how that works out. Try cutting a hundred parts 2" long with your track saw. Every tool has its strong points. A RAS happens to have a lot of them.

John

[jack duren]

It amazes me the silly arguments over whether you like an RAS or not.

[glenn bradley]

It amazes me the silly arguments over whether you like an RAS or not.

Sort of the storm-front I was eluding to when I said "Those that love them wouldn't be without them. The rest of us question the value for the footprint required." earlier in the thread. Certain things are hot buttons for certain folks: Festool, EZ-Smart, Bandsaw drift, etc. Anything to do with a RAS is one of the topics I buckle in and prepare for a ride on; its just one of those things :).

[jack duren]

Sort of the storm-front I was eluding to when I said "Those that love them wouldn't be without them. The rest of us question the value for the footprint required." earlier in the thread. Certain things are hot buttons for certain folks: Festool, EZ-Smart, Bandsaw drift, etc. Anything to do with a RAS is one of the topics I buckle in and prepare for a ride on; its just one of those things :).

I just believe every tool has a place no matter how large,small,old or new. If you have room for something by all means have it. If you don't then use other means to achieve the goal.

A lot of people have had bad luck with these saws but a lot have just had bad saws. Leaves a bad taste and I understand. Others are just ##### in the wind with negative comments because they can and its meaningless.

[Roy Turbett]

I can't imagine what people expected to get for $375 from sears?

The only RAS Sears still sells is $872.99 and 11 of the 46 reviews rate it at one star out of five. Hardly a quality saw and no comparision to the old DeWalts.

[Bob Cooper]

I have a nice Dewalt 5HP 3P RAS I need to sell if anyone is interested. No space for it

[Ole Anderson]

For me, it was a space issue and the fact that my 10" Monkey Wards RAS just wasn't accurate. If I had the room, I would still have the saw. Would a nice 12 or 14" commercial model be better? Sure, but the amount of use I would give it doesn't justify the space it (and the infeed/outfeed) table it takes up.

[jack duren]

For me, it was a space issue and the fact that my 10" Monkey Wards RAS just wasn't accurate. If I had the room, I would still have the saw. Would a nice 12 or 14" commercial model be better? Sure, but the amount of use I would give it doesn't justify the space it (and the infeed/outfeed) table it takes up.

I had a fairly new 10" Delta RAS. It was okay but not the most accurate. Work pulled there 12" Delta RAS for a Whirl wind and stuck it in a corner . I offered to trade the the newer 10" for the aging 12". We traded and I now have an accurate 12" RAS. a little fine tuning and I can now cut door and drawer panels and stock accurately. The main thing for me is dentil molding.. You can put a miter saw and RAS and multiple tools on the same fence if necessary...

[John Lifer]

Well, I've got not one but two..... Never have had both set up in same shop at same time, but hopefully that will be changing soon in my next shop. I crosscut. Yes, 1x4and 1x6 that could be done with a miter saw if I had one.....
But I also crosscut 14" sheet stock. Can't do with any miter on the market. And TS is too dangerous. RAS is the way to go......

[Rollie Meyers]

I have a 12" Rockwell sitting in the back room of my shop, one of these days it's going to be offered on CL, just don't have the room but they do have their place. At the time I bought it at auction a then current Delta 12" was selling for $1500 in the woodworking tool catalogs.

[Jim Andrew]

If I was framing houses again, would mount a big heavy ras along the side of a car trailer, so I could cut headers, cripples, sills and such with it, park it right next to the job where it would be handy. Nice to have square cuts on your framing members. And pretty fast as well if you have a guy cutting all the parts for openings for a wall. I had a sears ras and sent the motor and carriage in for the 100$.Scms for my woodshop.

[Roy Turbett]

If I was framing houses again, would mount a big heavy ras along the side of a car trailer, so I could cut headers, cripples, sills and such with it, park it right next to the job where it would be handy. Nice to have square cuts on your framing members. And pretty fast as well if you have a guy cutting all the parts for openings for a wall. I had a sears ras and sent the motor and carriage in for the 100$.Scms for my woodshop.

Some of the old DeWalts came mounted on their own trailer. I've seen a few come up on CL.

[Michael W. Clark]

Some of the old DeWalts came mounted on their own trailer. I've seen a few come up on CL.

Cool, there is a 16" Dewalt trailer mounted on the Indy CL. I thought it was home brew, but may be original?

[Roy Turbett]

Cool, there is a 16" Dewalt trailer mounted on the Indy CL. I thought it was home brew, but may be original?

From the serial number on the motor the saw appears to be a 1957 which is one of the years trailers were available. The guard looks to be from a later era. The guys at OWWM and the Delphi DeWalt RAS forum could tell for sure if the trailer is original.

[Bill Leonard]

Here's my pint of gasoline to help the blaze.
I started out with a Crapsman RAS well over twenty years ago, and never could come to enjoy its use. I abandoned it about 8 years ago. Really, abandoned it by leaving it behind during a move to a new house. Four or five years ago I bought an old Dewalt 9 in. RAS at auction for $45.00. I took the time to tune it according to "Mr Sawdust" and built a new table per the same document. It sits in my shop between my jointer and planer. It has become my go to saw. I also have a PM66 as well as a Delta tablesaw. The delta is dedicated to dados, the PM66 is for ripping, and the Dewalt has become my utility saw. Now, do I "need" the RAS-No. But then I don't "need" two tablesaws, but I have the luxury of a dedicated woodshop and find the RAS to be a true addition to how I make sawdust. Is it dangerous? Yes, but then so is a drill press, as well as a utility knife if you work with a rectal-cranial inversion attitude. I've added more DNA to my projects with a chisel than any of my saws. Any tool in your shop is of questionable need if you don't/won't use it properly and keep it tuned and respect it.

[Joe Jensen]

Radial Arm saws became a lot more dangerous when table saws became more common. A radial arm saw needs a negative hook angle blade and a table saw needs a positive hook angle blade. When you use a negative hook angle blade on a radial arm saw the hook angle pushes the wood down away from the blade and it's basically neutral on forward and backward pressure. On a table saw the positive hook angle pulls the wood down to the table. Using a negative hook angle on a table saw is very scary too. I have a 14" Dewalt set up as a dedicated 90 degree crosscut system with 8ft of Biesemeyer fence on the left and 10 ft on the right. With the right Forrest blade it's a dream and the best way to precision crosscut at 90 degrees.


How many crosscuts will a home user make in their lifetime?

There are better, safer methods to perform most of the other
cuts that an RAS can do.

Having a blade that turns to push the trunion toward the user?
That's just daft.